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Tags Clinton controversies , hillary clinton

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Old 26th May 2018, 07:52 PM   #161
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By this point in the terms of the last two presidents, I'd started forgetting who the losing candidates were. I don't hear too much about the losing Republican candidates (or any other party) even though they lost too, didn't they?
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Old 26th May 2018, 08:07 PM   #162
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Originally Posted by logger View Post
Do you really need it explained WHY theyíre extreme left?
YES. ABSOLUTELY!!

It seems to me you are not actually evaluating them based on their opinions and votes on cases, but on who appointed them...and then saying Bill Clinton appointed extreme left justices. It's your circular logic.
Originally Posted by logger View Post
Do you not believe they are extreme left?
No, not even close to being extreme left. But then I follow the court very closely.

The Clintons are very conservative Democrats. For example, Clinton pushed through Congress both the banking and insurance modernization acts with very little Democratic support and overwhelming Republican support. This ended Glass Steagall. Clinton pushed through Welfare reform that limited the time people could be on welfare and created work requirements. There is much more.

When you say 'left', I frankly don't know what you mean. I personally hate the terms left and right, conservative and liberal because they are close to meaningless.
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Old 26th May 2018, 08:12 PM   #163
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
YES. ABSOLUTELY!!

It seems to me you are not actually evaluating them based on their opinions and votes on cases, but on who appointed them...and then saying Bill Clinton appointed extreme left justices. It's your circular logic.


No, not even close to being extreme left. But then I follow the court very closely.

The Clintons are very conservative Democrats. For example, Clinton pushed through Congress both the banking and insurance modernization acts with very little Democratic support and overwhelming Republican support. This ended Glass Steagall. Clinton pushed through Welfare reform that limited the time people could be on welfare and created work requirements. There is much more.

When you say 'left', I frankly don't know what you mean. I personally hate the terms left and right, conservative and liberal because they are close to meaningless.
Let me ask this to prove a point. Who do you consider extreme left on the court now?
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Old 26th May 2018, 08:53 PM   #164
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Originally Posted by logger View Post
Let me ask this to prove a point. Who do you consider extreme left on the court now?
None of them. ABSOLUTELY NONE of THEM. The last Justice I think was truly liberal was William O. Douglas

But I don't look at the court through that lens. I look at the decisions and ask myself if I agree with their legal reasoning and the the effect.
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Old 26th May 2018, 10:11 PM   #165
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Originally Posted by logger View Post
Let me ask this to prove a point. Who do you consider extreme left on the court now?

Why don't you try answering the responses to the questions you already posed, instead of trying to feint in a different direction to avoid them?
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Old 27th May 2018, 02:08 AM   #166
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
None of them. ABSOLUTELY NONE of THEM. The last Justice I think was truly liberal was William O. Douglas
Thatís what I suspected, Iím glad I didnít waste my time showing you their liberalism.
Quote:
But I don't look at the court through that lens. I look at the decisions and ask myself if I agree with their legal reasoning and the the effect.
Obviously! And hilariously!

Because the court is never decided on ideology.
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Old 27th May 2018, 05:50 AM   #167
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Originally Posted by logger View Post
Thatís what I suspected, Iím glad I didnít waste my time showing you their liberalism.
You slip is showing again. You didn't waste your time showing us their liberalism because.... why? Your claim is "extreme left". Now go back to the start and show us the extreme leftists, not liberals, on the Supreme Court.

For the class,... here's your original statement:
Quote:
No itís not that simple, her husband, the predator in chief put extreme leftists on the Supreme Court. Besides there arenít really very many conservative Democrats, plenty of socialist Dems, which she is one.
You've been wandering around lost in the conservative brush for so long you think of anyone who doesn't adhere to your reactionary ideas as Extreme Left, but that's interchangeable with "Liberal" which is interchangeable with "Moderate" which is amazingly interchangeable with "John McCain". In short, anyone not on the Mercer/Bannon approved list of paleo conservatives.
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Old 27th May 2018, 06:27 AM   #168
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Originally Posted by Foolmewunz View Post
You slip is showing again. You didn't waste your time showing us their liberalism because.... why? Your claim is "extreme left". Now go back to the start and show us the extreme leftists, not liberals, on the Supreme Court.

