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Tags crickets , Cuba conspiracies , Cuba incidents , havana syndrome , mass hysteria , microwave weapons , sonic weapons , US-Cuba relations

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Old 22nd November 2021, 11:56 PM   #1121
dann
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Originally Posted by Orphia Nay View Post
I don't know if you follow 9/11 conspiracy theories, but "directed energy weapons" bringing down the twin towers was one of the crazier theories.

Weapons you can't see, hear, or trace.

No, I hadn't heard that one, but I can see that it's popular on Amazon.
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"Stupidity renders itself invisible by assuming very large proportions. Completely unreasonable claims are irrefutable. Ni-en-leh pointed out that a philosopher might get into trouble by claiming that two times two makes five, but he does not risk much by claiming that two times two makes shoe polish." B. Brecht
"The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx

Last edited by dann; 23rd November 2021 at 12:09 AM.
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Old 23rd November 2021, 11:46 AM   #1122
dann
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Gang Stalking

Joe Pierre M.D. has a very interesting mini-series of articles on Psychology Today about Gang Stalking, a delusion I had never heard of until now, but it seems to even more widespread than the 'Havana Syndrome', with which it has a lot in common:

Quote:
Interviews often note that T.I.s ("targeted individuals) don’t appear “unusual,” “disheveled,” or otherwise “crazy” and that some of them are doctors, acclaimed novelists, and other reasonably well-functioning professionals. Indeed, the T.I. community is comprised of thousands of diverse individuals, coming from all walks of life, with similarly diverse accounts of who might be harassing them and why.
For example, the “who” is variably attributed to neighbors, ex-boyfriends, employers, police, and other law enforcement agencies, “the financial elite,” or less conventional sources, like Freemasons and space aliens. The “why” is often attributed to retaliation for ending relationships, acting as whistleblowers at work, political activism, having run-ins with the law, or being privy to secret information. Seemingly motiveless harassment is chalked up to being hapless victims of experimentation by government agencies testing new techniques of surveillance or mind control.
(...)
If there’s a common thread to the accounts of gang stalking, it’s that T.I.s describe considerable suffering not only as a result of ongoing concerns about being harassed, but also from the experience of physical symptoms, like pain and “hearing voices,” and the significant social stigma associated with sharing their claims with family, friends, or mental health professionals who routinely dismiss them as “crazy.”
Gang Stalking: Real-Life Harassment or Textbook Paranoia?
Part 1: The paranoid reality of "targeted individuals."
(Psychology Today, Oct 20, 2021)

Quote:
Tellingly, when these 2020 survey results were compared to those from an earlier 2015 sample, respondents reported a greater frequency of believing that gang stalking was part of a global conspiracy that's being "covered up" by the "establishment." It's quite possible that these differences reflect the explosion of online accounts of gang stalking over the past 5 years as well as the proliferation of other conspiracy theories during a period of growing mistrust. Indeed, recent gang stalking survey respondents were also more likely than those from 2015 to report finding support online, while counterintuitively being more likely to feel isolated and lonely.
As I’ve discussed in a previous blogpost (“Are ‘Hearing Voices Groups’ a Help or Harm?"), support groups—whether in person or online—present something of a dilemma with regard to the people with psychotic symptoms. On the one hand, those with hallucinations or delusions can find valued support on the internet when it hasn’t been otherwise available, and when they refuse to seek psychiatric care. But on the other hand, such validation can also be harmful, reinforcing false beliefs and keeping people away from potentially helpful interventions in the form of actual treatment beyond simple support.
Gang Stalking: Conspiracy, Delusion, and Shared Belief
Part 2: When group affiliation reinforces delusion-like beliefs.
(Psychology Today, Oct 31, 2021)

Quote:
Note that even if "Havana syndrome" could actually be explained by the microwave attacks perpetrated by the likes of foreign entities like Russia, we'd still need a plausible explanation—recalling that paranoia and grandiosity are two sides of the same coin—of why such attacks would also be directed at "average Joes" here in the US to account for gang stalking. But in reality, there’s very little objective evidence to support that microwave attacks do offer the best explanation for Havana syndrome.
Gang Stalking: A Case of Mass Hysteria?
Part 3: When mass paranoia occurs through mass suggestion.
(Psychology Today, Nov 16, 2021)

I can imagine that it will be even harder to dismiss your delusion of gang stalking if you know that your job gives a foreign country an actual reason to stalk you and if your employer is the one who encourages you to be on the lookout for stalkers who are trying to harm you.
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"Stupidity renders itself invisible by assuming very large proportions. Completely unreasonable claims are irrefutable. Ni-en-leh pointed out that a philosopher might get into trouble by claiming that two times two makes five, but he does not risk much by claiming that two times two makes shoe polish." B. Brecht
"The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx

Last edited by dann; 23rd November 2021 at 11:48 AM.
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Old 24th November 2021, 10:27 AM   #1123
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Alien Attack? Mass Hysteria? Conspiracy?

