ISF Logo   IS Forum
Forum Index Register Members List Events Mark Forums Read Help

Go Back   International Skeptics Forum » General Topics » USA Politics
 


Welcome to the International Skeptics Forum, where we discuss skepticism, critical thinking, the paranormal and science in a friendly but lively way. You are currently viewing the forum as a guest, which means you are missing out on discussing matters that are of interest to you. Please consider registering so you can gain full use of the forum features and interact with other Members. Registration is simple, fast and free! Click here to register today.
Tags border walls , donald trump , immigration issues , Trump controversies

Reply
Old 22nd February 2019, 07:02 AM   #401
JoeMorgue
Self Employed
Remittance Man
 
JoeMorgue's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Florida
Posts: 18,709
Originally Posted by Upchurch View Post
There is no emergency. What's left to discuss?
There's no emergency, everybody knows there's no emergency, the person declaring the emergency has directly stated that there is no emergency so now as is tradition we have to play 40 pages of "Okay technically speaking..." from people who think there's A) a Congressional Gold Medal of Pedantics and B) it would be a great honor if they won it.
__________________
- "Ernest Hemingway once wrote that the world is a fine place and worth fighting for. I agree with the second part." - Detective Sommerset
- "Stupidity does not cancel out stupidity to yield genius. It breeds like a bucket-full of coked out hamsters." - The Oatmeal
- "To the best of my knowledge the only thing philosophy has ever proven is that Descartes could think." - SMBC
JoeMorgue is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 22nd February 2019, 07:10 AM   #402
Tero
Graduate Poster
 
Tero's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: North American prairie
Posts: 1,531
What is the point of a nonbinding resolution? Congress is preparing one.
Tero is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 22nd February 2019, 09:00 AM   #403
Toontown
Philosopher
 
Toontown's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 6,595
Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
There's no emergency, everybody knows there's no emergency, the person declaring the emergency has directly stated that there is no emergency so now as is tradition we have to play 40 pages of "Okay technically speaking..." from people who think there's A) a Congressional Gold Medal of Pedantics and B) it would be a great honor if they won it.
But...you mean there's no Congressional Gold Medal of Pedantics?

Life has no meaning.
__________________
"I did not say that!" - Donald Trump
Toontown is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 22nd February 2019, 01:28 PM   #404
dudalb
Penultimate Amazing
 
dudalb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Sacramento
Posts: 44,245
Originally Posted by Tero View Post
What is the point of a nonbinding resolution? Congress is preparing one.
It puts you on the record about something. It's a move for political purposes, not a legal one.
__________________
Pacifism is a shifty doctrine under which a man accepts the benefits of the social group without being willing to pay - and claims a halo for his dishonesty.

Robert Heinlein.
dudalb is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 22nd February 2019, 02:26 PM   #405
WilliamSeger
Illuminator
 
WilliamSeger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 4,543
Originally Posted by Tero View Post
What is the point of a nonbinding resolution? Congress is preparing one.
The House will vote Tuesday on blocking Trump’s national emergency
Originally Posted by MSN.com
As part of the National Emergencies Act of 1976, the law that details the president’s ability to make emergency declarations, there’s also a legislative check that’s given to Congress. After the president declares an emergency, Congress can pass a resolution that terminates it. House Democrats, led by Rep. Joaquín Castro (D-TX), have introduced this very measure, and the House is set to vote on it next Tuesday.
WilliamSeger is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 22nd February 2019, 02:28 PM   #406
JoeMorgue
Self Employed
Remittance Man
 
JoeMorgue's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Florida
Posts: 18,709
It never pass the Senate. You might as well fold the resolution into little paper boats and float them down the Potomac.
__________________
- "Ernest Hemingway once wrote that the world is a fine place and worth fighting for. I agree with the second part." - Detective Sommerset
- "Stupidity does not cancel out stupidity to yield genius. It breeds like a bucket-full of coked out hamsters." - The Oatmeal
- "To the best of my knowledge the only thing philosophy has ever proven is that Descartes could think." - SMBC
JoeMorgue is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 22nd February 2019, 02:47 PM   #407
acbytesla
Penultimate Amazing
 
acbytesla's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 21,584
Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
It never pass the Senate. You might as well fold the resolution into little paper boats and float them down the Potomac.
From what I understand it will DEFINITELY pass in the Senate.

