Can the Dems retain the House Speaker??! - Page 4

Stacyhs · 4th January 2023, 02:40 AM

Originally Posted by The Don

It is clear at this stage what the "rebels" want ?

Do they really want Jim ~~Jeffreys~~ Jordan as speaker (even though he himself does not want the role) ? Do they instead want more concessions of the type mentioned upthread in terms of Biden impeachment, Fauci to have his pension removed (and/or be imprisoned) and for them to get prime committee positions (and even be the majority on those committees) ?

Are they instead just throwing their toys out of the pram, for no particular reason, just because they can and because it gets them publicity ?

FTFY. Jeffries is the Democrat.

The Don · 4th January 2023, 02:54 AM

Originally Posted by Stacyhs

FTFY. Jeffries is the Democrat.

Derp

jimbob · 4th January 2023, 03:44 AM

Originally Posted by dudalb

SO you want one party rule in the US.Nice.

Until the GOP changes, you have to ask why any hypothetical Republican of good intent is still supporting the party. It's not the Party of Reagn; hell, it's not even the party of Nixon.

jimbob · 4th January 2023, 03:45 AM

Originally Posted by The Don

Derp

One word that encapsulates so much recent politics in the English speaking world.

Doubt · 4th January 2023, 04:20 AM

Originally Posted by Susheel

I believe that the schadenfreude that the Dems feel will be short-lived. There is a good chance that the deplorables will ultimately all compromise on one who might represent them the best...possibly Jim Jordan and then it will be back to business...."owning the libz" and hobbling the Presidency.

The Democrats can, if they choose, end this. Either a few don't show up or some vote for McCarthy and you get a situation where Jordan is locked out and McCarthy owes his seat to the Democrats.

Susheel · 4th January 2023, 04:22 AM

Originally Posted by Doubt

The Democrats can, if they choose, end this. Either a few don't show up or some vote for McCarthy and you get a situation where Jordan is locked out and McCarthy owes his seat to the Democrats.

And....? What makes you think that Kevin McCarthy will in any way acknowledge what he owes to the dems? We are talking about a party that has consistently backed out of any assurance of fair play.

Mongrel · 4th January 2023, 04:57 AM

Originally Posted by jimbob

Until the GOP changes, you have to ask why any hypothetical Republican of good intent is still supporting the party. It's not the Party of Reagn; hell, it's not even the party of Nixon.

It also ignores two important points.
1) That it's entirely the fault of the GOP, why should the Dems intervene when they appear to be happily schisming.

2) Opposing the GOP is the glue that holds the Dems together, without them they're going to fly apart into a range of groups that'll probably be the new parties

The Don · 4th January 2023, 05:20 AM

Originally Posted by Doubt

The Democrats can, if they choose, end this. Either a few don't show up or some vote for McCarthy and you get a situation where Jordan is locked out and McCarthy owes his seat to the Democrats.

So what if he owes his seat to the Democrats ?

Do you, for one second, think that he would in any way acknowledge this and act accordingly? The second he is in post he will progress the GOP agenda.

gypsyjackson · 4th January 2023, 05:25 AM

Originally Posted by The Don

It is clear at this stage what the "rebels" want ?

Do they really want Jim Jeffreys as speaker (even though he himself does not want the role) ? D

I know Stacyhs has already helped out here, but Jim Jeffries would be an ideal speaker as anyone who has heard his tale of his visit to the porn warehouse in Amsterdam will know.

Tero · 4th January 2023, 05:36 AM

Originally Posted by Athyrio

Soooo……. who gets to be President if Biden and Harris keel over today?

The various secretaries have not been fired yet. And there is no change in president so this time it would not be a problem. If there were a new president and a new party taking over congress, the succession might be problematic.

Random · 4th January 2023, 06:06 AM

Originally Posted by Susheel

I believe that the schadenfreude that the Dems feel will be short-lived. There is a good chance that the deplorables will ultimately all compromise on one who might represent them the best...possibly Jim Jordan and then it will be back to business...."owning the libz" and hobbling the Presidency.

Yeah, but that was always the GOP plan for this Congress. Dems lose nothing by enjoying the show.

That's the problem with no-holds-barred obstructionism. Yeah, you can stop your opponent's agenda pretty easily, and if you can make it seem like that is a positive accomplishment, that might be good for votes. But there is no room for actual negotiation, and no reason for the other side to do anything to help you out when you are experiencing a self-inflicted wound.

