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Tags donald trump , Trump controversies

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Old 30th January 2023, 09:19 PM   #1961
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As the Library Cop told Jerry on a Seinfeld episode:
Quote:
"What do we call people who break the law? CRIMINALS!"

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Old 30th January 2023, 11:35 PM   #1962
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Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
Well if you want to count all the CIVIL cases Trump is facing in addition to criminal, you have:
- The E. Jean Carroll case
- The NY fraud case brought by Leticia James
- Multiple lawsuits against Trump brought by police affected by the Jan6 terrorist attack
- A lawsuit related to a pyramid scheme Trump had promoted
- Copyright lawsuit over the use of the song "electric Avenue" during Trump's 2020 election campaign (I think that's still ongoing)

There was also a lawsuit launched by Cohen after he was kept in jail despite other inmates being released due to Covid (supposedly in retaliation for saying bad things about Trump.) The case was dismissed, but Cohen might appeal. I hope he does.
I'm frankly surprised there's so few!

What this means is he will be in jail AND he will be poor. Good.
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Old 30th January 2023, 11:52 PM   #1963
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I will not be surprised if some DA pulls out a tape in which #45 calls S.A. and says” hey, could you send a death squad over here to kill and dismember 2 or 3 civil-suit plaintiffs? You know - for old times.”
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Old 31st January 2023, 12:13 AM   #1964
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Originally Posted by Norman Alexander View Post
Quote:
Well if you want to count all the CIVIL cases Trump is facing in addition to criminal, you have:
(List of lawsuits cut for size)
I'm frankly surprised there's so few!

What this means is he will be in jail AND he will be poor. Good.
Well, that's assuming he's not actually poor now, and living on just what he can grift.

Sadly, I'm not sure how bad some of these lawsuits will be. The NY lawsuit over his bank fraud could be devastating (not just because of the amount involved, but because it could prevent him from doing business in NY.) And the prosecutor there seems to be on the ball. The other lawsuits don't seem to be as bad.

The rape/defamation lawsuit might be expensive for him, but old cases can be difficult to prosecute. (It all depends on what evidence she can bring up.)

Most of the other lawsuits are for relatively small amounts (copyright infringement over music used in his campaign), or have a low chance of success (e.g. the lawsuits over Jan6 could be dismissed if they assume Trump was functioning in his capacity as president.)
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Old 31st January 2023, 05:03 AM   #1965
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Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
Well, that's assuming he's not actually poor now, and living on just what he can grift.

Sadly, I'm not sure how bad some of these lawsuits will be. The NY lawsuit over his bank fraud could be devastating (not just because of the amount involved, but because it could prevent him from doing business in NY.) And the prosecutor there seems to be on the ball. The other lawsuits don't seem to be as bad.

The rape/defamation lawsuit might be expensive for him, but old cases can be difficult to prosecute. (It all depends on what evidence she can bring up.)

Most of the other lawsuits are for relatively small amounts (copyright infringement over music used in his campaign), or have a low chance of success (e.g. the lawsuits over Jan6 could be dismissed if they assume Trump was functioning in his capacity as president.)
All true. But Alex Jones has an outstanding 1.5 billion dollar debt as the result of just one or two defamation cases. Should Donny get fined, say, half a billion per case, his whole "fortune" would be at stake. One billion per case and he is in REALLY serious if not fatal financial trouble. And the usual offshore sources of his free funds might start to take a dim view and get a lot stingier with the handouts. Perhaps even turn that tap off and let him swing in the breeze this time.
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Old 31st January 2023, 05:52 AM   #1966
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The Stormy Daniels money is not completely done. Michael Cohen went to jail. Barr had all traces of Individual 1 erased from the charges. But there is a new grand jury on this.

Cohen has served his time but could be a witness.
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Old 31st January 2023, 10:43 AM   #1967
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Suppose we can throw a perjury charge in there somehow?

From: Yahoo
...Trump appears to have lied in sworn court records, opening him up to severe sanctions by a New York judge...Trump claimed he wasn’t the president of the Trump Organization during his four years at the White House, despite previously testifying that he was an “inactive president.” And he claimed that he didn’t have a financial stake in a partnership with the real estate company Vornado, even though he previously testified that he did.

(Unfortunately such things don't really have any sort of long-term impact.)
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Old 31st January 2023, 10:48 AM   #1968
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Originally Posted by Tero View Post
The Stormy Daniels money is not completely done. Michael Cohen went to jail. Barr had all traces of Individual 1 erased from the charges. But there is a new grand jury on this.
The grand jury that is currently investigating Trump's payments to Stormy Daniels is a state-level one. (On the other hand Cohen was convicted in federal court.)