Let me rephrase that. As it stands right now 5 to 10 Republicans will vote for the measure. That's enough for it to pass if all the Dems vote against it. Now Trump will have to veto the resolution and then it dies.
__________________
“ A wise man proportions his belief to the evidence. ”
― David Hume

Last edited by acbytesla; 22nd February 2019 at 02:51 PM.
acbytesla is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 22nd February 2019, 02:52 PM   #408
thaiboxerken
Penultimate Amazing
 
thaiboxerken's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 30,094
These days, the only thing that passes the Senate is the same thing that passes bowel movements.
__________________
All national institutions of churches, whether Jewish, Christian or Turkish, appear to me no other than human inventions, set up to terrify and enslave mankind, and monopolize power & profit - Thomas Paine
thaiboxerken is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 22nd February 2019, 03:26 PM   #409
Tero
Graduate Poster
 
Tero's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: North American prairie
Posts: 1,531
Hey, the Senate, well McCain, came thru earlier. I still have Obamacare.
Tero is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 22nd February 2019, 05:08 PM   #410
CapelDodger
Penultimate Amazing
 
CapelDodger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Cardiff, South Wales
Posts: 24,396
Originally Posted by Tero View Post
Hey, the Senate, well McCain, came thru earlier. I still have Obamacare.
So much winning ...
__________________
It's a poor sort of memory that only works backward - Lewis Carroll (1832-1898)

God can make a cow out of a tree, but has He ever done so? Therefore show some reason why a thing is so, or cease to hold that it is so - William of Conches, c1150
CapelDodger is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 22nd February 2019, 05:12 PM   #411
CapelDodger
Penultimate Amazing
 
CapelDodger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Cardiff, South Wales
Posts: 24,396
Originally Posted by thaiboxerken View Post
These days, the only thing that passes the Senate is the same thing that passes bowel movements.
The GOP : it's what puts the senna in Senate.
__________________
It's a poor sort of memory that only works backward - Lewis Carroll (1832-1898)

God can make a cow out of a tree, but has He ever done so? Therefore show some reason why a thing is so, or cease to hold that it is so - William of Conches, c1150
CapelDodger is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 4th March 2019, 11:03 AM   #412
Delphic Oracle
Illuminator
 
Delphic Oracle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Posts: 3,215
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/03/03/u...rand-paul.html

Rand Paul has flipped, meaning 51 votes to oppose the emergency declaration in the Senate.

Alternatively, Rand Paul may be asking how much the market rate is for him to flip back.
Delphic Oracle is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th March 2019, 09:55 PM   #413
Delphic Oracle
Illuminator
 
Delphic Oracle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Posts: 3,215
The resolution is in the Senate, referred to the Armed Services Committee

https://www.congress.gov/bill/116th-...-resolution/46

Nothing on the Committee calendar:

https://www.armed-services.senate.gov/hearings

Ladies and gentlemen, democracy at work.
Delphic Oracle is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th March 2019, 10:53 PM   #414
Skeptic Ginger
Nasty Woman
 
Skeptic Ginger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 74,527
Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
It never pass the Senate. You might as well fold the resolution into little paper boats and float them down the Potomac.
It's going to pass the Senate, McConnell already announced he can't stop it.
__________________
Restore checks and balances no matter your party affiliation.
Skeptic Ginger is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th March 2019, 06:13 AM   #415
JoeMorgue
Self Employed
Remittance Man
 
JoeMorgue's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Florida
Posts: 18,709
Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
It's going to pass the Senate, McConnell already announced he can't stop it.
"Going to pass the Senate, immediately be vetoed, and have zero chance of a veto over-ride."

The only difference is how much longer it gets drawn out.
__________________
- "Ernest Hemingway once wrote that the world is a fine place and worth fighting for. I agree with the second part." - Detective Sommerset
- "Stupidity does not cancel out stupidity to yield genius. It breeds like a bucket-full of coked out hamsters." - The Oatmeal
- "To the best of my knowledge the only thing philosophy has ever proven is that Descartes could think." - SMBC
JoeMorgue is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th March 2019, 06:19 AM   #416
Belz...
Fiend God
 
Belz...'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: In the details
Posts: 82,776
Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
"Going to pass the Senate, immediately be vetoed, and have zero chance of a veto over-ride."

The only difference is how much longer it gets drawn out.
Well, at least the Senate is making a show of disagreeing with Trump on something.

