ISF Logo   IS Forum
Forum Index Register Members List Events Mark Forums Read Help

Go Back   International Skeptics Forum » General Topics » Science, Mathematics, Medicine, and Technology
 


Welcome to the International Skeptics Forum, where we discuss skepticism, critical thinking, the paranormal and science in a friendly but lively way. You are currently viewing the forum as a guest, which means you are missing out on discussing matters that are of interest to you. Please consider registering so you can gain full use of the forum features and interact with other Members. Registration is simple, fast and free! Click here to register today.
Reply
Old 15th July 2017, 02:47 PM   #361
ProgrammingGodJordan
Banned
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Jamaica
Posts: 1,718
Originally Posted by JayUtah View Post
Computer science is a science the same way library science is a science. "Science" is a very misused word today. You're not a scientist in the way the word is commonly understood. A scientist can demonstrate a mode of critical thought that, based on your arguments here, completely escapes you. You have been given basic training in a vocation that employs technical tools. You are not a scientist.
That belief opposes science, is but not my fallacy.

Do explain, "critically thinking" one, how a system that barely concerns evidence (i.e. belief) does not oppose a system that is bound by evidence (i.e. science)

ProgrammingGodJordan is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 15th July 2017, 02:49 PM   #362
Aridas
Crazy Little Green Dragon
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 3,663
Originally Posted by ProgrammingGodJordan View Post
Don't you tire of expressing nonsense?
Don't you?

Originally Posted by ProgrammingGodJordan View Post
Synonyms, are, rather than opposing, quite similar, or the same.
Which does not dispute what I said. I said nothing about opposing. Rather, I pointed out that synonyms are frequently NOT the same, and if one has to go through intermediaries to get from one to another, you can make all sorts of nonsensical claims.

Originally Posted by ProgrammingGodJordan View Post
You had long expressed falsely, of the supposed opposing nature betwixt belief/system, amidst response 253 and beyond:
Learn to read.

There's absolutely no way to honestly get from what I said there to some opposed nature between belief and system.

Even less so when one takes into account everything else that I've consistently said.







Originally Posted by ProgrammingGodJordan View Post
No such contradiction persists.

Note my usage of the word "was" below:
Irrelevant. You may as well claim that the Gospel of the Flying Spaghetti Monster, had it been written in ancient times for the exact same reasons, would have counted as science. In general, mythology was used to deal with entirely different things than science and employed entirely different kinds of methods to produce. Lumping them together serves as a disservice to both.
__________________
So sayeth the crazy little dragon.
Aridas is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 15th July 2017, 02:54 PM   #363
ProgrammingGodJordan
Banned
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Jamaica
Posts: 1,718
Originally Posted by Aridas View Post
Don't you?



Which does not dispute what I said. I said nothing about opposing. Rather, I pointed out that synonyms are frequently NOT the same, and if one has to go through intermediaries to get from one to another, you can make all sorts of nonsensical claims.



Learn to read.

There's absolutely no way to honestly get from what I said there to some opposed nature between belief and system.

Even less so when one takes into account everything else that I've consistently said.
Quite the invalid response.

I shall no longer partake in response to your nonsensical comments.

Recall that you had mentioned clearly, that belief was not a system.

You need search for the definition of oppose.

Originally Posted by Aridas View Post
A fallacious claim remains a fallacious claim, whether it's looked at once or a thousand times. The first line in your self-quote is simply false assertion. The most damning fault there is that belief is not a system, no matter how many times you repeat it.
SOURCE: http://www.internationalskeptics.com...&postcount=253
ProgrammingGodJordan is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 15th July 2017, 02:54 PM   #364
steenkh
Philosopher
 
steenkh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Denmark
Posts: 5,113
Originally Posted by ProgrammingGodJordan View Post
That belief opposes science, is but not my fallacy.
Actually, it is. You are generalizing belief, so that you imply that a believer does not demand evidence for anything, whereas in reality, all believers only dispense with the need for evidence when it concerns their own particular belief.
__________________
Steen

--
Jack of all trades - master of none!
steenkh is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 15th July 2017, 02:56 PM   #365
Aridas
Crazy Little Green Dragon
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 3,663
Originally Posted by ProgrammingGodJordan View Post
Quite the inconsequential response.
Yet, that is what you're trying to claim that we should do, by the standards that you're pushing.



