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Old 9th October 2018, 10:32 AM   #2521
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
The occasion makes the thief this is the same thing with the guns, the more you have guns in the population, the more people will get killed. If you want to withdraw the problem, the problem that makes human to benefit to take advantage of each others, you withdraw the opportunity that makes that system easy, money.
But in your system, guns will be free. Everyone will have guns and run around killing each other. Maybe guns should be made more expensive to deter people from buying them. The result will be fewer deaths,


Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
Some people think it is not the money, it is the nature of human, but a system that makes profit of injustice should not be use. The less you pay for the work of others and the more you get paid for your work is your profit should not be used. The true justice is the price paid for your work is the price you want to pay for the work of others, zero dollar.
Gaetan, just watch nature and you can see why money is important. A bear will fatten itself up before their winter hibernation. Squirrels will gather a stockpile of nuts so they can survive through the winter and have enough food. Humans store money because it's a resource that can be used to purchase food and other things without constantly having to work on a daily basis.
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Old 9th October 2018, 01:23 PM   #2522
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
Some people think it is not the money, it is the nature of human, but a system that makes profit of injustice should not be use. The less you pay for the work of others and the more you get paid for your work is your profit should not be used. The true justice is the price paid for your work is the price you want to pay for the work of others, zero dollar.
Again as far as I recall no one here but you has asserted they want to pay people "zero dollar". If you find your own perspective, of what you want people to be paid, unjust then I recommend you correct your perspective, of what you want people to be paid.


Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
The occasion makes the thief this is the same thing with the guns, the more you have guns in the population, the more people will get killed. If you want to withdraw the problem, the problem that makes human to benefit to take advantage of each others, you withdraw the opportunity that makes that system easy, money.

As noted already free guns means more guns and it is actually easier to take advantage of others without money.
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Old 10th October 2018, 09:03 AM   #2523
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If people would be Saint they would pay the maximum price the work of their neighbour and don't ask to be paid for their work. As Saints have no money they live on charity like Jesus Christ.

Human nature want to be paid for the maximum for their work and not pay for the work of others. Then money has people to try to take advantage of each others and this is no good for the collectivity. Look at a policeman that represent the public order sees a fight between two guys he'll try to separate them but we allow people to fight against each others for the benefit of money. We allow that stupid system works.
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Old 10th October 2018, 10:24 AM   #2524
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
If people would be Saint they would pay the maximum price the work of their neighbour and don't ask to be paid for their work. As Saints have no money they live on charity like Jesus Christ.
If you aren't paid for your own work, how would you be able to pay the maximum for the work of their neighbor? That's basically the same situation you are protesting now.

Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
Human nature want to be paid for the maximum for their work and not pay for the work of others. Then money has people to try to take advantage of each others and this is no good for the collectivity. Look at a policeman that represent the public order sees a fight between two guys he'll try to separate them but we allow people to fight against each others for the benefit of money. We allow that stupid system works.
That isn't human nature to be paid the maximum and not pay anything in return. It's quite natural to believe that a doctor should be paid more than a guy sweeping floors because doctors provide a valuable service that not everyone in society can do. Whereas anyone, including children are capable of sweeping floors.

Therefore, it's fair to assume that a doctor should earn more than a guy sweeping floors.
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Old 10th October 2018, 10:40 AM   #2525
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
If people would be Saint they would pay the maximum price the work of their neighbour and don't ask to be paid for their work. As Saints have no money they live on charity like Jesus Christ.
I don't care to be a saint. Or a Saint.

Quote:
Human nature want to be paid for the maximum for their work and not pay for the work of others. Then money has people to try to take advantage of each others and this is no good for the collectivity. Look at a policeman that represent the public order sees a fight between two guys he'll try to separate them but we allow people to fight against each others for the benefit of money. We allow that stupid system works.
No, people work cooperatively for money. Without money, we would revert to hunter/gatherers and then you would see a fight.

Why do you want people to die brutal deaths fighting each other?
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Old 10th October 2018, 07:45 PM   #2526
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Originally Posted by RoboTimbo View Post
No, people work cooperatively for money.
You want to be paid the maximum and he wants to pay you the minimum. Who will solve that question? The Trump judge?
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Old 10th October 2018, 08:26 PM   #2527
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
You want to be paid the maximum and he wants to pay you the minimum. Who will solve that question? The Trump judge?
You have a weird Trump fixation. I'd be happy to sell him to you.
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Old 11th October 2018, 08:05 AM   #2528
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Originally Posted by RoboTimbo View Post
You have a weird Trump fixation. I'd be happy to sell him to you.
Money from rich elects politicians in US not people.
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Old 11th October 2018, 08:12 AM   #2529
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
You want to be paid the maximum and he wants to pay you the minimum. Who will solve that question? The Trump judge?
Er you agree on a figure. It's not rocket science.

