ISF Logo   IS Forum
Forum Index Register Members List Events Mark Forums Read Help

Go Back   International Skeptics Forum » General Topics » USA Politics
 


Welcome to the International Skeptics Forum, where we discuss skepticism, critical thinking, the paranormal and science in a friendly but lively way. You are currently viewing the forum as a guest, which means you are missing out on discussing matters that are of interest to you. Please consider registering so you can gain full use of the forum features and interact with other Members. Registration is simple, fast and free! Click here to register today.
Tags donald trump , Trump administration , Trump controversies

Closed Thread
Old 12th February 2019, 08:15 AM   #81
WilliamSeger
Illuminator
 
WilliamSeger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 4,539
It's illegal to spend any federal resources, including staff time, on campaigning. With previous presidents, it was hard to know where to draw the line, but not so with Trump: Taxpayers paid for a campaign rally, and it should be on the list of impeachable offenses.
__________________
"We're done! We're done! GET OUT!"
WilliamSeger is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 12th February 2019, 08:30 AM   #82
Ziggurat
Penultimate Amazing
 
Ziggurat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 43,483
Originally Posted by WilliamSeger View Post
It's illegal to spend any federal resources, including staff time, on campaigning.
That's not quite true. The Hatch Act prohibits most federal employees from doing partisan political activities. But employees of the Executive Office of the President are allowed to.

Quote:
With previous presidents, it was hard to know where to draw the line, but not so with Trump: Taxpayers paid for a campaign rally, and it should be on the list of impeachable offenses.
Yeah, no.
__________________
"As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law
Ziggurat is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 12th February 2019, 08:32 AM   #83
Segnosaur
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 13,171
Yet another lawsuit the president may have to deal with...

From: https://www.cnn.com/2019/02/11/polit...ide/index.html
Cliff Sims, a former White House staffer who wrote a tell-all book, is suing President Donald Trump to stop him from "silencing" Sims as he promotes his book (Team of vipers)....The lawsuit requests a court ruling that Trump "may not enforce, whether directly or through non-U.S. Government cutouts, any nondisclosure agreements that seek to unconstitutionally infringe upon his First Amendment rights."

Granted, this lawsuit won't hurt the president in a financial sense, but if the lawsuit is successful then it could mean more damaging information gets released in the future, since the threat from non-disclosure agreements would be voided.
__________________
Trust me, I know what I'm doing. - Sledgehammer

I'm Mary Poppin's Y'all! - Yondu

We are Groot - Groot
Segnosaur is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 12th February 2019, 08:35 AM   #84
Squeegee Beckenheim
Penultimate Amazing
 
Squeegee Beckenheim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 24,318
It's being reported that the White House is planning to use money for flood control projects in California, and disaster relief for Puerto Rico and California to fund building the wall
__________________
I don't trust atoms. They make up everything.
Squeegee Beckenheim is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 12th February 2019, 08:38 AM   #85
phiwum
Penultimate Amazing
 
phiwum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 11,464
Originally Posted by WilliamSeger View Post
It's illegal to spend any federal resources, including staff time, on campaigning. With previous presidents, it was hard to know where to draw the line, but not so with Trump: Taxpayers paid for a campaign rally, and it should be on the list of impeachable offenses.
What makes you think that the rally was paid for by taxpayers? Have you a citation to that effect?

The media called it a campaign rally. Absent explicit evidence, I reckon that the bulk of the spending (excepting things like security, which I think the government pays for and always has, though I welcome corrections) comes from the campaign.

So, do let me know if you have read that this was primarily a taxpayer-funded rally or to what extent it was taxpayer-funded and how that differs from previous incumbents' campaign events. Until then, I don't share your concerns.
phiwum is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 12th February 2019, 08:40 AM   #86
Segnosaur
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 13,171
Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim View Post
That makes sense... a flood of water, a flood of immigrants. Same thing really.



The article also mentions the possibility of using money that had been earmarked for military infrastructure as well.