NBC News has found an FBI agent with the CIA syndrome:

Quote:
In an email last month, an FBI official told a former agent who had reported possible brain injury symptoms that "unfortunately, the FBI is not authorized to give any medical advice and there are not any medical programs in place for current and/or retired employees." The agent began suffering migraines and dizziness about a decade ago after a stint overseas in a country near Russia.
(...)
NBC News reported in 2018 that U.S. intelligence officials considered Russia a leading suspect in what some of them assess to have been deliberate attacks on diplomats and CIA officers overseas. But in the nearly three years since then, the spy agencies have not uncovered enough evidence to pinpoint the cause or the culprit of the health incidents. U.S. officials cannot say for sure that they were intentional attacks or even that they were the result of human activity.
FBI acknowledges some agents may have Havana Syndrome symptoms (NBC News, Nov 24, 2021)
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"Stupidity renders itself invisible by assuming very large proportions. Completely unreasonable claims are irrefutable. Ni-en-leh pointed out that a philosopher might get into trouble by claiming that two times two makes five, but he does not risk much by claiming that two times two makes shoe polish." B. Brecht
"The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx
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Old 24th November 2021, 10:32 AM   #1124
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Originally Posted by dann View Post
NBC News has found an FBI agent with the CIA syndrome:

Quote:
...after a stint overseas in a country near Russia.
Alaska?

You might have inadvertently found what's wrong with Sarah Palin.
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Old 24th November 2021, 11:16 AM   #1125
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I don't think NBC News considers Alaska to be overseas ...
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"Stupidity renders itself invisible by assuming very large proportions. Completely unreasonable claims are irrefutable. Ni-en-leh pointed out that a philosopher might get into trouble by claiming that two times two makes five, but he does not risk much by claiming that two times two makes shoe polish." B. Brecht
"The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx
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Old 24th November 2021, 09:23 PM   #1126
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Quote:
CIA Director William J. Burns delivered a confidential warning to Russia’s top intelligence services that they will face “consequences” if they are behind the string of mysterious health incidents known as “Havana Syndrome” afflicting U.S. diplomats and spies around the world, according to U.S. officials familiar with the exchange.
CIA director warns Russian spies of ‘consequences’ if they are behind ‘Havana Syndrome’ incidents (WP, Nov 24, 2021)

'We just want to warn you guys that if you are behind these incidents that we don't understand but for some reason insist are attacks by you guys, there'll be a price to pay!'

Will it have any consequences at all when the CIA director and his cronies have to realize that they themselves cause the 'Havana Syndrome' incidents by insisting that they are attacks?
Is the whole point of the 'Havana Syndrome' at this point to delay this realization?
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"Stupidity renders itself invisible by assuming very large proportions. Completely unreasonable claims are irrefutable. Ni-en-leh pointed out that a philosopher might get into trouble by claiming that two times two makes five, but he does not risk much by claiming that two times two makes shoe polish." B. Brecht
"The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx
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Old 24th November 2021, 09:26 PM   #1127
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Originally Posted by dann View Post
No, I hadn't heard that one, but I can see that it's popular on Amazon.

That's the culprit.
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Old 24th November 2021, 09:28 PM   #1128
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Originally Posted by dann View Post
Will it have any consequences at all when the CIA director and his cronies have to realize that they themselves cause the 'Havana Syndrome' incidents by insisting that they are attacks?
Is the whole point of the 'Havana Syndrome' at this point to delay this realization?
They don't know how to say it's in their heads.

What's a nice way to put it?
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Old 24th November 2021, 09:31 PM   #1129
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Quote:
Internal FBI emails show an agent had reported possible brain injury symptoms after working in a country near Russia.
FBI acknowledges agents may have had ‘Havana Syndrome’ symptoms (New York Post, Nov 24, 2021)

And what were the symptoms again?

Quote:
Havana Syndrome is so named because the first incidents of it were reported by US officials serving in Cuba in 2016. Symptoms include migraines, nausea, memory lapses and dizziness.

Yeah, right!
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"Stupidity renders itself invisible by assuming very large proportions. Completely unreasonable claims are irrefutable. Ni-en-leh pointed out that a philosopher might get into trouble by claiming that two times two makes five, but he does not risk much by claiming that two times two makes shoe polish." B. Brecht
"The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx
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Old 26th November 2021, 12:54 PM   #1130
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FBI declares 'Havana Syndrome' a 'top priority': report - US officials still have yet to determine cause of syndrome (Fox News, Nov 26, 2021)
Yes, they do have to determine the cause, but they don't seem to be getting any closer: "Theories range from a nerve agent to microwave or sonic weapons."
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"Stupidity renders itself invisible by assuming very large proportions. Completely unreasonable claims are irrefutable. Ni-en-leh pointed out that a philosopher might get into trouble by claiming that two times two makes five, but he does not risk much by claiming that two times two makes shoe polish." B. Brecht
"The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx
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Old 29th November 2021, 01:12 AM   #1131
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'Immaculate Concussion'

