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Tags !MOD BOX WARNING! , Andrew Bolt , autism , environmental activists , Greta Thunberg

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Old 27th August 2019, 02:23 AM   #521
Cosmic Yak
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Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
If you refer back to the post, it is a quote by Lasse Lehtinen, not me.
Originally Posted by jimbob View Post
Yes, there are idiots all over the place, but I tend to only quote them when I have a point to make.

What is your point about his insane ramblings?
Quite.

Vixen, you linked to this rubbish, so you should be taking the time to explain why you think this crap is worth reading.
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Old 28th August 2019, 04:54 AM   #522
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Some nutjob, with a previous conviction for making illegal threats, has been charged with sending multiple letters where they threaten to kill Greta Thunberg and her mother (there's no mention of threats made against her father, so presumably he would be spared). They admit sending the letters, but deny any intentions of threatening or causing them physical harm, and supposedly regrets his actions which were apparently done to stop her climate change activism.
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Old 28th August 2019, 08:28 AM   #523
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Meanwhile, Greta has arrived in New York:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-49500642
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Old 28th August 2019, 09:09 AM   #524
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Originally Posted by Arcade22 View Post
Some nutjob, with a previous conviction for making illegal threats, has been charged with sending multiple letters where they threaten to kill Greta Thunberg and her mother (there's no mention of threats made against her father, so presumably he would be spared). They admit sending the letters, but deny any intentions of threatening or causing them physical harm, and supposedly regrets his actions which were apparently done to stop her climate change activism.
What an idiot. She's attending the UN Climate Summit. Opposing her activism? That ship has already sailed.
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Old 28th August 2019, 09:09 AM   #525
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Originally Posted by Dr. Keith View Post
That's what she gets for flying Spirit.
Still better than Ryanair.
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Old 28th August 2019, 12:54 PM   #526
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Originally Posted by Arcade22 View Post
Some nutjob, with a previous conviction for making illegal threats, has been charged with sending multiple letters where they threaten to kill Greta Thunberg and her mother (there's no mention of threats made against her father, so presumably he would be spared). They admit sending the letters, but deny any intentions of threatening or causing them physical harm, and supposedly regrets his actions which were apparently done to stop her climate change activism.
The way adults like to target children in particular for the most withering and vile of criticism and abuse just because they've done something harmless that's gotten a little publicity has always struck me as deeply disturbing, and all facets of the visceral hate-response that's been directed at Thunberg is no exception.
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Old 28th August 2019, 01:27 PM   #527
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Originally Posted by Checkmite View Post
The way adults like to target children in particular for the most withering and vile of criticism and abuse just because they've done something harmless that's gotten a little publicity has always struck me as deeply disturbing, and all facets of the visceral hate-response that's been directed at Thunberg is no exception.
It is a fascinating phenomena and massively unsettling. I wonder if that isn't a topic that deserves its own thread. Although I don't know what it would be beyond a list of disgusting examples and then people showing how it is done by doubling down on certain targets by pointing out how that child is actually evil. Never mind, I don't like my idea much anymore.
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Old 28th August 2019, 05:18 PM   #528
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Originally Posted by Checkmite View Post
The way adults like to target children in particular for the most withering and vile of criticism and abuse just because they've done something harmless that's gotten a little publicity has always struck me as deeply disturbing, and all facets of the visceral hate-response that's been directed at Thunberg is no exception.
I wonder if it's not largely the result of jealousy and that her appearance clashes with the typical photogenic activists that are usually made into figureheads. These people probably think along the lines of "How did this little girl become so famous?! She's a freak! She's not good looking and hasn't accomplished anything at all! What's her deal?! Who does she think she is?".

Spiteful responses become a natural response in order to call her out for acting above her station and that she should know her place. At least that's what I imagine is making so many people respond like toxic juvenile bullies.
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Old 28th August 2019, 06:40 PM   #529
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Originally Posted by Arcade22 View Post
I wonder if it's not largely the result of jealousy and that her appearance clashes with the typical photogenic activists that are usually made into figureheads. These people probably think along the lines of "How did this little girl become so famous?! She's a freak! She's not good looking and hasn't accomplished anything at all! What's her deal?! Who does she think she is?".
I'm not sure it's appearance-based. Haters will certainly weaponize that, but I don't think it's what motivates them.

