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Tags China issues , China-Hong Kong relations , Hong Kong incidents , Hong Kong issues , protest incidents

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Old 15th August 2019, 09:10 AM   #81
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Originally Posted by Foolmewunz View Post
Ha ha! That never gets old!
Good to hear. Let me know if this ever changes.
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Old 15th August 2019, 09:13 AM   #82
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Always nice to know what Beijing wants you to believe, I suppose.
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Old 23rd August 2019, 11:59 PM   #83
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Interesting aspect:
YouTube disables 210 accounts spreading misinformation about Hong Kong
Twitter and Facebook did too. Including content like:
Quote:
Facebook showed examples of removed content in its own post. The posts depicted Hong Kong's protestors—who have been overwhelmingly peaceful—as masked, violent vigilantes. A couple of posts also dismissed the protestors as "cockroaches."
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Old 25th August 2019, 08:57 AM   #84
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Hong Kong Crisis: Made in America

Originally Posted by Tony Cartalucci
Claims that Western interests are driving unrest in Hong Kong to undermine China have been decried across the Western media as "fake news," "disinformation," and even grounds for censorship from platforms like Facebook and Twitter.

Yet a look at the organizations directly involved in leading the unrest and those supporting it reveals unequivocally that it originates in Washington DC - not organically from within Hong Kong itself.

In order to conceal this fact, the Western media has attempted to portray the unrest as "leaderless." Yet coordinated protests most certainly have both leaders and organizations directing the majority of the movement's decisions as well as providing the logistical support necessary for the sustained unrest Hong Kong now faces. [...]

"Interesting aspect": Tony himself has recently been banned from the big 'uns as well.
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Old 26th August 2019, 09:10 AM   #85
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Originally Posted by Childlike Empress View Post
Given that this article was written 12 days ago, one wonders how long this last stage will last.

One of the claims in the article surprised me, the claim that protesters were using US-made grenade launchers. So I looked into it. There are counter-claims that the person who did this was a Chinese government plant intended to discredit the protesters. I find that quite credible, but there's admittedly no way to really establish that reliably right now. But the claim that these were US-made weapons doesn't withstand scrutiny. First off, China claims it was an M310 grenade launcher. It certainly looks like an M320. But the M320 is manufactured by Heckler & Koch, a German firm, who supplies it to many different customers. Furthermore, the fact that it looks like an M320 doesn't mean that it is an M320. For example, there's at least one airsoft launcher that looks identical, by design. There's no way to tell from the video whether this was an actual M320 grenade launcher or an airsoft lookalike, but it's far more likely to be the latter than the former.

ETA: here's another brand with an M320-style airsoft grenade launcher
https://www.airsoftglobal.com/shop/i...l15tsfru65mr96
Airsoft imitations of real guns is a thing, apparently. There are a lot of companies that make them, and I bet even some in China.
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Last edited by Ziggurat; 26th August 2019 at 09:28 AM.
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Old 26th August 2019, 09:12 AM   #86
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Originally Posted by Childlike Empress View Post
Your article is full of conspiratorial innuendo, but it doesn't even touch the rather fundamental question of whether or not the protesters have a legitimate grievance. Propaganda usually has a tell.
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Old 3rd October 2019, 09:41 AM   #87
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"Apple has banned an app that allows people in Hong Kong to keep track of protests and police activity in the city state, claiming such information is illegal."

https://www.theregister.co.uk/2019/1...ple_hong_kong/


Chinese goons are shooting protesters, point blank, in the street.

But hey, we'll still let them into all the sporting events, all the financial arenas, absolutely everything, because money trumps morality.