I hope Trump tries... the legal hassles will keep the project tied up for years.
__________________
Trust me, I know what I'm doing. - Sledgehammer

I'm Mary Poppin's Y'all! - Yondu

We are Groot - Groot
Segnosaur is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 12th February 2019, 08:45 AM   #87
Belz...
Fiend God
 
Belz...'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: In the details
Posts: 82,499
Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim View Post
That doesn't sound like a great plan.
__________________
Master of the Shining Darkness

"My views are nonsense. So what?" - BobTheCoward


Belz... is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 12th February 2019, 08:48 AM   #88
Segnosaur
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 13,171
Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
Quote:
It's illegal to spend any federal resources, including staff time, on campaigning.
That's not quite true. The Hatch Act prohibits most federal employees from doing partisan political activities. But employees of the Executive Office of the President are allowed to.
The president and employees of the executive are allowed to engage in political activities, but they are required to reimburse the government for some of the costs.

From: https://www.wusa9.com/article/news/l...s/65-584456401
If the president travels to endorse Congressional Candidates, either the campaign or a political action committee must reimburse the government for some of the expenses. Things like food, lodging and whatever the president would have paid on a commercial ticket. When travel involves both official and political functions, the White House uses a formula to determine how much airfare is to be paid by the traveler, and how any per diem and other travel related costs are to be paid by the government. Also the Federal Election Commission said for travel on behalf of a campaign, "The reimbursement for that travel is the responsibility of the committee on whose behalf the travel occurs."

So, the big question is whether Trump actually followed protocol and paid for his food/lodging/cost of a commercial flight, or whether he avoided those costs by either: 1) totally ignoring the issue (which would be illegal, but falls in line with how Trump normally operates), or 2) claiming that the trip was an 'official' function (i.e. part of his official job as president, which most people recognize that it was not.)
__________________
Trust me, I know what I'm doing. - Sledgehammer

I'm Mary Poppin's Y'all! - Yondu

We are Groot - Groot
Segnosaur is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 12th February 2019, 09:04 AM   #89
Trebuchet
Penultimate Amazing
 
Trebuchet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: The Great Northwet
Posts: 21,837
Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim View Post
Originally Posted by Belz... View Post
That doesn't sound like a great plan.
Hey, California only floods because they don't mow the forests and fires happen! And a lot of people in PR have names ending in "ez". Just put a wall of paper towels around them.
__________________
Cum catapultae proscribeantur tum soli proscripti catapultas habeant.
Trebuchet is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 12th February 2019, 09:04 AM   #90
WilliamSeger
Illuminator
 
WilliamSeger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 4,539
Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
That's not quite true. The Hatch Act prohibits most federal employees from doing partisan political activities. But employees of the Executive Office of the President are allowed to.
It is quite true that they are not allowed to expend any federal resources for campaigning purposes or devote any time to fund raising. The Hatch Act excludes Executive Office employees from the requirement to refrain from any active political campaigning, but does not exempt them from those laws. Just two months ago, the Office of Special Council found that six White House employees violated the Hatch Act just by tweeting.

Quote:
Yeah, no.
As frequently mentioned, that's for Congress to decide.
__________________
"We're done! We're done! GET OUT!"

Last edited by WilliamSeger; 12th February 2019 at 09:06 AM.
WilliamSeger is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 12th February 2019, 09:06 AM   #91
Ziggurat
Penultimate Amazing
 
Ziggurat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 43,483
Originally Posted by WilliamSeger View Post
It is quite true that they are not allowed to expend any federal resources for campaigning purposes or devote any time to fund raising.
phiwum already asked you why you thought federal funds were spent on this rally. Do you have a response to that?
__________________
"As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law
Ziggurat is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 12th February 2019, 09:12 AM   #92
WilliamSeger
Illuminator
 
WilliamSeger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 4,539
Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
phiwum already asked you why you thought federal funds were spent on this rally. Do you have a response to that?
Since there was no "official" purpose, all of the time and money spent on it except for the security, which taxpayers are required to pay wherever the president goes.
__________________
"We're done! We're done! GET OUT!"
WilliamSeger is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 12th February 2019, 09:20 AM   #93
Segnosaur
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 13,171
Since Trump is so keen in building a wall, I thought it would be a good idea to remind people of some of the secondary costs:

The wall is expected to impact the following:

- The National Butterfly Center (which, in addition to its environmental benefits, also brings in tourists to the area.)