For the class,... here's your original statement:


You've been wandering around lost in the conservative brush for so long you think of anyone who doesn't adhere to your reactionary ideas as Extreme Left, but that's interchangeable with "Liberal" which is interchangeable with "Moderate" which is amazingly interchangeable with "John McCain". In short, anyone not on the Mercer/Bannon approved list of paleo conservatives.

And more and more of even those are having trouble keeping up with that goal line, which seems to be receding to the right at an increasing velocity
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Old 27th May 2018, 07:21 AM   #169
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Originally Posted by Slings and Arrows View Post
Well there you have it, proof positive that Hillary Clinton is a misogynist and a homophobe.

And on top of that, since Andrew Cuomo is a white male, Hillary must also be a racist.
Laughable.

Or maybe not, if you can provide evidence that...
Quote:
... spent the last couple of years hearing that anyone who supports a male candidate over a female candidate has to be anti-women
If this is proof positive, and if the writer ("Rusty") has been spent a couple of years hearing it, then it should be a stroll in the park to provide evidence that Hillary ever said something like that.

Preemptively, "vote for me because woman are awesome" or the like doesn't qualify.

I eagerly await your response and the resultant mutual knowledge transfer.

Add: I do realize I'm going out on a limb here, what with "Rusty" as the data source.

* * * *

This thread is inspiring me to resurrect Sarah Palin and flail at her as if that would even be slightly relevant in 2018.
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Last edited by varwoche; 27th May 2018 at 07:35 AM.
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Old 27th May 2018, 07:53 AM   #170
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Originally Posted by varwoche View Post
<snip>

This thread is inspiring me to resurrect Sarah Palin and flail at her as if that would even be slightly relevant in 2018.

It probably wouldn't make a dent on the people you'd be aiming it at.

I am quite sure that they would, without the slightest hint or even awareness of irony, explain how she had been railroaded by her political opponents, and that her record was grossly distorted or even fabricated by her enemies.
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Old 27th May 2018, 08:01 AM   #171
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Originally Posted by logger View Post
Thatís what I suspected, Iím glad I didnít waste my time showing you their liberalism.


Obviously! And hilariously!

Because the court is never decided on ideology.
You still haven't said what 'extreme left' opinions either Breyer or Ginsburg has written and what makes those positions 'extreme left'. You keep saying these people are extreme. I want to understand in your mind what is an EXTREME left position.

And compared to what? Your position? The positions held by the majority or perhaps just by the Alabama chapter of the John Birch Society?
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Old 27th May 2018, 11:46 AM   #172
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Originally Posted by Slings and Arrows View Post
Well there you have it, proof positive that Hillary Clinton is a misogynist and a homophobe.

And on top of that, since Andrew Cuomo is a white male, Hillary must also be a racist.
It's hilarious when y'all try to imitate people who point out obvious bigots like Dolt 45, yet somehow never manage to figure out that it's their beliefs and actions that earn them the label, and not simply because they're "a white male".

Also, Cuomo's big problem is his conservative (note the difference between "conservative" and "bigoted reactionary") lean, and his habit of manipulating party politics using money. IMO, His main opponent Nixon (who is also white, dunno how picking one over the other makes Hillary Clinton "racist") is the simple fact that she has no experience in politics - although she seems to be mostly in the right place ethically and politically, there's no guarantee she'll be able to get anything done.
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Old 27th May 2018, 11:49 AM   #173
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Originally Posted by Mumbles View Post
It's hilarious when y'all try to imitate people who point out obvious bigots like Dolt 45, yet somehow never manage to figure out that it's their beliefs and actions that earn them the label, and not simply because they're "a white male".

Also, Cuomo's big problem is his conservative (note the difference between "conservative" and "bigoted reactionary") lean, and his habit of manipulating party politics using money. IMO, His main opponent Nixon (who is also white, dunno how picking one over the other makes Hillary Clinton "racist") is the simple fact that she has no experience in politics - although she seems to be mostly in the right place ethically and politically, there's no guarantee she'll be able to get anything done.
Well said.
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Old 27th May 2018, 11:49 AM   #174
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Originally Posted by Foolmewunz View Post
You've been wandering around lost in the conservative brush for so long you think of anyone who doesn't adhere to your reactionary ideas as Extreme Left, but that's interchangeable with "Liberal" which is interchangeable with "Moderate" which is amazingly interchangeable with "John McCain". In short, anyone not on the Mercer/Bannon approved list of paleo conservatives.
You misspelled "Nazi fetishists and child molesters" for that last part .
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Old 27th May 2018, 12:46 PM   #175
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Originally Posted by Foolmewunz View Post
You slip is showing again. You didn't waste your time showing us their liberalism because.... why? Your claim is "extreme left". Now go back to the start and show us the extreme leftists, not liberals, on the Supreme Court.

