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Tags Brett Kavanaugh , Congressional hearings , Supreme Court nominees

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Old 2nd October 2018, 10:37 AM   #241
Belz...
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
Do you think I'm obsessed with race and sex?
I wouldn't know. My comment was a general observation about the left wing and the right wing.
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Old 2nd October 2018, 10:59 AM   #242
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
I said this earlier and it bears repeating. It wasn't Ford's testimony that made me believe Kavanaugh was unfit. It was Kavanaugh's testimony. It was that pathetic, wimpy frat boy entitlement. The absurd indignance, his lack of forthrightness and temperament. Nothing about him says to me that he can be counted on to be trustworthy and impartial.
Can you name even one SC Justice, currently, that is "impartial" ?
Sotomayor ?
Ginsberg ?
Thomas ?
Ect.
They all vote along party lines.

The delay may or may not work, but if the "blue wave" doesn't happen we wiill get another conservative justice nominated.
I wonder what horrible injustice he'll be guilty of to stall again till 2020 ?
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Old 2nd October 2018, 11:15 AM   #243
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Originally Posted by Busta Capp View Post
Can you name even one SC Justice, currently, that is "impartial" ?
Sotomayor ?
Ginsberg ?
Thomas ?
Ect.
They all vote along party lines.
That's why Kennedy was so interesting. I don't mind bias, but one has to be able to look beyond that and sometimes act against their personal opinions in order to think about the larger issues.
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Old 2nd October 2018, 11:17 AM   #244
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Originally Posted by Belz... View Post
I wouldn't know. My comment was a general observation about the left wing and the right wing.
The accusation of racism and sexism wasn't leveled at the right wing. It was leveled at me personally.
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Old 2nd October 2018, 11:19 AM   #245
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When you’re a knee-jerk apologist for racists and sexists, sometimes you get a little on you.
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Old 2nd October 2018, 11:24 AM   #246
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Originally Posted by johnny karate View Post
When you’re a knee-jerk apologist for racists and sexists, sometimes you get a little on you.
When you diverge at all from leftist orthodoxy, you "get a little on you".

It'll come around to you some day. The left always eats its own eventually.
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Old 2nd October 2018, 11:25 AM   #247
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
That doesn't make sense, since he wasn't a senior or 18 when the events with Ford were alleged to have taken place. That wouldn't be a mystery to the committee. Nor does he ever claim that he only drank while a senior. And I think there's a rather obvious alternative reason for him to say this, which is simply to point out that alcohol was commonly and easily available to highschoolers.
He doesn’t want to be recorded talking about his underage drinking, so instead of just owning up to it he’s trying to deceive the committee. There is no other reason for him to mention seniors at all, save trying to deceive the committee as he wasn’t legal drinking age even when he was a senior.

Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
And I think there's a rather obvious alternative reason for him to say this, which is simply to point out that alcohol was commonly and easily available to highschoolers.
You are grasping at straws.
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Old 2nd October 2018, 11:28 AM   #248
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
The accusation of racism and sexism wasn't leveled at the right wing. It was leveled at me personally.
Ok I'll try to illustrate the situation. Bear with me.

You know how Holocaust deniers almost to a man turn out to be anti-semitic? So that when you see a new one pop up, you can put some money on them being anti-Jew?

Ok, so by the same logic, a LOT of right-wing people, and those who defend people like Cosby or Weinstein or, even at this point in the procedings, Kavanaugh, seem to require a LOT more evidence to believe women or minorities than they do when the roles are reversed or, as stated earlier, when the political affiliations are reversed. So naturally a lot of people on the left are wary of the sort of rhetoric that comes up in those discussions and often assume the worst.
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Old 2nd October 2018, 11:36 AM   #249
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
The accusation of racism and sexism wasn't leveled at the right wing. It was leveled at me personally.
Not without reason. You asserted that Kavanaugh's accusers were not credible without any evidence whatsoever. How else are we supposed to take this other than as sexism and possibly racism?
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Old 2nd October 2018, 11:38 AM   #250
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Originally Posted by Cavemonster View Post
He wasn't addressing the committee, he was addressing the court of public opinion.
Originally Posted by lomiller View Post
He doesn’t want to be recorded talking about his underage drinking, so instead of just owning up to it he’s trying to deceive the committee.
These are contradictory claims. I'll let you two duke it out.