Hong kong is ******.
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Old 3rd October 2019, 10:00 AM   #88
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Micheal Yon is a reporter who does some excellent on-scene reporting from conflict zones. He's been in Hong Kong for a while, got lots of interesting stuff on his facebook page about the protests:
https://www.facebook.com/MichaelYonFanPage
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Old 3rd October 2019, 05:04 PM   #89
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It is still going at an incredible intensity. The people of Hong Kong really don't want to be assimilated into the Borg.
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Old 3rd October 2019, 07:55 PM   #90
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Originally Posted by a_unique_person View Post
It is still going at an incredible intensity. The people of Hong Kong really don't want to be assimilated into the Borg.
They are right not to want to. I hope they succeed, but fear they may not.
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Old 3rd October 2019, 09:54 PM   #91
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Some in Hong Kong Feel Frustrated, as Their City is Losing to Mainland China

Originally Posted by Andre Vltchek
[...] After leaving Hong Kong, in Shanghai, I visited a brilliant, socialist realism exhibition at the iconic, monumental China Art Museum. Country under the leadership of President Xi is once again confident, revolutionary and increasingly socialist; to horror of declining West. It is a proud nation with great, elegant cities constructed by the people, for the people, and with progressively ecological countryside. Its scientific, intellectual and social achievements speak louder than words.

Contrast between Hong Kong and Shanghai is tremendous, and growing.

But do not get me wrong: I like Hong Kong. I have more than 20 years of history with that old, neurotic and spoiled lady. I can feel her pulse. I love old trams and ferries, and out-of-the-way islands.

But Hong Kong’s charm lies in its decay.

Mainland China’s beauty is fresh. China is one of the oldest cultures on earth, one of the deepest. But it feels crisp, full of hope and positive energy. Together with its closest ally, Russia, it is now working and fighting for the entire world; it is not selfish.

Hong Kong is fighting only for its vaguely defined uniqueness. Actually, it is not Hong Kong that is fighting, as most of people there want to be where they truly belong – in their beloved nation – China. It is a gang of kids with their face-masks that is fighting. In brief: a relatively big group of pro-Western extremists, whose leaders are putting their fame above the interests of the people. [...]
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Old 4th October 2019, 12:11 AM   #92
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You do realise that art is censored.
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Old 4th October 2019, 02:07 AM   #93
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Originally Posted by Childlike Empress View Post
Some will always lick the boots of their oppressors.
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Old 4th October 2019, 07:54 AM   #94
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Originally Posted by Childlike Empress View Post
Quote:
Together with its closest ally, Russia, it is now working and fighting for the entire world; it is not selfish.
Bwahahahahahahahaha!
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Old 4th October 2019, 07:55 AM   #95
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Originally Posted by a_unique_person View Post
You do realise that art is censored.
Socialist realism isn't merely censored. It's explicitly propaganda.
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Old 4th October 2019, 07:57 AM   #96
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That sinking feeling in your gut when you realize that Vladimir Putin's Russia is literally your closest ally, and you have to put the best propaganda spin on it you can.
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Old 4th October 2019, 08:11 AM   #97
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I knew you would love the text. Vltchek rocks.
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Old 4th October 2019, 08:12 AM   #98
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Originally Posted by Childlike Empress View Post
You really should step out of the bubble, sometimes.
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Old 4th October 2019, 08:59 AM   #99
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Originally Posted by Childlike Empress View Post
I knew you would love the text. Vltchek rocks.
Well, he's amusing. What I particularly like is his appeals to the evils of "colonialism", while ignoring the fact that China itself is now acting like a colonial power in Africa. I'm not sure what selfless reason he thinks the Chinese have for militarizing islands in the South China Sea either, or how forced reeducation of Uighurs is "progressive". And of course, Xi Jinpeng is so confident in mainland China's future that he's banned Winnie the Pooh. Imagine what it would take for you to feel threatened by Winnie the Pooh.

But propagandists gotta propagandize.
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Old 5th October 2019, 04:13 PM   #100
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
Well, he's amusing. What I particularly like is his appeals to the evils of "colonialism", while ignoring the fact that China itself is now acting like a colonial power in Africa.
Yes, because if there's one thing that colonial powers are known to do it is to write off debts they are owned.