I wonder if you might be on the right track about "jealousy", though. The phenomenon of adults living vicariously through the successes of children they like, usually their own but sometimes others', is well-known and I think moderately understood. It at least sounds plausible to me that adults can become vicariously rivalrous of children they disapprove of who are nevertheless "succeeding" in ways the adult thinks they shouldn't be.

But even if that's a thing that actually happens, it's still up in the air as to whether that explains the larger problem. Adults have heaped just as much abuse upon children who certainly couldn't be described as "successful". Examples like Jimmy Kimmel seem to indicate that some adults just really enjoy the suffering of children, viewing it as a form of entertainment, and I wonder if that might be a bigger contributor to the problem than vicarious jealousy.
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Old 29th August 2019, 09:09 AM   #530
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Originally Posted by Dr. Keith View Post
It is a fascinating phenomena and massively unsettling. I wonder if that isn't a topic that deserves its own thread. Although I don't know what it would be beyond a list of disgusting examples and then people showing how it is done by doubling down on certain targets by pointing out how that child is actually evil. Never mind, I don't like my idea much anymore.
Originally Posted by Checkmite View Post
I wonder if you might be on the right track about "jealousy", though. The phenomenon of adults living vicariously through the successes of children they like, usually their own but sometimes others', is well-known and I think moderately understood. It at least sounds plausible to me that adults can become vicariously rivalrous of children they disapprove of who are nevertheless "succeeding" in ways the adult thinks they shouldn't be.

I don't think jealousy is quite right. It seems to me to be more of a sense of adult elitism; the idea that "children" (aka anyone sufficiently younger) are inherently inferior, and exist solely to become carbon copies of adults, and should therefore "know their place". Look at all the kerfuffle that has historically gone on every time "the youth" comes up with some new musical style, fashion style, or socio-political movement that threatens the status quo.

Culturally, there is a fairly rigid social hierarchy, the view of which can vary a bit from group to group; but few would deny its existence. Children are considered low in the hierarchy by nearly everyone in mainstream culture. Those who consider themselves higher up in the hierarchy do not take kindly to those of lower status daring to challenge their authority and step out of their assigned place. Just like racists do not appreciate "low status" minorities attempting to act as equals, very many adults do not appreciate younger generations attempting to act as equals, and tend to believe that children should be little more than mirrors of their elders with no wills or desires of their own.
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Old 29th August 2019, 09:31 AM   #531
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Originally Posted by Checkmite View Post
I'm not sure it's appearance-based. Haters will certainly weaponize that, but I don't think it's what motivates them.
It wasn't just her physical appearance. It's pretty much everything about her that seems to throw people off. She looks strange and she acts strange... she is strange in a way that many people find annoying and upsetting. Combine this with the fact that she looks noticeably younger than she is, people who already object to what she stands for ("climate change activism") seem unable to help themselves from attacking her in very personal terms.

They bash her because she's young, although she's 16 years so dismissing her as a "child" is quite questionable even in principle. They also mostly bash her because she's a "freak", even though her behavior is far from objectionable or otherwise would reasonably cause any kind of annoyance in other people.
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Old 29th August 2019, 10:41 AM   #532
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Originally Posted by Arcade22 View Post
It wasn't just her physical appearance. It's pretty much everything about her that seems to throw people off. She looks strange and she acts strange... she is strange in a way that many people find annoying and upsetting. Combine this with the fact that she looks noticeably younger than she is, people who already object to what she stands for ("climate change activism") seem unable to help themselves from attacking her in very personal terms.

They bash her because she's young, although she's 16 years so dismissing her as a "child" is quite questionable even in principle. They also mostly bash her because she's a "freak", even though her behavior is far from objectionable or otherwise would reasonably cause any kind of annoyance in other people.
I think we should also consider the subject. Some people consider climate change a hoax. Others believe the danger is over stated. Still, others believe there is nothing we can do about it anyway. Someone who brings attention to the issue is an easy target for naysayers.
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Old 29th August 2019, 03:31 PM   #533
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So I am guessing now she has sailed to the US, with a team of sailors, The sailing team will fly home, she will fly round the US to get to all the conferences and then fly home.

