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#1001 |
Philosopher
Join Date: Dec 2006
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"I don't think I'm getting the most out of my computer. I turn it on... and use it as a light." - Harry Hill |
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#1002 |
Philosopher
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Spokane, WA
Posts: 7,086
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The Home Office answered that question for me. A substantial but unknown number of communities has been conceded to Muslim parallel societies and aren't beholden to UK law.
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As for the "getting people on the Internet to prove something" challenge...well, the top comment from that article--with 1056 upvotes and only 27 downvotes--corroborates everything I've been saying thus far. "At first one would say 'beyond belief' but if you have lived in this country over the years then you would not in anyway be surprised! A country within a country." |
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#1003 |
Philosopher
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Spokane, WA
Posts: 7,086
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#1004 |
Master Poster
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 2,217
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"CD does not prove 9/11 was an inside job. It only proves CD"- FalseFlag |
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#1005 |
Philosopher
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 5,345
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"I love sex and drugs and sausage rolls But nothing compares to Archie Gemmill's goal" |
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#1006 |
Professional Nemesis for Hire
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Not where I should be.
Posts: 5,847
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A baby smoking? That's child abuse - UncaYimmy Your avatar really cracked me up the first hundred or so times I saw it...Now, it gets on my nerves.. - Skeptical Greg ![]() |
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#1007 |
Lackey
Administrator
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: South East, UK
Posts: 84,737
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#1008 |
Now. Do it now.
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: UK
Posts: 24,805
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You are conflating two separate things: Sharia "law" (it isn't), and no-go areas. There are no such thing as the latter, and the former is one of the many different forms of conciliation process that is acceptable before cases go to court. It isn't applicable to criminal activity, but is a voluntary arrangement in cases of civil disagreement.
I am an architect, and administer contracts between clients and builders all the time. Built into every contract is a dispute resolution process, in which the parties agree to trying conciliation or arbitration to resolve disputes prior to going to court. Sharia "courts" hold the same place in law as these processes. It is not the sinister thing you like to believe. As an atheist, I would rather they didn't exist, and that no religious body ever gets to determine anything. However, for some people Sharia "courts" (they're not courts at all, they're more like councils) are a useful way of resolving disputes before they escalate into something requiring recourse to the law. They actually spend most of their time sorting out "divorces" of people who aren't actually officially married. Now, of course you will ignore all that and just blather on about Sharia and no-go areas as if I had said nothing. |
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"The Conservatives want to keep wogs out and march boldly back to the 1950s when Britain still had an Empire and blacks, women, poofs and Irish knew their place." The Don That's what we've sunk to here. |
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#1009 |
Now. Do it now.
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: UK
Posts: 24,805
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That is simply a lie. A 100% falsehood. It is not the case at all, in any way. That won't stop you repeating it, which confirms you as a liar.
The only people living in the country who aren't subject to UK law are foreign diplomats, as is the case in every country in the world. |
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"The Conservatives want to keep wogs out and march boldly back to the 1950s when Britain still had an Empire and blacks, women, poofs and Irish knew their place." The Don That's what we've sunk to here. |
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#1010 |
Philosopher
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Spokane, WA
Posts: 7,086
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Because I believe in women's rights, gay rights, animal rights, victim's rights, etc. I have the conviction to stand up for these rights. I'm sorry you don't.
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#1011 |
Philosopher
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 8,261
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"I don't think I'm getting the most out of my computer. I turn it on... and use it as a light." - Harry Hill |
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#1012 |
Lackey
Administrator
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: South East, UK
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#1013 |
Lackey
Administrator
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: South East, UK
Posts: 84,737
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Yes I agree there is some legitimate concerns about ensuring people (especially those in potentially vulnerable groups) know their rights and the legal implications and limits of voluntary arbitration. And I do know there have been targeted campaigns to try and reach potentially vulnerable people.
