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Tags Australia elections , Australia politics , Julie Bishop , Malcolm Turnbull , Peter Dutton , Scott Morrison

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Old 16th September 2019, 10:00 PM   #1681
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Originally Posted by arthwollipot View Post
If the Government loses the case the implications are huge. Can a company tell its bookkeeping software to automatically reissue an invoice if it is not paid?
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Old 17th September 2019, 10:51 PM   #1682
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Olivia Newton John at question time.

Olivia Newton John sat in the guest gallery watching Question Time in the House of Representatives today. This is a sample of the comments that our esteemed leaders made:
Quote:
"Have you ever been mellow? Why are you yelling out?" - Deputy Prime Minister Michael McCormack to Labor MPs.

"I tried to get physical with the Member for Hunter last week." - McCormack again.

"Question to the Treasurer, to whom we are hopelessly devoted." - Liberal MP Andrew Laming.
https://7news.com.au/politics/questi...ament-c-459975
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Old 17th September 2019, 11:02 PM   #1683
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What. A. Bunch. Of. Childish. NUMPTIES!
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Old 17th September 2019, 11:07 PM   #1684
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It depresses me sometimes to read the liveblog of question time.

On the other hand, a Liberal Party minister was caught today running a fundraiser out of his ministerial office, so there's that.
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Old 17th September 2019, 11:17 PM   #1685
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Originally Posted by arthwollipot View Post
It depresses me sometimes to read the liveblog of question time.

On the other hand, a Liberal Party minister was caught today running a fundraiser out of his ministerial office, so there's that.
A chook-raffle?
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Old 17th September 2019, 11:23 PM   #1686
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Originally Posted by Norman Alexander View Post
A chook-raffle?
No, a Liberal Party fundraiser.

Quote:
So from the paperwork Labor was trying to table in parliament, the Pinnacle Club fundraiser is being held at a private club, but the address registered with the AEC for the Pinnacle Club is also Jason Wood’s electorate office postal address.

The financial controller for the Pinnacle Club, according to the fundraising entity’s Australian Electoral Commission disclosure return, has an @aph.gov.au email address.

Using taxpayer funded ministerial resources for private uses - such as fundraising - is against the ministerial code of conduct.

Jason Wood is the assistant customs minister. So that is why this is an issue.
Usual source
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Old 17th September 2019, 11:58 PM   #1687
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Originally Posted by arthwollipot View Post
No, a Liberal Party fundraiser.
So yeah. A chook raffle for entitled squatters, merchant bankers, and failed auctioneers, then.
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Old 18th September 2019, 06:00 PM   #1688
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Frydenberg has announced a massive underspend on the budget outcome, having slashed funding for essential services like the NDIS. Of course, this is being spun as a big win for the Coalition government.
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Old 18th September 2019, 06:17 PM   #1689
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Originally Posted by arthwollipot View Post
Frydenberg has announced a massive underspend on the budget outcome, having slashed funding for essential services like the NDIS. Of course, this is being spun as a big win for the Coalition government.
Government is not a business. It isn't supposed to make a profit.
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Old 18th September 2019, 06:21 PM   #1690
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Originally Posted by Norman Alexander View Post
Government is not a business. It isn't supposed to make a profit.
And yet, delivering a budget surplus is considered a primary consideration for the Coalition, overriding every other concern including human compassion.
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Old 18th September 2019, 06:30 PM   #1691
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Originally Posted by arthwollipot View Post
And yet, delivering a budget surplus is considered a primary consideration for the Coalition, overriding every other concern including human compassion.
Makes you wonder what they think the profit is going to be used for. Paying off national debts? That should have been part of the outgoings spreadsheet already. Christmas party...?
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Old 18th September 2019, 06:51 PM   #1692
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Australia nears its first balanced budget in a decade. But is it what the economy needs?

Quote:
After 10 budget deficits in a row, Australia is basically back in the black.

Despite April's 2019-20 Budget signalling a $4.2 billion deficit for 2018-19 financial year, the Government has announced a $690 million deficit.

In a half-a-trillion-dollar budget, that is little more than a rounding error. Relative to the size of Australia's economy it rounds to 0.0 per cent, making it essentially a balanced budget.

The result has prompted the Treasurer and Finance Minister to reconfirm the forecast return to surplus in the current financial year.