Quote:
There is no other reason for him to mention seniors at all, save trying to deceive the committee as he wasn’t legal drinking age even when he was a senior.
The committee knows he was 17 and not a senior at the time of the alleged events.

Quote:
You are grasping at straws.
That's ironic.
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Old 2nd October 2018, 11:42 AM   #251
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Originally Posted by lomiller View Post
Not without reason. You asserted that Kavanaugh's accusers were not credible without any evidence whatsoever.
That is unintentionally accurate. They are not credible because they have no evidence whatsoever.

Quote:
How else are we supposed to take this other than as sexism and possibly racism?
No bias is actually needed. But even assuming bias is involved, partisan bias could suffice. For example, someone who believed Republicans over Democrats every time, regardless of race or sex, is not therefore racist or sexist.
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Old 2nd October 2018, 11:42 AM   #252
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
Quote:
You are grasping at straws.
That's ironic.
Because you can drink out of a straw. I get it.
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Old 2nd October 2018, 11:43 AM   #253
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
These are contradictory claims. I'll let you two duke it out.
You mean people who disagree with you might also disagree with each other? WOW!!

But to me I'm not particularly interested in debating WHO he meant to fool.

The plain natural reading of the phrasing in question is not so unclear.
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Old 2nd October 2018, 11:46 AM   #254
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
No bias is actually needed. But even assuming bias is involved, partisan bias could suffice. For example, someone who believed Republicans over Democrats every time, regardless of race or sex, is not therefore racist or sexist.
Depends. Maybe they believe Republicans over Democrats every time because they identify with that party due to their similarities on race and sex.
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Old 2nd October 2018, 11:51 AM   #255
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Originally Posted by Belz... View Post
Depends. Maybe they believe Republicans over Democrats every time because they identify with that party due to their similarities on race and sex.
Your defense of his personal accusation against me is basically that it could be true, and that evidently suffices.

I'll keep that in mind for all future considerations about you, and all the things you might be.
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Old 2nd October 2018, 11:55 AM   #256
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
Your defense of his personal accusation against me is basically that it could be true, and that evidently suffices.

I'll keep that in mind for all future considerations about you, and all the things you might be.
What a bizarre response. My post explained that perception of conservatives in general can give someone that sort of impression, something I voice myself earlier. That has nothing to do with your characterisation here.

But then, par for the course for you.
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Old 2nd October 2018, 12:04 PM   #257
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
These are contradictory claims. I'll let you two duke it out.

No, they not even the slightest bit contradictory.


Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
The committee knows he was 17 and not a senior at the time of the alleged events.
So? Liars usually think no one else is clever enough to catch onto their pretty games

Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
That's ironic.
You are still grasping at straws.
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Old 2nd October 2018, 12:27 PM   #258
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
That is unintentionally accurate. They are not credible because they have no evidence whatsoever.
A man says something and you automatically assume he’s telling the truth unless proven otherwise.
A women says something and you assume she isn’t unless proven otherwise.

Are you still seriously saying you don’t understand why people would have a problem with this?

Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
For example, someone who believed Republicans over Democrats every time
If you want to tell us the fact that you refuse to believe women’s testimony is really just a coincidence and you are simply rejecting any evidence challenge Republican orthodoxy I’m more than willing to believe it, but it doesn’t really put you in a better light IMO.
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Old 2nd October 2018, 12:36 PM   #259
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Originally Posted by lomiller View Post
A man says something and you automatically assume he’s telling the truth unless proven otherwise.
A women says something and you assume she isn’t unless proven otherwise.
You're pulling this accusation out of your ass. No surprise, since a lack of evidence clearly doesn't matter to you.
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Old 2nd October 2018, 12:36 PM   #260
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Originally Posted by lomiller View Post
No, they not even the slightest bit contradictory.