Originally Posted by ProgrammingGodJordan View Post
ADVICE:
You need avoid silly, irrelevant anecdotes.
Silly, sure. They're intended to show off how silly your claims are, after all. Irrelevant? Hardly. They're simply applications of the standards that you are pushing.
__________________
So sayeth the crazy little dragon.
Aridas is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 15th July 2017, 02:59 PM   #366
ProgrammingGodJordan
Banned
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Jamaica
Posts: 1,718
Originally Posted by steenkh View Post
Actually, it is. You are generalizing belief, so that you imply that a believer does not demand evidence for anything, whereas in reality, all believers only dispense with the need for evidence when it concerns their own particular belief.


I tire of the nonsensical content amidst your responses.

There are already words for constructs that prioritize evidence, such as science.

I need not generalize belief, for by definition, belief is not one of the aforementioned words.
ProgrammingGodJordan is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 15th July 2017, 03:04 PM   #367
Aridas
Crazy Little Green Dragon
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 3,663
Originally Posted by ProgrammingGodJordan View Post
Quite the invalid response.

I shall no longer partake in response to your nonsensical comments.

Recall that you had mentioned clearly, that belief was not a system.

You need search for the definition of oppose.
Belief is not a system. That something is not something in no way means that it opposes it, though. Furthermore, when it's been specifically and repeatedly stated that systems can certainly be made out of beliefs, your response is shown to be even more nonsensical. At this point, though, it's beyond any reasonable doubt that your obtuseness is willful. Congratulations on earning the title "Troll."
__________________
So sayeth the crazy little dragon.

Last edited by Aridas; 15th July 2017 at 03:06 PM.
Aridas is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 15th July 2017, 03:08 PM   #368
ProgrammingGodJordan
Banned
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Jamaica
Posts: 1,718
Originally Posted by BStrong View Post
That there is a universe of delusional individuals that present themselves as having earned all manner of qualifications and decorations when in fact they have neither.

Between your tortured use of the english language and everything else you posted in the last couple of pages you're neck and neck with the #1 guy on the Stolen Valor hit parade.
Quite the inconsequential comment of yours for I have not, beyond the UWI CS degree, presented to have attained any other/"all manner of" qualification.
ProgrammingGodJordan is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 15th July 2017, 03:10 PM   #369
ProgrammingGodJordan
Banned
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Jamaica
Posts: 1,718
Originally Posted by Aridas View Post
Belief is not a system. That something is not something in no way means that it opposes it, though. Furthermore, when it's been specifically and repeatedly stated that systems can certainly be made out of beliefs, your response is shown to be even more nonsensical. At this point, though, it's beyond any reasonable doubt that your obtuseness is willful. Congratulations on earning the title "Troll."
A prior quote of mine applies:

Originally Posted by ProgrammingGodJordan

Both beliefs and systems are expressible as plans or ideas.





ProgrammingGodJordan is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 15th July 2017, 03:17 PM   #370
Aridas
Crazy Little Green Dragon
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 3,663
Originally Posted by ProgrammingGodJordan View Post
A prior quote of mine applies:
And the prior quote of mine applies, too. Synonyms are not perfectly the same, especially when you're dealing with words that have multiple meanings, and by chaining together synonyms, you can fairly certainly get from red to elephant, which by your logic here would mean that red and elephant are the same thing. Even past that, belief, for example, is ALSO synonyms with words like hypothesis and conclusion that are quite important terms to science.

Argument by synonym, much less synonym chain, isn't a valid argument in the first place. On top of that, if it was granted that it was, though, you would have to accept that belief is an integral part of science, too, which would destroy non-beliefism by highlighting the internal contradictions clearly.

There's no victory here for you, even potentially.
__________________
So sayeth the crazy little dragon.