Dave Rogers · 4th January 2023, 06:26 AM

Originally Posted by Doubt

The Democrats can, if they choose, end this. Either a few don't show up or some vote for McCarthy and you get a situation where Jordan is locked out and McCarthy owes his seat to the Democrats.

"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake."

- Napoleon Bonaparte.

Darat · 4th January 2023, 06:39 AM

Originally Posted by Random

Yeah, but that was always the GOP plan for this Congress. Dems lose nothing by enjoying the show.

That's the problem with no-holds-barred obstructionism. Yeah, you can stop your opponent's agenda pretty easily, and if you can make it seem like that is a positive accomplishment, that might be good for votes. But there is no room for actual negotiation, and no reason for the other side to do anything to help you out when you are experiencing a self-inflicted wound.

They've now got members that have been schooled in the idea that you never compromise, it's hardly surprising they turn that attitude to their own party.

Upchurch · 4th January 2023, 07:02 AM

I'm not familiar with the full cast of decenters, but with Greene, Boebert, and Gaetz I think there needs to be only one more hardline decenter and McCarthy is screwed.

sackett · 4th January 2023, 07:31 AM

Jordan? Gym Jordan? Oohoo! If he was in the job and I was a Congresscritter, I'd be in trouble every day for addressing him not as "Mr. Speaker," but as "Mr. Futtbucker," and then doing my famous double take, "I beg your pardon, sir, I never meant to be CHEEKY!"

Oh it's great to be back in America!

plague311 · 4th January 2023, 08:36 AM

Originally Posted by gypsyjackson

I know Stacyhs has already helped out here, but Jim Jeffries would be an ideal speaker as anyone who has heard his tale of his visit to the porn warehouse in Amsterdam will know.

I was going to say the same thing. He has a wonderful outlook on gun control as well. Also, I've never heard the C word used on the floor of the House and God knows it would be used ad nauseum if Jeffries were up there.

slyjoe · 4th January 2023, 09:03 AM

Originally Posted by Upchurch

I'm not familiar with the full cast of decenters, but with Greene, Boebert, and Gaetz I think there needs to be only one more hardline decenter and McCarthy is screwed.

I think they would need 2 more; they have 222 reps, correct?

lobosrul5 · 4th January 2023, 09:07 AM

Originally Posted by slyjoe

I think they would need 2 more; they have 222 reps, correct?

Yes, McCarthy can be elected speaker with up to 4 GoP dissenting votes... assuming they don't dissent by voting "present" in which case he can stand to lose more votes.

pgwenthold · 4th January 2023, 09:24 AM

I think this process just shows that the only things the republicans can do is to oppose democrats. They can't accomplish anything on their own.

They should just vote for a democratic speaker so they can just obstruct everything.

Doubt · 4th January 2023, 10:05 AM

Originally Posted by The Don

So what if he owes his seat to the Democrats ?

Do you, for one second, think that he would in any way acknowledge this and act accordingly? The second he is in post he will progress the GOP agenda.

It doesn't matter what he does after that. He will look even weaker than he does now and the Republicans will pull the rug out from under him as soon as they can.

The minimum business to run the country will get done and nothing else. And then when they do sack him the whole thing starts over again.

sackett · 4th January 2023, 10:34 AM

Suppose the Democrats agree to elect Whistlebritches if he and his GOP supporters in turn agree to specific conditions publicly and in writing. Yes, political deal-making out in the open and documented, for all voters to see. This Great January Accord would not be law, it would be a contract between honorable men to pursue the public good.

Rethuglican treachery and false dealing would of course follow, but it could never be defended as policy, or as anything honest. It would at last be seen as open black-shirted thuggery, unworthy of any man who had ever sworn an oath of office.

IOW, business as usual and without pretense. It wouldn't solve any immediate problems. But it might -- I think it would have to -- turn enough citizens' stomachs to change 2024 in some good ways.

sackett · 4th January 2023, 10:36 AM

DP

carlosy · 4th January 2023, 10:41 AM

I wonder what the result would look like if it were an anonymous vote.

Darat · 4th January 2023, 10:41 AM

Originally Posted by sackett

Suppose the Democrats agree to elect Whistlebritches if he and his GOP supporters in turn agree to specific conditions publicly and in writing. Yes, political deal-making out in the open and documented, for all voters to see. This Great January Accord would not be law, it would be a contract between honorable men to pursue the public good.