For the class,... here's your original statement:


You've been wandering around lost in the conservative brush for so long you think of anyone who doesn't adhere to your reactionary ideas as Extreme Left, but that's interchangeable with "Liberal" which is interchangeable with "Moderate" which is amazingly interchangeable with "John McCain". In short, anyone not on the Mercer/Bannon approved list of paleo conservatives.
Lol

Yes extreme left is the same as liberal today, moderate, not so much. Iím happy to explain to liberals what they are. The conservative label is easy, not much argument there unlike liberals who clamor to not be one.
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Old 27th May 2018, 12:48 PM   #176
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
You still haven't said what 'extreme left' opinions either Breyer or Ginsburg has written and what makes those positions 'extreme left'. You keep saying these people are extreme. I want to understand in your mind what is an EXTREME left position.

And compared to what? Your position? The positions held by the majority or perhaps just by the Alabama chapter of the John Birch Society?
If you donít think any justices are far left, I would simply be wasting my time. Why donít you just accept the label and be proud of what they are?
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Old 27th May 2018, 12:50 PM   #177
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Originally Posted by Mumbles View Post
It's hilarious when y'all try to imitate people who point out obvious bigots like Dolt 45, yet somehow never manage to figure out that it's their beliefs and actions that earn them the label, and not simply because they're "a white male".

Also, Cuomo's big problem is his conservative (note the difference between "conservative" and "bigoted reactionary") lean, and his habit of manipulating party politics using money. IMO, His main opponent Nixon (who is also white, dunno how picking one over the other makes Hillary Clinton "racist") is the simple fact that she has no experience in politics - although she seems to be mostly in the right place ethically and politically, there's no guarantee she'll be able to get anything done.
It doesnít look like you know what a bigot is if you think President Donald Trump is an obvious one. Same with the word racist.
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Old 27th May 2018, 01:05 PM   #178
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Originally Posted by logger View Post
If you don’t think any justices are far left, I would simply be wasting my time. Why don’t you just accept the label and be proud of what they are?
What are you playing? Dodge Ball? Can't you answer one damn question? You're the one that called them 'extreme left'. You would think since you have this view, you would know precisely what these extreme left positions are and what makes them extreme.
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Old 27th May 2018, 01:50 PM   #179
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
What are you playing? Dodge Ball? Can't you answer one damn question? You're the one that called them 'extreme left'. You would think since you have this view, you would know precisely what these extreme left positions are and what makes them extreme.
I’m simply not playing your games, it’s clear what their politics are.

Besides you’ve already said there isn’t a hard leftist on the court, so obviously anything I put up isnt going to change your mind. They’re liberal accept it.

Last edited by logger; 27th May 2018 at 01:57 PM.
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Old 27th May 2018, 01:56 PM   #180
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Originally Posted by logger View Post
I’m simply not playing your games, it’s clear what their politics are.
The question is easy and you are running from it. You called them Extreme Left, not me. If I put a label on someone, i would know my reasons for applying that label.
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Last edited by acbytesla; 27th May 2018 at 01:59 PM.
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Old 27th May 2018, 01:57 PM   #181
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
No, you're not. The question is easy and you are running from it.
Besides youíve already said there isnít a hard leftist on the court, so obviously anything I put up isnt going to change your mind. Theyíre liberal accept it.
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Old 27th May 2018, 02:08 PM   #182
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Originally Posted by logger View Post
Besides youíve already said there isnít a hard leftist on the court, so obviously anything I put up isnt going to change your mind. Theyíre liberal accept it.
Who said anything about changing minds? I simply asked you what about their opinions make them Extreme Left? You're entitled to your perspective and I want to know what criteria you use when you slap a label on someone.
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Old 27th May 2018, 02:36 PM   #183
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
Who said anything about changing minds? I simply asked you what about their opinions make them Extreme Left? You're entitled to your perspective and I want to know what criteria you use when you slap a label on someone.


