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Old 22nd April 2015, 12:37 PM   #321
jeffreyw
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Originally Posted by Sol88 View Post

but when you only have square holes to work with...mainstream will keep bashing those round pegs till they fit!

Remember the dirtysnowyballofdust is DEAD. So where does that leave the mainstream? Comets did not seed Earth's water and they're not dirty snowballs..there goes two large pillars prior theory were resting on!
The EU doesn't have a theory for how Earth has water oceans either. So both establishment and EU are barking but no noise is coming out.

It is just chemistry. Hydrogen combines with oxygen forming water. It is an exothermic reaction. The activation energy required is provided by gravitational collapse. Where in the galaxy are there objects radiating, cool enough to combine hydrogen with oxygen in their gaseous phase, and undergoing gravitational collapse?

Neptune, Uranus, Jupiter and Saturn.

The objects make water as they evolve (raining down into their interiors, you guys know what rain is right?)

Noobs.
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Planets are not formed from disks, that would be in violation of the conservation of angular momentum.

A "planet" is just an ancient star. They were never mutually exclusive.

http://vixra.org/abs/1205.0107
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Old 22nd April 2015, 02:01 PM   #322
Reality Check
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Originally Posted by jeffreyw View Post
The EU doesn't have a theory for how Earth has water oceans either. So both establishment and EU are barking but no noise is coming out.
Wrong, jeffreyw.
EU has not even fantasies about how the Earth got oceans.
Science has scientific theories about how the Earth got oceans. Science has evidence against oceans being formed by just comet impacts. That leaves asteroid impacts with maybe some comet impacts.

Your fantasies about planets forming from stars are just wrong. The gravitational collapse that forms stars from molecular clouds leaves behind enough rock to form planets, etc. Water in solar systems comes from either chemical reactions during the formation of the system or from existing water.
That is the answer to "Where in the galaxy are there objects radiating, cool enough to combine hydrogen with oxygen in their gaseous phase, and undergoing gravitational collapse?", jeffreyw.
The latest is that it is existing water: Water in the solar system predates the Sun

You obviously do not even know what rain is, jeffreyw ! It is oceans and other existing surface water evaporating to form clouds which then drop rain when conditions are right. There is no formation of water from hydrogen and water via rain.

As for your ignorance about Neptune, Uranus, Jupiter and Saturn: No oceans of water there either, jeffreyw !

Last edited by Reality Check; 22nd April 2015 at 02:05 PM.
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Old 26th April 2015, 04:49 PM   #323
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Is this still the best we've got concerning jet production?

http://www.lpi.usra.edu/meetings/lpsc2013/pdf/2401.pdf
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"Goes without saying that nothing electrical happened." [Jonesdavid116]

"No, never electric discharges" [Tusenfem]

Give up. Your idiocy knows no bounds. The electric comet woo is dead. R.I.P. [Jonesdave116]
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Old 26th April 2015, 04:56 PM   #324
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Quote:
Science has evidence against oceans being formed by just comet impacts. That leaves asteroid impacts with maybe some comet impacts.
Reality Check

I think I'll add that to my signature...another corker from you old mate!

Asteroids are comets and comets are asteroids....just like the EU mob bang on about and now confirmed by the number one emanate citizen scientist REALITY CHECK

Thanks 'ol mate
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"Goes without saying that nothing electrical happened." [Jonesdavid116]

"No, never electric discharges" [Tusenfem]

Give up. Your idiocy knows no bounds. The electric comet woo is dead. R.I.P. [Jonesdave116]
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Old 26th April 2015, 05:03 PM   #325
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Connections between the jet activity and surface features on Comet 9P/Tempel 1


Quote:
We present results from our study of the Stardust-NExT NAVCAM images of Comet 9P/Tempel 1, in which we analyze the dust coma and derive the locations and directions of 11 isolated jets detected around closest approach. Seven of the jets form a cluster that is associated with terraced terrain near the equator. Other jets arise from the nightside of the nucleus, having been in darkness for as long as 4 h, indicating that thermal lags continue to drive activity long after sunset. We compare the coma features observed here to those seen during the Deep Impact encounter on the previous apparition, and argue that much of the isolated jet activity is associated with steep slopes and the edges of smooth areas. We estimate that the cluster of jets produces 7-20% of the total dust in the coma, indicating that isolated sources play a significant role in the comet's activity. We measured an average dust production rate A(alpha)frho = 42 ± 6 cm at an approach phase angle of 79°, corresponding to a dust mass loss of approximately 264 kg s-1. Our analysis also indicates that the Stardust-NExT spacecraft did not pass through any dust jets during the flyby.
As predicted and show by observation....tick one more for the EU!!
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"Goes without saying that nothing electrical happened." [Jonesdavid116]