McConnell saying he can't stop it, though, sure indicates that GOP leadership would go along with their Fuhrer.
__________________
Master of the Shining Darkness

"My views are nonsense. So what?" - BobTheCoward


Belz... is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th March 2019, 06:33 AM   #417
JoeMorgue
Self Employed
Remittance Man
 
JoeMorgue's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Florida
Posts: 18,709
Originally Posted by Belz... View Post
Well, at least the Senate is making a show of disagreeing with Trump on something.

McConnell saying he can't stop it, though, sure indicates that GOP leadership would go along with their Fuhrer.
Yeah that's my point. That's all anyone can do. "Make a show of disagreeing." It's yet another meaningless, symbolic victory that we're supposed to think is either A) is an actual meaningful victory against Trump or B) the vanguard of some inevitable and on the horizon victory against him that's been coming "any day now" for about 10,000 years.

Might as well have Pelosi joining the breakaway Republicans in a sarcastic clap at him again since that was the last "Big win lookit how awesome that win was OMG we're just so great and awesome" anybody got against Trump.

We've got "disagreeing with Trump" down pat. Can somebody... like stop him at some point?

Yeah, yeah, yeah I know it's "gonna" happen "any day" now.

//I know, I know conversation had a billion times already.//
__________________
- "Ernest Hemingway once wrote that the world is a fine place and worth fighting for. I agree with the second part." - Detective Sommerset
- "Stupidity does not cancel out stupidity to yield genius. It breeds like a bucket-full of coked out hamsters." - The Oatmeal
- "To the best of my knowledge the only thing philosophy has ever proven is that Descartes could think." - SMBC
JoeMorgue is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th March 2019, 06:36 AM   #418
BobTheCoward
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 17,042
New legislation overrides old legislation even when not specific. The funding passed. The national emergencies melaw is to quickly address emergencies Congress may not be able to.

Does the budget override the national emergencies act with respect to wall funding? Congress deliberated on the border crisis and passed something signed by the president.

Why or why not?
BobTheCoward is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th March 2019, 06:37 AM   #419
Crossbow
Seeking Honesty and Sanity
 
Crossbow's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Charleston, WV
Posts: 12,705
It is nice to see that there are still at least few Republicans who are not butt-kissing Trump toadies. These few actually do have the good sense to finally vote against Trump when it comes to an important issue.
__________________
On 22 JUL 2016, Candidate Donald Trump in his acceptance speech: "There can be no prosperity without law and order."
On 05 FEB 2019, President Donald Trump said in his Sate of the Union Address: "If there is going to be peace and legislation, there cannot be war and investigation."
On 15 FEB 2019 'BobTheCoward' said: "I constantly assert I am a fool."
A man's best friend is his dogma.
Crossbow is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th March 2019, 06:38 AM   #420
Belz...
Fiend God
 
Belz...'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: In the details
Posts: 82,776
Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
We've got "disagreeing with Trump" down pat. Can somebody... like stop him at some point?
How?
__________________
Master of the Shining Darkness

"My views are nonsense. So what?" - BobTheCoward


Belz... is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th March 2019, 06:43 AM   #421
JoeMorgue
Self Employed
Remittance Man
 
JoeMorgue's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Florida
Posts: 18,709
Originally Posted by Belz... View Post
How?
That's the thing... they can't. The Democrats can't get their crap together long enough to amass enough actual power in actual places that it matters to stop him and the Republicans can't figure out a way to throw the Captain over the side without also sinking the boat.

I think we need to face the reality that Trump isn't going away until we vote him out in 2020. Each day that passes his chances of making it to the end of this term are ticking up, not down as far as I'm concerned.

Again... I know I harp on this. I really, honestly do and I have never wanted to be more wrong about something in my entire life. But I'm not getting a "noose tightening" vibe off the political landscape right now. I'm getting an Id driven man-child getting more and more comfortable with what he's allowed to get away with vibe.
__________________
- "Ernest Hemingway once wrote that the world is a fine place and worth fighting for. I agree with the second part." - Detective Sommerset
- "Stupidity does not cancel out stupidity to yield genius. It breeds like a bucket-full of coked out hamsters." - The Oatmeal
- "To the best of my knowledge the only thing philosophy has ever proven is that Descartes could think." - SMBC

Last edited by JoeMorgue; 6th March 2019 at 06:48 AM.
JoeMorgue is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th March 2019, 06:47 AM   #422
SuburbanTurkey
Graduate Poster
 
SuburbanTurkey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: Boston, USA
Posts: 1,633
Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
That's the thing... they can't. The Democrats can't get their crap together long enough to amass enough actual power in actual places that it matters to stop him and the Republicans can't figure out a way to throw the Captain over the side without also sinking the boat.

