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2nd February 2023, 12:05 PM | #3881 |
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The problem isn't that you can't publish papers. It's that you can't even understand the papers you cite.
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"As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law |
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2nd February 2023, 02:20 PM | #3882 |
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So, let's first have a look at the list of authors for that paper;
O. Pezzi, F. Pecora, J. le Roux, N. E. Engelbrecht, A. Greco, S. Servidio, H. V. Malova, O. V. Khabarova, O. Malandraki, R. Bruno, W. H. Matthaeus, G. Li, L. M. Zelenyi, R. A. Kislov, V. N. Obridko & V. D. Kuznetsov We'll come back to a few of them. Let's also look at some of the papers referenced in that paper; F.V. Coroniti, On the tearing mode in quasi-neutral sheets. J. Geophys. Res. 85(A12), 6719–6728 (1980) P.L. Pritchett, F.V. Coroniti, V.K. Decyk, Three-dimensional stability of thin quasi-neutral current sheets. J. Geophys. Res. 101(A12), 27413–27430 (1996) M.I. Sitnov, H.V. Malova, A.T.Y. Lui, Quasi-neutral sheet tearing instability induced by electron preferential acceleration from stochasticity. J. Geophys. Res. 102(A1), 163–174 (1997) (I believe the latter author is known to Tusenfem. The second author is a co-author on the paper Sol88 linked!) Back to the authors of this paper that Sol, for reasons known only to himself, thinks contradicts Alfven's claim that the solar wind has to be net neutral; Let's just concentrate on the lead author and a couple of others, whose papers I have already dealt with on here; O. Pezzi, H. V. Malova, & O. V. Khabarova. (Bolded authors are co-authors of the Pezzi, et al paper linked by Sol.) Differential kinetic dynamics and heating of ions in the turbulent solar wind F Valentini, D Perrone, S Stabile, O Pezzi, S Servidio, R De Marco, F Marcucci, R Bruno, B Lavraud, J De Keyser, G Consolini, D Brienza, L Sorriso-Valvo, A Retinò, A Vaivads, M Salatti and P Veltri
Originally Posted by Valentini, et al
Multilayered structure of thin current sheets: multiscale ”Matreshka” model A. S. Sharma, L. M. Zelenyi, H. V. Malova, V. Yu. Popov, & D. C. Delcourt
Originally Posted by Sharma, et al
Universal Scaling of Thin Current Sheets L. M. Zelenyi, H. V. Malova, E. E. Grigorenko, V. Yu Popov, and E. M. Dubinin
Originally Posted by Zelenyi, et al
PARTICLE DYNAMICS IN THE RECONNECTING HELIOSPHERIC CURRENT SHEET: SOLAR WIND DATA VERSUS THREE-DIMENSIONAL PARTICLE-IN-CELL SIMULATIONS Zharkova, V. V. & Khabarova, O. V. (2012)
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2nd February 2023, 05:54 PM | #3883 |
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yeah...nah, nice confabulation! The problem was YOUR (mainstream Models)
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When you do use the correct model,
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The solar wind is chockablok with electric currents! Were you aware of this FACT? |
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“No rock. Any charge separation is limited. The electric field is pointing in the wrong direction. Currents are doing nothing.” Jonesdave116. “The 'electric comet' is physically IMPOSSIBLE to model using mainstream science! PERIOD! True story! End of story!” Indagator |
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2nd February 2023, 06:47 PM | #3884 |
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So easy to shoot yourself in the foot, jd116.
READ CAREFULLY
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The ELECTRIC UNIVERSE mob have indeed initially consider the 3D models. jd116 seems way back in history still, why is this
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It's almost like they seem threatened by the alternative. |
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“No rock. Any charge separation is limited. The electric field is pointing in the wrong direction. Currents are doing nothing.” Jonesdave116. “The 'electric comet' is physically IMPOSSIBLE to model using mainstream science! PERIOD! True story! End of story!” Indagator |
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2nd February 2023, 07:01 PM | #3885 |
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The solar wind @jd116's scale is indeed homogeneous quasi-neutral plasma and no net current anywhere, doing anything.