But economists are urging the Government to let go of its surplus obsession and to instead consider the needs of an increasingly struggling economy.
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Old 18th September 2019, 06:52 PM   #1693
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Originally Posted by Norman Alexander View Post
Makes you wonder what they think the profit is going to be used for. Paying off national debts? That should have been part of the outgoings spreadsheet already. Christmas party...?
Where do you think the money comes from to pay down the national debt if not a budget surplus? Should they have borrowed that money instead?
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Old 18th September 2019, 07:01 PM   #1694
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Originally Posted by psionl0 View Post
Where do you think the money comes from to pay down the national debt if not a budget surplus? Should they have borrowed that money instead?

Can't paying down that debt just be part of the budget? Does it have to be attached only to a 'surplus'? Sounds like a word game to me.
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Old 18th September 2019, 07:25 PM   #1695
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Originally Posted by quadraginta View Post
Can't paying down that debt just be part of the budget? Does it have to be attached only to a 'surplus'? Sounds like a word game to me.
I'm pretty sure that it is a numbers game. Debt either rises or falls depending on whether you have a budget deficit or surplus.

The cost of servicing the debt should be included in the budget but you can't tell. Budget figures are so rubbery that it wouldn't surprise me if government debt rose in spite of the "surplus".
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Old 19th September 2019, 12:03 AM   #1696
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Originally Posted by Norman Alexander View Post
Makes you wonder what they think the profit is going to be used for. Paying off national debts? That should have been part of the outgoings spreadsheet already. Christmas party...?
Political posturing.

That’s all it ever was.
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Old 19th September 2019, 12:23 AM   #1697
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Originally Posted by arthwollipot View Post
The Government should be spending to stimulate the economy. It should be printing money + borrowing it for capital works.
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Old 19th September 2019, 01:23 AM   #1698
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Originally Posted by psionl0 View Post
Where do you think the money comes from to pay down the national debt if not a budget surplus? Should they have borrowed that money instead?
I did say it should already be part of the outgoings spreadsheet. They should...what’s the word...budget for it.

Originally Posted by quadraginta View Post
Can't paying down that debt just be part of the budget? Does it have to be attached only to a 'surplus'? Sounds like a word game to me.
Very much so. They can just “declare” it balanced regardless of the facts.
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Old 19th September 2019, 02:48 AM   #1699
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Originally Posted by Norman Alexander View Post
I did say it should already be part of the outgoings spreadsheet. They should...what’s the word...budget for it.
So it horrifies you if the government budgets for a surplus but you are ok with them budgeting for a debt reduction?

They are one and the same thing.
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Old 19th September 2019, 11:54 AM   #1700
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Originally Posted by psionl0 View Post
So it horrifies you if the government budgets for a surplus but you are ok with them budgeting for a debt reduction?

They are one and the same thing.

Only if they earmark the "surplus" for debt reduction. Then it would be part of the budget, and not a surplus. A surplus is what you have left over after you pay for everything in your budget.
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Old 19th September 2019, 06:53 PM   #1701
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Originally Posted by quadraginta View Post
Only if they earmark the "surplus" for debt reduction. Then it would be part of the budget, and not a surplus. A surplus is what you have left over after you pay for everything in your budget.
What do you think the government does with surpluses? Put them in Scrooge McDuck's money bin?

They either buy back bonds (they can always sell them again later) or earmark the surplus for a capital project. A surplus is just the difference between current revenue and current expenditure.
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Old 19th September 2019, 07:50 PM   #1702
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Originally Posted by psionl0 View Post
What do you think the government does with surpluses? Put them in Scrooge McDuck's money bin?

They either buy back bonds (they can always sell them again later) or earmark the surplus for a capital project. A surplus is just the difference between current revenue and current expenditure.
It is also a clear indicator that they failed to spend YOUR money on what they should have - medical care, infrastructure, education, etc. All these are what we elect governments to actually do. The difference between the parties is how the money is apportioned to those needs, and we can argue about that. A surplus means they have not spent the income on that. They have scrimped on something they promised to do which means some services are not properly funded. Let's hope it was nothing important...
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Old 19th September 2019, 07:57 PM   #1703
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Originally Posted by Norman Alexander View Post
It is also a clear indicator that they failed to spend YOUR money on what they should have - medical care, infrastructure, education, etc.
You have shifted the goal posts. Your earlier argument was that the government should have included debt reduction in the budget.
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Old 19th September 2019, 08:06 PM   #1704
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Originally Posted by psionl0 View Post
You have shifted the goal posts. Your earlier argument was that the government should have included debt reduction in the budget.
No, the earlier argument was that IF the government was going to make debt repayments THEN it should be a controlled part of the budget. Otherwise they are both scrimping on services, and they are also mismanaging the debt repayments, hoping that there is a surplus of some sort to throw in that pot. Hardly what you would call good fiscal policy.
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Old 19th September 2019, 08:23 PM   #1705
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Originally Posted by Norman Alexander View Post
No, the earlier argument was that IF the government was going to make debt repayments THEN it should be a controlled part of the budget.
I have already explained it. Money spent making debt repayments is money not spent on social security, medicare, education etc. Ditto for any money spent servicing the debt. It doesn't matter what label you give it. What matters is whether we should be reducing debt while the conditions for the government are relatively good or continue on a spending binge and leave the cost of servicing the resulting debt to the next generation.