Rethuglican treachery and false dealing would of course follow, but it could never be defended as policy, or as anything honest. It would at last be seen as open black-shirted thuggery, unworthy of any man who had ever sworn an oath of office.

IOW, business as usual and without pretense. It wouldn't solve any immediate problems. But it might -- I think it would have to -- turn enough citizens' stomachs to change 2024 in some good ways.

He has done that so far - that's what his "55 page" document did: https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...rdliners-house

Darat · 4th January 2023, 10:43 AM

Originally Posted by carlosy

I wonder what the result would look like if it were an anonymous vote.

Even better - have Jim Jeffreys change his name to Jim Jordan but don't tell the republicans.

The Don · 4th January 2023, 10:49 AM

Originally Posted by Doubt

It doesn't matter what he does after that. He will look even weaker than he does now and the Republicans will pull the rug out from under him as soon as they can.

The minimum business to run the country will get done and nothing else. And then when they do sack him the whole thing starts over again.

As far as I can see, the modern day GOP has no interest in governing, just stopping the Democrats from achieving anything. Likely their first item of business will be some kind of political grandstanding rather than real legislation

Random · 4th January 2023, 11:12 AM

Originally Posted by sackett

Suppose the Democrats agree to elect Whistlebritches if he and his GOP supporters in turn agree to specific conditions publicly and in writing. Yes, political deal-making out in the open and documented, for all voters to see. This Great January Accord would not be law, it would be a contract between honorable men to pursue the public good.

Rethuglican treachery and false dealing would of course follow, but it could never be defended as policy, or as anything honest. It would at last be seen as open black-shirted thuggery, unworthy of any man who had ever sworn an oath of office.

IOW, business as usual and without pretense. It wouldn't solve any immediate problems. But it might -- I think it would have to -- turn enough citizens' stomachs to change 2024 in some good ways.

The GOP does not care about how they look. Shamelessness is their superpower.

carlosy · 4th January 2023, 11:16 AM

Originally Posted by Random

The GOP does not care about how they look. Shamelessness is their superpower.

Exactly. This more like the first line of 'defense', the first installment of blocking the government. And all the crazies get their fame for the 'how great a debate is' and 'that's democracy' lines...

Dread Pirate Roberts · 4th January 2023, 11:39 AM

I read an article that McCarthy might try to get enough "Present" votes to only need 213 votes, not 218. Wouldn't it be hilarious if they ended up botching that process so that Jeffries did end up as speaker 212-211.

crescent · 4th January 2023, 11:42 AM

Originally Posted by Darat

He has done that so far - that's what his "55 page" document did: https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...rdliners-house

Here's a direct link to that document: Adopting Rules for the 118TH Congress

A bit odd, the article refers to a 55 page document, referring to the linked document. But the linked document is only 12 pages.

That seems to have very little in the way of compromise with the Democrats. It's much more focused on compromising with the far right:

Quote:

Select Subcommittee on the Coronavirus Pandemic. Subsection (a) establishes the Select Subcommittee on the Coronavirus Pandemic of the Committee on Oversight and Accountability to investigate, make findings, and provide legislative recommendations on the origins of the Coronavirus pandemic, including the Federal Government’s funding of gain-of-function research, the use of taxpayer funds and relief programs to address the pandemic, the effectiveness of laws and regulations to address the Coronavirus pandemic and prepare for future pandemics, the development of vaccines and treatments and the implementation of vaccine mandates for federal employees and the military, the economic impact of the pandemic, including state and local government responses, the impact of school closures on American children, Executive Branch decisions and communications related to the pandemic, the protection of whistleblowers who provided information about improper activities, and inter-government cooperation regarding oversight of the preparedness for and response to the pandemic.
The Speaker is directed to appoint up to 12 Members, Delegates, or the Resident Commissioner to serve on the Select Subcommittee and to designate one of its members to serve as the chair. Not more than five of the members may be appointed on the recommendation of the Minority Leader.

Quote:

A bill to prohibit taxpayer funded abortions.

Quote:

A resolution establishing the Select Committee on the Strategic Competition Between the United States and the Chinese Communist Party.
• A resolution establishing a Select Subcommittee on the Weaponization of the Federal Government as a select investigative subcommittee of the Committee on the Judiciary.