The modern, mid 2000's on, is showing this interpretation to be totally incorrect. Pretty confident the Parker Solar Probe will upset the current paradigm. These Electric currents (Birkeland currents for brevity)
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Including,
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There will also be a return current. As jd116 says. |
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“No rock. Any charge separation is limited. The electric field is pointing in the wrong direction. Currents are doing nothing.” Jonesdave116. “The 'electric comet' is physically IMPOSSIBLE to model using mainstream science! PERIOD! True story! End of story!” Indagator |
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3rd February 2023, 12:48 AM | #3886 |
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It appears to me that Sol88’s EU is a version of the God of the Gaps argument: So far nothing indicates that EU is right, but there is still hope! The solar wind is more complicated than previously thought, so maybe EU can still topple all physics and be right after all! The Parker Solar Probe may still deliver results that could topple all of physics! Maybe another probe in a 100 years could prove EU right after all.
Hope is vanishing, but as long as magic is possible in some far future result, EU could still be right! All electric phenomena are Birkeland currents! Plasma is not a gas! |
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3rd February 2023, 05:20 AM | #3887 |
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Yes, it has to have ~ equal numbers of positive and negative charges in it. And nobody is claiming any differently.
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3rd February 2023, 05:25 AM | #3888 |
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Irony much, from someone who hasn't got a clue about what he is reading?
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You don't have an alternative. It doesn't exist. |
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3rd February 2023, 05:30 AM | #3889 |
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No it hasn't, and nobody with a clue is claiming otherwise. Which is why you can't show anyone claiming otherwise.
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3rd February 2023, 06:21 AM | #3890 |
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Is a lie. And there is a very easy way to settle the question. Sol merely has to name the author/s he thinks have shown that the solar wind is not net neutral at macroscopic scales. Then I'll contact them. Loser never posts on here again. Deal?
I think we all know that Sol will avoid such a deal with yet another gish-gallop of wilful ignorance. |
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“There is in every village a torch - the teacher; and an extinguisher - the priest.” - Victor Hugo “Never argue with an idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.” - George Carlin |
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3rd February 2023, 06:34 AM | #3891 |
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"As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law |
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3rd February 2023, 07:52 AM | #3892 |
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3rd February 2023, 09:38 AM | #3893 |
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Bumping the bolded part as it was predictably ignored.
Added to which it can be asked where are the gamma rays from the impossible fusion on the surface? Why aren't they there? Why are we here if such fusion was impossibly occurring? Where are the incoming electrons that Scott requires? How are they getting past a magnetic field heading in the opposite direction? All these questions cannot be answered by the adherents of the impossible electric sun woo. |
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3rd February 2023, 04:33 PM | #3894 |
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“No rock. Any charge separation is limited. The electric field is pointing in the wrong direction. Currents are doing nothing.” Jonesdave116. “The 'electric comet' is physically IMPOSSIBLE to model using mainstream science! PERIOD! True story! End of story!” Indagator |
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3rd February 2023, 04:39 PM | #3895 |
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“No rock. Any charge separation is limited. The electric field is pointing in the wrong direction. Currents are doing nothing.” Jonesdave116. “The 'electric comet' is physically IMPOSSIBLE to model using mainstream science! PERIOD! True story! End of story!” Indagator |
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4th February 2023, 04:39 AM | #3896 |
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"As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law |
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4th February 2023, 04:45 AM | #3897 |
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4th February 2023, 12:56 PM | #3898 |
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Vague similarities?