Nice virtue signalling
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Old 29th August 2019, 03:57 PM   #534
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
So I am guessing now she has sailed to the US, with a team of sailors, The sailing team will fly home, she will fly round the US to get to all the conferences and then fly home.

Nice virtue signalling
What a load of crap. Show evidence she will be flying.

No, don’t bother. Evidence is not your thing. She will not be flying around the US.

These sort of pointless personal attacks on Greta are designed to dismiss or discredit her uncomfortable message.
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Old 29th August 2019, 04:00 PM   #535
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Originally Posted by lionking View Post
What a load of crap. Show evidence she will be flying.

No, don’t bother. Evidence is not your thing. She will not be flying around the US.

These sort of pointless personal attacks on Greta are designed to dismiss or discredit her uncomfortable message.
I don't have any evidence

Which is why I said "I guess". It is called presuming.
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Old 29th August 2019, 04:03 PM   #536
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Oh

It appears I was right

She saved carbon emissions of herself going by plane, so a team of sailors could fly instead

Quote:
The 18-metre yacht features state-of-the-art solar panels on its deck and sides while there are two hydro-generators which together provide all the electricity needed on board.

Her voyage has however sparked controversy after a spokesman for Herrmann, the yacht's co-skipper, told Berlin newspaper TAZ that several people would fly into New York to help take the yacht back to Europe. Hermann himself will also return by plane, according to the spokesman.

Team Malizia's manager insisted however that the young activist's journey would be climate neutral, as the flights would "be offset."

Thunberg has meanwhile said that she doesn't yet know how she will return to Europe when the time comes.
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Old 29th August 2019, 04:09 PM   #537
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
Oh

It appears I was right

She saved carbon emissions of herself going by plane, so a team of sailors could fly instead
Dealt with earlier in this thread. What does the action of the crew have to do with Greta?

She and her family have pledged not to fly. But of course you will “ guess” she is lying.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greta_Thunberg


Quote:
To lower her family's carbon footprint, she insisted they become vegan and give up flying.[17
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Old 29th August 2019, 04:22 PM   #538
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She is clearly trying to bring attention to the wastefulness of flying, but it is difficult in a system that is optimized for speed over fuel consumption.

So, she finds the least wasteful way for her to travel, but it is a one off. Therefore it is not as optimized as it could be. There are no passenger sailboats across the Atlantic.

But I think her trip shows that there could be. If people refused to fly and asked for less wasteful methods could there be a market for trans-Atlantic passenger sailboats? I don't know. But I do know that she has shown that it doesn't take that much extra time to rely on the wind rather than relying on jet fuel. And I think that is interesting.

She is bringing attention to a problem and laying out a possible solution.

And **** if it hasn't gotten under some people's skin. Publicity? Check!
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Old 29th August 2019, 04:32 PM   #539
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Some cargo ships can take passengers along. Given that the cargo ship was going to make the trip anyway, would that be less carbon than flying?
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Old 29th August 2019, 04:33 PM   #540
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Originally Posted by lionking View Post
Dealt with earlier in this thread. What does the action of the crew have to do with Greta?

She and her family have pledged not to fly. But of course you will “ guess” she is lying.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greta_Thunberg
It just seems a tad stupid that her chosen transport needed as she chooses not to fly because of emission requires more people flying.

I haven't accused her of anything, except displaying virtue signaling

I'd never heard of the chick till about a week ago and have zero idea what all the hype over her is.
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Old 29th August 2019, 04:42 PM   #541
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post

I'd never heard of the chick till about a week ago and have zero idea what all the hype over her is.
Sure. It’s simply coincidental that you are echoing right-wing climate change denier criticisms against a young person making a difference. How dare she.

And “chick”? Really?
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Old 29th August 2019, 04:52 PM   #542
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Originally Posted by lionking View Post
Sure. It’s simply coincidental that you are echoing right-wing climate change denier criticisms against a young person making a difference. How dare she.

And “chick”? Really?
https://newrepublic.com/amp/article/...mpression=true
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Old 29th August 2019, 04:53 PM   #543
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Originally Posted by lionking View Post
Sure. It’s simply coincidental that you are echoing right-wing climate change denier criticisms against a young person making a difference. How dare she.