Unless obviously, you are a rocket scientist.

The 'you' is generic, it's pretty obvious you are not...
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Old 11th October 2018, 10:17 AM   #2530
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
You want to be paid the maximum and he wants to pay you the minimum. Who will solve that question? The Trump judge?
Gaetan, do you have no concept of supply and demand? If I own a business and I need someone to sweep my floors, I might advertise a help wanted sign. I'm sure if I offered to pay zero dollars per hour, nobody will apply for such work. If I offer say $12 an hour, I will get applicants but it will mostly be high schoolers or college kids who need a part time job. If I offer $50 an hour, half of my community will either think it's a scam or they will apply for the job.

The fact that nobody will apply to work for a job that pays zero dollars per hour is really strong evidence that a no money system will not work.
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Old 11th October 2018, 10:30 AM   #2531
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
<snip political insanity>
Not sure what that has to do with a no-money "economy" but anyway...

Until you send me all your money and come clean my toilets, nobody believes you. Sorry, that's just the way it is.
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Old 11th October 2018, 12:59 PM   #2532
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Originally Posted by Joecool View Post

The fact that nobody will apply to work for a job that pays zero dollars per hour is really strong evidence that a no money system will not work.
It doesn't matter the money when everything is free.
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Old 11th October 2018, 01:22 PM   #2533
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
It doesn't matter the money when everything is free.
Not much will matter when everything is free. The people who clean sewers will stop working because they no longer have to work in order to get stuff. Everything is free.

Things in limited supply such as medicine will get looted because there's not enough for everyone and no more will be made because drug companies, which operate on profits (money) will no longer exist in a no money world.

We will go back to the dark ages where might becomes right.
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Old 11th October 2018, 01:42 PM   #2534
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
It doesn't matter the money when everything is free.
Awesome! I can quit work and I'll have all the mansions and yachts and fast cars and guns I want! Everything is free!
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Old 11th October 2018, 05:23 PM   #2535
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
It doesn't matter the money when everything is free.
Resources aren't unlimited. You might want to take a look at the various water crisis in California. Making water free would only serve to make the problems worse, not better.
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Old 11th October 2018, 07:43 PM   #2536
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Originally Posted by RoboTimbo View Post
Awesome! I can quit work and I'll have all the mansions and yachts and fast cars and guns I want! Everything is free!
You agree that people will work so that you can enjoy that.
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Old 11th October 2018, 07:45 PM   #2537
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Originally Posted by Leftus View Post
Resources aren't unlimited. You might want to take a look at the various water crisis in California. Making water free would only serve to make the problems worse, not better.
The ocean is full of water, you'll get that in your home at no cost.
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Old 12th October 2018, 02:20 AM   #2538
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
You agree that people will work so that you can enjoy that.
No problem. According to YOU they will work for free.
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Old 12th October 2018, 02:21 AM   #2539
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
The ocean is full of water, you'll get that in your home at no cost.
How will you desalinate it? How will you get it to all homes?
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Old 12th October 2018, 03:26 AM   #2540
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Originally Posted by abaddon View Post
How will you desalinate it? How will you get it to all homes?
I believe in miracles....

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Old 12th October 2018, 05:21 AM   #2541
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
You agree that people will work so that you can enjoy that.
You agree that people won't work so we'll be reduced to hunter/gatherer barbarity. You will enjoy that.
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Old 12th October 2018, 05:23 AM   #2542
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
The ocean is full of water
Which will be great for people who can drink salt water.

Quote:
you'll get that in your home at no cost.
As long as your home is within walking distance of an ocean.
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Old 12th October 2018, 11:43 AM   #2543
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
You agree that people will work so that you can enjoy that.
I don't agree. The moment that the news announces that Gaetan's no money world has taken effect, I will quit working and enjoy free golf, free steak and lobster dinners and free lodging at the nearest Hilton hotel.
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Old 12th October 2018, 04:17 PM   #2544
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
The ocean is full of water, you'll get that in your home at no cost.
I don't drink salt water. I also don't water my plants with it either.