Good luck with that.
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Old 27th May 2018, 02:43 PM   #184
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Originally Posted by NoahFence View Post


Good luck with that.
I know. God forbid we get beyond labels and devolve into actual facts, logic and issues. Why talk about anything in depth when we can rely on labels that are meaningless?
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Old 27th May 2018, 02:46 PM   #185
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
Who said anything about changing minds? I simply asked you what about their opinions make them Extreme Left? You're entitled to your perspective and I want to know what criteria you use when you slap a label on someone.
Obviously their opinions, statements and actions.
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Old 27th May 2018, 02:52 PM   #186
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Originally Posted by logger View Post
Iím happy to explain to liberals what they are.
This thread quite clearly illustrates otherwise. Oh, you're quite happy to spew insults and invective at liberals; that's certainly true.

...But when it actually comes down to explanations that are, you know, meaningful, and discussions with substance, your rhetoric simply isn't up to the task...

Hence we get the predictable question dodges like you're doing now. LOL
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Old 27th May 2018, 02:57 PM   #187
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Originally Posted by Cabbage View Post
This thread quite clearly illustrates otherwise. Oh, you're quite happy to spew insults and invective at liberals; that's certainly true.

...But when it actually comes down to explanations that are, you know, meaningful, and discussions with substance, your rhetoric simply isn't up to the task...

Hence we get the predictable question dodges like you're doing now. LOL
Just the kind of reaction I would expect from a commie liberal. If you can't see how right logger is, he doesn't want to talk to you. While continually posting.

(Did I guess your response correctly, buddy?)
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Old 27th May 2018, 03:02 PM   #188
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Originally Posted by TheGoldcountry View Post
Just the kind of reaction I would expect from a commie liberal. If you can't see how right logger is, he doesn't want to talk to you. While continually posting.

(Did I guess your response correctly, buddy?)
Well, I find it fascinating that folks on the left need it explained why Ginsburg is considered a leftist, or Breyer, or Sotomayor or Kagan. So since none of you would ever agree that they are in fact left, even though most others consider them left, itís probably a waste of time to argue that. Wouldnít you agree?
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Old 27th May 2018, 03:26 PM   #189
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Originally Posted by logger View Post
Well, I find it fascinating that folks on the left need it explained why Ginsburg is considered a leftist, or Breyer, or Sotomayor or Kagan. So since none of you would ever agree that they are in fact left, even though most others consider them left, itís probably a waste of time to argue that. Wouldnít you agree?
You don't explain what that is. A label is shallow. It offers little or in this case nothing.

If you can't explain the reasoning behind your opinions you might as well be pissing into the wind.
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Old 27th May 2018, 06:50 PM   #190
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Originally Posted by logger View Post
Well, I find it fascinating that folks on the left need it explained why Ginsburg is considered a leftist, or Breyer, or Sotomayor or Kagan. So since none of you would ever agree that they are in fact left, even though most others consider them left, itís probably a waste of time to argue that. Wouldnít you agree?
Oh, moving the goal posts from "far left" to simply "left" now, are we?

Very subtle, I'm sure no one will notice...
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Old 27th May 2018, 06:59 PM   #191
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Originally Posted by Lambchops View Post
Oh, moving the goal posts from "far left" to simply "left" now, are we?

Very subtle, I'm sure no one will notice...
Iím sure itís very significant to the left, lol, itís a big deal when one is doing all they can to avoid the dreaded ďfar leftĒ label.
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Old 27th May 2018, 07:26 PM   #192
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Quote:
Why did Hillary Clinton endorse Cuomo over Cynthia Nixon?

Clintonís endorsement of Cuomo might make sense if Nixonís politics were way out of line with her own currently professed views, but theyíre not. Nixonís program sits firmly within the realm of left-liberal reform and has much in common with the platform Clinton ran on in 2016. If elected, she would be the first female governor of New York, as well as the first openly LGBT New York governor. If we are to take Clinton at her word, itís hard to think of a better candidate for her to throw her support behind.

The picture gets clearer when you look at Clintonís history with Cuomo, who served as housing secretary in her husbandís administration and campaigned for her in the 2016 primary and general elections. Itís almost like taking care of your friends is more important than getting more women into office.

