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Old 15th November 2015, 05:05 PM   #641
JayUtah
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Originally Posted by Jodie View Post
OBE's aren't the same as NDE's.
Irrelevant. You spackle everything with the goo of your multidimensional consciousness hypyothesis so splitting hairs here doesn't really help you.

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The difference between what I'm doing is that a dimensional reality theoretically exists.
No. It has been amply shown how you either misunderstand or misrepresent the science.

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Probative is relative, I never claimed that what I think is in anyway true.
But you accuse your critics of closed-mindedness if their consideration of your hypothesis doesn't validate it. That's tantamount to claiming it's true. You don't accept the possibility that there can be a rational rejection of it.

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Sure you can, it's called weighing the evidence. You've decided that since there is no evidence for my stated belief it follows that it can't be possible.
That doesn't address my post. You told a ghost story. You offered a pseudoscientific contention that it could be authentic. You cited a number of sources from mainstream and fringe science that you claimed support your contention. You berated a number of your critics for not paying attention to them.

But then a careful examination of your sources showed that not only did they fail to support your belief, in many cases they actually refuted it. Some discussion was had on that point culminating in your admission that you couldn't profess any actual expertise in those sciences, whereupon you made one further inconsequential post and dropped the debate. If your own sources suggest that your belief is impossible, then you either have to abandon the sources or accept the verdict. You forget that in weighing the evidence, that evidence might unexpectedly wind up on the wrong side of the scale.

If you abandon one argument and its sources, nothing prevents you from making an argument de novo, according to whatever new evidence or logic you can muster. You haven't done that. Therefore your hypothesis remains unsubstantiated. Your critics are simply responding to your arguments. By one argument your beliefs are impossible. By another (non-)argument, your beliefs have no demonstrable basis. Don't conflate the two lines of reasoning and their conclusions.

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Rational skeptics decide what doesn't apply by following a line of logic that states that if you can't test it, don't ask.
Straw man. In this case your argument doesn't apply because of the equivocation we've been discussing at length. What physics means by "dimension" is not what you mean by "dimension." Therefore their findings do not apply to your claims.

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That is not rational and I've also explained that to you at length.
And your misrepresentation of your critics has been explained to you at length.

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My stated belief has been untestable since the conversation started.
Your stated belief changes to keep it untestable as putative tests appear on the horizon. It is that variability that raises questions. Some have accused you of gaming the forum for whatever purpose. Your goalpost-shifting is their primary evidence for it.

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It is speculation.
Then stop accusing your critics of various intellectual transgressions for treating it as the speculation it is.

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There is no burden of proof for either side of the argument where anything can be decided definitively, nothing has changed.
Nonsense. If you claim there exists a multidimensional reality that has the properties you hypothesize, then you most definitely have the burden to prove it. And the failure of you or anyone else to prove it on your behalf means your claim fails. That's how affirmative claims work. I shouldn't have to explain why hypothesizing untestable flights of fancy and then hiding behind the untestability is obviously specious.

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All I ignored was that you and a few others stated that I was incorrect in my understanding but nothing was forthcoming to demonstrate why that was. Until I can see it, I won't accept what you are saying.
All the other people managed to find it in the ghost-story thread, along with all manner of other posts you claim didn't exist. When they directed your attention to it, you abandoned the thread. Your inability or unwillingness to face arguments against your belief doesn't make them go away.

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All of my critics here tend to be hidebound to a rigid interpretation of what science has to offer.
All of your critics here tell you what science is. Your fervent wish that it be something else that is more lenient toward your beliefs is comically immaterial.
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Old 15th November 2015, 05:08 PM   #642
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Originally Posted by Jodie View Post
...
My stated belief has been untestable since the conversation started. It is speculation. It's not that I don't want them tested, it's a matter of no one knowing how to test it.
...
Not so much, the actual matter is that you haven't presented anything in support of your claim to test.


Originally Posted by Jodie View Post
...
There is no burden of proof for either side of the argument where anything can be decided definitively, nothing has changed.
...
Since it concerns your belief, your claim, the burden of proof rests squarely on your shoulders.
You know you can not meet that burden of proof and in addition to that, you have nothing to test.

You proselytize empty handed.
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Old 15th November 2015, 05:28 PM   #643
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Originally Posted by Jodie View Post
Because it isn't proven to be wrong.
Shifting the burden of proof. Should every unfalsifiable claim be shoved down someone's throat?

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Why wouldn't you?
The question itself explained that and you did not address it.