So? Liars usually think no one else is clever enough to catch onto their pretty games



You are still grasping at straws.
How can you read this statement:

Quote:
Yes, we drank beer. My friends and I, the boys and girls. Yes, we drank beer. I liked beer. Still like beer. We drank beer. The drinking age, as I noted, was 18, so the seniors were legal, senior year in high school, people were legal to drink, and we — yeah, we drank beer, and I said sometimes — sometimes probably had too many beers, and sometimes other people had too many beers.
and interpret it to mean that Kavanaugh was trying to mislead people into thinking he was legally of age? That is some serious twisting. ". . . So the seniors were legal," clearly indicates that people who went to his school, people which were not him, were legal to drink. He did not say, "I only drank when I was a senior." It's clear he drank beer during high school because the seniors had easy access to it, therefore everyone had easy access.

Again, there are so many other parts of his testimony to pick apart, this one seems pretty straightforward.
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Old 2nd October 2018, 12:40 PM   #261
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Originally Posted by xjx388 View Post
How can you read this statement:



and interpret it to mean that Kavanaugh was trying to mislead people into thinking he was legally of age? That is some serious twisting. ". . . So the seniors were legal," clearly indicates that people who went to his school, people which were not him, were legal to drink. He did not say, "I only drank when I was a senior." It's clear he drank beer during high school because the seniors had easy access to it, therefore everyone had easy access.

Again, there are so many other parts of his testimony to pick apart, this one seems pretty straightforward.
That was the impression I got: that he was saying he was drinking legally because he was a senior. I just assumed he was a senior at the time until I found out otherwise later.
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Old 2nd October 2018, 12:42 PM   #262
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Originally Posted by xjx388 View Post



and interpret it to mean that Kavanaugh was trying to mislead people into thinking he was legally of age? That is some serious twisting. ". . . So the seniors were legal," clearly indicates that people who went to his school, people which were not him, were legal to drink.
The drinking habits of unnamed random seniors who may have been present is completely irrelevant to the question. There is no reason for him to bring it up other than as a diversion intended to leave listeners with the impression that HE was one of those seniors for whom drinking was legal.
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Old 2nd October 2018, 12:43 PM   #263
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Originally Posted by lomiller View Post
The drinking habits of unnamed random seniors who may have been present is completely irrelevant to the question.
The general availability of alcohol is not.
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Old 2nd October 2018, 12:50 PM   #264
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Originally Posted by Beelzebuddy View Post
That was the impression I got: that he was saying he was drinking legally because he was a senior. I just assumed he was a senior at the time until I found out otherwise later.
The committee to which he was giving sworn testimony knew he wasn't a senior during the period in question. And nothing he says contradicts that. So no perjury there.
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Old 2nd October 2018, 12:53 PM   #265
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
The general availability of alcohol is not.
He doesn’t mention “availability of alcohol” and why would he bother? Clearly if he was drinking underage he must have had access to alcohol so it would be completely redundant.
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Old 2nd October 2018, 12:56 PM   #266
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Why is a little sexual assault now suddenly something that they can't even admit to when the president bragged about it often and no one cares? Look powerful connected men like Trump and Kavanaugh sexually abuse women under their power that is a basic fact and not really a big deal people.

Its like going to a catholic boys school run by monks and being shocked that it turns out they were raping the kids for decades. That is just the way things work.
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Old 2nd October 2018, 01:04 PM   #267
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
The committee to which he was giving sworn testimony knew he wasn't a senior during the period in question. And nothing he says contradicts that. So no perjury there.
No frank answers either, which I would consider an essential requirement for nomination to the supreme court.

Let me put it in a way that will let you set aside the partisan blinders. One of the things that turned me off about Hillary Clinton during her run was that she never gave a straight answer. Every question, no matter how direct, would always get spun somehow into an answer to the question she wanted to be asked instead. Although she would not lie, she did not come off as trustworthy. So it is with Kavanaugh. Even discounting the possible rape and probable sexual assault and nearly certain drinking problem and obvious little white perjuries, the guy is a weasel.
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Old 2nd October 2018, 01:06 PM   #268
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Funny how the same people complain because Bill Clinton used “sexual relations” as a synonym for intercourse are now so willing to hang their hats on “it’s technically accurate” so he wasn’t trying to deceive anyone.”
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Old 2nd October 2018, 01:10 PM   #269
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Originally Posted by Beelzebuddy View Post
No frank answers either, which I would consider an essential requirement for nomination to the supreme court.