Last edited by Aridas; 15th July 2017 at 03:20 PM.
Aridas is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 15th July 2017, 03:23 PM   #371
ProgrammingGodJordan
Banned
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Jamaica
Posts: 1,718
Originally Posted by Aridas
And the prior quote of mine applies, too. Synonyms are not perfectly the same, especially when you're dealing with words that have multiple meanings, and by chaining together synonyms, you can fairly certainly get from red to elephant, which by your logic here would mean that red and elephant are the same thing. Even past that, belief, for example, is ALSO synonyms with words like hypothesis and conclusion that are quite important terms to science.

Argument by synonym, much less synonym chain, isn't a valid argument in the first place. On top of that, if it was granted that it was, though, you would have to accept that belief is an integral part of science, too, which would destroy non-beliefism by highlighting the internal contradictions clearly.

There's no victory here for you, even potentially.
Inconsequential.

Last edited by ProgrammingGodJordan; 15th July 2017 at 03:25 PM.
ProgrammingGodJordan is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 15th July 2017, 03:25 PM   #372
ProgrammingGodJordan
Banned
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Jamaica
Posts: 1,718
Originally Posted by JayUtah View Post
You solve them by writing programs. That is a vocation. If you want to demonstrate skill at problem analysis and creative solution, you will have to provide more than simply parroted algorithms on GitHub.


Yes, to build upon them and extend the science. You're merely implementing the work of others -- restating it, as it were. That does not make you a scientist.


See 'thought curvature', work of mine, concerning the construction of the basis for some super artificial general intelligence.

Thought curvature utilizes a paradigm of mine, I called the 'Supermanifold hypothesis in deep Learning'.

The Supermanifold Hypothesis in Deep Learning is a simple extension of the Manifold hypothesis in deep learning, amidst Yoshua Bengio's Deep learning book.


Originally Posted by JayUtah View Post
Originally Posted by ProgrammingGodJordan
Is it not typical for an undergraduate CS student to possess some range of detailed mathematical knowledge, regarding quantum computing.
https://www.quora.com/How-does-quant...rdan-Bennett-9
It is typical for an undergraduate CS student to have a rudimentary understanding of discrete mathematics and numerical methods. Set theory and formal logic used to be part of the field, but is no longer commonly taught. It is not common for such a student to have knowledge of subfields such as quantum computing. If you are claiming expertise in that field as the basis for your thesis, you will need to lay the appropriate foundation. A general CS diploma is not enough.
The response above, is yet to approach my prior response, highlighted in yellow.




Quote:
I don't recognize you as an expert on science. I'll draw my own conclusions on whether your claims have scientific merit.
I have never once mentioned of any such alpha geekery.


FOOTNOTE (Not addressed to you JayUtah):

Note: A hypothesis is by definition, a concept that typically concerns evidence, (albeit limited), whereas the very concept of belief, is a construct that typically consists of no evidence at all.

Last edited by ProgrammingGodJordan; 15th July 2017 at 03:35 PM.
ProgrammingGodJordan is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 15th July 2017, 03:26 PM   #373
Aridas
Crazy Little Green Dragon
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 3,663
Originally Posted by ProgrammingGodJordan View Post
Inconsequential.
What is inconsequential about it, though?

By engaging in fallacious logic like this to try to defend it, rather than simply correcting the errors, you're showing that non-beliefism is no better than religion.
__________________
So sayeth the crazy little dragon.

Last edited by Aridas; 15th July 2017 at 03:29 PM.
Aridas is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 15th July 2017, 03:33 PM   #374
abaddon
Penultimate Amazing
 
abaddon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 16,468
Originally Posted by ProgrammingGodJordan View Post
That there are fake degrees for a sequence of real universities, does not suddenly invalidate my Computer Science degree via UWI Mona Campus.
Sorry, I don't believe you.
__________________
Who is General Failure? And why is he reading my hard drive?
abaddon is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 15th July 2017, 03:35 PM   #375
abaddon
Penultimate Amazing
 
abaddon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 16,468
Originally Posted by ProgrammingGodJordan View Post
Originally Posted by BStrong View Post
That there is a universe of delusional individuals that present themselves as having earned all manner of qualifications and decorations when in fact they have neither.