I think we need to face the reality that Trump isn't going away until we vote him out in 2020. Each day that passes his chances of making it to the end of this term are ticking up, not down as far as I'm concerned.

Again... I know I harp on this. I really and I have never wanted to be more wrong about something in my entire life. But I'm not getting a "noose tightening" vibe off the political landscape right now. I'm getting an Id driven man-child getting more and more comfortable with what he's allowed to get away with vibe.
Sure, but even if such public investigations don't lead to removal via impeachment, I think airing Trump's dirty laundry is going to hurt his re-election chances.

Him fighting the D's to keep his dirty deeds secret, and losing, is going to make him look weak. Humiliation is not re-election fuel.
__________________
Gobble gobble
SuburbanTurkey is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th March 2019, 08:28 AM   #423
Squeegee Beckenheim
Penultimate Amazing
 
Squeegee Beckenheim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 24,373
Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
Might as well have Pelosi joining the breakaway Republicans in a sarcastic clap at him again since that was the last "Big win lookit how awesome that win was OMG we're just so great and awesome" anybody got against Trump.
I know people thought it was funny. I don't remember anybody opining that it was a "big win". Can you quote anybody saying that?
__________________
I don't trust atoms. They make up everything.
Squeegee Beckenheim is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th March 2019, 04:08 PM   #424
Dr. Keith
Not a doctor.
 
Dr. Keith's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Texas
Posts: 18,355
Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
That's the thing... they can't. The Democrats can't get their crap together long enough to amass enough actual power in actual places that it matters to stop him and the Republicans can't figure out a way to throw the Captain over the side without also sinking the boat.

I think we need to face the reality that Trump isn't going away until we vote him out in 2020. Each day that passes his chances of making it to the end of this term are ticking up, not down as far as I'm concerned.

Again... I know I harp on this. I really, honestly do and I have never wanted to be more wrong about something in my entire life. But I'm not getting a "noose tightening" vibe off the political landscape right now. I'm getting an Id driven man-child getting more and more comfortable with what he's allowed to get away with vibe.
I see this particular vote in the senate as more important to senate elections in 2020 than anything having to do with the president. In close races it may matter that a GOP senator handed over the most important power of the legislative branch to satisfy the whims of an unpopular president.
__________________
Suffering is not a punishment not a fruit of sin, it is a gift of God.
He allows us to share in His suffering and to make up for the sins of the world. -Mother Teresa

If I had a pet panda I would name it Snowflake.
Dr. Keith is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th March 2019, 04:12 PM   #425
Skeptic Ginger
Nasty Woman
 
Skeptic Ginger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 74,527
Originally Posted by Crossbow View Post
It is nice to see that there are still at least few Republicans who are not butt-kissing Trump toadies. These few actually do have the good sense to finally vote against Trump when it comes to an important issue.
Collins is trying to rehabilitate her image after her Kavanaugh speech.
__________________
Restore checks and balances no matter your party affiliation.
Skeptic Ginger is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th March 2019, 05:14 PM   #426
Norman Alexander
Philosopher
 
Norman Alexander's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 5,685
For the record here, what would be a veto-proof number of votes in the Senate? 61?
__________________
...our governments are just trying to protect us from terror. In the same way that someone banging a hornets’ nest with a stick is trying to protect us from hornets. Frankie Boyle, Guardian, July 2015
Norman Alexander is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th March 2019, 05:21 PM   #427
bytewizard
Master Poster
 
bytewizard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: In the woods
Posts: 2,018
Originally Posted by Norman Alexander View Post
For the record here, what would be a veto-proof number of votes in the Senate? 61?
2/3 House and 2/3 Senate
bytewizard is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th March 2019, 05:33 PM   #428
Norman Alexander
Philosopher
 
Norman Alexander's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 5,685
Originally Posted by bytewizard View Post
2/3 House and 2/3 Senate
Thanks.

So the House is there. And the Senate has to get to 66 votes. With a 2-seat majority, that would mean...18 GOP senators to flip?
__________________
...our governments are just trying to protect us from terror. In the same way that someone banging a hornets’ nest with a stick is trying to protect us from hornets. Frankie Boyle, Guardian, July 2015
Norman Alexander is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th March 2019, 08:27 PM   #429
Delphic Oracle
Illuminator
 
Delphic Oracle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Posts: 3,215
Originally Posted by Norman Alexander View Post
Thanks.