Quote:
But propagandists gotta propagandize.
You mean like claiming that a non-Western country which is giving free money to African countries is acting like a colonial power (without quotes) but Western countries which take money/value out of African countries, even enslaving and otherwise brutally oppressing the population, is just "colonialism" (with quotes)?
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Old 5th October 2019, 11:38 PM   #101
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Originally Posted by Childlike Empress View Post
I knew you would love the text. Vltchek rocks.
Sorry, but writing-wise it reads like just some crappy trip report from Junák (old communistic magazine for young people). Especially that set of adjectives he used was popular back then.
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Old 5th October 2019, 11:59 PM   #102
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Originally Posted by Klimax View Post
Sorry, but writing-wise it reads like just some crappy trip report from Junák (old communistic magazine for young people). Especially that set of adjectives he used was popular back then.

Fun fact: His father is/was Czech and Andre grew up in your country where he hated that stuff like Junák with a passion. After the iron wall came down he went to the US, married rich and got US citizenship. Just to come to hate that stuff even more and become a poor globetrotting internationalist writer and reporter.
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Old 6th October 2019, 12:03 AM   #103
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Originally Posted by caveman1917 View Post
You mean like claiming that a non-Western country which is giving free money to African countries is acting like a colonial power (without quotes) but Western countries which take money/value out of African countries, even enslaving and otherwise brutally oppressing the population, is just "colonialism" (with quotes)?

It's almost cute how these people expect that others buy the propaganda they have been soaked in since birth, isn't it?
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Old 6th October 2019, 12:28 AM   #104
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Originally Posted by Childlike Empress View Post
It's almost cute how these people expect that others buy the propaganda they have been soaked in since birth, isn't it?
You don’t even have that excuse.
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Old 6th October 2019, 05:37 AM   #105
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Protesters plan to topple HK government, new manifesto for provisional government recited, senior government officials to be dimissed

Sounds like they came up with it all by themselves :

Originally Posted by Manifesto
In the development of human civilisation, it is inevitable for a dysfunctional institution to be abolished and replaced by a better one. This is how progress is made. If a government is not of the people, by the people, for the people, then it is inevitable that the people will establish a government of the people. The Hong Kong Special Administrative Region Government has proved itself to be not of the people, by the people, for the people. We hereby declare the establishment of the Provisional Government of Hong Kong.

‘We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.’ We have always identified with this inviolable principle of truth. The government and the legislature are established by the people to ensure that their rights will be protected against encroachment. All the powers of the government are derived from the people. If a government violates this principle, then the people have an absolute right to abolish it and establish a new one. [...]
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Old 6th October 2019, 07:38 AM   #106
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Hong Kong is in such a deplorable political state.
Seriously, China
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Old 7th October 2019, 04:45 AM   #107
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Ah, money, greater than morals.

Here's the NBA desperately trying to have it both ways.


https://www.theguardian.com/sport/20...emocracy-tweet
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Old 7th October 2019, 04:45 PM   #108
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Originally Posted by caveman1917 View Post
Yes, because if there's one thing that colonial powers are known to do it is to write off debts they are owned.



You mean like claiming that a non-Western country which is giving free money to African countries is acting like a colonial power (without quotes) but Western countries which take money/value out of African countries, even enslaving and otherwise brutally oppressing the population, is just "colonialism" (with quotes)?

You never met a Marxist Dictatorship you did not like.
(Granted, CHina is pretty much a CINO country..Communist In Name Only) but I think the point still holds.
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Old 7th October 2019, 04:46 PM   #109
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Never forget that in the 1930 and 40's we heard a lot from certain idiots about how wonderful job Uncle Joe was doing in Russia....
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Old 8th October 2019, 02:43 AM   #110
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
Never forget that in the 1930 and 40's we heard a lot from certain idiots about how wonderful job Uncle Joe was doing in Russia....
Still mourning the loss of Nazi Germany on the Eastern Front, I see...
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Old 8th October 2019, 04:33 AM   #111
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Originally Posted by 3point14 View Post
Ah, money, greater than morals.

Here's the NBA desperately trying to have it both ways.


https://www.theguardian.com/sport/20...emocracy-tweet
Blizzard following the NBA's brave moral stand, banning a pro Hearthstone player and revoking his prize money after making pro Hong Kong statements on the video stream.

https://www.invenglobal.com/articles...g-kong-protest
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Old 8th October 2019, 05:20 AM   #112
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Originally Posted by SuburbanTurkey View Post
Blizzard following the NBA's brave moral stand, banning a pro Hearthstone player and revoking his prize money after making pro Hong Kong statements on the video stream.



https://www.invenglobal.com/articles...g-kong-protest
Why on earth would Blizzard want their entertainment service to be in any way associated with this political minefield?