Between your tortured use of the english language and everything else you posted in the last couple of pages you're neck and neck with the #1 guy on the Stolen Valor hit parade.
Quite the inconsequential comment of yours for I have not, beyond the UWI CS degree, presented to have attained any other/"all manner of" qualification.
Yeah, try reading what was actually posted rather than what you imagine was posted.
__________________
Who is General Failure? And why is he reading my hard drive?
abaddon is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 15th July 2017, 03:36 PM   #376
ProgrammingGodJordan
Banned
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Jamaica
Posts: 1,718
Originally Posted by abaddon View Post
Yeah, try reading what was actually posted rather than what you imagine was posted.
Yet another invalid, inconsequential comment.
ProgrammingGodJordan is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 15th July 2017, 03:37 PM   #377
John Jones
Penultimate Amazing
 
John Jones's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Iowa USA
Posts: 11,373
Originally Posted by ProgrammingGodJordan View Post
Regardless of that of the feelings of the beings amidst this thread, I am a scientist, for I posses a modern CS degree, whence I typically apply computer science, such that computer science aligned problems are solved.
QED
__________________
Credibility is not a boomerang. If you throw it away, it's not coming back.
John Jones is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 15th July 2017, 03:40 PM   #378
The Norseman
Meandering fecklessly
 
The Norseman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 6,858
Originally Posted by ProgrammingGodJordan View Post
That there are fake degrees for a sequence of real universities, does not suddenly invalidate my Computer Science degree via UWI Mona Campus.
Based on your posts here, it certainly calls into question the validity of the documents you are providing in order to bolster your standing.

You fail at both your attempts at logic and at English and it surprises many here that you could have earned a bachelors degree at any decent university at all.

The more I think about it, it appears you're trying for an Appeal to Authority anyway.




Quote:
Yes, your invalid expressions were incorrect.
I was only incorrect in my statement about that university not offering a general CS degree nothing more.







Originally Posted by ProgrammingGodJordan View Post
Precisely.

I simply had to respond to the Norsemans and the BStrongs, in relation to my CS degree's status.
You initially brought it up as some sort of proof that you're competent in spouting the nonsense you're spouting. Ultimately, JayUtah is again correct in pointing out that it matters not that you have a bachelors in Computer Science; it does not mean that you're a scientist as is understood the term to mean. Others may have different ideas, of course, but I generally feel that the doctorate level people have earned the title of scientist.

However, my good friend earned a BS in Political Science (as he wanted to become an attorney later). Is he therefore a scientist too, just like you?
The Norseman is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 15th July 2017, 03:49 PM   #379
John Jones
Penultimate Amazing
 
John Jones's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Iowa USA
Posts: 11,373
Originally Posted by ProgrammingGodJordan View Post
Precisely.

I simply had to respond to the Norsemans and the BStrongs, in relation to my CS degree's status.

As I had prior mentioned:
Have you ever heard of the Crackpot Index? If you haven't, you have no business at a place like this.

One sign of a crackpot is that he will cite and quote himself more than anyone else.

Do you do that?
__________________
Credibility is not a boomerang. If you throw it away, it's not coming back.
John Jones is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 15th July 2017, 03:54 PM   #380
abaddon
Penultimate Amazing
 
abaddon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 16,468
Originally Posted by John Jones View Post
Have you ever heard of the Crackpot Index? If you haven't, you have no business at a place like this.

One sign of a crackpot is that he will cite and quote himself more than anyone else.

Do you do that?
Oh don't be so serious. The mangled "Engrish as she is goodly spoke" is hilarious entertainment all on it's own.
__________________
Who is General Failure? And why is he reading my hard drive?
abaddon is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 15th July 2017, 03:59 PM   #381
John Jones
Penultimate Amazing
 
John Jones's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Iowa USA
Posts: 11,373
Originally Posted by abaddon View Post
Oh don't be so serious. The mangled "Engrish as she is goodly spoke" is hilarious entertainment all on it's own.
I beg your pardon. I drop in and out of this series of gibberish threads when I have time to kill.