"No, never electric discharges" [Tusenfem]

Give up. Your idiocy knows no bounds. The electric comet woo is dead. R.I.P. [Jonesdave116]
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Old 27th April 2015, 01:23 AM   #326
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Originally Posted by Sol88 View Post
Is this still the best we've got concerning jet production?

http://www.lpi.usra.edu/meetings/lpsc2013/pdf/2401.pdf
That is just an abstract, maybe you will learn more reading a complete PhD thesis by Fougere, or any/all of papers in this list
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Old 27th April 2015, 02:20 AM   #327
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Originally Posted by Sol88 View Post

Connections between the jet activity and surface features on Comet 9P/Tempel 1




As predicted and show by observation....tick one more for the EU!!
Conveniently forgetting that EU predicts that there is electrical activity on a rock that is blasted off a planet by unknown means. Magnetic data show there are no currents, and therefore no electrical activity on the comet. The density of the comet shows that it is not rock. Basic equations show that electrostatic forces are not the cause of the measured low density. Also ignoring the measurement of molecular nitrogen, which puts constraints on the conditions in which the comet formed, i.e. in the cold outer reaches of the solar system.
So, apart from getting the origin wrong, the lack of electrical activity, the wrong density and the wrong material make up of the comet, you are doing quite well. Still batting zero, though.
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Old 27th April 2015, 03:10 AM   #328
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Quote:
Conveniently forgetting that
clays, olivine, forsterite, carbonates and silicates have been FOUND. Kinda puts a fork in mainstream bovine excrement spouted as truth!!!

Hands down
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"Goes without saying that nothing electrical happened." [Jonesdavid116]

"No, never electric discharges" [Tusenfem]

Give up. Your idiocy knows no bounds. The electric comet woo is dead. R.I.P. [Jonesdave116]
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Old 27th April 2015, 03:14 AM   #329
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Look at how wrong they've got the jet and dust mechanism completey wrong when not including charge on the dust particles!! That my friends is a dusty plasma, the other observed effects are secondary to the electrical/plasma nature of the observed phenomena that electric comets are. ��
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"Goes without saying that nothing electrical happened." [Jonesdavid116]

"No, never electric discharges" [Tusenfem]

Give up. Your idiocy knows no bounds. The electric comet woo is dead. R.I.P. [Jonesdave116]
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Old 27th April 2015, 03:47 AM   #330
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Originally Posted by Sol88 View Post
clays, olivine, forsterite, carbonates and silicates have been FOUND. Kinda puts a fork in mainstream bovine excrement spouted as truth!!!

Hands down
I presume you mean in some of the tiny little dust grains? Still doesn't explain a density of 470 km/m^3 does it? And has no implications for the mainstream theory. To quote from the ESA Rosetta blog, http://blogs.esa.int/rosetta/2015/04...-dust-grains/:
"Density is a critical parameter differentiating these two families of particles, and it is likely that they have quite different histories. By comparing the GIADA results with laboratory measurements, the scientists believe that the denser compact grains represent materials that underwent significant processing in the environment surrounding the new born Sun, before being accreted by Comet 67P/C-G as it formed in the outer Solar System.

The low-density fluffy particles, however, are thought to be primitive material linked to interstellar dust, material that pre-dates the birth of the Sun and escaped any processing before being accreted by the comet during its formation."

Or from this paper, here: http://iopscience.iop.org/1538-4357/...8534.text.html

"Amorphous silicates in comets are thought to be presolar interstellar medium (ISM) silicate grains (Wooden 2002; Hanner & Bradley 2004). On the other hand, crystalline silicates by their relative absence (≤0.5%) in the ISM (Kemper et al. 2004) are primitive grains processed in the solar nebula."

So nothing about the comet having to be blasted off of Earth, Venus, Mars or Mercury needed to explain any of this. Still batting zero.
You still haven't explained the density. Explain the density.
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Old 27th April 2015, 04:44 AM   #331
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Density??? Explain the clays and carbonates and maybe we can talk!