That’s why I read the whole couple pages dedicated to plasma is a gas… it’s not it plasma, of which there is a zoo of types. Do you accept that mainstream, with the clarity of the correct mode/model of plasma instability being applied, will come to the realisation that the solar wind is far more complex than just being a quasi neutral zephyr? Data, from a number of mission to various planets n moons, asteroids, comets(great solar plasma probes) and thru the suns plasma boundaries, looks pretty solid when it includes current driven plasma instabilities. Or Is all a bit confronting? |
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“No rock. Any charge separation is limited. The electric field is pointing in the wrong direction. Currents are doing nothing.” Jonesdave116. “The 'electric comet' is physically IMPOSSIBLE to model using mainstream science! PERIOD! True story! End of story!” Indagator |
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4th February 2023, 01:12 PM | #3899 |
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Real scientists already know what the solar wind is, and what it contains. It is quasi-neutral at macroscopic scales. And has to be. As Alfven explained.
There is nothing proposed by EU non-scientists that anybody needs to take any notice of, as none of them have a clue about plasma physics, or even know what the solar wind is. |
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“There is in every village a torch - the teacher; and an extinguisher - the priest.” - Victor Hugo “Never argue with an idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.” - George Carlin |
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4th February 2023, 01:41 PM | #3900 |
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No.
Scott hit the nail on the head… the hang up was here, as I recall;
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Highly turbulent plasmas like the solar wind close to the stars, HH objects, AGN’s, quasars…, flux ropes seems the most common term used. Happy to call them Parker Currents. Seems these currents have not had time to get field aligned. Birkeland current in planetary plasmaspheres. ALL need an electric field. |
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“No rock. Any charge separation is limited. The electric field is pointing in the wrong direction. Currents are doing nothing.” Jonesdave116. “The 'electric comet' is physically IMPOSSIBLE to model using mainstream science! PERIOD! True story! End of story!” Indagator |
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4th February 2023, 01:58 PM | #3901 |
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Jd116, you may benefit from jotting this down somewhere…. More specifically, coronal mass ejections (Low 2001) form solar flux ropes (also known as interplanetary magnetic clouds) as they move in the solar wind away from the Sun. They, being the multitude of electric currents and current driven instabilities. Plasma is not a gas and the solar wind is not quasi neutral. |
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“No rock. Any charge separation is limited. The electric field is pointing in the wrong direction. Currents are doing nothing.” Jonesdave116. “The 'electric comet' is physically IMPOSSIBLE to model using mainstream science! PERIOD! True story! End of story!” Indagator |
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4th February 2023, 02:04 PM | #3902 |
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Scott's 'paper' was crap. As has been pointed out here and elsewhere. He screws up the equations at the start, and it just gets worse from thereon. If that were possible. He is not a plasma physicist, and is utterly clueless about the subject. Not to mention a whole bunch of other physics. Because he's an engineer. Not a physicist. He is suffering from a terminal case of Dunning-Kruger syndrome. Which seems to be contagious in EU circles. You and Thornhill have certainly caught it.
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4th February 2023, 02:09 PM | #3903 |
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And you may benefit from high school physics. And then trying to understand basic plasma physics, which you have completely failed to do after umpteen years.
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4th February 2023, 04:43 PM | #3904 |
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You seem to be hung up on a 1939 paper by a pioneer in plasma physics. |
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“No rock. Any charge separation is limited. The electric field is pointing in the wrong direction. Currents are doing nothing.” Jonesdave116. “The 'electric comet' is physically IMPOSSIBLE to model using mainstream science! PERIOD! True story! End of story!” Indagator |
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4th February 2023, 04:49 PM | #3905 |
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You seem to be hung up on a 1939 paper by a pioneer in plasma physics. |
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“No rock. Any charge separation is limited. The electric field is pointing in the wrong direction. Currents are doing nothing.” Jonesdave116. “The 'electric comet' is physically IMPOSSIBLE to model using mainstream science! PERIOD! True story! End of story!” Indagator |
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5th February 2023, 08:08 AM | #3906 |
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They are not saying that the solar wind is a net current. Learn to read. Nobody sane is claiming that. If you are claiming that these two authors are making such a claim, then accept the challenge I offered - I'll email them and see what they say about the net neutrality of the solar wind. Loser never posts here again. Deal?
