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8th April 2009, 12:47 PM | #961 |
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getting kinda warm in here. someone notify Al Roker!
reading Gregory's post im sure jonesie getting hot under the collar. He may have to loosen up that tie.
So Hey Jonesie!! Name one steel framed hi rise that globally collapsed by being heated to 8 deg. C over room temperature! Just one! C'mon Jonesie you can do it! |
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911 resource site by Mark Roberts http://wtc7lies.googlepages.com/home Gravy: Christopher7; You are a Basking Shark in a sea of ignorance. Galileo:The jury said I didn't have any mental defects or diseases, they declared me 100% sane. Has a jury ever declared you sane? Don’t get me lol’n off my chesterfield dude. |
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8th April 2009, 12:48 PM | #962 |
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8th April 2009, 12:49 PM | #963 |
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8th April 2009, 12:49 PM | #964 |
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Is it customary for NIST to subject all of its publications to the peer review process? What about the process of producing this report was inadequate due to the fact that it was not peer-reviewed in a scientific journal? (Other than the fact that responses & criticisms would be limited to a select group of scientists, rather than being open to anyone who wished to respond)
The government paid for it, but it was not produced solely by the government. Suspected by whom? You? Other truthers? Using your logic we should also reject the findings of Kevin Ryan, Steven Jones, Richard Gage, CIT, etc because they are suspected of using 9/11 conspiracy theories for personal gain. If not NIST, who should the science be left to? Do you feel that the time window for rebuttals was inadequate? Why? What will happen if they don't? |
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8th April 2009, 12:50 PM | #965 |
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My reading of spectral output is ancient, to the point where basically I have forgotten how to do so.
Is it possible that the Sodium (Na) peaks are Zinc Peaks, given they occur at almost identical placed on the spectra (around the 1 keV)? TAM |
8th April 2009, 12:50 PM | #966 |
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8th April 2009, 12:51 PM | #967 |
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8th April 2009, 12:52 PM | #968 |
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Just had a quick look at that, they pick up on the magnetic issue too. I'm also intrigued by the 6th post down
Quote:
The small peak is only visible in samples a,b and d. Is this statistically significant amongst the background? Did the equipment not label this peak? Did they look closer at it or not notice? I myself thought it was part of the "noise". It's not in the microsphere Fig 21 so that would suggest ruling out the "gray layer" as a source. |
8th April 2009, 12:54 PM | #969 |
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8th April 2009, 12:54 PM | #970 |
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8th April 2009, 12:55 PM | #971 |
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Sunstealer, given their proximity on the spectral outputs, is it possible the Na Peaks are in fact Zn Peaks?
TAM |
8th April 2009, 01:06 PM | #972 |
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Well this is something that struck me as odd when comparing EDS data - Figs 7, 14 don't tally thus suggesting different materials.
Why does all of the paint have to be of the exact same composition and from a single manufacture? It wouldn't be beyond reasonable doubt to suggest that samples in Jones' paper are more than one type of paint. Surely if this material were thermite then the composition would be common across all spectra? |
8th April 2009, 01:09 PM | #973 |
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8th April 2009, 01:10 PM | #974 |
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Don't you have this backwards?
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
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8th April 2009, 01:10 PM | #975 |
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So in the end, the results are FAR from conclusive, wrt to the existence of "superthermite" in the dust. It could very easily be Primer paint(s).
Can you tell me, if the Na peaks are close enough to the Zn peaks to be mistaken in some of the other spectra, or are their locations, while close to one another, close enough to say they are in fact Na and Zn as given in the paper? TAM |
8th April 2009, 01:11 PM | #976 |
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8th April 2009, 01:15 PM | #977 |
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8th April 2009, 01:18 PM | #978 |
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"My father would womanize, he would drink, he would make outrageous claims, like he invented the question mark. Sometimes, he would accuse chestnuts of being lazy - the sort of general malaise that only the genius possess and the insane lament." - Dr. Evil |
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8th April 2009, 01:30 PM | #979 |
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I doubt he will change his tune. I have discussed just that issue with him on the STJ911 forum. I pointed out that the times given by NIST were for the first heavy debris to hit the ground. It can be seen in the videos that nearly half the building was standing at that point. A more realistic time for WTC1 is 14-15 seconds as even Jim Hoffman has concluded. I wrote a paper on the implications (or rather lack thereof) of the fall times, but The Journal of 9/11 Studies wouldn't consider it and told me to try elsewhere.
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"My father would womanize, he would drink, he would make outrageous claims, like he invented the question mark. Sometimes, he would accuse chestnuts of being lazy - the sort of general malaise that only the genius possess and the insane lament." - Dr. Evil |
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8th April 2009, 01:31 PM | #980 |
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8th April 2009, 01:32 PM | #981 |
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8th April 2009, 01:35 PM | #982 |
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8th April 2009, 01:37 PM | #983 |
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No, that is not true unless you can prove that other paints that may have been used in the WTC would not have presented similar spectrums to those in Jones paper. Jone paper has to prove that the spectra and other data prove that THE ONLY thing in that pile that could have produced such data, was superthermite. he has not.