So the House is there. And the Senate has to get to 66 votes. With a 2-seat majority, that would mean...18 GOP senators to flip?
67 for super-majority.

But a veto vote is often different from a bill vote. It can be viewed more about the principle of the Congress vs. the West Wing. More Senators might vote to uphold the legitimacy of the vote even if they voted against it.

Last edited by Delphic Oracle; 6th March 2019 at 08:29 PM.
Delphic Oracle is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th March 2019, 09:37 PM   #430
Norman Alexander
Philosopher
 
Norman Alexander's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 5,685
Originally Posted by Delphic Oracle View Post
67 for super-majority.

But a veto vote is often different from a bill vote. It can be viewed more about the principle of the Congress vs. the West Wing. More Senators might vote to uphold the legitimacy of the vote even if they voted against it.
So it is within the realms of possibility the veto vote will carry with a super-majority? If so, does that mean Trump must accept the result power of the legislative branch? Not that I expect he will see it that way. He will rant and rave about border security and communist lefty Dems, etc.
__________________
...our governments are just trying to protect us from terror. In the same way that someone banging a hornets’ nest with a stick is trying to protect us from hornets. Frankie Boyle, Guardian, July 2015

Last edited by Norman Alexander; 6th March 2019 at 09:39 PM.
Norman Alexander is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th March 2019, 12:45 AM   #431
Delphic Oracle
Illuminator
 
Delphic Oracle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Posts: 3,215
Originally Posted by Norman Alexander View Post
So it is within the realms of possibility the veto vote will carry with a super-majority? If so, does that mean Trump must accept the result power of the legislative branch? Not that I expect he will see it that way. He will rant and rave about border security and communist lefty Dems, etc.
It's still a tough sell for anyone in a district where Trump is popular and they could get primaried.

From what I'm reading, no vote is scheduled but it is "anticipated" on Thursday the 14th of March.
Delphic Oracle is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th March 2019, 02:23 AM   #432
smartcooky
Penultimate Amazing
 
smartcooky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Nelson, New Zealand
Posts: 11,930
Originally Posted by Delphic Oracle View Post
It's still a tough sell for anyone in a district where Trump is popular and they could get primaried.

From what I'm reading, no vote is scheduled but it is "anticipated" on Thursday the 14th of March.
The vote must take place within 18 days of the passing of the "no" vote in the House.
__________________
#THEYAREUS
If you don't like my posts, my opinions, or my directness then put me on your ignore list.
This will be of benefit to both of us; you won't have to take umbrage at my posts, and I won't have to waste my time talking to you... simples! !
smartcooky is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th March 2019, 04:19 AM   #433
Traveler Steve
Scholar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 108
Originally Posted by Crossbow View Post
It is nice to see that there are still at least few Republicans who are not butt-kissing Trump toadies. These few actually do have the good sense to finally vote against Trump when it comes to an important issue.
Respectfully, I don't see it that way. I see it as some Republicans are scared witless that, in the future, a "librul" President will declare a national emergency on the number of firearms in the country leading to "an unacceptable number of mass shootings and needless deaths" and start pumping out executive orders to "grab them guns".

Or even declare a national health emergency for the "unacceptable number of needless deaths in the health care system" and pump up Obamacare to be a truly socialized health-care system.

It's not about Trump, really, it's about future Presidential power grabs.
Traveler Steve is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th March 2019, 04:48 AM   #434
uke2se
Penultimate Amazing
 
uke2se's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 12,934
Originally Posted by Traveler Steve View Post
Respectfully, I don't see it that way. I see it as some Republicans are scared witless that, in the future, a "librul" President will declare a national emergency on the number of firearms in the country leading to "an unacceptable number of mass shootings and needless deaths" and start pumping out executive orders to "grab them guns".

Or even declare a national health emergency for the "unacceptable number of needless deaths in the health care system" and pump up Obamacare to be a truly socialized health-care system.

It's not about Trump, really, it's about future Presidential power grabs.
And that's completely rational. The Democrats have not been late to outright state that if this passes the courts, it'll be precedent and future Democratic Presidents will use it to push through liberal issues.

Anyone opposed to liberal issues should be opposed to Trump's handling on this. The problem is that Trumpists aren't able to process information the way the rest of us can.
__________________
Before you say something stupid about climate change, check this list.