I'm not sure about jurisdiction here... I could be wrong, but I think Trump is being investigated for business fraud for the way he hid the payments with his company. I am not sure that issues of campaign finance (the charges that Cohen was sent to jail for) are things that can be charged by the Manhattan DA or if there actually has to be separate charges brought forward in federal court.
Quote:
Cohen has served his time but could be a witness.
Cohen has already testified in the grand jury over this.
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Old 31st January 2023, 02:12 PM   #1969
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Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
Well, that's assuming he's not actually poor now, and living on just what he can grift.

Sadly, I'm not sure how bad some of these lawsuits will be. The NY lawsuit over his bank fraud could be devastating (not just because of the amount involved, but because it could prevent him from doing business in NY.) And the prosecutor there seems to be on the ball. The other lawsuits don't seem to be as bad.

The rape/defamation lawsuit might be expensive for him, but old cases can be difficult to prosecute. (It all depends on what evidence she can bring up.)

Most of the other lawsuits are for relatively small amounts (copyright infringement over music used in his campaign), or have a low chance of success (e.g. the lawsuits over Jan6 could be dismissed if they assume Trump was functioning in his capacity as president.)
Carroll has the dress she was wearing at the time she says he raped her. It was tested and found to have male DNA on it. Trump's lawyers were notified to present a sample of Trump's DNA for comparison.

Two friends of Carroll's, Carol Martin and Lisa Birnbach, have said that Carroll told them about the rape. Birnbach says she was told right after it happened and Martin says she was told 2-3 days later.
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Old 31st January 2023, 02:38 PM   #1970
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A dress again, I love it. Are we sure this isn't a Three Stooges episode? No offense to the stooges, of course. It just gets weirder and weirder.
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Old 31st January 2023, 03:29 PM   #1971
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Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
Cohen has already testified in the grand jury over this.
He wants to be careful just now that he doesn't suffer the same fate as Jeffery Epstein...
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Old 31st January 2023, 07:09 PM   #1972
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Are dresses like garlic to US presidents?
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Old 3rd February 2023, 09:19 AM   #1973
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This could be.... interesting.

Remember Weisselberg, Trump's executive in jail for tax fraud? The one who got what many consider an overly-lenient deal to testify against the Trump organization (despite his unwillingness to testify against Trump himself)?

He might still be in some hot water...

From: ABC News
The Manhattan district attorney's office has recently threatened to file new criminal charges against former Trump Organization chief financial officer Allen Weisselberg...The new charges...would involve insurance fraud... Prosecutors in Manhattan are using the threat of additional charges to pressure Weisselberg into cooperating with their ongoing criminal investigation... Insurance fraud was mentioned in New York Attorney General Letitia James' $250 million civil lawsuit...The lawsuit, which also names Weisselberg and other executives, alleges that the former CFO lied to an insurance company about an appraisal of Trump's real estate portfolio.

If the reports are true, then I should congratulate DA Alvin Bragg for finally showing a little backbone and a willingness to play hardball. I bit late in the game, but still would be a welcome change.
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Old 3rd February 2023, 09:23 AM   #1974
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Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
The lawsuit, which also names Weisselberg and other executives, alleges that the former CFO lied to an insurance company about an appraisal of Trump's real estate portfolio.
Prosecutors must love the opportunity to prosecute someone for both over- and under-valuing the same property.
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Old 3rd February 2023, 09:49 AM   #1975
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Originally Posted by Aber View Post
Prosecutors must love the opportunity to prosecute someone for both over- and under-valuing the same property.
Depending on context, each is a crime so why not?
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Old 3rd February 2023, 02:18 PM   #1976
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Originally Posted by Aber View Post
Prosecutors must love the opportunity to prosecute someone for both over- and under-valuing the same property.

Would sure make it a lot easier to prove shenanigans that way.
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Old 4th February 2023, 07:13 PM   #1977
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Looks like there may be criminal charges coming soon regarding the Georgia election interference.

'Trump has a lot of legal problems. But one phone call in 2020 could soon lead to criminal charges':
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2023-02-...woes/101925518
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Old 4th February 2023, 08:19 PM   #1978
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Originally Posted by Orphia Nay View Post
Looks like there may be criminal charges coming soon regarding the Georgia election interference.

'Trump has a lot of legal problems. But one phone call in 2020 could soon lead to criminal charges':
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2023-02-...woes/101925518
Not soon enough. I want to see him suffer.
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Old 5th February 2023, 08:54 AM   #1979
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https://www.vox.com/policy-and-polit...-investigation

The hush money payment Cohen made might be a bigger problem. In Georgia, you could get an anti-American juror who would hang it and Trump would get a mistrial. In New York, that's less of a concern. Plus, they have already secured a conviction in the Stormy Daniels hush money payment scheme.
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Old 13th February 2023, 06:18 PM   #1980
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Parts of results of the grand jury investigation into Trump's election interference in GA will be released on Thursday.