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If the question is "What is it that survives after our physical bodies die/" then it would be relevant to look.
But that's not the question. The question appears to be "Does our consciousness go to some other 'dimension' when we die?" That either presupposes one proposition or the other, or conflates them into a circular claim.

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However, I don't think science will advance much further without at least trying to find out if these other dimensions exist...
What makes you think science is or should be interested in what you think "dimensions" are? You lambast religion for having prejudiced our thinking. But how is your speculative attribution of various properties to these "dimensions" any different? Theoretical physicists indeed propose that reality may be describable in ways not immediately or intuitively apparent to us. But none of this requires or allows for your faerie realms -- even described as they are in sciency-sounding words. You're simply proposing another religion to take the place of older discredited ones. Your claims are still wanton speculation in defiance of known behavior and required to be taken on faith. You even use theistic patterns of argument to defend them -- "You can't prove God multidimensional reality doesn't exist!"

Last edited by JayUtah; 15th November 2015 at 06:34 PM.
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Old 15th November 2015, 06:43 PM   #644
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Originally Posted by Jodie View Post
Because it isn't proven to be wrong.
Go ahead and prove it right. Then you might have a point.



Originally Posted by Jodie View Post
Why wouldn't you? If the question is "What is it that survives after our physical bodies die/" then it would be relevant to look.
The answer is nothing beyond wishful thinking. If you wish to make the affirmative claim, then it is your burden of proof. as things stand, there is no evidence at all for the survival post mortem of anything.

Originally Posted by Jodie View Post
Of course no one is going to do that because the religions of the world have so distorted the perception of what an afterlife would be like it makes it seem ridiculous.
Seems?

Originally Posted by Jodie View Post
However, I don't think science will advance much further without at least trying to find out if these other dimensions exist and how they are integrated into our reality.
God of the very small and shrinking gaps. "How they are integrated into our reality" it is to laugh. They are part of our reality and always have been if they do in fact exist.
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Old 15th November 2015, 07:57 PM   #645
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Pretending? I pretend nothing, I believe that we live on after death. I might be wrong in how that's accomplished but I'm not giving up my belief simply because a few forum members think it's irrational. IMO I think the rational skeptic's approach is stupid when there is no concrete evidence to refute the possibility.

What chaos? No one forces you to respond to me. It is your responsibility regarding what you decide to respond to and post. If you can't have a speculative discussion because the topic makes you uncomfortable then that one is on you.
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Old 15th November 2015, 08:03 PM   #646
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Originally Posted by Jodie View Post
Pretending? I pretend nothing, I believe that we live on after death. I might be wrong in how that's accomplished but I'm not giving up my belief simply because a few forum members think it's irrational. IMO I think the rational skeptic's approach is stupid when there is no concrete evidence to refute the possibility.

What chaos? No one forces you to respond to me. It is your responsibility regarding what you decide to respond to and post. If you can't have a speculative discussion because the topic makes you uncomfortable then that one is on you.

Your claim - your burden of proof.

Nothing about that makes me uncomfortable. The fact that you find this stupid speaks volumes about you.
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Old 15th November 2015, 08:09 PM   #647
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Originally Posted by Jodie View Post
...but I'm not giving up my belief simply because a few forum members think it's irrational.
They're explaining why it's irrational. You can't answer except to promise to hold steadfastly to the faith regardless.

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IMO I think the rational skeptic's approach is stupid when there is no concrete evidence to refute the possibility.
Shifting the burden of proof so as to require refutation of an affirmative claim is always irrational. Mistaking mere "possibility" for actuality is a common fringe theorist's mistake. Again, you have no answer for this except to lash out at your critics.

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If you can't have a speculative discussion because the topic makes you uncomfortable then that one is on you.
Oh, get over yourself. It has been explained to you more times than I count that the objection -- which you mischaracterize as emotional discomfort -- is simply the predictable response to your blatant and demonstrated misuse of science and reason. You assiduously insist that it must be your critics' narrow worldview -- or, at times, their presumed ignorance -- that keeps them from agreeing with you. You ignore the reasons they actually state.

What sort of "speculative discussion" did you envision? You told us in the ghost-story thread that you come here to present your claims because you explicitly don't want just some echo chamber. That implies you anticipate some resistance, dissent, and dispute from the posters here. Yet when that expected resistance appears, we get this same unproductive song and dance from you.