Originally Posted by Norman Alexander View Post
Otherwise they are both scrimping on services, and they are also mismanaging the debt repayments, hoping that there is a surplus of some sort to throw in that pot. Hardly what you would call good fiscal policy.
Time for you to do a course in accounting.
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Old 19th September 2019, 08:47 PM   #1706
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Originally Posted by psionl0 View Post
I have already explained it. Money spent making debt repayments is money not spent on social security, medicare, education etc. Ditto for any money spent servicing the debt. It doesn't matter what label you give it. What matters is whether we should be reducing debt while the conditions for the government are relatively good or continue on a spending binge and leave the cost of servicing the resulting debt to the next generation.
That's not what I said at all. Would you like me to rephrase it?

Quote:
Time for you to do a course in accounting.
Our current government is more in need of this.
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Old 20th September 2019, 04:39 AM   #1707
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Originally Posted by Norman Alexander View Post
That's not what I said at all. Would you like me to rephrase it?
I don't see the point. No matter how you phrase it, if I address your point you will say I misunderstood you.

The (soon to be) return to surplus is accidental rather than budgeted this time. Not that it matters; what the government budgets for and what it actually spends/receives are usually two different things. This includes surpluses or deficits.
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Old 20th September 2019, 03:03 PM   #1708
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Be interesting to see the reaction, (if any), of the government to the massive turnout to the climate change strike yesterday. I can just imagine Scomo giving us a rerun of his "God's gift" thing while holding a piece of coal. Having just returned from brown nosing the climate change denier Trump, he most likely full of renewed vigour in his quest to convince us that all is well. God is in control after all and beside which "End Times" is upon us.*


* Have to admit to taking some licence with that sentence in assuming Scomo's Pentecostalism will rise to the challenge.
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Old 20th September 2019, 03:37 PM   #1709
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Originally Posted by Thor 2 View Post
Be interesting to see the reaction, (if any), of the government to the massive turnout to the climate change strike yesterday.
None at all, and nor should there be.

Estimated 300,000 across Australia, out of a population of school kids of over 3,000,000, so under 10%.

On a school day.

See how many turn up when it's their time - try a march on a fine Saturday and get back to me.

(Be aware I am 100% in favour of urgent climate action worldwide, but these school strikes are just nonsense. The number of kids who got dropped off by mummy in a giant 4WD would be of interest as well.)
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Old 20th September 2019, 04:10 PM   #1710
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On another subject Malcolm Roberts* has put in his pennyworth about family violence.

Who was it once said: "I thought he was an idiot until he opened his mouth and removed all doubt."

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-09-...lence/11532150


From his own mouth:

Quote:
"There's no excuse for violence," Mr Roberts said.
"I know you agree with me Leith on that and you've counselled people against that.
"But when you're a father, and you can't get access to your kids, and you can't get access to the legal system properly, what else is there to do other than check out or hurt the other person?

Is it just me or didn't he just give an excuse for violence immediately after saying there was no excuse for it?
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Old 20th September 2019, 04:16 PM   #1711
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Originally Posted by The Atheist View Post
None at all, and nor should there be.

Estimated 300,000 across Australia, out of a population of school kids of over 3,000,000, so under 10%.

On a school day.

See how many turn up when it's their time - try a march on a fine Saturday and get back to me.

(Be aware I am 100% in favour of urgent climate action worldwide, but these school strikes are just nonsense. The number of kids who got dropped off by mummy in a giant 4WD would be of interest as well.)

A might testy and cynical today The Atheist.