Quote:
Fulton County Superior Court Judge Robert McBurney said three portions of the panel's report will be released Thursday, including a section expressing concerns that some witnesses may have lied under oath, although the names of those witnesses will not be made public.

McBurney also ordered the release of the grand jury's conclusions as part of a ruling that represented a partial concession to District Attorney Fani Willis who argued last month that disclosure of the panel's findings would damage an ongoing investigation.
Quote:
While the judge rejected arguments from a media consortium, which called for immediate and full disclosure of the report as a "court record," he also noted the "compelling public interest in the proceedings and the unquestionable value and importance of transparency" as prompting the partial release.

"Indeed it (the grand jury) provided the district attorney with exactly what she requested: a roster of who should (or should not) be indicted and for what in relation to the conduct (and aftermath) of the 2020 general election in Georgia," McBurney wrote, adding that the panel had done its work "by the book."
Too bad we won't be able to see the highlighted part.
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Old 13th February 2023, 06:43 PM   #1981
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Originally Posted by alfaniner View Post
Not soon enough. I want to see him suffer.
I mean we all understand this is the whole point. No need to say the quite part out loud.
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Old 13th February 2023, 06:58 PM   #1982
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
I mean we all understand this is the whole point. No need to say the quite part out loud.
I want to see him legally held to account for his actions; to show that no one is above the law, even the POTUS. Thus fundamental rule of law must be enforced or it fatally undermines one of our basic Constitutional principles.
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Old 13th February 2023, 10:10 PM   #1983
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
I want to see him legally held to account for his actions; to show that no one is above the law, even the POTUS. Thus fundamental rule of law must be enforced or it fatally undermines one of our basic Constitutional principles.
I'll second this. Trump suffering does nothing for me. I honestly don't care about him much at all. I do care about a number of things and issues that surround him, though, and thus quite desire that he receive punishment commensurate with the harm that he's caused as a matter of principle and practicality.
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Old 13th February 2023, 10:19 PM   #1984
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
I mean we all understand this is the whole point. No need to say the quite part out loud.
Aaaawww...virtue signaling much? Or is it concern trolling. I bet the libs are all being such small minded meanies...right?
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Old 14th February 2023, 12:38 PM   #1985
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
Quote:
The rape/defamation lawsuit might be expensive for him, but old cases can be difficult to prosecute. (It all depends on what evidence she can bring up.)
Carroll has the dress she was wearing at the time she says he raped her. It was tested and found to have male DNA on it. Trump's lawyers were notified to present a sample of Trump's DNA for comparison.
They have the dress and a DNA analysis, but at the time the lawsuit was started Trump did not submit a sample for comparison.

Trump's lawyers have since offered to provide a sample, but it is likely a bad-faith attempt to muddy the waters, as the evidence discovery phase has already passed. So they are either trying to:

- Delay the trial by having them reopen discovery to do the analysis

- Claim "we offered Trump's DNA but they didn't want to test it"

Overall, the dress may not actually play a part in the trial. (Her lawyers have already said its "not a DNA case".)
Quote:
Two friends of Carroll's, Carol Martin and Lisa Birnbach, have said that Carroll told them about the rape. Birnbach says she was told right after it happened and Martin says she was told 2-3 days later.
That is probably more damaging to Trump's case than the dress.

You also have Trump's mis-identification of Carroll in a photo during his deposition (which contradicts his "she wasn't my type" claim.)
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Old 14th February 2023, 01:01 PM   #1986
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Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
They have the dress and a DNA analysis, but at the time the lawsuit was started Trump did not submit a sample for comparison.

Trump's lawyers have since offered to provide a sample, but it is likely a bad-faith attempt to muddy the waters, as the evidence discovery phase has already passed. So they are either trying to:

- Delay the trial by having them reopen discovery to do the analysis

- Claim "we offered Trump's DNA but they didn't want to test it"

Overall, the dress may not actually play a part in the trial. (Her lawyers have already said its "not a DNA case".)

That is probably more damaging to Trump's case than the dress.

You also have Trump's mis-identification of Carroll in a photo during his deposition (which contradicts his "she wasn't my type" claim.)
Trump's DNA could be collected by legal means other than his giving it. AIUI, any 'abandoned' object such as a drinking cup left behind can be used to collect DNA.
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Old 14th February 2023, 01:05 PM   #1987
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
Quote:
They have the dress and a DNA analysis, but at the time the lawsuit was started Trump did not submit a sample for comparison.

