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Old 17th August 2006, 11:19 AM   #41
Axiom_Blade
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Originally Posted by Sword_Of_Truth View Post
While theoretically possible, I have never, ever, heard of such a person.
What. I know people like that. It can't be that obscure a position.

I think a combined Palestinian-Israeli state would be the most sensible solution; but who knows when, or if, that will ever happen, since extremists are running things on both sides.
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Old 17th August 2006, 07:02 PM   #42
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Here's a surprising one--Uncle Fetzer accusing a reporter of being Jewish.

Quote:
James Fetzer, a philosophy professor at the University of Minnesota who poses as a scientist, praised Venezuela President Hugo Chavez and promoted Chavez's proposal for an international criminal tribunal to put the Bush administration on trial. By e-mail, professor Fetzer accused me of being Jewish – sadly, I am not – because I disagree with his theories.
Yellow light, though, because this reporter's account of Steven Jones' comments in the paragraph above is questionable. It's my impression that Fetzer was the one who called for overthrow of the government. Indeed, he's fantasized about a military coup,

Still, if the reporter's got the email, I'd very much like to see it.
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Old 17th August 2006, 11:58 PM   #43
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Originally Posted by Axiom_Blade View Post
What. I know people like that. It can't be that obscure a position.

I think a combined Palestinian-Israeli state would be the most sensible solution; but who knows when, or if, that will ever happen, since extremists are running things on both sides.
I concur, AB - that it's not that obscure a position. In fact I fit the bill. I've got weird bloodlines (Sicilian-Jewish), and am assuredly not anti-semitic, but I don't think the STATE necessarily has any rights or moral imperative on its side. Remember, also that the radical left in the USA was largely Jewish (at least in NYC, so that's a very subjective statement, since that's where my experience with the movement came from). And many of that older generation are very much of the Anti-Zionist persuasion (using the LEGITIMATE meaning of the expression). I wouldn't be surprised to learn that a number of their offspring hold the same beliefs.
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Old 18th August 2006, 12:36 AM   #44
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Originally Posted by Axiom_Blade View Post
What. I know people like that. It can't be that obscure a position.

I think a combined Palestinian-Israeli state would be the most sensible solution; but who knows when, or if, that will ever happen, since extremists are running things on both sides.
With right of return? And while Palestinians are actively attempting to kill Israelis? There is no chance the Israelis will agree to this. It's a kumbayah notion.
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Old 18th August 2006, 02:30 AM   #45
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Originally Posted by Brainster View Post
With right of return? And while Palestinians are actively attempting to kill Israelis? There is no chance the Israelis will agree to this. It's a kumbayah notion.
This is off-topic...if you really want to discuss this, we should start another thread.
I thought the Palestinians' anger stems from being displaced (homes being bulldozed, etc.) If the source of the dispute is mitigated, then the killings would be, too?
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Old 18th August 2006, 05:06 AM   #46
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Originally Posted by Brainster View Post
Here's a surprising one--Uncle Fetzer accusing a reporter of being Jewish.



Yellow light, though, because this reporter's account of Steven Jones' comments in the paragraph above is questionable. It's my impression that Fetzer was the one who called for overthrow of the government. Indeed, he's fantasized about a military coup,

Still, if the reporter's got the email, I'd very much like to see it.
This is interesting. The SfT camp was the only one I hadn't seen at least overtones of anti-Semitism occurring in.
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Old 18th August 2006, 05:13 AM   #47
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Suggestion guys, if you want to get into the politics of Israel/Zionists and the Palestinians/Arabs/Muslims, may i suggest you proceed to the Political subforum, where you will be met with open arms (and raised verbal daggers) by some rather battle-scarred warriors on both sides of the discussion.
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Old 18th August 2006, 07:59 AM   #48
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Originally Posted by Axiom_Blade View Post
This is off-topic...if you really want to discuss this, we should start another thread.
I thought the Palestinians' anger stems from being displaced (homes being bulldozed, etc.) If the source of the dispute is mitigated, then the killings would be, too?
I'd rather drop the topic myself; it's not really one I'm interested in pursuing.
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Old 18th August 2006, 08:17 AM   #49
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Originally Posted by Axiom_Blade View Post
What if you oppose the existence of Israel, but you're not an anti-Semite? What word do you use then?
When it comes down to it, all modern countries are the result of force, establishing borders and keeping other people out. For most countries this happened fairly long ago so we don't pay attention to the fact that, for example, Britain was formed through wars with (mainly) France, Scandinavia and what is now Germany. Someone opposing Israel as a country for any reason other than the people who live in it, ie. Jews, would logically have to oppose the existence of almost every other country.
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Old 19th August 2006, 01:29 AM   #50
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Originally Posted by Brainster View Post
Here's a surprising one--Uncle Fetzer accusing a reporter of being Jewish.
Followup: WND allowed Fetzer to respond on their page, which has been posted in elsewhere. Here's what Fetzer has to say about the "Jewish" accusation:

Quote:
His blizzard of posts of low intellectual quality led me to send an e-mail asking about his background and education. In the absence of a response, I offered my own guess about the kind of person who would behave like this, speculating that he was 15 years old, very bright, probably Jewish, possibly a resident of Brooklyn, attending a scientific/technological high school, who believes that he is superior to everyone else and has an obsession to try and prove it! I was commenting on his behavior, not the subject of his posts – and it fits to a tee.
There are parts that don't quite add up to me. How do, "low intellectual quality" and "very bright" fit together? But let's see if we can put all that together in a sentence.