In another context, I stumbled on this article, Wind of Ball Theory, Could a Near Miss of a Cannonball Kill You? (TFB, March 12, 2019), which mentions historical examples, but they are very low tech and don't involve sonic or microwave weapons:

Quote:
In the segment "Subcutaneous contusions without external marks" the author mentions that despite the victim showing no external marks, the internal organs have become "viscus" or "lacerated" and that "a strong tendon like the tendo-Achillis has been ruptured, without any mark having been left by the shot on the skin; symptoms of cerebral concussion have shown themselves, or rupture of a sinus and fatal effusion of the blood has occurred, yet no lesion to the scalp has been detected."

But as the article says, "skepticism still remains."
Of course, tendons can rupture without any marks on the skin - and without any cannonballs - and the alleged "symptoms of cerebral concussion" may have been due to shell shock and not confirmed by autopsies.
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"Stupidity renders itself invisible by assuming very large proportions. Completely unreasonable claims are irrefutable. Ni-en-leh pointed out that a philosopher might get into trouble by claiming that two times two makes five, but he does not risk much by claiming that two times two makes shoe polish." B. Brecht
"The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx
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Old 29th November 2021, 07:23 AM   #1132
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The allusion to Camila Cabello's song makes it obvious that the Indian news site FPJ doesn't take the 'syndrome' quite seriously:
FPJ Explains: Havana, ooh na-na - Should India fear this mysterious syndrome? (The Free Press Journal, Nov 27, 2021)

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I AGREE
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"Stupidity renders itself invisible by assuming very large proportions. Completely unreasonable claims are irrefutable. Ni-en-leh pointed out that a philosopher might get into trouble by claiming that two times two makes five, but he does not risk much by claiming that two times two makes shoe polish." B. Brecht
"The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx

Last edited by dann; 29th November 2021 at 07:26 AM.
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Old 30th November 2021, 06:21 AM   #1133
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The author of this article has considered all the current explanations but remains undecided "until science – and some stellar detective work – shines a light where currently there is none":

Quote:
Phantoms, fears and no end in sight
The evolving story – with its diverse cast of characters, impenetrable mysteries, contradictory conclusions and accumulating escalations – reads like a genre-defining work of “espionage surrealism.” Victims of alleged attacks with weapons which may not exist, have filed lawsuits for compensation for debilitating illnesses which may not have an external cause – and they are likely to succeed in court. In another sideways tilt of the plot, the loudest public voices of the putative defendant – the US government – have openly sided with the plaintiffs.
Havana Syndrome: The Perfect Disease for a Post-Truth World (Balkan Insight, Nov 30, 2021)
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"Stupidity renders itself invisible by assuming very large proportions. Completely unreasonable claims are irrefutable. Ni-en-leh pointed out that a philosopher might get into trouble by claiming that two times two makes five, but he does not risk much by claiming that two times two makes shoe polish." B. Brecht
"The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx
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Old Yesterday, 08:39 AM   #1134
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In a new article at the Fair Observer, Peter Isackson analyzes recent reporting in NYT, WP and NBC News on CIA's Mr Burns's absurd threats against Russia. As mentioned in post 1071 on Oct 30, 2021, the site has already published several articles about the 'Havana Syndrome':

Quote:
The public manifestation of paranoia that Burns dared to toss at the Russians may be little more than political posturing. It could be intended to comfort the victims by creating the illusion that the government is ready to go to battle in their cause, while pleasing hawkish Democrats intent on accusing Russia of everything bad that takes place in the world. This example of officially proclaimed paranoia begins with the formulation engineered by the authorities who make the claims, with no need to present evidence. It is then disseminated by the media, such as The Washington Post, The New York Times or NBC News. Those organs can be trusted to spread an illusory idea of a chain of cause and effect. In this case, that borders on comedy — they make the assertion while officially denying that it is a fact.
The CIA Brings Havana to Ukraine - CIA Director William J. Burns demonstrates the art of hypothetical geopolitical brinkmanship. (Fair Observer, Nov 30, 2021)
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"Stupidity renders itself invisible by assuming very large proportions. Completely unreasonable claims are irrefutable. Ni-en-leh pointed out that a philosopher might get into trouble by claiming that two times two makes five, but he does not risk much by claiming that two times two makes shoe polish." B. Brecht
"The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx
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Old Yesterday, 03:02 PM   #1135
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Originally Posted by dann View Post
In a new article at the Fair Observer, Peter Isackson analyzes recent reporting in NYT, WP and NBC News on CIA's Mr Burns's absurd threats against Russia.
Mate, thanks for your work on this - you're doing a great job.

Pity the people running USA, the CIA and their foreign affairs wouldn't ever see it.
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