Quote:

Subsection (g) provides for the consideration of a concurrent resolution expressing the sense of Congress condemning the recent attacks on prolife facilities, groups, and churches

Quote:

Subsection (h) allows the Speaker to recognize a member for the reading of the Constitution on any legislative day through February 28, 2023.

Nosi · 4th January 2023, 11:59 AM

Originally Posted by sackett

Hey, relax. Any and all republican'ts who don't win can cry fraud.

F'rinstance: Who actually hired that clerk? Was he vetted? How bout his wife? I wanna see his laptop. His DNA. Take back the steal!

The black woman who's being the house clerk and running the show at the moment in the House is a Pelosi pick.

Trebuchet · 4th January 2023, 12:02 PM

Just flipped over to a news channel and saw Boob-bert nominating someone. Flipped back.

carlosy · 4th January 2023, 12:03 PM

Are the members called in alphabetical order, everytime? Because there are already 4 against him, but they are very early in the numbers.

Nosi · 4th January 2023, 12:03 PM

Originally Posted by crescent

Maybe George Santos can declare himself to be the winner.

Anything's possible!

Nosi · 4th January 2023, 12:05 PM

Originally Posted by shemp

More like a **** show in slow motion. The vote is slow and tedious, but it makes good television. If this goes past 9 ballots, I'll throw my hat in the ring!

Your more qualified!

Nosi · 4th January 2023, 12:06 PM

Originally Posted by Norman Alexander

Based on Shemp's arithmetic, get 10 of the nutjobs to not vote and the humiliation would be complete.

That or vote for the janitor...

Darat · 4th January 2023, 12:09 PM

4th vote lost.

jimbob · 4th January 2023, 12:10 PM

FlpFFv0WYAABXWt.jpg

From elsewhere

Nosi · 4th January 2023, 12:12 PM

Originally Posted by shemp

On CNN, Jonah Goldberg of The Dispatch called it a "fecal festival"!

You got a link to that?

Nosi · 4th January 2023, 12:13 PM

Originally Posted by Gulliver Foyle

No. The only time a Democrat should vote for an R is to permanently disbar them from any office.

4th January 2023, 03:44 AM	#123
jimbob Uncritical "thinker" Moderator Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: UK Posts: 29,183	Originally Posted by dudalb SO you want one party rule in the US.Nice. Until the GOP changes, you have to ask why any hypothetical Republican of good intent is still supporting the party. It's not the Party of Reagn; hell, it's not even the party of Nixon.
	__________________ OECD healthcare spending Public/Compulsory Expenditure on healthcare https://data.oecd.org/chart/60Tt Every year since 1990 the US Public healthcare spending has been greater than the UK as a proportion of GDP. More US Tax goes to healthcare than the UK

4th January 2023, 03:45 AM	#124
jimbob Uncritical "thinker" Moderator Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: UK Posts: 29,183	Originally Posted by The Don Derp One word that encapsulates so much recent politics in the English speaking world.
	__________________ OECD healthcare spending Public/Compulsory Expenditure on healthcare https://data.oecd.org/chart/60Tt Every year since 1990 the US Public healthcare spending has been greater than the UK as a proportion of GDP. More US Tax goes to healthcare than the UK

4th January 2023, 04:20 AM	#125
Doubt Philosopher Join Date: Apr 2002 Posts: 7,781	Originally Posted by Susheel I believe that the schadenfreude that the Dems feel will be short-lived. There is a good chance that the deplorables will ultimately all compromise on one who might represent them the best...possibly Jim Jordan and then it will be back to business...."owning the libz" and hobbling the Presidency. The Democrats can, if they choose, end this. Either a few don't show up or some vote for McCarthy and you get a situation where Jordan is locked out and McCarthy owes his seat to the Democrats.
Doubt Philosopher Join Date: Apr 2002 Posts: 7,781	__________________ 45 es un titere

4th January 2023, 04:22 AM	#126
Susheel Illuminator Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Hyderabad, India Posts: 3,085	Originally Posted by Doubt The Democrats can, if they choose, end this. Either a few don't show up or some vote for McCarthy and you get a situation where Jordan is locked out and McCarthy owes his seat to the Democrats. And....? What makes you think that Kevin McCarthy will in any way acknowledge what he owes to the dems? We are talking about a party that has consistently backed out of any assurance of fair play.
	__________________ I've got to get to a library...fast Robert Langdon