Care to have a crack?
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"Goes without saying that nothing electrical happened." [Jonesdavid116]

"No, never electric discharges" [Tusenfem]

Give up. Your idiocy knows no bounds. The electric comet woo is dead. R.I.P. [Jonesdave116]
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Old 27th April 2015, 08:43 AM   #332
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Originally Posted by Sol88 View Post
Density??? Explain the clays and carbonates and maybe we can talk!


Care to have a crack?

Sol, I suggest you go off and educate yourself, to the extent that's possible, on the diifference between particle density and bulk density. Then you'd be in a position to discuss some actual science. I'll go way out on a limb here and predict you'll instead continute chucking rocks at the greenhouse.
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Old 27th April 2015, 09:45 AM   #333
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Originally Posted by Sol88 View Post
Density??? Explain the clays and carbonates and maybe we can talk!


Care to have a crack?
why bother, you won't understand nor believe what would be wrtitten
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Old 27th April 2015, 11:06 AM   #334
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Originally Posted by tusenfem View Post
why bother, you won't understand nor believe what would be wrtitten
Quite. Much easier to believe that there is a planet out there with crustal rocks that have a density of 470 kg/m^3, from which was ejected a portion of said rock due to electrical woo.
I've come to the opinion that for a lot of these EU fanatics, this psuedo-science has actually become faith based. This church will eventually split, based on factions gathering around its various high priests, and their interpretation of their electric sun models (none of which work). We'll have the Resistor church, under high priest Thornhill, and the Capacitor church, led by Archbishop Scott.
There will also be other factions, the equivalent of Anabaptists and Mormons, where Mozina and others will be preaching. All going on about something that doesn't exist.
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Old 27th April 2015, 12:20 PM   #335
Sol88
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Originally Posted by tusenfem View Post
why bother, you won't understand nor believe what would be wrtitten

Have a go, not just me in this thread.
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"Goes without saying that nothing electrical happened." [Jonesdavid116]

"No, never electric discharges" [Tusenfem]

Give up. Your idiocy knows no bounds. The electric comet woo is dead. R.I.P. [Jonesdave116]
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Old 27th April 2015, 12:29 PM   #336
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Originally Posted by jonesdave116 View Post
Quite. Much easier to believe that there is a planet out there with crustal rocks that have a density of 470 kg/m^3, from which was ejected a portion of said rock due to electrical woo.
I've come to the opinion that for a lot of these EU fanatics, this psuedo-science has actually become faith based. This church will eventually split, based on factions gathering around its various high priests, and their interpretation of their electric sun models (none of which work). We'll have the Resistor church, under high priest Thornhill, and the Capacitor church, led by Archbishop Scott.
There will also be other factions, the equivalent of Anabaptists and Mormons, where Mozina and others will be preaching. All going on about something that doesn't exist.

Of course black holes(division by zero) dark matter, dark energy, flavour changing neutrinos to name a few are fine inside the grand poobah of creation religions called the big bang!!

Nice story though, even if it ignores a large part of evidence out ancient forebears recorded for us, nice elegant maths to prove it as well! Pity it bears no relation to actual reality. But why spoil a good pay check!!
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"Goes without saying that nothing electrical happened." [Jonesdavid116]

"No, never electric discharges" [Tusenfem]

Give up. Your idiocy knows no bounds. The electric comet woo is dead. R.I.P. [Jonesdave116]
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Old 27th April 2015, 12:38 PM   #337
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Originally Posted by Sol88 View Post
Of course black holes(division by zero) dark matter, dark energy, flavour changing neutrinos to name a few are fine inside the grand poobah of creation religions called the big bang!!
... said the Velikovsky believer.

Quote:
Nice story though, even if it ignores a large part of evidence out ancient forebears recorded for us
Evidence like neolithic religions?

I won't use the forum's irony smilies here, they aren't big enough to express your colossal hypocrisy.
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Old 27th April 2015, 03:17 PM   #338
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
... said the Velikovsky believer.



Evidence like neolithic religions?

I won't use the forum's irony smilies here, they aren't big enough to express your colossal hypocrisy.

Your (mainstream) arrogance is nothing short of outstanding, to not include the whole of human history.

Velikovsky is just one interpretation, yours is the other.