If you want a forum free from dissent, go find an echo chamber. If you're going to proselytize to skeptics, expect exactly this sort of a response.
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Old 15th November 2015, 08:36 PM   #648
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Originally Posted by Jodie View Post
What chaos? No one forces you to respond to me. It is your responsibility regarding what you decide to respond to and post. If you can't have a speculative discussion because the topic makes you uncomfortable then that one is on you.
I wonder if this makes you uncomfortable. I am 100,000 years old, and have have stalked you through 40 of your previous lives during this period.

This is a speculative discussion, and I am right, and you are right as well about permanent life. Why don't you remember these previous experiences? Or do you?

We are all one!

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Old 16th November 2015, 12:53 AM   #649
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Originally Posted by Jodie View Post
Pretending? I pretend nothing, I believe that we live on after death.
Absent any evidence, that is called faith. Similar to my kids who pretend to have faith in Santa, even though they are old enough to know that Santa is not real. We all pretend he is just for the joy of it.

Originally Posted by Jodie View Post
I might be wrong in how that's accomplished
You are wrong thinking it exists.

Originally Posted by Jodie View Post
but I'm not giving up my belief simply because a few forum members think it's irrational.
Not a few and it is irrational.

Originally Posted by Jodie View Post
IMO I think the rational skeptic's approach is stupid when there is no concrete evidence to refute the possibility.
Do you have concrete evidence to SUPPORT the possibility? Of course not.

Originally Posted by Jodie View Post
What chaos? No one forces you to respond to me. It is your responsibility regarding what you decide to respond to and post.
Nor you. Where does that leave us?

Originally Posted by Jodie View Post
If you can't have a speculative discussion because the topic makes you uncomfortable then that one is on you.
Speculative discussions are fine. Speculation presented as fact is something very different.
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Old 16th November 2015, 02:48 AM   #650
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Originally Posted by Jodie View Post
... No one forces you to respond to me.. ...
That's not entirely true, since you're forcing your non-stuff into other people's faces.
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Old 16th November 2015, 07:12 AM   #651
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Jodie was Jabba in a former life! You can tell by her karma!

We are all numb.
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Old 16th November 2015, 08:33 AM   #652
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Originally Posted by sackett View Post
We are all numb.
And not comfortably.
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Old 17th November 2015, 05:49 PM   #653
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The lack of oxygen-theory of the brain is also not satisfying at all. Because some people with hyperoxygenation symptoms also had near death experiences. So, the socalled 'scientific' explanations fail.
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Old 17th November 2015, 06:04 PM   #654
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Originally Posted by Maartenn100 View Post
The lack of oxygen-theory of the brain is also not satisfying at all. Because some people with hyperoxygenation symptoms also had near death experiences. So, the socalled 'scientific' explanations fail.
I know how silly this sounds, but I don't suppose you have a link to this...
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Old 17th November 2015, 06:28 PM   #655
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The lifereview for example is rather then being a review, it is more like a reliving of the life of the experiencer but from a much greater point of consciousness and the life of any oter human being that he or she has ever effected in any way through any of her of his actions when he or she was existing in this physical world.

How can such a rich and enhanced awareness and meaningful experience be 'just the result of a dying brain'?
Such a socalled scientific explanation is not convincing at all for many intelligent people.
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'Where' is the image in the mind? What 'space' is the image in your mind in? Where is the dream? Where is your inner voice? It's not the same spacetime then where the electrical and chemical pulses are in the brain, causing this image or the dream. The image you see in your mind's eye is in a completely different dimension than where the chemistry in the brain is. (Maarten Vergucht)

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Old 17th November 2015, 06:32 PM   #656
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Originally Posted by Slowvehicle View Post
I know how silly this sounds, but I don't suppose you have a link to this...
I can't find a source, but someone who had an NDE was giving this argument on Youtube. You think she is not telling the truth?
I must admit: I can't find a source.
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'Where' is the image in the mind? What 'space' is the image in your mind in? Where is the dream? Where is your inner voice? It's not the same spacetime then where the electrical and chemical pulses are in the brain, causing this image or the dream. The image you see in your mind's eye is in a completely different dimension than where the chemistry in the brain is. (Maarten Vergucht)
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Old 17th November 2015, 06:36 PM   #657
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Originally Posted by Maartenn100 View Post
The lifereview for example is rather then being a review, it is more like a reliving of the life of the experiencer but from a much greater point of consciousness and the life of any oter human being that he or she has ever effected in any way through any of her of his actions when he or she was existing in this physical world.