And “chick”? Really?
No

I am pointing out that one particular trip is stupid.

I have no idea what else she has done, and if it is good, then great, but I don't particularly care.
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Old 29th August 2019, 05:33 PM   #544
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
No

I am pointing out that one particular trip is stupid.

I have no idea what else she has done, and if it is good, then great, but I don't particularly care.
This thread is about Greta Thunberg and you admit knowing nothing about her. Why are you posting?
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Old 29th August 2019, 05:36 PM   #545
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Originally Posted by Dr. Keith View Post
There are no passenger sailboats across the Atlantic.
There should be.

One of the things on my never-attainable bucket list is to take a ship to the UK.
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Old 29th August 2019, 07:38 PM   #546
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
I am pointing out that one particular trip is stupid.
And why is that? In the grand scheme of things it doesn't matter. It's a symbolic yet ultimately futile gesture, but somehow it manages to trigger so many people for no good reason at all. It's like she's expected to adhere to some absolute abstinence from utilizing anything's that's not carbon neutral, even though she's not made that kind of commitment.
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Old 29th August 2019, 08:12 PM   #547
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
It just seems a tad stupid that her chosen transport needed as she chooses not to fly because of emission requires more people flying.
Well, it didn't really require more people flying. That was a choice the owner and crew has made.

Thunberg let it be known she wanted to go to the Americas by sail to attend the conference. The owner of this boat offered her a ride, and she accepted. That's the limit of Thunberg's involvement. The boat's owner is under no obligation to share Thunberg's philosophy; and the fact that he/she does not, doesn't prove that Thunberg's motivation was misguided or futile. What they decided to do after dropping her off has nothing to do with her.
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Old 30th August 2019, 02:46 AM   #548
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Originally Posted by lionking View Post
This thread is about Greta Thunberg and you admit knowing nothing about her. Why are you posting?
There is a forum rule about not commenting on topics you find interesting?

Like virtue signaling

I tell you what

You write down a list of topics you think I shouldn't comment on and I will print it and file it in a perfect place.

I get you are sensitive about this topic, but this isn't my problem
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Old 30th August 2019, 02:56 AM   #549
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Originally Posted by Checkmite View Post
Well, it didn't really require more people flying. That was a choice the owner and crew has made.

Thunberg let it be known she wanted to go to the Americas by sail to attend the conference. The owner of this boat offered her a ride, and she accepted. That's the limit of Thunberg's involvement. The boat's owner is under no obligation to share Thunberg's philosophy; and the fact that he/she does not, doesn't prove that Thunberg's motivation was misguided or futile. What they decided to do after dropping her off has nothing to do with her.
This is true and if she is happy a bunch of people took airplane trips back so she didn't have to take one, that is obviously a great symbolism to some people.

I personally can't understand why it is, but then maybe I am just not looking at the "big picture"
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Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
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Old 30th August 2019, 03:14 AM   #550
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post

I personally can't understand why it is, but then maybe I am just not looking at the "big picture"
You can say that again.

What do you think about global warming?

On the off chance you have bothered to look at what Thunberg is doing, what do you think of her efforts?
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Old 30th August 2019, 03:31 AM   #551
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Originally Posted by lionking View Post
You can say that again.

What do you think about global warming?

On the off chance you have bothered to look at what Thunberg is doing, what do you think of her efforts?
I haven't looked, but since I have heard of her, I have heard more good than bad.

This doesn't make that particular trip more logical to her apparent cause.

Apologies, but I really can't be bothered making an effort over a teenager just saying what loads of other people say.
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I generally oppose gun control, but I support the ban on assault weapons and I support a slightly longer waiting period to purchase a gun. With today’s Internet technology we should be able to tell within 72-hours if a potential gun owner has a record.

Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000

Last edited by cullennz; 30th August 2019 at 03:33 AM.
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Old 30th August 2019, 03:42 AM   #552
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Originally Posted by lionking View Post
You can say that again.

What do you think about global warming?

On the off chance you have bothered to look at what Thunberg is doing, what do you think of her efforts?
With regard to what I think about climate change

The climate is obviously changing.