- Ranches that have existed near the border that have been run by the same family for over 2 centuries

- The SpaceX launch facility in Texas, which brings in millions of dollars to the local economy. Building a wall will probably mean the facility will need to be moved, removing dozens of jobs from the local area

https://www.vox.com/2018/3/28/171526...ge-butterflies

https://www.texastribune.org/2018/09...-ranching-rio/

https://www.techspot.com/news/78677-...launchpad.html
__________________
Trust me, I know what I'm doing. - Sledgehammer

I'm Mary Poppin's Y'all! - Yondu

We are Groot - Groot
Segnosaur is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 12th February 2019, 09:24 AM   #94
JoeMorgue
Self Employed
Remittance Man
 
JoeMorgue's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Florida
Posts: 18,548
I really don't think "But think of the butterflies!" is going to sway anybody already on board with the wall.
__________________
- "Ernest Hemingway once wrote that the world is a fine place and worth fighting for. I agree with the second part." - Detective Sommerset
- "Stupidity does not cancel out stupidity to yield genius. It breeds like a bucket-full of coked out hamsters." - The Oatmeal
- "To the best of my knowledge the only thing philosophy has ever proven is that Descartes could think." - SMBC
JoeMorgue is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 12th February 2019, 09:25 AM   #95
Belz...
Fiend God
 
Belz...'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: In the details
Posts: 82,499
Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
I really don't think "But think of the butterflies!" is going to sway anybody already on board with the wall.
Maybe if we show them pictures of butterfly foetuses...
__________________
Master of the Shining Darkness

"My views are nonsense. So what?" - BobTheCoward


Belz... is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 12th February 2019, 09:27 AM   #96
Segnosaur
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 13,171
Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
I really don't think "But think of the butterflies!" is going to sway anybody already on board with the wall.
That's why I also mentioned the fact that the National Butterfly Center is a tourist destination, and has a positive benefit for the local economy.

Building a wall will eliminate jobs, both at the Center itself, and at local businesses any tourists may frequent.
__________________
Trust me, I know what I'm doing. - Sledgehammer

I'm Mary Poppin's Y'all! - Yondu

We are Groot - Groot
Segnosaur is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 12th February 2019, 09:29 AM   #97
JoeMorgue
Self Employed
Remittance Man
 
JoeMorgue's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Florida
Posts: 18,548
Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
That's why I also mentioned the fact that the National Butterfly Center is a tourist destination, and has a positive benefit for the local economy.

Building a wall will eliminate jobs, both at the Center itself, and at local businesses any tourists may frequent.
Anybody who works at or visits a butterfly center is a pansy limp-wristed liberal. Acceptable collateral damage.
__________________
- "Ernest Hemingway once wrote that the world is a fine place and worth fighting for. I agree with the second part." - Detective Sommerset
- "Stupidity does not cancel out stupidity to yield genius. It breeds like a bucket-full of coked out hamsters." - The Oatmeal
- "To the best of my knowledge the only thing philosophy has ever proven is that Descartes could think." - SMBC
JoeMorgue is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 12th February 2019, 09:33 AM   #98
phiwum
Penultimate Amazing
 
phiwum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 11,464
Originally Posted by WilliamSeger View Post
Since there was no "official" purpose, all of the time and money spent on it except for the security, which taxpayers are required to pay wherever the president goes.
And other presidents have similarly had campaign events. There is a difference insofar as Trump has more campaign events, and that may be an issue, but it seemed to me that you were up in arms over something more than just a difference in the number of events.
phiwum is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 12th February 2019, 09:34 AM   #99
Segnosaur
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 13,171
Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
Quote:
Building a wall will eliminate jobs, both at the Center itself, and at local businesses any tourists may frequent.
Anybody who works at or visits a butterfly center is a pansy limp-wristed liberal. Acceptable collateral damage.
I know you were (probably) kidding about that... But, I'm sure there are plenty of (for example) restaurant owners, gas station attendants, and hotel workers who are god-fearing republicans who would be harmed if all those limp-wristed liberals decided who stopped at their establishments on their way to look at the the butterflies suddenly had nothing left to see.
__________________
Trust me, I know what I'm doing. - Sledgehammer