Trump's lawyers have since offered to provide a sample, but it is likely a bad-faith attempt to muddy the waters, as the evidence discovery phase has already passed.
Trump's DNA could be collected by legal means other than his giving it. AIUI, any 'abandoned' object such as a drinking cup left behind can be used to collect DNA.
Not sure why that wasn't done. But there may be privacy issues involved. Or the issue of establishing a chain of custody. (i.e. "it could have been anyone's DNA")

Police probably have more leeway to use those methods in a criminal investigation, but this is a civil case.
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Old 14th February 2023, 01:07 PM   #1988
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Trump loses again...

From: ABC News
An appellate court in New York on Tuesday upheld a $110,000 fine imposed on former President Donald Trump over his failure to comply with a subpoena issued by the New York Attorney General's office as part of its civil investigation of Trump and his family business.
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Old 14th February 2023, 01:32 PM   #1989
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Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
Not sure why that wasn't done. But there may be privacy issues involved. Or the issue of establishing a chain of custody. (i.e. "it could have been anyone's DNA")

Police probably have more leeway to use those methods in a criminal investigation, but this is a civil case.
True...but the collection can be video recorded to establish the chain of custody
and that it's his DNA. I've seen this done on some true crime shows. I doubt there's any difference between a criminal and civil case when it comes to collecting DNA from an abandoned source.

I don't think it will come down to that; he'll give up his DNA.

Mary Trump should give a sample of her DNA for them to compare the dress DNA to first. It will show if there's a family connection or not.
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Old 14th February 2023, 01:44 PM   #1990
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
Quote:
Not sure why that wasn't done. But there may be privacy issues involved. Or the issue of establishing a chain of custody. (i.e. "it could have been anyone's DNA")
True...but the collection can be video recorded to establish the chain of custody and that it's his DNA.
They can video tape the collection, but they also would need to follow through and video tape the complete analysis.
Quote:
I've seen this done on some true crime shows. I doubt there's any difference between a criminal and civil case when it comes to collecting DNA from an abandoned source.
Like I suggested... privacy is also an issue. Cops can do things in criminal cases that civil lawyers cannot.

Quote:
I don't think it will come down to that; he'll give up his DNA.
I don't think so. As I said, the discovery part of the case is done. Trump "giving up his DNA" will require a delay in the trial (something I am sure Trump would love but Carrol would not.)

Quote:
Mary Trump should give a sample of her DNA for them to compare the dress DNA to first. It will show if there's a family connection or not.
Actually that would have been a smart idea. I wonder why it wasn't done.
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Old 14th February 2023, 01:57 PM   #1991
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Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
They can video tape the collection, but they also would need to follow through and video tape the complete analysis.

Like I suggested... privacy is also an issue. Cops can do things in criminal cases that civil lawyers cannot.


I don't think so. As I said, the discovery part of the case is done. Trump "giving up his DNA" will require a delay in the trial (something I am sure Trump would love but Carrol would not.)


Actually that would have been a smart idea. I wonder why it wasn't done.
This case concerned a private detective, so not the cops:

Quote:
Commonwealth v. Cabral, Appeals Court of Massachusetts, No. 06-P-987, 5/16/07. The defendant spat on a public sidewalk, a private detective collected the spittle and it was sent to a laboratory for DNA testing. The court concluded that the expectorating defendant had no reasonable expectation of privacy for his spittle, nor the DNA evidence derived therefrom.
They could collect the spittle that foams from his mouth during one of his rally rants and flicks onto the microphone!
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Old 15th February 2023, 07:36 PM   #1992
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Whatever you thought of the usefulness of a DNA analysis, it is now officially moot...

From: CTV News
Judge Lewis A. Kaplan rejected the 11th-hour offer by Trump's legal team to provide a DNA sample to rebut claims E. Jean Carroll first made publicly in a 2019 book...Kaplan said that lawyers for Trump and Carroll had over three years to make DNA an issue in the case and that both chose not to do so....He said it would almost surely delay the trial scheduled to start April 25 to reopen the DNA issue four months after the deadline passed to litigate concerns over trial evidence
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Old 15th February 2023, 11:41 PM   #1993
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Well, that sucks lemons.
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Old 16th February 2023, 05:40 AM   #1994
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
Well, that sucks lemons.
The delay, delay, delay is infuriating. I think it shows a flaw in our system of justice that somehow needs to be addressed.