Embarrassing for scientist to have no idea about the same archetypes recorded around the world in different cultures, except it had something to do with religion...

Shame on you.

oh and just for your information, I never said I was a Velikovskyian. Though when the electric comet is proven beyond doubt, mainstream is going to have a dam hard time not acknowledging Velikovsky.
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"Goes without saying that nothing electrical happened." [Jonesdavid116]

"No, never electric discharges" [Tusenfem]

Give up. Your idiocy knows no bounds. The electric comet woo is dead. R.I.P. [Jonesdave116]
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Old 27th April 2015, 03:30 PM   #339
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sol88
Density??? Explain the clays and carbonates and maybe we can talk!


Care to have a crack?
Quote:
why bother, you won't understand nor believe what would be wrtitten

But we digress again....


anyone here willing to have a crack at mainstreams explanation for the observed clays, carbonates and crystalline silicates in the formation of comets from the solar nebula?

Oh and by the way a total surprise for mainstream scientist and expected if it was once part of a planetary crust something along the lines of the surface of the planet Mars
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"Goes without saying that nothing electrical happened." [Jonesdavid116]

"No, never electric discharges" [Tusenfem]

Give up. Your idiocy knows no bounds. The electric comet woo is dead. R.I.P. [Jonesdave116]
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Old 27th April 2015, 04:03 PM   #340
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Originally Posted by Sol88 View Post
I never said I was a Velikovskyian.

Well then here is the $64 question. Are you now, or have you ever been a member of the Velikovsky Kool-Aid crowd?
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Old 27th April 2015, 04:37 PM   #341
Reality Check
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Originally Posted by Sol88 View Post
I think I'll add that to my signature...another corker from you old mate.
Oh dear: lying (quote mining) and twisting of my basic English into the EU delusions is not good, Sol88 !
This is what I wrote about a delusion that Earth is a comet:
Originally Posted by Reality Check View Post
That is a couple of fantasies about the pillars of comet theory, Sol88.
Comet theory does not predict that Earths oceans were formed by comets. Earth is not a comet ! The theory of the formation of Earth includes that its oceans were formed from comets and/or asteroids. We already knew that oceans coming only from comets was unlikely given the existing measurements of the D/H ratio of comets compared to what we calculate the D/H of the early oceans was. The measurement of the D/H ratio in 67P is essentially the nail in the coffin of that theory. That still leaves the physical fact that asteroids and comets must have impacted the Earth in its early history (we see that on moons). So the oceans were formed from asteroids + some comets.
This is what I wrote about what looks like ignorance of astronomy from jeffreyw:
Originally Posted by Reality Check View Post
Wrong, jeffreyw.
EU has not even fantasies about how the Earth got oceans.
Science has scientific theories about how the Earth got oceans. Science has evidence against oceans being formed by just comet impacts. That leaves asteroid impacts with maybe some comet impacts.

Neither post supports any of the EU delusions, Sol88 !
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Old 27th April 2015, 04:42 PM   #342
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Originally Posted by Sol88 View Post
Of course black holes(division by zero) dark matter, dark energy, flavour changing neutrinos to name a few are fine inside the grand poobah of creation religions called the big bang!!

Nice story though, even if it ignores a large part of evidence out ancient forebears recorded for us, nice elegant maths to prove it as well! Pity it bears no relation to actual reality. But why spoil a good pay check!!
Still waiting for an answer from you. But instead you vanish and fringe-reset and instead of discussion you're now playing some kind of fallacy salad.

You are doing a bang-up job representing the finest thinking ElectroWhateverIsm provides.
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Old 27th April 2015, 04:45 PM   #343
Reality Check
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Originally Posted by Sol88 View Post
As predicted and show by observation....tick one more for the EU!!
Tick one more for the delusion that the EU crowd know enough about electromagnetism to make predictions, Sol88 !
Connections between the jet activity and surface features on Comet 9P/Tempel 1[/b]
Quote:
We present results from our study of the Stardust-NExT NAVCAM images of Comet 9P/Tempel 1, in which we analyze the dust coma and derive the locations and directions of 11 isolated jets detected around closest approach. Seven of the jets form a cluster that is associated with terraced terrain near the equator. Other jets arise from the nightside of the nucleus, having been in darkness for as long as 4 h, indicating that thermal lags continue to drive activity long after sunset. We compare the coma features observed here to those seen during the Deep Impact encounter on the previous apparition, and argue that much of the isolated jet activity is associated with steep slopes and the edges of smooth areas. We estimate that the cluster of jets produces 7-20% of the total dust in the coma, indicating that isolated sources play a significant role in the comet's activity. We measured an average dust production rate A(alpha)frho = 42 ± 6 cm at an approach phase angle of 79°, corresponding to a dust mass loss of approximately 264 kg s-1. Our analysis also indicates that the Stardust-NExT spacecraft did not pass through any dust jets during the flyby.