But unless we want to strip all of us of our right to agree to voluntary arbitration there isn't much more we can do. And removing the right to agree to voluntary arbitration would mean our courts would be overwhelmed within days. |
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#1014 |
Philosopher
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Besźel or Ul Qoma - not sure...
Posts: 8,812
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#1015 |
Philosopher
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Besźel or Ul Qoma - not sure...
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#1016 |
Lackey
Administrator
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#1017 |
Philosopher
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#1018 |
Philosopher
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Besźel or Ul Qoma - not sure...
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#1019 |
Lackey
Administrator
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#1020 |
Penultimate Amazing
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 11,595
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Audiophile/biker/sceptic |
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#1021 |
Penultimate Amazing
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 11,595
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Here is an example that is often seen in Scotland;
https://img.theculturetrip.com/840x4...t_2011_159.jpg the Protestant Orange Lodge. The also common is the traditional "dog collar" seen on reverends/ministers and the "habit" worn by nuns. Then other religions have various head dresses and women wear traditional clothing. Did you really need that explaining to you? |
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#1022 |
Penultimate Amazing
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 11,595
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Audiophile/biker/sceptic |
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#1023 |
Penultimate Amazing
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 11,595
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All religions have the or own courts deciding on matters pertaining to their church, the conduct of its members, church policy and secular activity to name but a few. Here is the Church of Scotland's;
http://www.churchofscotland.org.uk/a...neral_assembly |
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#1024 |
Philosopher
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 8,261
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So it's your contention that this Clockwork Orange looking gaggle comprise those who the poster alleged 'have their lives made a misery because of their religious dress'? Plus ministers in dog collars and nuns wearing habits. Are you asserting that these are the people who are being actively protected by this message?
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#1025 |
Bandaged ice that stampedes inexpensively through a scribbled morning waving necessary ankles
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Cair Paravel, according to XKCD
Posts: 28,485
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Hang on a moment. When did we establish that protecting people from religiously motivated assault was a bad thing unless they're Christian?
(Oh, and by the way, there's a long history of orthodox Jews being singled out for persecution based on their religious dress. Did you want that revived, or are you OK with posters telling people not to do it?) Dave |
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Me: So what you're saying is that, if the load carrying ability of the lower structure is reduced to the point where it can no longer support the load above it, it will collapse without a jolt, right? Tony Szamboti: That is right |
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#1026 |
Penultimate Amazing
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 11,595
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I was only showing you examples of religious dress seen in Scotland. I have not looked at any crime figures for which religions are at the receiving end of the most/least amount of hate.
The message is any religious dress should be tolerated and not cause the wearer to be the subject of hate. You just thought it was to protect Muslims because you were ignorant of Scottish religious issues, which to be fair, many people do not. There is a very distinctive attitude here, resulting in what happened to the Muslim suicide bomber attackers at Glasgow Airport; https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...ism.features11 "This is Glasgow. We'll just set aboot ye...."I got a kick in," he said. "Other passengers were getting kicks in. The flames were going in two directions ... You know when you're younger, you put a can of Lynx [aftershave] on the fire, and it's like a flame thrower." And: "Me and other folk were just trying to get the boot in and some other guy banjoed him". (To banjo is Scottish slang for to hit someone as hard as you can.)" |
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#1027 |
Philosopher
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 8,261
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First, we're not talking about assault. I'm pretty sure everyone understands that assault is a crime and the police don't want us to to do it. The poster talks of 'intolerance' and 'hate', which are not physical attacks but modes of thought and expression.
Second, it's clear that this poster is targeted at Christians. If you don't want to see it you don't, but numerous Christian groups believe the same thing. If the poster was designed to protect them don't you think they'd be thankful as opposed to considering legal action against it? The rise in anti-Semitism has come about in no small part through Islamic immigration and radicalisation. Anti-semitism is now embraced by the leader of the UK's second largest mainstream party who courts the Muslim vote. The idea that this poster is protecting Jews would be laughable if it weren't so tragic. It's cheerleading for the very group from which anti-Semitism mostly stems.