I'm off to the Jacuzzi for a while. Cheers!
__________________
Credibility is not a boomerang. If you throw it away, it's not coming back.
John Jones is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 15th July 2017, 04:10 PM   #382
ProgrammingGodJordan
Banned
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Jamaica
Posts: 1,718
Originally Posted by The Norseman View Post


You initially brought it up as some sort of proof that you're competent in spouting the nonsense you're spouting. Ultimately, JayUtah is again correct in pointing out that it matters not that you have a bachelors in Computer Science; it does not mean that you're a scientist as is understood the term to mean. Others may have different ideas, of course, but I generally feel that the doctorate level people have earned the title of scientist.

However, my good friend earned a BS in Political Science (as he wanted to become an attorney later). Is he therefore a scientist too, just like you?

Yet another silly, trivially demonstrable lie.

The posting of the degree was initially in response to desmirelle's comment, via reply 293.

Desmirelle had invalidly expressed my degree's nature.


FOOTNOTE:

Factually, JayUtah's comment, is demonstrably wrong:


Last edited by ProgrammingGodJordan; 15th July 2017 at 04:16 PM.
ProgrammingGodJordan is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 15th July 2017, 04:20 PM   #383
ProgrammingGodJordan
Banned
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Jamaica
Posts: 1,718
Originally Posted by Aridas View Post
What is inconsequential about it, though?

By engaging in fallacious logic like this to try to defend it, rather than simply correcting the errors, you're showing that non-beliefism is no better than religion.
As I had long mentioned, the aforementioned words (belief, system, plan) bare non-trivial connections.

Non-beliefism underlines that belief opposes science.

That belief opposes science is not non-beliefism manufactured; for such persists regardless of non-beliefism's presence.
ProgrammingGodJordan is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 15th July 2017, 05:29 PM   #384
abaddon
Penultimate Amazing
 
abaddon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 16,468
Originally Posted by ProgrammingGodJordan View Post
Yet another silly, trivially demonstrable lie.

The posting of the degree was initially in response to

Desmirelle had invalidly expressed my degree's nature.


FOOTNOTE:

Factually, JayUtah's comment, is demonstrably wrong:
OK, I shall be generous. It might well be that you are unaware that honking great multi-coloured fonts and graphics are the hallmark and signature of the internet crackpot.

I will allow that you may not be aware of this, although I cannot see how this might be, but you are a young bloke and us old fogies have a certain tolerance for the folly of youth.

Be aware, however, that you have more than reached the end of such tolerance. Technicolour posts add no weight to your proposition, rather they detract credibility. Whenever I see such technicolour presentation I have a single thought immediately... "Ah, a child". You are quite free to self present as such. I ask, is that how you wish to be perceived? You are free to do so, should that be your desired self presentation to the world at large. Good luck with that.
__________________
Who is General Failure? And why is he reading my hard drive?
abaddon is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 15th July 2017, 05:55 PM   #385
Loss Leader
Would Be Ringing (if a bell)
Moderator
 
Loss Leader's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Florida
Posts: 23,575
Synonym for "elephant" is "mammoth."

Synonym for "mammoth" is "large".

Synonym for "large" is "generous".

Synonym for "generous" is "honest".

Thus, elephants are honest.
__________________
I have the honor to be
Your Obdt. St

L. Leader
Loss Leader is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 15th July 2017, 06:04 PM   #386
abaddon
Penultimate Amazing
 
abaddon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 16,468
Originally Posted by Loss Leader View Post
Synonym for "elephant" is "mammoth."

Synonym for "mammoth" is "large".

Synonym for "large" is "generous".

Synonym for "generous" is "honest".

Thus, elephants are honest.
Those word games are fun. It is not unrelated to the Six Degrees of Bacon. I find it amusing that Kevin does not much mind it.
__________________
Who is General Failure? And why is he reading my hard drive?
abaddon is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 15th July 2017, 06:50 PM   #387
JayUtah
Penultimate Amazing
 
JayUtah's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 13,973
Originally Posted by ProgrammingGodJordan View Post
That belief opposes science, is but not my fallacy.
No, my belief in the nature of the field I taught does not "oppose science." You are not an authority on what science is or is not.