How can such a rich and enhanced awareness and meaningful experience be 'just the result of a dying brain'?
Such a socalled scientific explanation is not convincing at all for many intelligent people.
Name some, just for laughs.
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Old 17th November 2015, 06:39 PM   #658
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Originally Posted by Maartenn100 View Post
How can such a rich and enhanced awareness and meaningful experience be 'just the result of a dying brain'?
Why not?

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Such a socalled scientific explanation is not convincing at all for many intelligent people.
"Believe me or else you're stupid." Well, I'm convinced.
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Old 17th November 2015, 06:40 PM   #659
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Originally Posted by Maartenn100 View Post
I can't find a source, but someone who had an NDE was giving this argument on Youtube. You think she is not telling the truth?
I must admit: I can't find a source.
You have alleged a fact. You need to substantiate the allegation. If you cannot, you don't get to compel people to accommodate that allegation into their reasoning. Until we can examine the claim, we can make no judgment regarding its credibility.
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Old 17th November 2015, 06:46 PM   #660
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Originally Posted by JayUtah View Post
Why not?
You don't have any proof for your claim, that's why.
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'Where' is the image in the mind? What 'space' is the image in your mind in? Where is the dream? Where is your inner voice? It's not the same spacetime then where the electrical and chemical pulses are in the brain, causing this image or the dream. The image you see in your mind's eye is in a completely different dimension than where the chemistry in the brain is. (Maarten Vergucht)
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Old 17th November 2015, 06:53 PM   #661
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I told you this before: anything about the inner experience of a soul (human or animal) can't be proven. That's an inherent characteristic of nature. To ask for proof of the experience of an NDE is asking for something totally impossible. Science can't go behind this boarder. Scientists are very limited when they want to have proof for consciousness.
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'Where' is the image in the mind? What 'space' is the image in your mind in? Where is the dream? Where is your inner voice? It's not the same spacetime then where the electrical and chemical pulses are in the brain, causing this image or the dream. The image you see in your mind's eye is in a completely different dimension than where the chemistry in the brain is. (Maarten Vergucht)

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Old 17th November 2015, 07:00 PM   #662
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That's right, you can make no judgement regarding credibility.
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Old 17th November 2015, 07:01 PM   #663
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Originally Posted by Daylightstar View Post
That's not entirely true, since you're forcing your non-stuff into other people's faces.
How does one force another forum member to do anything? Whop them upside the head with caps lock?
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Old 17th November 2015, 07:13 PM   #664
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Originally Posted by JayUtah View Post
They're explaining why it's irrational. You can't answer except to promise to hold steadfastly to the faith regardless.
Yes, but I'm not asking you to believe, you are trying to talk me out of it.Nothing you've offered thus far is anymore concrete than what I've linked. That's the difference.

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Shifting the burden of proof so as to require refutation of an affirmative claim is always irrational. Mistaking mere "possibility" for actuality is a common fringe theorist's mistake. Again, you have no answer for this except to lash out at your critics.
The only one " lashing" is you and a choice few others.

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Oh, get over yourself. It has been explained to you more times than I count that the objection -- which you mischaracterize as emotional discomfort -- is simply the predictable response to your blatant and demonstrated misuse of science and reason. You assiduously insist that it must be your critics' narrow worldview -- or, at times, their presumed ignorance -- that keeps them from agreeing with you. You ignore the reasons they actually state.
Go ahead and rationalize your discomfort with the topic any way you see fit. If you can't have a speculative discussion about something then simply don't participate.

Quote:
What sort of "speculative discussion" did you envision? You told us in the ghost-story thread that you come here to present your claims because you explicitly don't want just some echo chamber. That implies you anticipate some resistance, dissent, and dispute from the posters here. Yet when that expected resistance appears, we get this same unproductive song and dance from you.
I expect dissent, but outright ignoring what some physicists suggest regarding other dimensions seems to be cherry picking on your part.

Quote:
If you want a forum free from dissent, go find an echo chamber. If you're going to proselytize to skeptics, expect exactly this sort of a response.
The only reason you see it as proselytizing is because you find the topic of the afterlife as an unacceptable possibility for personal reasons of your own.
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Old 17th November 2015, 07:16 PM   #665
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Originally Posted by Maartenn100 View Post
I can't find a source, but someone who had an NDE was giving this argument on Youtube. You think she is not telling the truth?
I must admit: I can't find a source.
Surprise...
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Old 17th November 2015, 07:20 PM   #666
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Originally Posted by John Jones View Post
Your claim - your burden of proof.