"You're probably a bright, smug, self-satisfied Jewish sophomore at Brooklyn Academy of Science who doesn't know bleep and thinks he's better than everybody else."

When you're addressing an adult, it's not hard to see that nothing in there is intended as a compliment, down to the "Jewish". I'm trying not to be too sensitive on this stuff, and I'm not Jewish myself (Irish Catholic). I certainly assume that Fetzer's not associated with Neo-Nazism.

But, as I said yesterday, Fetzer's a big deal. He has definitely become on of the faces of the Denial Movement.

I exchanged a few emails with Moseley today. He appears to be pretty well versed on the CT, but perhaps a little unfamiliar with the cast of characters. When I saw that he'd claimed Steven Jones had called for insurrection, I knew he'd somehow confused SJ with either AJ or Fetzer. Jones is absolutely the mildest-mannered person you can imagine in the 9-11 Denial Movement.
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Old 19th August 2006, 01:33 AM   #51
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Quote:
Jones is absolutely the mildest-mannered person you can imagine in the 9-11 Denial Movement.
theres a method to his mildness though, note when hes questioned on his thermite research he is quick to point out that he is still researching and hasnt drawn any conclusion syet, but then he sits idly back while fetzer rants and raves about him having "proved" thermite was used to bring down the towers

i think SJ just sits back and lets others do the talking so he can say "well I never said that"
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Old 19th August 2006, 09:07 AM   #52
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Here's one I'm not as doubtful about posting. The Loosers have another poll up; "Was it wrong to question the Holocaust?" Sixty-six percent say no.

Better, still, check out the comments:

Quote:
Sorry if some people thought it made the truth movement look bad, that was not my intention, N however there is no denying that 9/11 is connected to it.
The Holocaust and 9-11 are connected? Get these various comments from different people:

Quote:
I'm not denying that the Holocaust happened. I just think there might have been something fishy about it when it did occur.
Quote:
It's not wrong to question the Holocaust. Just don't try and drag it around with the 9/11 truth movement. They have no connection.
Quote:
well it's possible that Israel/Zionists was involved in 911 and they were involved with the holocaust, so there could be a connection.

I think all the huge events in the past few hundred years might be linked.
Yes, I seem to recall there were some Zionists involved with the Holocaust, as well. What was their role? Victims I believe?

And you know that the CT crowd is not going to leave alone that last sentence about how all the events of the past few hundred years are linked:

Quote:
...THOUSANDS
A Denier with some connections and seeming sense steps in:

Quote:
The connection with the Zionists, I agree with. But you start talking about Zionists being behind 9/11 and start talking about the Holocaust, and a lot of people will dismiss you and any evidence you have. Too many people don't have the distinction that Zionism is not Judaism. The Zionists have done a good job intertwining themselves with the Jewish faith. And has been posted numerous times here, there are Jews against Zionism.
But by a few posts later he's gone off the deep end:

Quote:
Okay. Israel and the Mossad connection is seperate in most people's minds from Zionism. The misconception is Zionism = Judaism. That's all I'm saying. Don't get into a trap about Zionism with the unitiated. Once some one sees the evidence of 9/11 and wants to expose the truth, then bring up the dancing Israelis, the Israeli "art students," the Fox News report on Israeli spying, etc. Then you can move on to Zionism not being Judaism and talk about the Zionists. Once you get past the Zionists, then you can move on to the history of it, and talk about the Holocaust.
Good old NesNYC explains how all these events are related:

Quote:
You're right, they are ABSOLUTELY connected in that the "Holocaust" was the outcome of a world war and 9/11 is the spark that will ignite the next world war. The same power player "banksters" that were involved in the creation of WW2 are the same people behind 9/11 and the coming WW3. To understand 9/11 fully, you must understand how WW2 happened and the mechanics of the "Holocaust" and how it has been used and manipulated to set up the Zionist state.
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Old 19th August 2006, 09:15 AM   #53
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Originally Posted by Brainster View Post
Good old NesNYC explains how all these events are related:


Oh good. I had always thought WW2 was caused by an evil man and his evil friends who had an evil ideology, managed to entice a powerful nation, and went on an aggressive rampage.

I feel much better knowing it was actually just the banks that did it.

-Andrew
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Old 19th August 2006, 05:40 PM   #54
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Originally Posted by gumboot View Post
I feel much better knowing it was actually just the banks that did it.
I stood in line at my bank for 20 minutes today to buy a roll of quarters. I am beginning to suspect that my bank is totally responsible.
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Old 19th August 2006, 06:38 PM   #55
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Hmmm, I see Mark Lane and We the People mentioned. If you're interested in Neo-Nazism and how it turned into the "tax movement" I suggest going to the Quatloos forums and PMing a moderator that goes by the name Demosthenes. She's been watching the tax deniers back when they started out as neo-nazis and has some of their papers and such. She may have more links between AFP and the nazi movement.

http://www.quatloos.com
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