4th January 2023, 04:57 AM	#127
Mongrel Begging for Scraps Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: UK, suburbia. 20 minutes in the future Posts: 2,194	Originally Posted by jimbob Until the GOP changes, you have to ask why any hypothetical Republican of good intent is still supporting the party. It's not the Party of Reagn; hell, it's not even the party of Nixon. It also ignores two important points. 1) That it's entirely the fault of the GOP, why should the Dems intervene when they appear to be happily schisming. 2) Opposing the GOP is the glue that holds the Dems together, without them they're going to fly apart into a range of groups that'll probably be the new parties
	__________________ “Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge: it is those who know little, and not those who know much, who so positively assert that this or that problem will never be solved by science.” - Charles Darwin ...like so many contemporary philosophers he especially enjoyed giving helpful advice to people who were happier than he was. - Tom Lehrer

4th January 2023, 02:40 AM	#121
Stacyhs Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: United States Posts: 29,332	Originally Posted by The Don It is clear at this stage what the "rebels" want ? Do they really want Jim ~~Jeffreys~~ Jordan as speaker (even though he himself does not want the role) ? Do they instead want more concessions of the type mentioned upthread in terms of Biden impeachment, Fauci to have his pension removed (and/or be imprisoned) and for them to get prime committee positions (and even be the majority on those committees) ? Are they instead just throwing their toys out of the pram, for no particular reason, just because they can and because it gets them publicity ? FTFY. Jeffries is the Democrat.

4th January 2023, 02:54 AM	#122
The Don Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Sir Fynwy Posts: 36,323	Originally Posted by Stacyhs FTFY. Jeffries is the Democrat. Derp

4th January 2023, 05:20 AM	#128
The Don Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Sir Fynwy Posts: 36,323	Originally Posted by Doubt The Democrats can, if they choose, end this. Either a few don't show up or some vote for McCarthy and you get a situation where Jordan is locked out and McCarthy owes his seat to the Democrats. So what if he owes his seat to the Democrats ? Do you, for one second, think that he would in any way acknowledge this and act accordingly? The second he is in post he will progress the GOP agenda.

4th January 2023, 05:25 AM	#129
gypsyjackson Graduate Poster Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia Posts: 1,691	Originally Posted by The Don It is clear at this stage what the "rebels" want ? Do they really want Jim Jeffreys as speaker (even though he himself does not want the role) ? D I know Stacyhs has already helped out here, but Jim Jeffries would be an ideal speaker as anyone who has heard his tale of his visit to the porn warehouse in Amsterdam will know.

4th January 2023, 05:36 AM	#130
Tero Illuminator Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: North American prairie Posts: 3,001	Originally Posted by Athyrio Soooo……. who gets to be President if Biden and Harris keel over today? The various secretaries have not been fired yet. And there is no change in president so this time it would not be a problem. If there were a new president and a new party taking over congress, the succession might be problematic.
	__________________ Dominus vo-bisque'em Et cum spear a tu-tu, oh! Politics blog: https://esapolitics.blogspot.com/ Parody: http://karireport.blogspot.com/ Poll: https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com...proval-rating/

4th January 2023, 06:06 AM	#131
Random Illuminator Join Date: Jul 2001 Posts: 3,567	Originally Posted by Susheel I believe that the schadenfreude that the Dems feel will be short-lived. There is a good chance that the deplorables will ultimately all compromise on one who might represent them the best...possibly Jim Jordan and then it will be back to business...."owning the libz" and hobbling the Presidency. Yeah, but that was always the GOP plan for this Congress. Dems lose nothing by enjoying the show. That's the problem with no-holds-barred obstructionism. Yeah, you can stop your opponent's agenda pretty easily, and if you can make it seem like that is a positive accomplishment, that might be good for votes. But there is no room for actual negotiation, and no reason for the other side to do anything to help you out when you are experiencing a self-inflicted wound.
Random Illuminator Join Date: Jul 2001 Posts: 3,567	__________________ The road to Fascism is paved with people saying, "You're overreacting!".