Quote:
Do explain, "critically thinking" one, how a system that barely concerns evidence (i.e. belief) does not oppose a system that is bound by evidence (i.e. science).
Because you have simply contrived it to be so by crude and unworkable definitions of the relevant concepts. Your theory involves cognitive neuroscience and comparative ancient literature, fields not typically covered in an easily-obtained vocational certificate. You have shown no mastery of these alien fields.
JayUtah is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 15th July 2017, 07:01 PM   #388
JayUtah
Penultimate Amazing
 
JayUtah's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 13,973
Originally Posted by ProgrammingGodJordan View Post
See...
No, I'm not interested in reading your other self-published puffery. Do you have any peer-reviewed publications in the appropriate journals for cognitive neuroscience and folklore and mythology?

Quote:
The response above, is yet to approach my prior response, highlighted in yellow.
No, the response answers your question succinctly and correctly. You are claiming expertise you cannot demonstrate that you have. Further, the expertise you are claiming is not relevant to the conclusions you're drawing regarding the nature of belief in humans.

Quote:
I have never once mentioned of any such alpha geekery.
You describe yourself as a "programming god" in your nick, despite having limited practical experience and, by your own admission, a lower than typical level of education for someone in your vocation. Given that the median age of my software development team is around 40, and that their median level of experience is somewhere around 20 years, I think you're making a very hubristic claim. I would expect that hubris to rub off in other areas.

Further, when you deign to tell people what is or isn't science, then yes you are implying you are knowledgeable enough to make that judgment. I do not accept you as an expert on what constitutes science.

Quote:
...whereas the very concept of belief, is a construct that typically consists of no evidence at all.
I don't agree, and I cannot see where you have done an appropriate level of research, experimentation, or study to support such a conclusion. Nor have your attempts to defend it here exhibited any sort of suitable erudition.
JayUtah is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 15th July 2017, 07:11 PM   #389
abaddon
Penultimate Amazing
 
abaddon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 16,468
Originally Posted by ProgrammingGodJordan View Post
As I had long mentioned, the aforementioned words (belief, system, plan) bare non-trivial connections.

Non-beliefism underlines that belief opposes science.

That belief opposes science is not non-beliefism manufactured; for such persists regardless of non-beliefism's presence.
And what is that in english?
__________________
Who is General Failure? And why is he reading my hard drive?
abaddon is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 15th July 2017, 07:32 PM   #390
JayUtah
Penultimate Amazing
 
JayUtah's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 13,973
Originally Posted by ProgrammingGodJordan View Post
Factually, JayUtah's comment, is demonstrably wrong:
I taught in the field so I'll keep my own counsel regarding whether computer science is a science in the sense that you intend. Had you consulted instead the article on "Computer Science," rather than trying to equivocate on the identity of "scientist," Wikipedia would have told you that "Its fields can be divided into a variety of theoretical and practical disciplines." You have been trained in the practical discipline of programming a computer. You have not been trained as a scientist. Nor is any part of computer science concerned with comparative literature or cognitive neuroscience, the fields that pertain to your claims regarding human belief.

Further, it's cute that you think that having earned a baccalaureate degree in computer science makes you a computer scientist of any stripe. I'm sure you realize there are degrees beyond the bachelor's, and that your professors would probably be considered computer scientists while you -- their student -- are not. For example, there exists an academic field called "construction science." That's different than simply working as a construction worker.
JayUtah is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 15th July 2017, 07:39 PM   #391
abaddon
Penultimate Amazing
 
abaddon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 16,468
Originally Posted by John Jones View Post
I beg your pardon. I drop in and out of this series of gibberish threads when I have time to kill.