Of course, itís possible Clintonís name has become so toxic her opposition will actually help Nixon. Intentionally or not, opposition from such unpopular establishment figures as Clinton will only help the activist and Sex and the City actor make a case for herself as the reformer Albany needs.

https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...-york-governor (May 24, 2018)

In 2016, former secretary of state Madeleine Albright introduced Hillary Clinton at a campaign event in New Hampshire telling the crowd: ďThereís a special place in Hell for women who donít help each other!Ē

--------------------

"Hey everyone, I just wanted to say thanks. Thanks for your feminism, for your activism, and all I can hope is you keep up the really important good work. And let me just say, this is directed to the activist bitches supporting bitches, so let's go." -- Hillary Clinton (January 2018)

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Old 27th May 2018, 07:45 PM   #193
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Originally Posted by logger View Post
Iím sure itís very significant to the left, lol, itís a big deal when one is doing all they can to avoid the dreaded ďfar leftĒ label.
What difference does it make if you have no criteria for that?
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Old 27th May 2018, 07:49 PM   #194
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
What difference does it make if you have no criteria for that?
Why would you think there isnít any?

Opinions, statements and actions.
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Old 27th May 2018, 07:59 PM   #195
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Originally Posted by logger View Post
Why would you think there isnít any?

Opinions, statements and actions.
Nonsense (yet again). You're Humpty-Dumptying. "Far left" means what I say it means.

No, it doesn't. Show us the far left decisions and cases of just one of them. I'll go with Notorious R.B.G. Please show the class, with cites (hint: stump speeches by Louie Gohmert are not "cites") the "far left" body of work you find in Ginsburg's considerable case history. I'm sure you can find at least one.

We'll wait.
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Old 27th May 2018, 08:12 PM   #196
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Originally Posted by Foolmewunz View Post
Nonsense (yet again). You're Humpty-Dumptying. "Far left" means what I say it means.

No, it doesn't. Show us the far left decisions and cases of just one of them. I'll go with Notorious R.B.G. Please show the class, with cites (hint: stump speeches by Louie Gohmert are not "cites") the "far left" body of work you find in Ginsburg's considerable case history. I'm sure you can find at least one.

We'll wait.
https://www.cnn.com/2018/05/21/polit...off/index.html

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics...cision/373703/

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/guyben...ymore-n2191709

Iím sure these wonít meet your expectations.
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Old 27th May 2018, 08:18 PM   #197
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Originally Posted by logger View Post
Why would you think there isnít any?

Opinions, statements and actions.
Originally Posted by Foolmewunz View Post
Nonsense (yet again). You're Humpty-Dumptying. "Far left" means what I say it means.

No, it doesn't. Show us the far left decisions and cases of just one of them. I'll go with Notorious R.B.G. Please show the class, with cites (hint: stump speeches by Louie Gohmert are not "cites") the "far left" body of work you find in Ginsburg's considerable case history. I'm sure you can find at least one.

We'll wait.

It's ridiculous. All he keeps saying is they are "extreme left" As if that says a damn thing. Everyone has opinions, statements and actions. That doesn't make them Extreme or Left. Chief Justice Roberts appointed by W. voted for the personal mandate for the affordable care act. Was that an extreme left position? And more importantly, what makes it extreme?
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Old 27th May 2018, 08:21 PM   #198
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Originally Posted by logger View Post
No, they don't. We're not asking anyone else, we are asking YOU. What is your analysis of their legal opinions and what makes their position 'extreme left'.
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Old 27th May 2018, 08:34 PM   #199
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Originally Posted by logger View Post
Two classic liberal dissents to conservative court majorities' bad decisions and an opinion piece by a right wing writer.

So, we'll ask again.... do you have any evidence in Ginsburg's lifetime of work that she's part of the far left.

Alternately, just concede that you're so far right that you have the Humpty Dumpty Pass and can call anyone you disagree with "Far Left".


See? We've got different upbringings. I actually know people on the far left. You think the guy who ran for Alderman down at Logger Acres is far left because he wants to post a crossing guard at Robert Taft Elementary and your delivery trucks would have to slow down.
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Old 27th May 2018, 08:46 PM   #200
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Originally Posted by Foolmewunz View Post
Two classic liberal dissents to conservative court majorities' bad decisions and an opinion piece by a right wing writer.

So, we'll ask again.... do you have any evidence in Ginsburg's lifetime of work that she's part of the far left.

Alternately, just concede that you're so far right that you have the Humpty Dumpty Pass and can call anyone you disagree with "Far Left".


See? We've got different upbringings. I actually know people on the far left. You think the guy who ran for Alderman down at Logger Acres is far left because he wants to post a crossing guard at Robert Taft Elementary and your delivery trucks would have to slow down.

I think it's interesting that the first article was for her position protecting 80 years of labor law. How is that possibly extreme left?
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