Don't talk politics at work people. Unless it's your job.
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Old 8th October 2019, 02:33 PM   #113
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Originally Posted by caveman1917 View Post
Still mourning the loss of Nazi Germany on the Eastern Front, I see...
Still ignoring the Ukraine Famine ,the Purges, and the Gulag, I see....
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Old 8th October 2019, 09:48 PM   #114
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Originally Posted by Childlike Empress View Post
Fun fact: His father is/was Czech and Andre grew up in your country where he hated that stuff like Junák with a passion. After the iron wall came down he went to the US, married rich and got US citizenship. Just to come to hate that stuff even more and become a poor globetrotting internationalist writer and reporter.
Doesn't explain why he is writing like communistic writer from 50s pro-KGB Putin and dictatorship of China posts and talkin about wonderful socialistic realism. (They are what he allegedly hates...)
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Old 8th October 2019, 10:46 PM   #115
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Originally Posted by Klimax View Post
(They are what he allegedly hates...)

What he hated. After he examined the grass on the other side he decided that he fell for western propaganda from listening to all that Feindsender stuff as a youth.
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Old 8th October 2019, 11:20 PM   #116
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I've been living in Hong Kong for the last 12 years, amazed I only just saw this thread.

I live in Wan Chai on Hennessy Road, the main thoroughfare between Admiralty and Central, where the majority of the protest marches take place. I now regularly see tear gas and riot police on the street below my apartment.

Anyone has any questions on the situation, feel free to ask, there is too much to write in one go.

In the last few weeks the violence and vandalism from the protesters have ramped up a stage, to the point that when Carrie Lam introduced an anti mask law on Friday night, the protesters rampaged across the city, vandalising MTR (subway train) stations, China-associated banks and businesses, and pro-Beijing offices. The damage was so extensive, the entire MTR system shut down on Saturday, which has never happened in 40 years, and is only just now getting back to normal.

Despite this unpleasantness, the majority of the HK population seem to still broadly support the protesters, as they feel the government has not done enough to meet their demands, and that the Occupy movement from 2014 showed that peaceful protests doesn't work.

The worry over Tanks crossing the border and entering the streets of HK was prevalent in the first few weeks, but now has receded, as the vague threats from the central Chinese government have come up empty. China cannot simply do another Tiananmen square these days, it still needs to be seen as a responsible global player, its entire belt and road initiative depends on it.

The police force that used to be considered Asia's finest is now hated and distrusted. This is because for many weeks they have been the only visible face of the government, and have hence borne the brunt of the protesters ire. They are under tremendous pressure, have not been trained for the situation and individuals have slipped up many times, using excessive force. An independent inquiry into police actions is now the top demand of the protesters, supported by over 80% of the population surveyed.

But the root cause of this all is the lack of democracy. This is a fundamentally grass roots movement that has emerged due to a population finally getting tired of an incompetent and unaccountable government that doesn't represent its people's interests, but instead the interests of big business and property developers, and by extension the Central Chinese government. The HK people want to be able to vote for a government that represents them by universal suffrage, as promised in the Basic Law that was established after the 1997 handover.

It has reached a tipping point now where the government will have to make some serious reforms in order to resolve the unrest, the current policy of suppressing protests has not worked and makes things worse. There is currently no motivation on behalf of the protesters to stop, so the unrest will continue.
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Old 9th October 2019, 08:52 AM   #117
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Originally Posted by Klimax View Post
Doesn't explain why he is writing like communistic writer from 50s pro-KGB Putin and dictatorship of China posts and talkin about wonderful socialistic realism. (They are what he allegedly hates...)
Some people just want to see the world get stomped by a boot, forever.
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Old 9th October 2019, 05:25 PM   #118
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Originally Posted by GraculusTheGreenBird View Post
I've been living in Hong Kong for the last 12 years, amazed I only just saw this thread.