My monthly water bill is roughly 24 bucks. 80 cents a day. There is zero chance that desalination will make it cheaper. Now I know that you won't take this into consideration, but cheaper also means fewer resources to deliver. Desalination adds more resources, and raises the costs and lowers the feasibility. All you've done is "solve" a resource issue by using more resources which are also limited.
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Old 13th October 2018, 06:32 AM   #2545
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
If people would be Saint they would pay the maximum price the work of their neighbour and don't ask to be paid for their work. As Saints have no money they live on charity like Jesus Christ.
If everyone were a "Saint" it would diminish the distinction of being, well, a "Saint".

Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
Human nature want to be paid for the maximum for their work and not pay for the work of others.
Your particular disdain for what you perceive to be "Human nature" doesn't actually make it either "Human nature" or just a predominate trend.


Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
Then money has people to try to take advantage of each others and this is no good for the collectivity. Look at a policeman that represent the public order sees a fight between two guys he'll try to separate them but we allow people to fight against each others for the benefit of money. We allow that stupid system works.
Again people can "try to take advantage of each others" and even fight without money. Was the "policeman that represent the public order" not paid to do so?
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Old 13th October 2018, 06:37 AM   #2546
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
You want to be paid the maximum and he wants to pay you the minimum. Who will solve that question? The Trump judge?

See, that's where the "cooperatively for money" RoboTimbo mentioned comes in and fagin lays it out that they "agree on a figure."
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Old 13th October 2018, 07:51 AM   #2547
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Originally Posted by Joecool View Post
I don't agree. The moment that the news announces that Gaetan's no money world has taken effect, I will quit working and enjoy free golf, free steak and lobster dinners and free lodging at the nearest Hilton hotel.
You probably need to get those reservations in now, since there are only a few hundred rooms at that Hilton and probably the same number of tee times too.

This is the problem that Gaetan is either unwilling or unable to grasp. Money, and in this case, green fees, is what makes golf courses accessible. It provides the barrier that lowers demand so that the supply of tee times is available to those that want it.

That is what most of us know, when there is no cost, demand rises. I don't need another TV, but if it were free, there is no reason I wouldn't take one. This creates waste. It also disincentives maintenance of goods. Why should I maintain my car, fridge, house, washer, dryer, etc. when a new and improved model is there for the taking?
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Old 13th October 2018, 07:53 AM   #2548
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Originally Posted by The Man View Post
See, that's where the "cooperatively for money" RoboTimbo mentioned comes in and fagin lays it out that they "agree on a figure."
You don't agree, you pay what you have to or Trump judge will take care of that.
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Old 13th October 2018, 08:22 AM   #2549
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
You don't agree, you pay what you have to or Trump judge will take care of that.
That's not the way it works. You only have a "Trump judge" involved if there is some sort of agreement (read - contract) which spells out the activity and compensation that has been agreed to. If there is no agreement, there is nothing for a "Trump judge" to enforce.
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Old 13th October 2018, 08:27 AM   #2550
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
You don't agree, you pay what you have to or Trump judge will take care of that.
Trump is not a judge and doesn't dictate what people have to pay for anything other than his own properties and products. As I don't purchase such trump properties and products I don't have to agree with what he might charge for them.
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Old 13th October 2018, 08:45 AM   #2551
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
You don't agree, you pay what you have to or Trump judge will take care of that.
You agree that fixation on authority figures is a sign of religion aberration and mental illness?

Maybe you should go back to talking about money.
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Old 13th October 2018, 11:05 AM   #2552
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After the murder of the journalist in the Saoudien consul in Turkey Trump must answer questions about his support of the Saoudien cruel regime. Does he put money before the human right?
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Old 13th October 2018, 11:43 AM   #2553
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So you're advocating that everyone should be given millions of dollars so there won't be any incentive to do any crimes?
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Old 13th October 2018, 01:21 PM   #2554
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
After the murder of the journalist in the Saoudien consul in Turkey Trump must answer questions about his support of the Saoudien cruel regime. Does he put money before the human right?
Dude, Trump puts money before everything, do you live under a rock?
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Old Yesterday, 10:56 AM   #2555
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
After the murder of the journalist in the Saoudien consul in Turkey Trump must answer questions about his support of the Saoudien cruel regime. Does he put money before the human right?
How would a lack of money make this any better?

Money can't buy happiness but it can make your misery more comfortable.
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