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Old 22nd February 2021, 11:47 AM   #2321
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Originally Posted by Jack by the hedge View Post
You know what, I was wrong. Looks like it was only up to the third and fourth generation who get punished by God for things they didn't do. Don't know where I picked up the idea about the seventh generation from.

So anyway, how about showing us where it says Satan does that kind of crazy, malevolent stuff?
Don't forget, though, that at least for some Christians, there's ****Original Sin!****

No generational cutoff on that. We're all on the hook forever. You're born with a ticket to hell.
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Last edited by bruto; 22nd February 2021 at 11:48 AM.
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Old 22nd February 2021, 12:10 PM   #2322
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Originally Posted by bruto View Post
Don't forget, though, that at least for some Christians, there's ****Original Sin!****

No generational cutoff on that. We're all on the hook forever. You're born with a ticket to hell.
Oh dear. Those poor Christians, all thinking they're doomed to their hell. Tut. I suppose they must think it's Satan who decided to punish them like that, right? I mean, what "loving" God would do anything so psychopathic as that?


Say, is it just me or is this thread drifting away from lunatic ideas about reforming global society into a gigantic hunter-gatherer band with Teslas?
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Old 22nd February 2021, 02:42 PM   #2323
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
You too, you mistake the right God with Satan, Jesus never taught God was like that.
In the Bible in the book of Ecclesiastes, verse 10:19, it says money is the answer to everything.

This book was written by King Solomon, who was considered the wisest king in the Bible with the exception of God himself.
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Old 22nd February 2021, 04:19 PM   #2324
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I eagerly await Gaetan's convoluted reinterpretation of the parable of the talents (Matthew 25:14-30).
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Old 22nd February 2021, 04:41 PM   #2325
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
The difference between God and the devil:

God shares with others........
Your "God" murdered every innocent child in the flood, and you think that is a good thing?

Even the devil didn't murder all the world's children.
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Old 22nd February 2021, 04:48 PM   #2326
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
You too, you mistake the right God with Satan, Jesus never taught God was like that.
The greatest trick the Devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn’t exist.

If only god would do us the same favour.
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Old 22nd February 2021, 05:07 PM   #2327
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Originally Posted by bruto View Post
I eagerly await Gaetan's convoluted reinterpretation of the parable of the talents (Matthew 25:14-30).
It's already done a few laps here, like most other things.


If I recall correctly, Gaetan considered the mentioning of specifically "money" to be metaphorical. While "talents" was literally interpreted by him to mean 'an aptitude or skill' and not 'a unit of money worth twenty years labor'.
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Old 22nd February 2021, 05:09 PM   #2328
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Originally Posted by Matthew Ellard View Post
Your "God" murdered every innocent child in the flood, and you think that is a good thing?

Even the devil didn't murder all the world's children.
Well, he did share the water with them...
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Old 22nd February 2021, 05:17 PM   #2329
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Originally Posted by The Man View Post
Well, he did share the water with them...
My great-nieces never want to get out of the pool when they stay with us.

I don’t see the the problem either. I am literally godfather to one of them
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Old 23rd February 2021, 05:32 AM   #2330
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
The difference between God and the devil:

God forgives; the devil never forgives.
God shares with others; the devil doesn't share anything, it's every man for himself.
God gives freely; when the devil gives, he always asks for something in return.
God loves, the devil loves no one.
God is devoted to others, the devil thinks only of himself.
God makes free; with the devil you're not free, you're stuffed with taxes, you can't eat or drink what you want, you can't dress how you want, you can't work when you want

You can replace the devil by money it is exactly the samething
The god of the bible does all of those things. Are you talking about some other god?
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Old 23rd February 2021, 06:07 AM   #2331
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Originally Posted by abaddon View Post
The god of the bible does all of those things. Are you talking about some other god?
May well be talking about some other bible.

But this thread is of course about his crazy economics idea. I don't really know why he's arguing his unique interpretation of the bible here instead of with Christians who might actually care about it.
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Old 23rd February 2021, 08:42 AM   #2332
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Originally Posted by Jack by the hedge View Post
May well be talking about some other bible.

But this thread is of course about his crazy economics idea. I don't really know why he's arguing his unique interpretation of the bible here instead of with Christians who might actually care about it.
He has admitted in the past that he knows his readings are, let's just say unique, and aren't shared. The problem is, that he can't accept the idea he might be wrong. And discussing the idea that doesn't start with the preconception that he is right, makes you an agent of the CIA. Because he is that important and his ideas are that powerful. It's all delusion, cause by insomnia, more than likely given his fixation on sleep aids.
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Old 23rd February 2021, 08:53 AM   #2333
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
The difference between God and the devil:

God forgives; the devil never forgives.
God defined the sins and then made us sinners. We don't need to seek forgiveness from the devil since there are no sins he is holding us responsible for. God created the sins and made us sinners for the sole purpose of us to petition him for forgiveness.