"If we extend unlimited tolerance even to those who are intolerant, if we are not prepared to defend a tolerant society against the onslaught of the intolerant, then the tolerant will be destroyed, and tolerance with them. " Karl Popper, The Open Society and Its Enemies Vol. 1
uke2se is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th March 2019, 06:04 AM   #435
Norman Alexander
Philosopher
 
Norman Alexander's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 5,685
Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
Anyone opposed to liberal issues should be opposed to Trump's handling on this. The problem is that Trumpists aren't able to process information the way the rest of us can.
They want to see Trump set the law by breaking the law. Perfectly rational.
__________________
...our governments are just trying to protect us from terror. In the same way that someone banging a hornets’ nest with a stick is trying to protect us from hornets. Frankie Boyle, Guardian, July 2015
Norman Alexander is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th March 2019, 07:17 AM   #436
uke2se
Penultimate Amazing
 
uke2se's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 12,934
Originally Posted by Norman Alexander View Post
They want to see Trump set the law by breaking the law. Perfectly rational.
Well, if you don't care much about the law in the first place, it could be depending on your ultimate goal.

My point was that it's rational for Goopers to worry about a Democratic President using the same method in the future. They will.
__________________
Before you say something stupid about climate change, check this list.

"If we extend unlimited tolerance even to those who are intolerant, if we are not prepared to defend a tolerant society against the onslaught of the intolerant, then the tolerant will be destroyed, and tolerance with them. " Karl Popper, The Open Society and Its Enemies Vol. 1
uke2se is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th March 2019, 10:05 AM   #437
Captain_Swoop
Penultimate Amazing
 
Captain_Swoop's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 21,222
Trump Tweets

We are on track to APPREHEND more than one million people coming across the Southern Border this year. Great job by Border Patrol (and others) who are working in a Broken System. Can be fixed by Congress so easily and quickly if only the Democrats would get on board!
Captain_Swoop is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th March 2019, 10:07 AM   #438
Captain_Swoop
Penultimate Amazing
 
Captain_Swoop's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 21,222
Is he really saying that nearly 3000 people are apprehended each day on the border?
Captain_Swoop is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th March 2019, 10:16 AM   #439
Segnosaur
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 13,228
Originally Posted by Traveler Steve View Post
Quote:
It is nice to see that there are still at least few Republicans who are not butt-kissing Trump toadies. These few actually do have the good sense to finally vote against Trump when it comes to an important issue.
Respectfully, I don't see it that way. I see it as some Republicans are scared witless that, in the future, a "librul" President will declare a national emergency on the number of firearms in the country...Or even declare a national health emergency
Exactly.

Remember, these are the republicans who acted to confirm Drunky McRapeface to the Supreme court (as well as such stellar nominees as Devos to the cabinet). They have no real sense of integrity.
__________________
Trust me, I know what I'm doing. - Sledgehammer

I'm Mary Poppin's Y'all! - Yondu

We are Groot - Groot
Segnosaur is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 8th March 2019, 06:09 AM   #440
BobTheCoward
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 17,042
Originally Posted by Captain_Swoop View Post
Is he really saying that nearly 3000 people are apprehended each day on the border?
That is correct. Over 76,000 were apprehended crossing the border in February.

https://www.vox.com/2019/3/6/1825344...igration-trump

Quote:
The Trump administration reported that 76,103 people tried to enter the US without valid papers in February. That number combines people who came to official border crossings and migrants who were caught by Border Patrol after crossing illegally.

But while current apprehension levels are higher than they’ve been in the last decade, they’re still way below pre-recession levels.

What is truly unprecedented is who the migrants are.

Almost two-thirds of Border Patrol apprehensions are of parents and their children. While we don’t have complete historical data, it seems likely that more families are coming to the US without papers than ever before. Additionally, a large share of migrants (both families and single adults) are expressing a desire to seek asylum.

Maybe I'm wrong, but you seem to have expressed incredulity at that number. Now that I presented evidence that the number is more credible, does that change any of your views?
BobTheCoward is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Reply

International Skeptics Forum » General Topics » USA Politics

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 10:45 AM.
Powered by vBulletin. Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

This forum began as part of the James Randi Education Foundation (JREF). However, the forum now exists as
an independent entity with no affiliation with or endorsement by the JREF, including the section in reference to "JREF" topics.

Disclaimer: Messages posted in the Forum are solely the opinion of their authors.