Nothing about that makes me uncomfortable. The fact that you find this stupid speaks volumes about you.
You still haven't gotten over the errant/arrant debacle as evidenced by stalking me from thread to thread. I believe that needs no further comment to put things in the correct perspective.
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Old 17th November 2015, 07:28 PM   #667
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Originally Posted by Jodie View Post
Yes, but I'm not asking you to believe...
No, you're just asking what's wrong with people who don't. You chastise people for not "considering" your ideas. In fact your ideas have been considered and discussed at some length. That consideration does not result in approval, which seems to be what's bothering you.

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Go ahead and rationalize your discomfort...
What discomfort? You're being disagreed with. People are giving you the dispassionate reasons why they disagree. You're the only one trying to make it sound like an emotional thing.

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If you can't have a speculative discussion about something then simply don't participate.
Asked and answered. If you're not getting the responses you expected, then simply don't participate.

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I expect dissent, but outright ignoring what some physicists suggest regarding other dimensions seems to be cherry picking on your part.
Asked and answered. Your interpretation of the physicists you cite was given quite a lengthy treatment in your ghost-story thread -- posts you seem to have difficulty finding but which others located without any trouble. Disagreeing with your interpretation -- which you flatly admitted was inexpert -- does not constitute "ignoring" evidence.

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The only reason you see it as proselytizing is because you find the topic of the afterlife as an unacceptable possibility for personal reasons of your own.
Did that argument work for you in your ghost-story thread? No, it didn't. So don't keep trying. Your critics don't disagree with you because of some deep-seated fear or "personal reason." Your critics disagree with you because they can see how you have misrepresented your sources. And they've been kind enough to tell you how. That's quite compatible with the ostensible reason you presented those ideas in a skeptics forum. Pretending that your ideas are being criticized for reasons other than those clearly stated is just your wishful thinking.
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Old 17th November 2015, 07:31 PM   #668
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Originally Posted by Maartenn100 View Post
You don't have any proof for your claim, that's why.
You're the one claiming that near-death experiences are "a dying brain." I think that's a very simplistic characterization. But since it's your characterization, please define and support it.

You're the one claiming that reports of a "rich and varied" experience associated with near-death states of mind are incompatible with "a dying brain." You didn't explain how or why.

Please correct those deficiencies.
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Old 17th November 2015, 07:39 PM   #669
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Originally Posted by Maartenn100 View Post
I told you this before: anything about the inner experience of a soul (human or animal) can't be proven.
Yet for some reason you can tell us that "rich" experiences are not possible in the physiological state that gives rise to near-death experiences. Can you please reconcile your claim of inherent unknowability in these matters with your ability to assertively reject the competing hypothesis.

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To ask for proof of the experience of an NDE is asking for something totally impossible.
For starters all you've presented in evidence is your vague recollection of a YouTube video claiming some condition that, according to you, falsifies a physiological explanation for near-death experiences. It's not unreasonable to ask you for proof that this claim actually exists.

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Scientists are very limited when they want to have proof for consciousness.
Consciousness as a property of the human brain is well enough established. Insinuating that consciousness exists separately from the physiological embodiment of it is not entirely outside the realm of empirical study and hypothetico-deductive methods. It just is generally not supported by any of those exercises.
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Old 17th November 2015, 08:21 PM   #670
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Originally Posted by JayUtah View Post
No, you're just asking what's wrong with people who don't. You chastise people for not "considering" your ideas. In fact your ideas have been considered and discussed at some length. That consideration does not result in approval, which seems to be what's bothering you.
Very little was considered other than what motives I might have been for wanting to discuss the topic.

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What discomfort? You're being disagreed with. People are giving you the dispassionate reasons why they disagree. You're the only one trying to make it sound like an emotional thing.
All that has been said is that I've misunderstood the science, there hasn't been any detailed explanation as to how I'm wrong. I think I'm safe to assume that I'm not mistaken until serious discussion to the contrary occurs.

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Asked and answered. If you're not getting the responses you expected, then simply don't participate.
No, I've provided what was asked to the best of my ability, you and a few others have not. Saying that you have doesn't make it so.

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Asked and answered.
Only in some other alternate time line.

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Your interpretation of the physicists you cite was given quite a lengthy treatment in your ghost-story thread -- posts you seem to have difficulty finding but which others located without any trouble.
You mean simply saying someone is wrong is enough? Not by my standards.