4th January 2023, 06:26 AM	#132
Dave Rogers Bandaged ice that stampedes inexpensively through a scribbled morning waving necessary ankles Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Cair Paravel, according to XKCD Posts: 33,715	Originally Posted by Doubt The Democrats can, if they choose, end this. Either a few don't show up or some vote for McCarthy and you get a situation where Jordan is locked out and McCarthy owes his seat to the Democrats. "Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake." - Napoleon Bonaparte.
	__________________ There is truth and there are lies. - President Joseph R. Biden, January 20th, 2021

4th January 2023, 06:39 AM	#133
Darat Lackey Administrator Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: South East, UK Posts: 108,048	Originally Posted by Random Yeah, but that was always the GOP plan for this Congress. Dems lose nothing by enjoying the show. That's the problem with no-holds-barred obstructionism. Yeah, you can stop your opponent's agenda pretty easily, and if you can make it seem like that is a positive accomplishment, that might be good for votes. But there is no room for actual negotiation, and no reason for the other side to do anything to help you out when you are experiencing a self-inflicted wound. They've now got members that have been schooled in the idea that you never compromise, it's hardly surprising they turn that attitude to their own party.
	__________________ I wish I knew how to quit you

4th January 2023, 07:02 AM	#134
Upchurch Papa Funkosophy Join Date: May 2002 Location: St. Louis, MO Posts: 33,589	I'm not familiar with the full cast of decenters, but with Greene, Boebert, and Gaetz I think there needs to be only one more hardline decenter and McCarthy is screwed.
	__________________ "There is nothing more deceptive than an obvious fact." -- Sherlock Holmes. "It’s easier to fool people than to convince them that they have been fooled." -- Mark Twain, maybe.

4th January 2023, 07:31 AM	#135
sackett Philosopher Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Detroit Posts: 8,304	Jordan? Gym Jordan? Oohoo! If he was in the job and I was a Congresscritter, I'd be in trouble every day for addressing him not as "Mr. Speaker," but as "Mr. Futtbucker," and then doing my famous double take, "I beg your pardon, sir, I never meant to be CHEEKY!" Oh it's great to be back in America!
	__________________ If you would learn a man's character, give him authority. If you would ruin a man's character, let him seize power.

4th January 2023, 08:36 AM	#136
plague311 Great minds think... Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: North Dakota Posts: 13,789	Originally Posted by gypsyjackson I know Stacyhs has already helped out here, but Jim Jeffries would be an ideal speaker as anyone who has heard his tale of his visit to the porn warehouse in Amsterdam will know. I was going to say the same thing. He has a wonderful outlook on gun control as well. Also, I've never heard the C word used on the floor of the House and God knows it would be used ad nauseum if Jeffries were up there.
	__________________ “There are times when the mind is dealt such a blow it hides itself in insanity. While this may not seem beneficial, it is. There are times when reality is nothing but pain, and to escape that pain the mind must leave reality behind.” - Patrick Rothfuss

4th January 2023, 09:03 AM	#137
slyjoe Illuminator Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Near Harmonica Virgins, AZ Posts: 3,445	Originally Posted by Upchurch I'm not familiar with the full cast of decenters, but with Greene, Boebert, and Gaetz I think there needs to be only one more hardline decenter and McCarthy is screwed. I think they would need 2 more; they have 222 reps, correct?
	__________________ "You have done nothing to demonstrate an understanding of scientific methodology or modern skepticism, both of which are, by necessity, driven by the facts and evidence, not by preconceptions, and both of which are strengthened by, and rely upon, change." - Arkan Wolfshade

4th January 2023, 09:07 AM	#138
lobosrul5 Illuminator Join Date: Nov 2017 Posts: 4,419	Originally Posted by slyjoe I think they would need 2 more; they have 222 reps, correct? Yes, McCarthy can be elected speaker with up to 4 GoP dissenting votes... assuming they don't dissent by voting "present" in which case he can stand to lose more votes.
lobosrul5 Illuminator Join Date: Nov 2017 Posts: 4,419

4th January 2023, 09:24 AM	#139
pgwenthold Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Sep 2001 Posts: 21,026	I think this process just shows that the only things the republicans can do is to oppose democrats. They can't accomplish anything on their own. They should just vote for a democratic speaker so they can just obstruct everything.
	__________________ "As your friend, I have to be honest with you: I don't care about you or your problems" - Chloe, Secret Life of Pets

4th January 2023, 10:05 AM	#140
Doubt Philosopher Join Date: Apr 2002 Posts: 7,781	Originally Posted by The Don So what if he owes his seat to the Democrats ? Do you, for one second, think that he would in any way acknowledge this and act accordingly? The second he is in post he will progress the GOP agenda. It doesn't matter what he does after that. He will look even weaker than he does now and the Republicans will pull the rug out from under him as soon as they can. The minimum business to run the country will get done and nothing else. And then when they do sack him the whole thing starts over again.
Doubt Philosopher Join Date: Apr 2002 Posts: 7,781	__________________ 45 es un titere