Let me put it in a way that will let you set aside the partisan blinders. One of the things that turned me off about Hillary Clinton during her run was that she never gave a straight answer. Every question, no matter how direct, would always get spun somehow into an answer to the question she wanted to be asked instead. Although she would not lie, she did not come off as trustworthy. So it is with Kavanaugh. Even discounting the possible rape and probable sexual assault and nearly certain drinking problem and obvious little white perjuries, the guy is a weasel.
Let's be clear: Regardless of how we judge the frankness of his answer (and "Yes, we drank beer. My friends and I, the boys and girls. Yes, we drank beer. I liked beer. Still like beer. We drank beer." seems frank enough to me), it is not perjury.
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Old 2nd October 2018, 01:12 PM   #270
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
You're pulling this accusation out of your ass. No surprise, since a lack of evidence clearly doesn't matter to you.
Ok how about this: what do you think of Kavanaugh's credibility?
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Old 2nd October 2018, 01:14 PM   #271
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Originally Posted by lomiller View Post
Funny how the same people complain because Bill Clinton used “sexual relations” as a synonym for intercourse are now so willing to hang their hats on “it’s technically accurate” so he wasn’t trying to deceive anyone.”
"I did not have sexual relations [with a woman who's had my cigar up her vagina and my jism on her dress]" seems like about as clear-cut a case of perjury as ever there was. Where's the technical escape clause for Bill in that?
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Old 2nd October 2018, 01:17 PM   #272
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Let's be clear: Regardless of how we judge the frankness of his answer (and "Yes, we drank beer. My friends and I, the boys and girls. Yes, we drank beer. I liked beer. Still like beer. We drank beer." seems frank enough to me), it is not perjury.
Assuming there were at least two dozen other qualified candidates, would you hire someone who answered questions during an interview the way he did?
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Old 2nd October 2018, 01:23 PM   #273
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
"I did not have sexual relations [with a woman who's had my cigar up her vagina and my jism on her dress]" seems like about as clear-cut a case of perjury as ever there was. Where's the technical escape clause for Bill in that?
No, that was contempt of court. Come on, you're old enough to know this.
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Old 2nd October 2018, 01:31 PM   #274
Beelzebuddy
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Let's be clear: Regardless of how we judge the frankness of his answer (and "Yes, we drank beer. My friends and I, the boys and girls. Yes, we drank beer. I liked beer. Still like beer. We drank beer." seems frank enough to me), it is not perjury.
Is that the part of his answer I was addressing?
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Old 2nd October 2018, 01:42 PM   #275
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
"I did not have sexual relations [with a woman who's had my cigar up her vagina and my jism on her dress]" seems like about as clear-cut a case of perjury as ever there was. Where's the technical escape clause for Bill in that?
None.
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Old 2nd October 2018, 01:59 PM   #276
acbytesla
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'Boofing is flatulence'.
'Devils Triangle is a drinking game'.
--Bret Kavanaugh

Clear Perjury.
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Old 2nd October 2018, 02:11 PM   #277
Delvo
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
'Boofing is flatulence'.
'Devils Triangle is a drinking game'.
--Bret Kavanaugh

Clear Perjury.
Perjury on otherwise nearly irrelevant trivialities, so they tell us not only that he's willing to commit perjury, but also that it takes almost nothing to get him to.
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Old 2nd October 2018, 02:27 PM   #278
Ziggurat
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
'Boofing is flatulence'.
'Devils Triangle is a drinking game'.
--Bret Kavanaugh

Clear Perjury.
Go with that. Booferism is a guaranteed, sure-fire path for the Democrats to regain power. Make that the centerpiece of every single campaign.
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Old 2nd October 2018, 02:36 PM   #279
johnny karate
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
Go with that. Booferism is a guaranteed, sure-fire path for the Democrats to regain power. Make that the centerpiece of every single campaign.
I like when people pushing conspiracy theories accuse those arguing against them of pushing conspiracy theories. Their transparent desperation makes me laugh.
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Old 2nd October 2018, 02:38 PM   #280
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Originally Posted by Delvo View Post
Perjury on otherwise nearly irrelevant trivialities, so they tell us not only that he's willing to commit perjury, but also that it takes almost nothing to get him to.
Presidential
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