I'm Mary Poppin's Y'all! - Yondu

We are Groot - Groot
Segnosaur is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 12th February 2019, 09:35 AM   #100
Belz...
Fiend God
 
Belz...'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: In the details
Posts: 82,499
Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
Anybody who works at or visits a butterfly center is a pansy limp-wristed liberal. Acceptable collateral damage.
Besides, all those butterly child slaves produce is silk. Cotton is far superior.
__________________
Master of the Shining Darkness

"My views are nonsense. So what?" - BobTheCoward


Belz... is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 12th February 2019, 09:36 AM   #101
Ziggurat
Penultimate Amazing
 
Ziggurat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 43,483
Originally Posted by WilliamSeger View Post
Since there was no "official" purpose, all of the time and money spent on it except for the security, which taxpayers are required to pay wherever the president goes.
But do you have any actual evidence that his campaign didn't cover those expenses?
__________________
"As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law
Ziggurat is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 12th February 2019, 09:36 AM   #102
JoeMorgue
Self Employed
Remittance Man
 
JoeMorgue's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Florida
Posts: 18,548
Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
I know you were (probably) kidding about that... But, I'm sure there are plenty of (for example) restaurant owners, gas station attendants, and hotel workers who are god-fearing republicans who would be harmed if all those limp-wristed liberals decided who stopped at their establishments on their way to look at the the butterflies suddenly had nothing left to see.
Of course I was being sarcastic and I agree with you in the facts. But politics is not about the facts, it's about the imagery and the symbolism and the narrative I'm saying knocking down a "butterfly preserve" to build a wall to keep out the evil brown people isn't just an acceptable loss, it's a positive.

We keep the brown people out and get to take out one of those nature reserve things the Prius drivers are always up in arms about? It would only be better if it was a Spotted Owl preserve. (Sarcasm obvious I hope)
__________________
- "Ernest Hemingway once wrote that the world is a fine place and worth fighting for. I agree with the second part." - Detective Sommerset
- "Stupidity does not cancel out stupidity to yield genius. It breeds like a bucket-full of coked out hamsters." - The Oatmeal
- "To the best of my knowledge the only thing philosophy has ever proven is that Descartes could think." - SMBC
JoeMorgue is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 12th February 2019, 09:37 AM   #103
Belz...
Fiend God
 
Belz...'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: In the details
Posts: 82,499
Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
I know you were (probably) kidding about that... But, I'm sure there are plenty of (for example) restaurant owners, gas station attendants, and hotel workers who are god-fearing republicans who would be harmed if all those limp-wristed liberals decided who stopped at their establishments on their way to look at the the butterflies suddenly had nothing left to see.
I'm not sure they realise that. You know, like those Trumpsters who thought only the liberals would be hurt on their taxes.
__________________
Master of the Shining Darkness

"My views are nonsense. So what?" - BobTheCoward


Belz... is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 12th February 2019, 09:46 AM   #104
newyorkguy
Penultimate Amazing
 
newyorkguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: NY
Posts: 10,047
Ironically, when Trump appeared in El Paso last night he claimed, "We have, say, 35,000 people tonight, and he [O'Rourke] has, say, 200 people, 300 people," Trump said. The El Paso County Coliseum, where Trump appeared, seats about 11,000 people. Bloomberg News reported that O'Rourke's rally drew between 10,000 and 15,000 people. (Trump explained the seeming contradiction by claiming there were thousands more supporters outside the arena, people who were unable to get in.) Link