I'm off to the Jacuzzi for a while. Cheers!
You must admit, the whole malarkey is amusing. Sometimes I cannot suppress my inner child.
__________________
Who is General Failure? And why is he reading my hard drive?
abaddon is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 15th July 2017, 07:51 PM   #392
Thermal
Graduate Poster
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 1,908
Originally Posted by ProgrammingGodJordan View Post
...However, I hadn't ended my education amidst UWI Mona's scope...
Originally Posted by ProgrammingGodJordan View Post
...There is a non-trivial degree of contradiction amidst your response...
Originally Posted by ProgrammingGodJordan View Post
Regardless of that of the feelings of the beings amidst this thread, am a scientist...
Originally Posted by ProgrammingGodJordan View Post
...You had long expressed falsely, of the supposed opposing nature betwixt belief/system...
Originally Posted by ProgrammingGodJordan View Post
...is a simple extension of the Manifold hypothesis in deep learning, amidst Yoshua Bengio's...
Originally Posted by ProgrammingGodJordan View Post
...Non-beliefism underlines that belief opposes science...

That belief opposes science is not non-beliefism manufactured; for such persists regardless of non-beliefism's presence.
Drink!
Thermal is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 15th July 2017, 08:21 PM   #393
Aridas
Crazy Little Green Dragon
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 3,663
Originally Posted by ProgrammingGodJordan View Post
As I had long mentioned, the aforementioned words (belief, system, plan) bare non-trivial connections.
And where was it argued that there are no connections? Not by me, certainly. It's just that the non-trivial connections that actually are there show your assertions to be nonsense. Going by the connections that you've invoked, though, the words belief and conclusion bear a far more direct and powerful connection, much like system and attack, if one's going to try to treat argumentum ad synonym (chain) as valid. Are systems therefore conclusions? Is belief equatable with attack?

It's silly to claim that they are the same, yet that's exactly what you're doing. Why?

Originally Posted by ProgrammingGodJordan View Post
Non-beliefism underlines that belief opposes science.

That belief opposes science is not non-beliefism manufactured; for such persists regardless of non-beliefism's presence.
Rather, the claim that belief opposes science is simply invalid. Non-beliefism is irrelevant to the truth of that. However, that you've included that claim as a central part of non-beliefism is sufficient reason to treat non-beliefism as invalid.
__________________
So sayeth the crazy little dragon.

Last edited by Aridas; 15th July 2017 at 08:30 PM.
Aridas is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 15th July 2017, 08:25 PM   #394
ProgrammingGodJordan
Banned
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Jamaica
Posts: 1,718
Originally Posted by abaddon View Post
OK, I shall be generous. It might well be that you are unaware that honking great multi-coloured fonts and graphics are the hallmark and signature of the internet crackpot.

I will allow that you may not be aware of this, although I cannot see how this might be, but you are a young bloke and us old fogies have a certain tolerance for the folly of youth.

Be aware, however, that you have more than reached the end of such tolerance. Technicolour posts add no weight to your proposition, rather they detract credibility. Whenever I see such technicolour presentation I have a single thought immediately... "Ah, a child". You are quite free to self present as such. I ask, is that how you wish to be perceived? You are free to do so, should that be your desired self presentation to the world at large. Good luck with that.
Inconsequential.

That one is old does not suddenly grant one basic sense.
ProgrammingGodJordan is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 15th July 2017, 08:31 PM   #395
JayUtah
Penultimate Amazing
 
JayUtah's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 13,973
Originally Posted by ProgrammingGodJordan View Post
That one is old does not suddenly grant one basic sense.
It is generally accepted that wisdom increases with age, and Abaddon is generally correct about the correlation between gaudy visuals and crackpottery. You are a recent graduate, quite young on the grand scale of credibility. Consider that your critics are generally much older, much wiser, and much more experienced than you. Your ongoing hubris doesn't convey confidence.

Last edited by JayUtah; 15th July 2017 at 08:33 PM.
JayUtah is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 15th July 2017, 08:31 PM   #396
ProgrammingGodJordan
Banned
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Jamaica
Posts: 1,718
Originally Posted by JayUtah View Post
No, my belief in the nature of the field I taught does not "oppose science." You are not an authority on what science is or is not.



Because you have simply contrived it to be so by crude and unworkable definitions of the relevant concepts. Your theory involves cognitive neuroscience and comparative ancient literature, fields not typically covered in an easily-obtained vocational certificate. You have shown no mastery of these alien fields.
One need not any "alien degree", such that one observes belief's definition:

Belief: To accept as true, especially absent evidence (google...).