How much man has to do with how quickly it is happening to me is the actual topic.

I have no idea, but imagine we are contibuting quite a bit to the speed.

I think "carbon credits" and Carbon exchange schemes are utter bollocks as all it does is charge people more so companies spewing emissions can still spew the same emissions, but just get kind of a tax refund.

And until India, China and the US act (which they won't) in the plucked out of the air 11 years till death to all, it is a tad silly.
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I generally oppose gun control, but I support the ban on assault weapons and I support a slightly longer waiting period to purchase a gun. With today’s Internet technology we should be able to tell within 72-hours if a potential gun owner has a record.

Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
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Old 30th August 2019, 03:42 AM   #553
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
I haven't looked, but since I have heard of her, I have heard more good than bad.

This doesn't make that particular trip more logical to her apparent cause.

Apologies, but I really can't be bothered making an effort over a teenager just saying what loads of other people say.
Jeez, you know this thread isn’t just about her trip to the US don’t you? This event is what climate change deniers are getting hot and bothered about.

Do you understand she is communicating to the generations which will be gravely impacted by the incompetence of earlier generations?

But she’s just a teenager “chick” ( again, really?) so can be safely ignored.

The ignorance of some in this thread is amazing.
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Old 30th August 2019, 03:45 AM   #554
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
With regard to what I think about climate change

The climate is obviously changing.

How much man has to do with how quickly it is happening to me is the actual topic.

I have no idea, but imagine we are contibuting quite a bit to the speed.

I think "carbon credits" and Carbon exchange schemes are utter bollocks as all it does is charge people more so companies spewing emissions can still spew the same emissions, but just get kind of a tax refund.

And until India, China and the US act (which they won't) in the plucked out of the air 11 years till death to all, it is a tad silly.
Oh dear, denialism 101.
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Old 30th August 2019, 03:48 AM   #555
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Originally Posted by lionking View Post
Oh dear, denialism 101.
You got denialism from me saying man contributes quite a bit to the speed of climate change

How does that work?
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Old 30th August 2019, 03:57 AM   #556
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
You got denialism from me saying man contributes quite a bit to the speed of climate change

How does that work?
Weasel words. “How much.......” “I have no idea......”.

Accept the science. That is Greta’s message.
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Old 30th August 2019, 04:00 AM   #557
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Originally Posted by lionking View Post
Weasel words. “How much.......” “I have no idea......”.

Accept the science. That is Greta’s message.
You didn't answer my question, and you also seem to be saying that this whole 11 year thing is proven and not computer modelling
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I generally oppose gun control, but I support the ban on assault weapons and I support a slightly longer waiting period to purchase a gun. With today’s Internet technology we should be able to tell within 72-hours if a potential gun owner has a record.

Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
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Old 30th August 2019, 04:05 AM   #558
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
You didn't answer my question, and you also seem to be saying that this whole 11 year thing is proven and not computer modelling
Oh I understand what you are saying well enough.

Denialism 101.
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Old 30th August 2019, 04:11 AM   #559
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Originally Posted by lionking View Post
Oh I understand what you are saying well enough.

Denialism 101.
That is a great shut down line, but you usually need to point out where I have before it is actually warranted.
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I generally oppose gun control, but I support the ban on assault weapons and I support a slightly longer waiting period to purchase a gun. With today’s Internet technology we should be able to tell within 72-hours if a potential gun owner has a record.

Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
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Old 30th August 2019, 04:14 AM   #560
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For what it is worth. As I don't want to turn this into an ugly argument.

Yes. I think man contributes to obvious current climate change.

I also think climate change happens naturally as to not do so would be dim. The question is how much mans influence has on these changes.

And frankly again. I do not know. The fact you think your awesome enough to know for sure is great ...... Big ups to you.

Not pumping bad stuff out is a good thing either way, as it also has environmental upsides, but the 4-5 big players aren't going to stop doing it, and without them she is a bit of a dead end.
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I generally oppose gun control, but I support the ban on assault weapons and I support a slightly longer waiting period to purchase a gun. With today’s Internet technology we should be able to tell within 72-hours if a potential gun owner has a record.

Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
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