The irony is, according to the Texas Monthly magazine
Quote:
Trump won less than 26 percent of the El Paso County vote in 2016, the lowest this city has ever delivered for a major party presidential candidate. Link
As to the crowd sizes, Trump has some kind of cognitive difficulty with crowd-size-recognition. Example: Donnie thought the crowd in the photo on the right (below) was much, much larger than the crowd shown in the photo on the left.
.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg trump-inauguration-crowd.jpg (148.0 KB, 21 views)
newyorkguy is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 12th February 2019, 09:46 AM   #105
Segnosaur
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 13,171
Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
Of course I was being sarcastic and I agree with you in the facts. But politics is not about the facts, it's about the imagery and the symbolism and the narrative I'm saying knocking down a "butterfly preserve" to build a wall to keep out the evil brown people isn't just an acceptable loss, it's a positive.
I agree... it is about imagery.

I just hope that somewhere there are some political ad experts trying to put together some sort of ad campaign... interviews with workers near the proposed wall. "My job is at risk". "I'm about to lose my farm".
__________________
Trust me, I know what I'm doing. - Sledgehammer

I'm Mary Poppin's Y'all! - Yondu

We are Groot - Groot
Segnosaur is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 12th February 2019, 09:46 AM   #106
carlitos
"más divertido"
 
carlitos's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 20,293
Originally Posted by Norman Alexander View Post
Absolutely certainly NOT Trump's thumbs involved in this.

Given the propensity of reasonable grammar, good spelling, multi-syllable words, and now viable Arabic inclusions, it is now perfectly clear somebody else is running his tweet feed. Someone with actual writing skills and a working brain. Not necessarily a nice person, but certainly not MAGA Dump.

Can I suggest we need a new game here: Did Trump Write That? The aim of the game is to analyse the writing and content of each Trump tweet and then offer a possible author's name. We then keep a tally of tweet counts by name, and see where this leads us. Note, this is not an attempt to analyse what the content means or react to it. It's an exercise in information analysis. Any up for this?
That would be Persian, not Arabic.


This would be a good one; I'd like to be a fly on the wall as the president tries to highlight from left to right, but the text wants to be highlighted from right to left.
carlitos is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 12th February 2019, 09:48 AM   #107
Segnosaur
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 13,171
Originally Posted by newyorkguy View Post
As to the crowd sizes, Trump has some kind of cognitive difficulty with crowd-size-recognition. Example: Donnie thought the crowd in the photo on the right (below) was much, much larger than the crowd shown in the photo on the left. .
Well, did you ever think that the crowd on the right actually is bigger, but they just blend in to the white background because, being Trump supporters, all lot of them were wearing white hoods?
__________________
Trust me, I know what I'm doing. - Sledgehammer

I'm Mary Poppin's Y'all! - Yondu

We are Groot - Groot
Segnosaur is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 12th February 2019, 09:49 AM   #108
Belz...
Fiend God
 
Belz...'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: In the details
Posts: 82,499
Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
Well, did you ever think that the crowd on the right actually is bigger, but they just blend in to the white background because, being Trump supporters, all lot of them were wearing white hoods?
__________________
Master of the Shining Darkness

"My views are nonsense. So what?" - BobTheCoward


Belz... is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 12th February 2019, 09:51 AM   #109
JoeMorgue
Self Employed
Remittance Man
 
JoeMorgue's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Florida
Posts: 18,548
It's a trick he learned from Vince McMahon. Just pack the side of the stands opposite the hard cam so the arena looks packed.
__________________
- "Ernest Hemingway once wrote that the world is a fine place and worth fighting for. I agree with the second part." - Detective Sommerset
- "Stupidity does not cancel out stupidity to yield genius. It breeds like a bucket-full of coked out hamsters." - The Oatmeal
- "To the best of my knowledge the only thing philosophy has ever proven is that Descartes could think." - SMBC
JoeMorgue is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 12th February 2019, 10:07 AM   #110
Armitage72
Master Poster
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 2,928
Originally Posted by newyorkguy View Post
(Trump explained the seeming contradiction by claiming there were thousands more supporters outside the arena, people who were unable to get in.) Link