The EU delusion is that jets are electrical discharges. Electrical discharges do not form on "steep slopes" or even "edges" of ice and dust surfaces, Sol88.
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Old 27th April 2015, 04:48 PM   #344
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Originally Posted by Sol88 View Post
clays, olivine, forsterite, carbonates and silicates have been FOUND.
The COMPLETE TRUTH is that clays, olivine, forsterite, carbonates and silicates have been found in comet dust. The half-lie is this being the detection of the EU delusion of comets being made of rock, Sol88.
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Old 27th April 2015, 04:56 PM   #345
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Originally Posted by Sol88 View Post
Look at how wrong they've got the jet and dust mechanism completey wrong when not including charge on the dust particles!!
Look at how this is a lie about getting the jet and dust mechanism completely wrong, Sol88 !
Astronomers have got the jet mechanism completely right even when not including any charge on the dust particles!
Astronomers have got the dust mechanism completely right even when not including any charge on the dust particles!
ADS has 39 abstracts for comet jet dust charge dating from 1986!

Originally Posted by Sol88 View Post
That my friends is a dusty plasma,
That my friend is not a dusty plasma - it is charged dust particles !
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Old 27th April 2015, 05:02 PM   #346
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Originally Posted by Sol88 View Post
Density??? Explain the clays and carbonates and maybe we can talk!
That is easy to explain, Sol88: An EU delusion that dust particles are solid rock does not mean that comets are solid rock !

Six years of supporting EU delusions about comet densities shows that it is useless talking to you about comet densities. So no we cannot talk, Sol88, because you will continue to believe in the EU delusions regardless of what the real world says about comets:
Comets have measured densities that are much less than that of rocks (asteroids).
Quote:
The electric comet idea states that comets are rocky bodies like asteroids.
For some reason EC proponents cannot grasp that the measured density of comet nuclei is ~0.6 g/cc, the measured density of asteroids is ~3.0 g/cc and that 0.6 is less than 3.0 .
They tend to reply by asserting the methods used to calculate the density of comets are flawed in some unknown way. They make this into a wish fulfillment fantasy by having the unknown flaws reduce the real density when these unknown flaws could just as well increase the real density.
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Old 27th April 2015, 05:09 PM   #347
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Originally Posted by Sol88 View Post
Of course ...
Of course confirming ignorance about other areas of physics does not help your argument from ignorance about comets, Sol88.
Black holes are a simple result of GR with plenty of observational evidence that they exist. The only thing really missing is direct observation of an event horizon.
Dark matter is the observation that there is matter that does not emit light.
Dark energy is the observation that the expansion of the universe is expanding.
Lepton flavor changing neutrinos is the observation that neutrinos change lepton flavor !


Paranoia about pay checks creating science is just paranoia.
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Old 27th April 2015, 05:23 PM   #348
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Question Sol88: Are the Velikovskyian ideas correct

Originally Posted by Sol88 View Post
oh and just for your information, I never said I was a Velikovskyian. ...
FYI, Sol88.
Blind support of the electric comet delusion that is based on the Velikovskyian delusion does mean that you are at least indirectly Velikovskyian.
If you do not believe in the Velikovskyian fantasies then you should state so.

Thinking that the 50 year old Velikovskyian delusion would be correct in any universe is bad. Even worse is thinking that the neo-Velikovskyian fantasies of the electric comet authors could be correct.
Davis Talbot had (and may still have) the delusion that Saturn and other planets moved around in recent times to satisfy cherry picked myths . He is not notable enough to even have a Wikipedia page any more!
Wal Thornhill is also a neo-Velikovskyian and has the delusion that the Grand Canyon was caused by electrical discharges(s) .