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Disagreeing with your interpretation -- which you flatly admitted was inexpert -- does not constitute "ignoring" evidence.
There is no evidence to ignore because it is a hypothetical situation that can't be tested at the present

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Did that argument work for you in your ghost-story thread? No, it didn't. So don't keep trying. Your critics don't disagree with you because of some deep-seated fear or "personal reason." Your critics disagree with you because they can see how you have misrepresented your sources. And they've been kind enough to tell you how. That's quite compatible with the ostensible reason you presented those ideas in a skeptics forum. Pretending that your ideas are being criticized for reasons other than those clearly stated is just your wishful thinking.
I believe it's the opposite way around, but other than saying I'm wrong, no other explanation has been forth coming.
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Old 17th November 2015, 09:39 PM   #671
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Originally Posted by Maartenn100 View Post
The lifereview for example is rather then being a review, it is more like a reliving of the life of the experiencer but from a much greater point of consciousness and the life of any oter human being that he or she has ever effected in any way through any of her of his actions when he or she was existing in this physical world.
Speaking of a life review... Whenever I'm doing something really repetitive and boring for a sustained amount of time, I start having random memories pop up of things that have happened previously in my life, totally unrelated to what I'm doing. Anyone else have that happen?

Anyway, I've often thought that if it were overlayed with a sort of endorphin-fueled euphoria that makes everything seem vivid and important, rather than with boredom, it would be like the stories about a life review at death, and maybe the brain just does that sometimes when it's not getting enough external input.

But I don't know how I'd even begin to search if these sorts of unbidden life memories are common in certain situations like sustained boredom or similar almost trance-like states.
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Old 17th November 2015, 09:40 PM   #672
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Originally Posted by Jodie View Post
...but other than saying I'm wrong, no other explanation has been forth coming.
Let's let the readers decide whether you were appropriately answered in this thread (especially there at the end) and whether the record shows you paid adequate attention to the thread to know authoritatively what was and wasn't said in it.

http://www.internationalskeptics.com...=295654&page=7
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Old 18th November 2015, 12:19 AM   #673
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Jodie knows she's gaming.

She has me on some form of ignore. She is simply looping her "arguments" - mixing her special purple bridge paint.
She ignores substance and inflates opposition into attack.

All of this she does in every thread she's in.

It's like the toilet is leaking and the plumber is locked out.
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Old 18th November 2015, 01:18 AM   #674
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Originally Posted by Jodie View Post
All that has been said is that I've misunderstood the science, there hasn't been any detailed explanation as to how I'm wrong. I think I'm safe to assume that I'm not mistaken until serious discussion to the contrary occurs.
Have you watched the video I linked to? It provides the detailed explanation you have been asking for. Saying that nothing has been provided is disingenuous to say the least.
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Old 18th November 2015, 01:52 AM   #675
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Originally Posted by Jodie View Post
How does one force another forum member to do anything? Whop them upside the head with caps lock?
Who says one forces others to do something?
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Old 18th November 2015, 02:00 AM   #676
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Originally Posted by Jodie View Post
That's right, you can make no judgement regarding credibility.
That depends.
Once the claim is on the table and the claimant fails to support that claim in any way whatsoever, judgement of credibility is possible.
If the claimant does nothing but to persist with the claim and avoids providing any proper supporting evidence, credibility judgement becomes an easy logical consequence.
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Old 18th November 2015, 02:03 AM   #677
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Originally Posted by Maartenn100 View Post
I told you this before: anything about the inner experience of a soul (human or animal) can't be proven. That's an inherent characteristic of nature. To ask for proof of the experience of an NDE is asking for something totally impossible. Science can't go behind this boarder. Scientists are very limited when they want to have proof for consciousness.
And yet, you 'defend' the idea like a toothless tiger (cub).
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Old 18th November 2015, 04:59 AM   #678
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Originally Posted by Pup View Post
Speaking of a life review... Whenever I'm doing something really repetitive and boring for a sustained amount of time, I start having random memories pop up of things that have happened previously in my life, totally unrelated to what I'm doing. Anyone else have that happen?

...
Every time I read one of Maarten's threads...
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Old 18th November 2015, 05:38 AM   #679
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Science can't tell us anything about the Near Death Experience and about consciousness. That's not because the Near Death Experience or consciousness are illusions. It's because science is limited.
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Old 18th November 2015, 05:59 AM   #680
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Originally Posted by Maartenn100 View Post
Science can't tell us anything about the Near Death Experience and about consciousness. That's not because the Near Death Experience or consciousness are illusions. It's because science is limited.
I hear an echo. It's like a mosquito caught in a glass jar. Anyone else hearing it?
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