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8th April 2009, 01:40 PM | #984 |
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1. Yes there is a problem with "Pay to play" techniques, such as those used by Bentham.
2. They also used viral emailing techniques to obtain their "editors" for their "journals". This involved some cases where people who were educated in TOTALLY UNRELATED FIELDS were offered editorships. Offering a PhD in English a position as an editor on the board for "Astrophysics" for a hypothetical example... TAM |
8th April 2009, 01:41 PM | #985 |
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Correct me if i am wrong, but does part of that "fee" have to do with the lenght of the paper, and the included photos?
Not that it matters, but i think Ryan said some journals limit the size of a paper, so not all journals can be approached simply because of size and other limitations. |
8th April 2009, 01:43 PM | #986 |
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Hi Red,
I had a quick listen while I was working out. Here's the quote: about 16:40 into the mp3 'whereas the buldings collapsed in about 10 seconds... The only way then to achieve this rapid and complete fall , and symetrical as well, is through the use of explosives to move the mass out of the way' On Robertson's prodding he also agreed that it would have to be every 2 or 3 floors throughout the building.' http://www.911podcasts.com/files/aud...n_20061026.mp3 |
8th April 2009, 01:46 PM | #987 |
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You honestly want to know what Bentham is up to, start with these links...
http://gunther-eysenbach.blogspot.co...-journals.html http://www.library.yale.edu/~llicens.../msg00027.html https://listserv.indiana.edu/cgi-bin...&P=R10547&I=-3 For starters... much more info, here http://www.internationalskeptics.com...=110489&page=8 TAM |
8th April 2009, 02:01 PM | #988 |
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Yes it could very well be Zn. Usually Na and Zn are marked on the printout on the same peak (CuLα peak is just under 1KeV too). There are corresponding peaks around 8.6-7 and 9.6 for Zn too.
In Fig 14 the 1 KeV peak is labelled as Zn and has a corresponding 8.7 peak. It may well be that because of the absence of the later peak that the 1KeV peak is labelled Na in all the other spectra. You'll note that in the majority of spectra that label the 1KeV peak as Na there is also a K (Potassium) peak at @ 3.3KeV - Figs 7c, 11, (it's not labelled in 14 but looks like it's there), and 24. Not sure what to make of that. Either way I've no idea why you'd want either in thermite! Edited to add:
Quote:
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8th April 2009, 02:02 PM | #989 |
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Just curious, but did you and Dave go to the same high school?
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8th April 2009, 02:05 PM | #990 |
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More bad news for the JREFers. Another famous authority figure has endorsed the findings of the International Team of Experts:
Exotic High Tech Explosives Positively Identified in World Trade Center Dust — Editor A ground-breaking scientific paper confirmed this week that red-gray flakes found throughout multiple samples of WTC dust are actually unexploded fragments of nanothermite, an exotic high-tech explosive. The samples were taken from far-separated locations in Manhattan, some as early as 10 minutes after the second tower (WTC 1) collapsed, ruling out any possible contamination from cleanup operations. Authored by an international team of physicists, chemists, and others, the research paper was titled "Active Thermitic Material Discovered in Dust from the 9/11 World Trade Center Catastrophe." It was published in The Open Chemical Physics Journal, 2009, Vol. 2., and is available online for free download. The lead author is Niels H. Harrit of the Department of Chemistry, University of Copenhagen. READ THE REST, AND FOREVER REST YOUR PEACE! http://www.ae911truth.org/info/51 |
8th April 2009, 02:06 PM | #991 |
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8th April 2009, 02:08 PM | #992 |
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Well I think that the elemental Al issue is still up for debate - They only say that they picked a region of the sample for the EDS and don't give and exact area nor the corresponding SEM photo. It might sound a bit picky, but i'd like conformation.
Isn't paramagnetism only present in a magnetic field? The material doesn't exhibit magnetic properties outside of the field. I'm just trying to see if it might explain why the elemental aluminium concentrated during the 55 hours in MEK with agitation. |
8th April 2009, 02:10 PM | #993 |
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8th April 2009, 02:12 PM | #994 |
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8th April 2009, 02:13 PM | #995 |
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8th April 2009, 02:13 PM | #996 |
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8th April 2009, 02:14 PM | #997 |
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8th April 2009, 02:15 PM | #998 |
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dude, this is a science forum. There is no such word as "twoofer" in science. The paper is being supported by other experts, contrary to your false assertions. Show me a qualified scientist who have published an article that tears apart the paper. If you can't that makes you a liar as well.
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8th April 2009, 02:18 PM | #999 |
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8th April 2009, 02:20 PM | #1000 |
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