Every person who walked on the sidewalk or drove on the street near the building during the rally was counted as a supporter who couldn't get in.
Armitage72 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 12th February 2019, 10:08 AM   #111
JoeMorgue
Self Employed
Remittance Man
 
JoeMorgue's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Florida
Posts: 18,548
It's homeopathy. The fewer supporters he has the stronger the overall solution becomes... somehow.
__________________
- "Ernest Hemingway once wrote that the world is a fine place and worth fighting for. I agree with the second part." - Detective Sommerset
- "Stupidity does not cancel out stupidity to yield genius. It breeds like a bucket-full of coked out hamsters." - The Oatmeal
- "To the best of my knowledge the only thing philosophy has ever proven is that Descartes could think." - SMBC
JoeMorgue is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 12th February 2019, 10:22 AM   #112
The Great Zaganza
Maledictorian
 
The Great Zaganza's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 8,506
I'm sure the Trump crowd bought more MAGA merch than O'Rourke sold Beto stuff.

So Trump wins where it counts for him.
__________________
Careful! That tree's bark is worse than its bite.
The Great Zaganza is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 12th February 2019, 11:30 AM   #113
Beelzebuddy
Philosopher
 
Beelzebuddy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 6,801
Originally Posted by Norman Alexander View Post
Absolutely certainly NOT Trump's thumbs involved in this.

Given the propensity of reasonable grammar, good spelling, multi-syllable words, and now viable Arabic inclusions, it is now perfectly clear somebody else is running his tweet feed. Someone with actual writing skills and a working brain. Not necessarily a nice person, but certainly not MAGA Dump.

Can I suggest we need a new game here: Did Trump Write That? The aim of the game is to analyse the writing and content of each Trump tweet and then offer a possible author's name. We then keep a tally of tweet counts by name, and see where this leads us. Note, this is not an attempt to analyse what the content means or react to it. It's an exercise in information analysis. Any up for this?
I've been playing it for a while. So far I've noticed differences between Trump, lackey, Trump just after a briefing on his investigation (NO COLLUSION!), lackey tweeting with Trump looking over his shoulder, and Stephen Miller because no one else is that racist.

[ETA] but you know what'd be fun? Going to the specific tweets from his leaked schedule days and seeing if we can narrow down Trump's actual tweetportunities.

Last edited by Beelzebuddy; 12th February 2019 at 11:32 AM.
Beelzebuddy is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 12th February 2019, 11:44 AM   #114
dudalb
Penultimate Amazing
 
dudalb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Sacramento
Posts: 44,159
Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
That makes sense... a flood of water, a flood of immigrants. Same thing really.



The article also mentions the possibility of using money that had been earmarked for military infrastructure as well.

I hope Trump tries... the legal hassles will keep the project tied up for years.
It's not a coincidence that the states he is taking money from are "BLue" states.
If a few Democrats drown, that a good thing in Trump's world.
__________________
Pacifism is a shifty doctrine under which a man accepts the benefits of the social group without being willing to pay - and claims a halo for his dishonesty.

Robert Heinlein.
dudalb is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 12th February 2019, 11:51 AM   #115
Ladewig
I lost an avatar bet.
 
Ladewig's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 26,533
I was thinking about all those “Washington slept here” signs on the east coast.

Wouldn’t it be fun to put put “Trump lied here” signs at the venues that he lied at.
__________________
I lost an avatar bet to Doghouse Reilly.
Ladewig is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 12th February 2019, 11:56 AM   #116
dudalb
Penultimate Amazing
 
dudalb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Sacramento
Posts: 44,159
Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
Since Trump is so keen in building a wall, I thought it would be a good idea to remind people of some of the secondary costs:

The wall is expected to impact the following:

- The National Butterfly Center (which, in addition to its environmental benefits, also brings in tourists to the area.)