Last edited by Reality Check; 27th April 2015 at 05:24 PM.
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Old 27th April 2015, 05:34 PM   #349
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Originally Posted by Sol88 View Post
anyone here willing to have a crack at mainstreams explanation for the observed clays, carbonates and crystalline silicates in the formation of comets from the solar nebula?
Why should we address your ignorance (cosmic dust has clays, carbonates and crystalline silicates!), Sol88, when you have a track record of ignoring science (e.g. the measured density of comets)?
Or repeating the logical fallacy that your ignorance mans that the mainstream theory is wrong?
Or repeating the logical fallacy of false dichotomy (the mainstream theory being wrong does not mean that a complete delusion is right !)


And making up fairy stories as in the rest of your post?

Last edited by Reality Check; 27th April 2015 at 06:12 PM.
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Old 27th April 2015, 11:40 PM   #350
Sol88
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Quote:
Why should we address your ignorance (cosmic dust has clays, carbonates and crystalline silicates!)
Oh must have missed that. Do you have a source?
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"Goes without saying that nothing electrical happened." [Jonesdavid116]

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Old 27th April 2015, 11:50 PM   #351
Sol88
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Originally Posted by Reality Check View Post
FYI, Sol88.
Blind support of the electric comet delusion that is based on the Velikovskyian delusion does mean that you are at least indirectly Velikovskyian.
If you do not believe in the Velikovskyian fantasies then you should state so.

Thinking that the 50 year old Velikovskyian delusion would be correct in any universe is bad. Even worse is thinking that the neo-Velikovskyian fantasies of the electric comet authors could be correct.
Davis Talbot had (and may still have) the delusion that Saturn and other planets moved around in recent times to satisfy cherry picked myths . He is not notable enough to even have a Wikipedia page any more!
Wal Thornhill is also a neo-Velikovskyian and has the delusion that the Grand Canyon was caused by electrical discharges(s) .
Well then I must be a neo-Velikovskyian!

because i believe the land forms I've seen in the Kimberley Region of Australia LOOK very much like the landforms seen on rocky planets, moons AND comets in our solar system (and they look nothing like glaciers as has been harped on about here)

So it's not a far step to ask how the two are so similar, when as far as we've been told most of our planets, moons, asteroids and comets dont have the same proccess as Earth eg erosion, tectonics, vulcanism (except to save face by invoking the familiar(Io, Enceladeus...)....but PLASMA may a been a common cause and there you have your neo-Velikovskyian

Never read his work but should I spose if I'm labled a neo-Velikovskyian I'd better find out.

If an X2 class solar flare makes a direct hit on Earth do YOU think you would notice it?
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"Goes without saying that nothing electrical happened." [Jonesdavid116]

"No, never electric discharges" [Tusenfem]

Give up. Your idiocy knows no bounds. The electric comet woo is dead. R.I.P. [Jonesdave116]
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Old 28th April 2015, 01:28 AM   #352
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470 kg/m^3. End of argument.
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Old 28th April 2015, 03:25 AM   #353
Sol88
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Originally Posted by jonesdave116 View Post
470 kg/m^3. End of argument.
well you still have to explain the observed clays, carbonates and crystalline silicates....

and not so sure about the set in stone (no pun intended) figure of 470 kg/m^3

I mean try and explain that (from the rosetta blog)
Quote:
Dave Higgins says: 22/08/2014 at 09:11
Such a low density? (300kg/cubic meter)
Even a pile of course aggregate used as the base of road construction would have a far higher density than this, even though the pile would be full of air gaps.
Are there any thoughts as to how the structure of the comet could be so full of holes, it should look like a sponge.
When we look at large eroded areas like the striated side of the head, there is no clue to such a porous structure.
Its also difficult to imagine it being hollow, the erosion at the neck has been so extensive, it surely, by now, would have broken through to reveal a hollow core.
Also if the comet is built from interstellar dust, that is expected to be very fine, then you would expect it to pack very densely.
Baffled by these results ??
and CONSERT confirmed no large voids did it not??

So whilst the old dirtysnowball theory maybe dead and buried nothing else except some deep fried ice cream analogy....
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"Goes without saying that nothing electrical happened." [Jonesdavid116]

"No, never electric discharges" [Tusenfem]

Give up. Your idiocy knows no bounds. The electric comet woo is dead. R.I.P. [Jonesdave116]

Last edited by Sol88; 28th April 2015 at 03:34 AM.
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Old 28th April 2015, 05:06 AM   #354
jonesdave116
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Originally Posted by Sol88 View Post
well you still have to explain the observed clays, carbonates and crystalline silicates....

and not so sure about the set in stone (no pun intended) figure of 470 kg/m^3

I mean try and explain that (from the rosetta blog) and CONSERT confirmed no large voids did it not??