I live in Wan Chai on Hennessy Road, the main thoroughfare between Admiralty and Central, where the majority of the protest marches take place. I now regularly see tear gas and riot police on the street below my apartment.

Anyone has any questions on the situation, feel free to ask, there is too much to write in one go.

In the last few weeks the violence and vandalism from the protesters have ramped up a stage, to the point that when Carrie Lam introduced an anti mask law on Friday night, the protesters rampaged across the city, vandalising MTR (subway train) stations, China-associated banks and businesses, and pro-Beijing offices. The damage was so extensive, the entire MTR system shut down on Saturday, which has never happened in 40 years, and is only just now getting back to normal.

Despite this unpleasantness, the majority of the HK population seem to still broadly support the protesters, as they feel the government has not done enough to meet their demands, and that the Occupy movement from 2014 showed that peaceful protests doesn't work.

The worry over Tanks crossing the border and entering the streets of HK was prevalent in the first few weeks, but now has receded, as the vague threats from the central Chinese government have come up empty. China cannot simply do another Tiananmen square these days, it still needs to be seen as a responsible global player, its entire belt and road initiative depends on it.

The police force that used to be considered Asia's finest is now hated and distrusted. This is because for many weeks they have been the only visible face of the government, and have hence borne the brunt of the protesters ire. They are under tremendous pressure, have not been trained for the situation and individuals have slipped up many times, using excessive force. An independent inquiry into police actions is now the top demand of the protesters, supported by over 80% of the population surveyed.

But the root cause of this all is the lack of democracy. This is a fundamentally grass roots movement that has emerged due to a population finally getting tired of an incompetent and unaccountable government that doesn't represent its people's interests, but instead the interests of big business and property developers, and by extension the Central Chinese government. The HK people want to be able to vote for a government that represents them by universal suffrage, as promised in the Basic Law that was established after the 1997 handover.

It has reached a tipping point now where the government will have to make some serious reforms in order to resolve the unrest, the current policy of suppressing protests has not worked and makes things worse. There is currently no motivation on behalf of the protesters to stop, so the unrest will continue.
Question is how far does this extend beyond Hong Kong.
If it does extend beyond Hong Kong, then the Mandate Of Heaven for the current government might be in a little trouble...
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Old 9th October 2019, 05:26 PM   #119
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Originally Posted by Klimax View Post
Doesn't explain why he is writing like communistic writer from 50s pro-KGB Putin and dictatorship of China posts and talkin about wonderful socialistic realism. (They are what he allegedly hates...)
Which one are you talking about? We have two of them here who fit that description....
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Old 9th October 2019, 08:50 PM   #120
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
Question is how far does this extend beyond Hong Kong.
If it does extend beyond Hong Kong, then the Mandate Of Heaven for the current government might be in a little trouble...
At the moment any unrest is very tightly focused in Hong Kong itself. There have been vague reports of unrest in China before, but very few and far between and very hard to get any real information due to the censorship. The ones that you do hear about are protests against local councils or politicians due to corruption, which the government deems appropriate to report on, as it shows it cares about corruption issues. But these are extremely localised and focused on issues local to that specific town or village.

China is facing a few problems which their government needs to deal with. The most important long term is the fallout from their one child policy. The worry is that there are simply not going to be enough younger people working to support the size of their aging population. The one child policy was officially ended in just 2015, but is embedded culturally. Its hard to see how they are going to deal with that.

Another is fallout from the swine flu epidemic. Pork is an absolutely fundamental part of the Chinese diet, and in a bid to control the disease many pork farms have been closed, causing an extreme shortage and a huge price increase. July pork prices went up by 20%, then in August up by 50%!

However, neither of these have yet caused any major issues for the Central government, who very tightly control what is reported on.

Interestingly, just sitting in a Hennessy Road coffee shop as I write this, and can clearly see "Revolution is coming" graffiti on a nearby wall. And "**** the Popo" spray-painted on a pedestrian crossing. Make of that what you will.
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