4th January 2023, 10:34 AM	#141
sackett Philosopher Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Detroit Posts: 8,304	Suppose the Democrats agree to elect Whistlebritches if he and his GOP supporters in turn agree to specific conditions publicly and in writing. Yes, political deal-making out in the open and documented, for all voters to see. This Great January Accord would not be law, it would be a contract between honorable men to pursue the public good. Rethuglican treachery and false dealing would of course follow, but it could never be defended as policy, or as anything honest. It would at last be seen as open black-shirted thuggery, unworthy of any man who had ever sworn an oath of office. IOW, business as usual and without pretense. It wouldn't solve any immediate problems. But it might -- I think it would have to -- turn enough citizens' stomachs to change 2024 in some good ways.
	__________________ If you would learn a man's character, give him authority. If you would ruin a man's character, let him seize power.

4th January 2023, 10:36 AM	#142
sackett Philosopher Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Detroit Posts: 8,304	DP
	__________________ If you would learn a man's character, give him authority. If you would ruin a man's character, let him seize power.

4th January 2023, 10:41 AM	#143
carlosy Muse Join Date: Jun 2011 Posts: 556	I wonder what the result would look like if it were an anonymous vote.
carlosy Muse Join Date: Jun 2011 Posts: 556

4th January 2023, 10:41 AM	#144
Darat Lackey Administrator Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: South East, UK Posts: 108,048	Originally Posted by sackett Suppose the Democrats agree to elect Whistlebritches if he and his GOP supporters in turn agree to specific conditions publicly and in writing. Yes, political deal-making out in the open and documented, for all voters to see. This Great January Accord would not be law, it would be a contract between honorable men to pursue the public good. Rethuglican treachery and false dealing would of course follow, but it could never be defended as policy, or as anything honest. It would at last be seen as open black-shirted thuggery, unworthy of any man who had ever sworn an oath of office. IOW, business as usual and without pretense. It wouldn't solve any immediate problems. But it might -- I think it would have to -- turn enough citizens' stomachs to change 2024 in some good ways. He has done that so far - that's what his "55 page" document did: https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...rdliners-house
	__________________ I wish I knew how to quit you

4th January 2023, 10:43 AM	#145
Darat Lackey Administrator Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: South East, UK Posts: 108,048	Originally Posted by carlosy I wonder what the result would look like if it were an anonymous vote. Even better - have Jim Jeffreys change his name to Jim Jordan but don't tell the republicans.
	__________________ I wish I knew how to quit you

4th January 2023, 10:49 AM	#146
The Don Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Sir Fynwy Posts: 36,323	Originally Posted by Doubt It doesn't matter what he does after that. He will look even weaker than he does now and the Republicans will pull the rug out from under him as soon as they can. The minimum business to run the country will get done and nothing else. And then when they do sack him the whole thing starts over again. As far as I can see, the modern day GOP has no interest in governing, just stopping the Democrats from achieving anything. Likely their first item of business will be some kind of political grandstanding rather than real legislation
	Last edited by The Don; 4th January 2023 at 10:54 AM.

4th January 2023, 11:12 AM	#147
Random Illuminator Join Date: Jul 2001 Posts: 3,567	Originally Posted by sackett Suppose the Democrats agree to elect Whistlebritches if he and his GOP supporters in turn agree to specific conditions publicly and in writing. Yes, political deal-making out in the open and documented, for all voters to see. This Great January Accord would not be law, it would be a contract between honorable men to pursue the public good. Rethuglican treachery and false dealing would of course follow, but it could never be defended as policy, or as anything honest. It would at last be seen as open black-shirted thuggery, unworthy of any man who had ever sworn an oath of office. IOW, business as usual and without pretense. It wouldn't solve any immediate problems. But it might -- I think it would have to -- turn enough citizens' stomachs to change 2024 in some good ways. The GOP does not care about how they look. Shamelessness is their superpower.
Random Illuminator Join Date: Jul 2001 Posts: 3,567	__________________ The road to Fascism is paved with people saying, "You're overreacting!".