Originally Posted by Medhi Hassan
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#1028 |
Philosopher
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 8,261
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The fact is, and you and I both know it, that the people who routinely walk around in religious dress are Muslim females. Forget your dog collars and your habits and your sashes, that is what this poster is referring to.
And before you say it, no, I absolutely do not support people attacking anybody, for the way they dress or any other stupid reason. That is not what this poster is saying. It's effectively putting religious criticism on the wrong side of the law. If you show 'intolerance' for religious dress, or religious thought, then we'll come for you. That's the message. Not, "If you punch a woman in a hijab we'll come for you," which is expected and desired by all right-minded people. I have no doubt that the Scottish have no time for terrorists, just like the English, but we're not talking about terrorists here, we're talking about what is essentially blasphemy law. |
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#1029 | |||
Illuminator
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 4,775
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This is the kind of filthy, disgusting bigotry against Orangemen we once had to endure in the UK. Thankfully, after the posters went up, it's a thing of the past...
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"The cure for everything is salt water - tears, sweat or the sea." Isak Dinesen |
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#1030 |
Master Poster
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Dundee
Posts: 2,488
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It's not an exact science - the report is based on an analyst's judgement, but this report (page 18) indicates that that over 80% of incidents are linked to Roman Catholic or Protestant victims. Islam is 17%, which is slightly telling given that Muslims (in 2011 census) make up only 1.4% of the population.
Of course, the religion of the perpatrator is not recorded, as that would be too helpful, but also very problematic I would imagine. |
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"Violence is the last refuge of the incompetent" Isaac Asimov Not all cults are bad - I've joined a cult of niceness ![]() |
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#1031 |
Bandaged ice that stampedes inexpensively through a scribbled morning waving necessary ankles
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Cair Paravel, according to XKCD
Posts: 28,485
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The series of posters is aimed at bigots, disablists, transphobes, homophobes and racists. You and the groups you reference are the ones who insist that this set of epithets uniquely describes Christians; the rest of us are prepared to acccept that actually it simply describes bigots, disablists, transphobes, homophobes and racists.
Dave |
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Me: So what you're saying is that, if the load carrying ability of the lower structure is reduced to the point where it can no longer support the load above it, it will collapse without a jolt, right? Tony Szamboti: That is right |
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#1032 |
Philosopher
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 8,261
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"I don't think I'm getting the most out of my computer. I turn it on... and use it as a light." - Harry Hill |
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#1033 |
Master Poster
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Dundee
Posts: 2,488
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"Violence is the last refuge of the incompetent" Isaac Asimov Not all cults are bad - I've joined a cult of niceness ![]() |
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#1034 |
Philosopher
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 8,261
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Who is this 'rest of us'? A few apologists on a forum or the numerous Christian groups who are taking action against the originators of the poster?
And again, the hypocrisy is formidable. I bet that at any time, in any one of the current threads in the Religion forum, there are be several recent posts displaying the alleged bigotry and hate for which you are quite happy for people to be arrested. Yet they pass without comment. How is this so? |
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#1036 |
Philosopher
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 8,261
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"I don't think I'm getting the most out of my computer. I turn it on... and use it as a light." - Harry Hill |
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#1037 |
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Location: Besźel or Ul Qoma - not sure...
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#1038 |
Philosopher
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 8,261
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"I don't think I'm getting the most out of my computer. I turn it on... and use it as a light." - Harry Hill |
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#1039 |
Now. Do it now.
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: UK
Posts: 24,805
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"The Conservatives want to keep wogs out and march boldly back to the 1950s when Britain still had an Empire and blacks, women, poofs and Irish knew their place." The Don That's what we've sunk to here. |
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#1040 |
Pi
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 16,855
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I appreciate that, and the efforts of yourself and others.
However, once the subject has demonstrated an absolute inability to connect with reality, then it's just banging your head against a brick wall that's never going to move. When the simple answers to simple questions are not given, then you can't force the man to be reasonable and logical. It's like arguing with a two year old, pointless, frustrating and nothing's going to change. |
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