Quote:
God gives freely; when the devil gives, he always asks for something in return.
Then why are you here demanding everyone else to provide you with goods and services? Is God not giving freely enough to you?

Quote:
you can't eat or drink what you want, you can't dress how you want, you can't work when you want
Thou shall not work on the Sabbath.
Nor shall you wear a garmet made of both wool and linen.
But anything in the seas or the rivers that has not fins and scales, of the swarming creatures in the waters and of the living creatures that are in the waters, is detestable to you.

This god character has a metric ton of rules about what you should eat, wear, and when you can work.
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Old 23rd February 2021, 09:14 AM   #2334
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"I prayed to God for a Tesla, but eventually I realised that's not how things work. So I stole one instead and prayed to God for forgiveness." <after Emo Philips>
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Old 23rd February 2021, 02:08 PM   #2335
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Originally Posted by Joecool View Post
In the Bible in the book of Ecclesiastes, verse 10:19, it says money is the answer to everything.

This book was written by King Solomon, who was considered the wisest king in the Bible with the exception of God himself.
But Money is the answer to everything. Why is there suffering? Why is there evil? Why can't Gaetan drive his Tesla?

It's right there in front of you.
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Old 23rd February 2021, 02:22 PM   #2336
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I really don't want to go down this rabbit hole, but what food and drink does the devil prohibit? Angel food cake? We must subsist on Devils food cake, deviled eggs, and booze? I don't get it.
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Old 23rd February 2021, 02:45 PM   #2337
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Originally Posted by bruto View Post
Jesus taught that the 10 commandments still applied. There are times when he sounds quite liberal, but the text explicitly has him confirming the old laws. And Paul sure as hell "taught God was like that."
Put the verses first, you'll see you are wrong.
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Old 23rd February 2021, 03:05 PM   #2338
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We've done that with you and yet you still preach the same lies.

Jesus did say you cannot serve two masters. You cannot serve God and money. Jesus did not equate Satan to money. Why are you lying?

Why are you saying the opposite than what Jesus said? Jesus did not say serve Satan, he said serve money. If you are not quoting exactly what Jesus said then you are quoting the opposite.

Why haven't you looked look up the in dictionary the definitions of "use" and "serve", and tell us what the difference is? Is it because this will show you that you are wrong?

Where in the Bible does it state that Jesus couldn't carry money?

Proof that money is "the tool of Satan"? Provide the exact chapter and verse that states money is "the tool of Satan". Do you not know a tool is not evil or good? It is a tool. If I use a knife to cut someone, is the tool evil? Is the knife evil when I cut someone to remove a tumor? Is the knife evil when I use it to defend myself? Is the knife evil when I use it to skin a deer that I have hunted to feed my family?

Why haven't you answered my questions? Is it because if you do, you will see what sort of liar you are and show how wrong you are and how wrongly you understand your bible?
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Old 23rd February 2021, 04:26 PM   #2339
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
Put the verses first, you'll see you are wrong.
You have not read your magic book. In fact, jesus affirmed the entire 613 commandments as a whole, something you appear to be unaware of.

Of the so called ten commandments, jesus specifically endorsed 5, and added 2 others which were stolen from Hamurrabi.

Can you name the 5 commandments jesus directly endorsed? Of course you cannot. You have not read the stupid book.
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Old 24th February 2021, 09:01 AM   #2340
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Originally Posted by abaddon View Post
You have not read your magic book. In fact, jesus affirmed the entire 613 commandments as a whole, something you appear to be unaware of.
You are wrong

Quote:
Of the so called ten commandments, jesus specifically endorsed 5, and added 2 others which were stolen from Hamurrabi.

Can you name the 5 commandments jesus directly endorsed? Of course you cannot. You have not read the stupid book.
Then he didn't endorse the 10 commandments, you are making progress
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Old 24th February 2021, 09:44 AM   #2341
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
You are wrong



Then he didn't endorse the 10 commandments, you are making progress
He endorsed all of the insane rules. Not a jot or tittle were to change. If you broke them, or encouraged others to do so, you will be the least in heaven.

Why isn't your god providing for you Gaetan? Why must you rely on those who you think are serving Satan to meet your desires?
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Old 24th February 2021, 10:15 AM   #2342
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"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them."

He didn't have to list them one by one.
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Old 24th February 2021, 02:12 PM   #2343
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Originally Posted by bruto View Post
"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them."