4th January 2023, 11:16 AM	#148
carlosy Muse Join Date: Jun 2011 Posts: 556	Originally Posted by Random The GOP does not care about how they look. Shamelessness is their superpower. Exactly. This more like the first line of 'defense', the first installment of blocking the government. And all the crazies get their fame for the 'how great a debate is' and 'that's democracy' lines...
carlosy Muse Join Date: Jun 2011 Posts: 556

4th January 2023, 11:39 AM	#149
Dread Pirate Roberts Thinker Join Date: Jun 2014 Location: Las Vegas, NV Posts: 232	I read an article that McCarthy might try to get enough "Present" votes to only need 213 votes, not 218. Wouldn't it be hilarious if they ended up botching that process so that Jeffries did end up as speaker 212-211.

4th January 2023, 11:42 AM	#150
crescent Philosopher Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Colorado Posts: 5,315	Originally Posted by Darat He has done that so far - that's what his "55 page" document did: https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...rdliners-house Here's a direct link to that document: Adopting Rules for the 118TH Congress A bit odd, the article refers to a 55 page document, referring to the linked document. But the linked document is only 12 pages. That seems to have very little in the way of compromise with the Democrats. It's much more focused on compromising with the far right: Quote: Select Subcommittee on the Coronavirus Pandemic. Subsection (a) establishes the Select Subcommittee on the Coronavirus Pandemic of the Committee on Oversight and Accountability to investigate, make findings, and provide legislative recommendations on the origins of the Coronavirus pandemic, including the Federal Government’s funding of gain-of-function research, the use of taxpayer funds and relief programs to address the pandemic, the effectiveness of laws and regulations to address the Coronavirus pandemic and prepare for future pandemics, the development of vaccines and treatments and the implementation of vaccine mandates for federal employees and the military, the economic impact of the pandemic, including state and local government responses, the impact of school closures on American children, Executive Branch decisions and communications related to the pandemic, the protection of whistleblowers who provided information about improper activities, and inter-government cooperation regarding oversight of the preparedness for and response to the pandemic. The Speaker is directed to appoint up to 12 Members, Delegates, or the Resident Commissioner to serve on the Select Subcommittee and to designate one of its members to serve as the chair. Not more than five of the members may be appointed on the recommendation of the Minority Leader. Quote: A bill to prohibit taxpayer funded abortions. Quote: A resolution establishing the Select Committee on the Strategic Competition Between the United States and the Chinese Communist Party. • A resolution establishing a Select Subcommittee on the Weaponization of the Federal Government as a select investigative subcommittee of the Committee on the Judiciary. Quote: Subsection (g) provides for the consideration of a concurrent resolution expressing the sense of Congress condemning the recent attacks on prolife facilities, groups, and churches Quote: Subsection (h) allows the Speaker to recognize a member for the reading of the Constitution on any legislative day through February 28, 2023.

4th January 2023, 11:59 AM	#151
Nosi Illuminator Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 3,019	Originally Posted by sackett Hey, relax. Any and all republican'ts who don't win can cry fraud. F'rinstance: Who actually hired that clerk? Was he vetted? How bout his wife? I wanna see his laptop. His DNA. Take back the steal! The black woman who's being the house clerk and running the show at the moment in the House is a Pelosi pick.
Nosi Illuminator Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 3,019	__________________ __________ Hiding from the

4th January 2023, 12:02 PM	#152
Trebuchet Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Port Townsend, Washington Posts: 35,974	Just flipped over to a news channel and saw Boob-bert nominating someone. Flipped back.
	__________________ Cum catapultae proscribeantur tum soli proscripti catapultas habeant.

4th January 2023, 12:03 PM	#153
carlosy Muse Join Date: Jun 2011 Posts: 556	Are the members called in alphabetical order, everytime? Because there are already 4 against him, but they are very early in the numbers.
carlosy Muse Join Date: Jun 2011 Posts: 556

4th January 2023, 12:03 PM	#154
Nosi Illuminator Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 3,019	Originally Posted by crescent Maybe George Santos can declare himself to be the winner. Anything's possible!
Nosi Illuminator Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 3,019	__________________ __________ Hiding from the

4th January 2023, 12:05 PM	#155
Nosi Illuminator Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 3,019	Originally Posted by shemp More like a **** show in slow motion. The vote is slow and tedious, but it makes good television. If this goes past 9 ballots, I'll throw my hat in the ring! Your more qualified!
Nosi Illuminator Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 3,019	__________________ __________ Hiding from the