Simply 'wise one', that your particular beliefs are based on science, does not suddenly re-align belief's definition; belief is such that may especially exclude science.

There are words that construe a prioritizing of scientific evidence, belief is simply not one of such, regardless of your feelings.
ProgrammingGodJordan is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 15th July 2017, 08:31 PM   #397
abaddon
Penultimate Amazing
 
abaddon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 16,468
Originally Posted by JayUtah View Post
I taught in the field so I'll keep my own counsel regarding whether computer science is a science in the sense that you intend. Had you consulted instead the article on "Computer Science," rather than trying to equivocate on the identity of "scientist," Wikipedia would have told you that "Its fields can be divided into a variety of theoretical and practical disciplines." You have been trained in the practical discipline of programming a computer. You have not been trained as a scientist. Nor is any part of computer science concerned with comparative literature or cognitive neuroscience, the fields that pertain to your claims regarding human belief.

Further, it's cute that you think that having earned a baccalaureate degree in computer science makes you a computer scientist of any stripe. I'm sure you realize there are degrees beyond the bachelor's, and that your professors would probably be considered computer scientists while you -- their student -- are not. For example, there exists an academic field called "construction science." That's different than simply working as a construction worker.
Not at all. The funniest part is when words which he clearly has no understanding of get tossed about willy nilly. This is both irritating and amusing at the same time. If such a CV were wheeled across my desk, it would hit the bin immediately. There would be no chance of even a prelim interview. For some reason unexplained, PGJ seems blissfully unaware of this.

Can I explain this? Nope. No more than I can explain that we have all been subtly mocking him and he never noticed that either.

Sorry, but that is the reality. PGJ will not much like it, but what is one to do but call a spade a spade?
__________________
Who is General Failure? And why is he reading my hard drive?
abaddon is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 15th July 2017, 08:34 PM   #398
ProgrammingGodJordan
Banned
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Jamaica
Posts: 1,718
Originally Posted by JayUtah View Post
It is generally accepted that wisdom increases with age. You are a recent graduate, quite young on the grand scale of credibility. Consider that your critics are generally much older, much wiser, and much more experienced than you. Your ongoing hubris doesn't convey confidence.

That such 'wiser' older folk, are unable to distinguish between a construct that may especially entail non-evidence (i.e. belief), and one that is evidence bound (i.e. scientific methodology), is disappointing.
ProgrammingGodJordan is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 15th July 2017, 08:35 PM   #399
JayUtah
Penultimate Amazing
 
JayUtah's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 13,973
Originally Posted by ProgrammingGodJordan View Post
One need not any "alien degree", such that one observes belief's definition:

Belief: To accept as true, especially absent evidence (google...).

Simply 'wise one', that your particular beliefs are based on science, does not suddenly re-align belief's definition; belief is such that may especially exclude science.

There are words that construe a prioritizing of scientific evidence, belief is simply not one of such, regardless of your feelings.
Gibberish. You are drawing conclusions based on no discernible research or experimentation, and predicated by you upon a basis that has no relevant scientific foundation. You are very good at looking up words in common lay references, but you demonstrate no sophistication.
JayUtah is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 15th July 2017, 08:36 PM   #400
JayUtah
Penultimate Amazing
 
JayUtah's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 13,973
Originally Posted by ProgrammingGodJordan View Post
That such 'wiser' older folk, are unable to distinguish between a construct that may especially entail non-evidence (i.e. belief), and one that is evidence bound (i.e. scientific methodology), is disappointing.
No, people are not stupid because they dispute your claims. Please attempt a less arrogant posture.
JayUtah is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Reply

International Skeptics Forum » General Topics » Science, Mathematics, Medicine, and Technology

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 11:30 PM.
Powered by vBulletin. Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
2014, TribeTech AB. All Rights Reserved.
This forum began as part of the James Randi Education Foundation (JREF). However, the forum now exists as
an independent entity with no affiliation with or endorsement by the JREF, including the section in reference to "JREF" topics.

Disclaimer: Messages posted in the Forum are solely the opinion of their authors.