- Ranches that have existed near the border that have been run by the same family for over 2 centuries

- The SpaceX launch facility in Texas, which brings in millions of dollars to the local economy. Building a wall will probably mean the facility will need to be moved, removing dozens of jobs from the local area

https://www.vox.com/2018/3/28/171526...ge-butterflies

https://www.texastribune.org/2018/09...-ranching-rio/

https://www.techspot.com/news/78677-...launchpad.html
It's also going to impact a lot of landowners who are complaing that what the Trump administration wants to pay for their land is far below fair market value, which the law requires the federal government to pay when exercising eminent domain on private land.
It's going to be a legal mess.
I know, I work for the DOI agency which handles all land acquistation and transfers for the government.
__________________
Pacifism is a shifty doctrine under which a man accepts the benefits of the social group without being willing to pay - and claims a halo for his dishonesty.

Robert Heinlein.

Last edited by dudalb; 12th February 2019 at 12:03 PM.
dudalb is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 12th February 2019, 11:59 AM   #117
dudalb
Penultimate Amazing
 
dudalb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Sacramento
Posts: 44,159
Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
Of course I was being sarcastic and I agree with you in the facts. But politics is not about the facts, it's about the imagery and the symbolism and the narrative I'm saying knocking down a "butterfly preserve" to build a wall to keep out the evil brown people isn't just an acceptable loss, it's a positive.

We keep the brown people out and get to take out one of those nature reserve things the Prius drivers are always up in arms about? It would only be better if it was a Spotted Owl preserve. (Sarcasm obvious I hope)
That politics is often about emotion, about symbolism and imagery ,is what a lot of people here just do not get. It's the Mr. Spock syndrome again (expecting humand beings to be totally logical and have no emotions).
I don't like it at all, but that is the reality,and to ignore that fact is just plain stupid from a political pointe of view.
__________________
Pacifism is a shifty doctrine under which a man accepts the benefits of the social group without being willing to pay - and claims a halo for his dishonesty.

Robert Heinlein.
dudalb is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 12th February 2019, 12:04 PM   #118
WilliamSeger
Illuminator
 
WilliamSeger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 4,539
Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
But do you have any actual evidence that his campaign didn't cover those expenses?
No, you're right, I shouldn't jump to conclusions just because he's a grifter who needs his campaign funds for lawyers. I should wait for the impeachment investigations.
__________________
"We're done! We're done! GET OUT!"
WilliamSeger is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 12th February 2019, 12:16 PM   #119
Upchurch
Papa Funkosophy
 
Upchurch's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: St. Louis, MO
Posts: 31,490
Originally Posted by WilliamSeger View Post
No, you're right, I shouldn't jump to conclusions just because he's a grifter who needs his campaign funds for lawyers. I should wait for the impeachment investigations.
Perhaps we could see the Trump campaigns financial statements or Trump's personal financial statements to know where the money comes from?

That's a thing we do with presidents and presidential candidates, right?
__________________
"There is nothing more deceptive than an obvious fact." -- Sherlock Holmes.
"It’s easier to fool people than to convince them that they have been fooled." -- Mark Twain, maybe.
Upchurch is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 12th February 2019, 12:55 PM   #120
Norman Alexander
Philosopher
 
Norman Alexander's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 5,669
Originally Posted by carlitos View Post
That would be Persian, not Arabic.
Indeed. I corrected myself a few posts later.


Quote:
This would be a good one; I'd like to be a fly on the wall as the president tries to highlight from left to right, but the text wants to be highlighted from right to left.
I'd like to see him highlighting anything. I suspect it's all stream-of-conscience output for him, plus loose dentures. United Shtashes! Covfefe!
__________________
...our governments are just trying to protect us from terror. In the same way that someone banging a hornets’ nest with a stick is trying to protect us from hornets. Frankie Boyle, Guardian, July 2015
Norman Alexander is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Closed Thread

International Skeptics Forum » General Topics » USA Politics

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 05:50 AM.
Powered by vBulletin. Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

This forum began as part of the James Randi Education Foundation (JREF). However, the forum now exists as
an independent entity with no affiliation with or endorsement by the JREF, including the section in reference to "JREF" topics.

Disclaimer: Messages posted in the Forum are solely the opinion of their authors.