Both “Cleanup an Aisle 45” and “Opening Arguments” addressed this ploy by Trump’s attorneys in recent podcasts. In short, due to the fact that discovery was closed some time ago, this very, very late offer of the DNA was merely a delaying tactic, and the judge clearly saw it as such. E. Jean Carrol is 80 years old, and further delaying the trial could easily deny her justice in her lifetime. Clearly a case of “Justice delayed is justice denied”.
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Old 16th February 2023, 08:02 AM   #1995
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
Well, that sucks lemons.
I assume you were referring to the Judge's decision not to re-open discovery in order to get a DNA comparison done. (Which, as I mentioned before, seemed to be a delaying tactic more than anything else.)

One of the problems with the dress is that it was always an imperfect piece of evidence. They did find DNA samples of an unknown male (presumed to be Trump) but no evidence of sperm. So even if there was a match the Trump team could always argue it was "incidental contact" that left the DNA. The best it could do is prove the 2 of them had SOME contact (which has some value since I think Trump claimed he "never met her") but not what type of contact it was. (And in the worst case scenario, it wasn't Trump's DNA but some other random guy who had incidental contact, in which case he would claim that it exonerates him.)

I do not doubt Carroll's story... I think there are enough reasons to believe she is the one telling the truth. (His inability to distinguish Carroll from Maples despite her not "being his type", Trump initially fighting the DNA sample, even though if he was innocent it would benefit him since samples wouldn't match...) I just don't think the dress was needed to make the case.
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Old 16th February 2023, 12:42 PM   #1996
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Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
I assume you were referring to the Judge's decision not to re-open discovery in order to get a DNA comparison done. (Which, as I mentioned before, seemed to be a delaying tactic more than anything else.)

One of the problems with the dress is that it was always an imperfect piece of evidence. They did find DNA samples of an unknown male (presumed to be Trump) but no evidence of sperm. So even if there was a match the Trump team could always argue it was "incidental contact" that left the DNA. The best it could do is prove the 2 of them had SOME contact (which has some value since I think Trump claimed he "never met her") but not what type of contact it was. (And in the worst case scenario, it wasn't Trump's DNA but some other random guy who had incidental contact, in which case he would claim that it exonerates him.)

I do not doubt Carroll's story... I think there are enough reasons to believe she is the one telling the truth. (His inability to distinguish Carroll from Maples despite her not "being his type", Trump initially fighting the DNA sample, even though if he was innocent it would benefit him since samples wouldn't match...) I just don't think the dress was needed to make the case.
Thanks for the info. I didn't know it wasn't semen. From the NY Times:

Quote:
The report notes that “acid phosphatase activity, a presumptive indication of the presence of semen,” was not detected on either the dress or the shoes. Male DNA was detected on the dress, the report says, mostly on the right sleeve, as well as on the left sleeve, the left and right front shoulder area and outside and inside the garment’s front skirt area.
The highlighted part is what I find interesting: how would casual contact leave DNA on the inside of the skirt?
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Old 16th February 2023, 04:07 PM   #1997
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
Thanks for the info. I didn't know it wasn't semen. From the NY Times:



The highlighted part is what I find interesting: how would casual contact leave DNA on the inside of the skirt?

Trump told us how he gets away with that. You just grab 'em.
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Old 17th February 2023, 08:23 AM   #1998
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
Quote:
The report notes that “acid phosphatase activity, a presumptive indication of the presence of semen,” was not detected on either the dress or the shoes. Male DNA was detected on the dress, the report says, mostly on the right sleeve, as well as on the left sleeve, the left and right front shoulder area and outside and inside the garment’s front skirt area.
The highlighted part is what I find interesting: how would casual contact leave DNA on the inside of the skirt?
Well, if the DNA sample wasn't from Trump, it could have come from someone like a dry cleaner who would have had a reason to handle it.

If it was Trump's on the inside skirt entry, it would certainly help establish that it was from an assault. Not sure how it would have been explained by Trump. (Secondary contact?)
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Old 17th February 2023, 02:26 PM   #1999
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All the DNA has to prove is that Trump touched it, which would show that he lied - this is a defamation Trial after all.
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Old 17th February 2023, 04:35 PM   #2000
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
All the DNA has to prove is that Trump touched it, which would show that he lied - this is a defamation Trial after all.
Yes, it would certainly indicate he lied when he said he never met Carroll.

But stacyhs mentioned that one of the male samples was from the inside of the skirt. IF that were ever matched to Trump, it would be a rather... unusual place to find his DNA. On the shoulder or sleeve? Yeah, that could easily be from casual contact. Finding it on the skirt is a little bit more...questionable.

But then again, its all moot since they won't be trying to match the DNA on the dress to Trump.
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