So whilst the old dirtysnowball theory maybe dead and buried nothing else except some deep fried ice cream analogy....
It's still 470 kg/m^3, however you spin it. They wouldn't be able to plan orbital maneuvers were it to be anything else. Everything would go wrong. So however perplexing EU might find this data, it stands. And they still can't explain it.
Whatever the reason for the clays and carbonates, and I've seen a few hypotheses, then they will be intrinsic to the cometary environment. That is they happened on, within or to the comet. They may have an origin on a planetary surface, but only if the comet has picked up material ejected from Earth or Mars which has been blasted off those planets by impacts. If two particular hypotheses are correct, then you had a Mars sized object hitting the Earth, and something very large impacting Mars, causing the hemispherical dichotomy. That would leave a lot of dust and rocks of planetary origin floating around out there, which originated from the surfaces of planets that had the conditions for forming such materials.
Not saying that is the explanation, but it is far more feasible than some electric woo magicking a large body of rock, with a density half that of water, out into space. To the best of my knowledge, the CONSERT data doesn't show anything regarding the interior structure yet, as they didn't have a lot of time to do all the necessary experiments, and will need more results. They will also need to know its precise location. Knowledge of its internal structure will not change the density. It is what it is.
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Old 28th April 2015, 05:07 AM   #355
Sol88
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Originally Posted by jonesdave116 View Post
470 kg/m^3. End of argument.
Ohhh....I see where they've made the mistake now rookie mistake, well a couple actually.

from ESA

Determining the mass of comet 67P/C-G

Quote:
As the spacecraft passes close to comet 67P/C-G, it is pulled slightly off course by the comet’s gravity, resulting in tiny changes to the spacecraft’s velocity.
Do you assume the gravity is the same as on Earth???

Quote:
and can subsequently be translated into measurements of the mass and density structure of the comet.
and you assume mass and gravity are the same on Earth


So something so basics and mainstream can not explain gravity even with billions spent and 100's years of maths and ZIP...


So to taking 470 kg/m^3 as gospel is your fatal error.

Looks like rock smells like rock feels like rock but is deep fried ice cream
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"Goes without saying that nothing electrical happened." [Jonesdavid116]

"No, never electric discharges" [Tusenfem]

Give up. Your idiocy knows no bounds. The electric comet woo is dead. R.I.P. [Jonesdave116]
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Old 28th April 2015, 06:35 AM   #356
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Originally Posted by Sol88 View Post
Do you assume the gravity is the same as on Earth???
Let's see... our understanding of gravity can predict the motion of the planets and their moons with exquisite precision. It can guide the Rosetta probe to an accurate rendezvous with 67P. But once we get to 67P, suddenly our understanding of gravity is wrong.

How the hell did we even get there if we're wrong about gravity, Sol?
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Old 28th April 2015, 07:02 AM   #357
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Mass is the same, regardless of where you are. Gravity acts the same regardless of where you are. Amazingly enough, that is exactly why we managed to put probes in the right.place so tha r the EU people could show their scientific illiteracy. ...
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Old 28th April 2015, 07:54 AM   #358
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Hey Sol, how's your understanding of the difference between particle density and bulk density coming along? Any questions? Or are you still afraid understanding a little bit of science might create overwhelming cognitive dissonance?

Ignorance is understandable; willful ignorance not so much. If it takes any note of EU at all, history will note that it was but a fleeting pimple on the *** of scientific progress.
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Old 28th April 2015, 08:33 AM   #359
Matthew Cline
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Originally Posted by Sol88 View Post
So something so basics and mainstream can not explain gravity
What can't explain gravity? And can the same thing explain electromagnetism? If so, how is electromagnetism explained?
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Old 28th April 2015, 10:21 AM   #360
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Originally Posted by Sol88 View Post
Do you assume the gravity is the same as on Earth???
Wow a whole new layer of Conspiracy Theory!

So the Rosetta probe got there with calculations based upon standard celestial mechanics:

Yes or No Sol88 ?


I can't wait for the explanation!
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