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5th February 2023, 02:03 PM | #3907 |
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BRAINZZZZZZZZ |
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6th February 2023, 01:23 AM | #3908 |
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Sure if it make you feel any better.
Not really even sure if that will clear up the point that the solar wind may be considered quasi neutral at the scale of the solar system. I'd be more interested on their take of the pervasive electric currents that thread the solar wind. Are you able to ask them that as well?
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Or you saying the solar wind can not contain any current because of its (the solar wind) quasi neutrality? |
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“No rock. Any charge separation is limited. The electric field is pointing in the wrong direction. Currents are doing nothing.” Jonesdave116. “The 'electric comet' is physically IMPOSSIBLE to model using mainstream science! PERIOD! True story! End of story!” Indagator |
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6th February 2023, 03:27 AM | #3909 |
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For frak's sake! quasi-neutrality and currents are not related, apart from that they work with the same paricles.
quasi-neutral: [img]http://latex.codecogs.com/gif.latex? \Sigma_k n_k q_k = 0 [/img] with k meaning all species of ions and electrons, n is density and q is charge, and the sum over an appropriately large volume, i.e. several times the largest Larmor radius. A current: [img]http://latex.codecogs.com/gif.latex? {\bf J} = \Sigma_k n_k q_k {\bf v}_k [/img] where v is the velocity, and there is no volume involved. I am sure jonesdave116 is fully aware of these definitions and also that the two are independent (for example one is a scalar and one is a vector). So, NO JD did not say what you think he is saying. (not sure why (La)TeX is not working for me) |
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6th February 2023, 03:55 AM | #3910 |
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Great.
Don’t won’t to talk anymore about quasi neutrality in the bulk solar wind as jd116 natters about. The BIRKELAND CURRENTS (field aligned, force free, electron flux ropes) and the shinanigans the zoo of current driven plasma instabilities causes in astrophysical plasmas. Throw some nanodust into the mix… |
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“No rock. Any charge separation is limited. The electric field is pointing in the wrong direction. Currents are doing nothing.” Jonesdave116. “The 'electric comet' is physically IMPOSSIBLE to model using mainstream science! PERIOD! True story! End of story!” Indagator |
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6th February 2023, 07:25 AM | #3911 |
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And Sol chickens out. As predicted! Go back a number of pages and you will see where I said the solar wind can contain currents. I also said that the solar wind is quasi-neutral at macroscopic scales. And it is.
You will also see where I dealt with the strahl. Which part of this are you incapable of understanding?;
Originally Posted by Halekas, et al
Halekas, J. S. et al (2020) https://iopscience.iop.org/article/1...365/ab4cec/pdf As previously noted, you haven't got a clue what you are talking about. And neither does Scott. Get over it. |
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6th February 2023, 07:27 AM | #3912 |
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6th February 2023, 07:34 AM | #3913 |
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6th February 2023, 10:35 AM | #3914 |
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6th February 2023, 01:52 PM | #3915 |
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“No rock. Any charge separation is limited. The electric field is pointing in the wrong direction. Currents are doing nothing.” Jonesdave116. “The 'electric comet' is physically IMPOSSIBLE to model using mainstream science! PERIOD! True story! End of story!” Indagator |
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6th February 2023, 01:53 PM | #3916 |
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Field aligned force free electron currents better for you then? Birkeland Currents: A Force-Free Field-Aligned Model Donald E. Scott |
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“No rock. Any charge separation is limited. The electric field is pointing in the wrong direction. Currents are doing nothing.” Jonesdave116. “The 'electric comet' is physically IMPOSSIBLE to model using mainstream science! PERIOD! True story! End of story!” Indagator |
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6th February 2023, 01:59 PM | #3917 |
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6th February 2023, 02:01 PM | #3918 |
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“No rock. Any charge separation is limited. The electric field is pointing in the wrong direction. Currents are doing nothing.” Jonesdave116. “The 'electric comet' is physically IMPOSSIBLE to model using mainstream science! PERIOD! True story! End of story!” Indagator |
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