He didn't have to list them one by one.
Yes but the Law he talked about is the Law to love your neighbour as yourself not the law of Moses, if you apply the law of Moses you don't love your neighbour as yourself. That why you can't charge for your labor, if you charge for it you don't love your neighbour as yourself because the price you want to pay for the labor of your neighbour is zero dollar. You can't serve God and money.

ESV Mt 5.17 “Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. 18 For truly, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass from the Law until all is accomplished. 19 Therefore whoever relaxes one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever does them and teaches them will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. 20 For I tell you, unless your righteousness exceeds that of the scribes and Pharisees, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven.

You see he talks about the Law or the prophets as the Law to accomplish but what Law he means?

Mt 7.12 So whatever you wish that others would do to you, do also to them, for this is the Law and the Prophets.

13 “Enter by the narrow gate. For the gate is wide and the way is easy[a] that leads to destruction, and those who enter by it are many. 14 For the gate is narrow and the way is hard that leads to life, and those who find it are few.

You see he says that the golden rule is the Law and the prophet, He says in Matthew that it is not the easiest way he says that we should use the narrow gate the more difficult way. He use the same words that he use in Mt 5.17: The Law and the prophet. It is also in Luke:

Luke 6.27 “But I say to you who hear, Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you, 28 bless those who curse you, pray for those who abuse you. 29 To one who strikes you on the cheek, offer the other also, and from one who takes away your cloak do not withhold your tunic[b] either. 30 Give to everyone who begs from you, and from one who takes away your goods do not demand them back. 31 And as you wish that others would do to you, do so to them.

And in:

Mt 22.34 But when the Pharisees heard that he had silenced the Sadducees, they gathered together. 35 And one of them, a lawyer, asked him a question to test him. 36 “Teacher, which is the great commandment in the Law?” 37 And he said to him, “You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. 38 This is the great and first commandment. 39 And a second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself. 40 On these two commandments depend all the Law and the Prophets.”

He says that the golden rule again is the Law and the prophet he uses the same words again that the golden rule is the Law.

Luke 5.25 And behold, a lawyer stood up to put him to the test, saying, “Teacher, what shall I do to inherit eternal life?” 26 He said to him, “What is written in the? How do you read it?” 27 And he answered, ‘’You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength and with all your mind, and your neighbor as yourself.” 28 And he said to him, “You have answered correctly; do this, and you will live.”

In the parable of the good samaritain he says the Law to follow to have the eternal live is the Law to love your neighbour as yourself, and when you look at the teaching of Jesus Christ everything he teach is about more or less to love your neighbour as yourself.
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Old 24th February 2021, 03:00 PM   #2344
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
Yes but the Law he talked about is the Law to love your neighbour as yourself not the law of Moses, if you apply the law of Moses you don't love your neighbour as yourself. That why you can't charge for your labor, if you charge for it you don't love your neighbour as yourself because the price you want to pay for the labor of your neighbour is zero dollar. You can't serve God and money.
Lie. It's in Leviticus 19:18. You have not read your magic book.

Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
ESV Mt 5.17 “Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. 18 For truly, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass from the Law until all is accomplished. 19 Therefore whoever relaxes one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever does them and teaches them will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. 20 For I tell you, unless your righteousness exceeds that of the scribes and Pharisees, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven.

You see he talks about the Law or the prophets as the Law to accomplish but what Law he means?
Mosaic law, duh.

Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
Mt 7.12 So whatever you wish that others would do to you, do also to them, for this is the Law and the Prophets.
Yup. Mosaic law, according to your magic book. Leviticus 19:18

Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
13 “Enter by the narrow gate. For the gate is wide and the way is easy[a] that leads to destruction, and those who enter by it are many. 14 For the gate is narrow and the way is hard that leads to life, and those who find it are few.

You see he says that the golden rule is the Law and the prophet, He says in Matthew that it is not the easiest way he says that we should use the narrow gate the more difficult way.
That is not what it means.

Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
He use the same words that he use in Mt 5.17: The Law and the prophet. It is also in Luke:

Luke 6.27 “But I say to you who hear, Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you, 28 bless those who curse you, pray for those who abuse you. 29 To one who strikes you on the cheek, offer the other also, and from one who takes away your cloak do not withhold your tunic[b] either. 30 Give to everyone who begs from you, and from one who takes away your goods do not demand them back. 31 And as you wish that others would do to you, do so to them.

And in:

Mt 22.34 But when the Pharisees heard that he had silenced the Sadducees, they gathered together. 35 And one of them, a lawyer, asked him a question to test him. 36 “Teacher, which is the great commandment in the Law?” 37 And he said to him, “You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. 38 This is the great and first commandment. 39 And a second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself. 40 On these two commandments depend all the Law and the Prophets.”
Plagiarised from the OT and Hammurabi before it. Also, from Confucious. These concepts existed long before your magic jebus.

Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
He says that the golden rule again is the Law and the prophet he uses the same words again that the golden rule is the Law.
Leviticus 19:18 again.

Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
In the parable of the good samaritain he says the Law to follow to have the eternal live is the Law to love your neighbour as yourself, and when you look at the teaching of Jesus Christ everything he teach is about more or less to love your neighbour as yourself.
Is it more? or less? Because to me, I could not reject my family ever. Yet your magic jebus demands that I do. That is disgusting.

And we are still left with the conclusion that you have not read your magic book.
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Old 24th February 2021, 07:55 PM   #2345
Matthew Ellard
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
Yes but the Law he talked about is the Law to love your neighbour as yourself not the law of Moses.....,
......and Jesus specifically informed people how to look after their money and pay for things like towers.

Luke 14:28-30 : “Suppose one of you wants to build a tower. Won’t you first sit down and estimate the cost to see if you have enough money to complete it? 29 For if you lay the foundation and are not able to finish it, everyone who sees it will ridicule you, saying, ‘This person began to build and wasn’t able to finish.’

For Christ's sake, read the Bible and stop making up crap.
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Old Yesterday, 08:10 AM   #2346
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
Yes but the Law he talked about is the Law to love your neighbour as yourself not the law of Moses, if you apply the law of Moses you don't love your neighbour as yourself. That why you can't charge for your labor, if you charge for it you don't love your neighbour as yourself because the price you want to pay for the labor of your neighbour is zero dollar. You can't serve God and money
Wait just a second, the law of loving your neighbor IS a law of Moses. It's one of the commandments after all.

Clearly, you've not actually read the book, in order to make such a basic mistake. He was talking about the laws of Moses, as you've identified.

If you are applying the laws of Moses you are required to love your neighbor as yourself. So your analysis is fundamentally flawed.

I'm also curious, why are you still serving money and not God?
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Old Yesterday, 08:15 AM   #2347
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Originally Posted by abaddon View Post
Lie. It's in Leviticus 19:18. You have not read your magic book.

Mosaic law, duh.

Yup. Mosaic law, according to your magic book. Leviticus 19:18

That is not what it means.

Plagiarised from the OT and Hammurabi before it. Also, from Confucious. These concepts existed long before your magic jebus.

Leviticus 19:18 again.

Is it more? or less? Because to me, I could not reject my family ever. Yet your magic jebus demands that I do. That is disgusting.

And we are still left with the conclusion that you have not read your magic book.
The devil is in the details. It is one of the peculiarities of the devil to hate his crimes with what is good to rip off the faithful. Jesus didn't agree with the whole law of Moses but just to love your neighbour as yourself and not with the 10 commandments but just part of it.

Last edited by Gaetan; Yesterday at 08:20 AM.
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Old Yesterday, 11:35 AM   #2348
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
The devil is in the details. It is one of the peculiarities of the devil to hate his crimes with what is good to rip off the faithful. Jesus didn't agree with the whole law of Moses but just to love your neighbour as yourself and not with the 10 commandments but just part of it.
Ah, yes. jebus didn't agree with whole law of moses. He agreed with the killing of unruly children bit. Do you think unruly children should be killed?

Do you think it is good for a man to abandon his wife and kids? Your jebus did.
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Old Yesterday, 01:10 PM   #2349
Leftus
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
The devil is in the details. It is one of the peculiarities of the devil to hate his crimes with what is good to rip off the faithful. Jesus didn't agree with the whole law of Moses but just to love your neighbour as yourself and not with the 10 commandments but just part of it.
Then why didn't he just come out and say that? He said exactly the opposite, not changing a jot or tittle, being the phrase used, which is an odd way of saying everything else is gone.

I guess this explains why you are so cool with a plan that murders billions as you do away with the thou shall not kill commandment. Seems odd, that one seems to be a crowd favorite, but since it's not a jot or tittle, it goes.

You still use money, so how are you serving god? You can't be, so who are you really serving?
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Old Yesterday, 06:44 PM   #2350
Gaetan
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I understand that you fellows cannot serve or love God and money as every one else by your talks.
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Old Yesterday, 08:03 PM   #2351
Matthew Ellard
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
I understand that you fellows cannot serve or love God and money as every one else by your talks.
Considering we are atheists, and don't believe in your God or any "God" at all, your claim is very silly.

However it is you who is making a claim about your "god" that does not match your God's Bible and it appears you have never read the Bible at all.
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Old Today, 07:31 AM   #2352
Leftus
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
I understand that you fellows cannot serve or love God and money as every one else by your talks.
Gaetan serves (uses) money and has admitted as much. Thus, Gaetan can not be serving God, by his own definition. Therefor it is proven what he is spreading here can not be serving God by his own standards and has demonstrated this fact by trying to handwave it away.
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