It was a massive turnout given the constraints there would have been on many, including kids of climate change denying parents, who would have stopped them attending.
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Old 20th September 2019, 05:28 PM   #1712
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Originally Posted by The Atheist View Post
None at all, and nor should there be.

Estimated 300,000 across Australia, out of a population of school kids of over 3,000,000, so under 10%.

On a school day.

See how many turn up when it's their time - try a march on a fine Saturday and get back to me.

(Be aware I am 100% in favour of urgent climate action worldwide, but these school strikes are just nonsense. The number of kids who got dropped off by mummy in a giant 4WD would be of interest as well.)
Where to start. Firstly 300,000 is a great turnout and exceeds any other march for decades.

Secondly this was the last day of the school term. Most schools shut down at 1pm or 2pm. The kids could easily have gone home or chilled out somewhere. Instead a large number went into the city. There is not much school work that happens on the last day of term so the conservative bleat “the kids should be learning” means bugger all.

Thirdly the march assembled in Treasury Gardens. Getting a car anywhere near there with a crowd like that assembling would be near impossible. You will find nearly all caught public transport.

My youngest daughter was there and she was pumped. Ignore these future voters at your peril.
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Old 20th September 2019, 05:53 PM   #1713
The Atheist
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Originally Posted by Thor 2 View Post
A might testy and cynical today The Atheist.
Hard not to be, mate.

I've seen it all before, and nothing's changing.

For christ's sake, you lot only just voted against climate action by lining up for that Morrison twat.

Originally Posted by lionking View Post
Where to start. Firstly 300,000 is a great turnout and exceeds any other march for decades.
Really?

Looks to me like less than protested the Iraq War II in 2003.

And that worked so well...

As to the spontaneity and commitment: Bolstered by the support of more than 2000 businesses, universities, and dozens of union groups...

I see the acting PM suggests they try a weekend as well.

Yes, you call me cynical.

Looks like a very white middle-class crowd from every angle I've seen.
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Old 20th September 2019, 06:12 PM   #1714
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Originally Posted by The Atheist View Post
Hard not to be, mate.

I've seen it all before, and nothing's changing.

For christ's sake, you lot only just voted against climate action by lining up for that Morrison twat.



Really?

Looks to me like less than protested the Iraq War II in 2003.

And that worked so well...

As to the spontaneity and commitment: Bolstered by the support of more than 2000 businesses, universities, and dozens of union groups...

I see the acting PM suggests they try a weekend as well.

Yes, you call me cynical.

Looks like a very white middle-class crowd from every angle I've seen.
You are referencing the climate denying, conspiracy theorist agrarian socialist McCormack.This guy makes Winston Peters look Churchillian. Goodness me.

The next time he makes a sensible comment will be the first.
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Old 20th September 2019, 11:38 PM   #1715
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Originally Posted by psionl0 View Post
I don't see the point. No matter how you phrase it, if I address your point you will say I misunderstood you.
I'll take that as a "no" then. And also that you don't want to read my POV. Just say so next time. I won't waste electrons for you.

Quote:
The (soon to be) return to surplus is accidental rather than budgeted this time. Not that it matters; what the government budgets for and what it actually spends/receives are usually two different things. This includes surpluses or deficits.
Ah. So they failed to keep tabs on where the money went. That's "business-like", isn't it.
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Old 21st September 2019, 12:04 AM   #1716
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Originally Posted by Norman Alexander View Post
I'll take that as a "no" then. And also that you don't want to read my POV. Just say so next time. I won't waste electrons for you.
I just don't understand you. You appear to believe that budgeting for a surplus is different to budgeting for a debt reduction (of course you will deny this).
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Old 21st September 2019, 02:43 AM   #1717
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Originally Posted by psionl0 View Post
I just don't understand you. You appear to believe that budgeting for a surplus is different to budgeting for a debt reduction (of course you will deny this).
It is different.
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Old 21st September 2019, 02:46 AM   #1718
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It is possible to have a surplus and high debt.
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Old 21st September 2019, 03:41 AM   #1719
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Originally Posted by Robin View Post
It is different.


Originally Posted by Robin View Post
It is possible to have a surplus and high debt.
Of course but the debt is still reduced by the amount of the surplus.
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Old 21st September 2019, 04:41 AM   #1720
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Originally Posted by psionl0 View Post
Of course but the debt is still reduced by the amount of the surplus.
Not as far as I know. A surplus does not automatically go to pay off the country's borrowings. Debt and deficit are different things.
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