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Tags Andrew McCabe , donald trump , George Papadopoulos , Michael Cohen , Mueller investigation , Paul Manafort , Robert Mueller , Trump controversies , Trump-Russia connections

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Old 18th February 2019, 04:16 PM   #161
W.D.Clinger
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Originally Posted by slyjoe View Post
No kidding. Those guys had brains. Who is at the top of the Republican intellectual pile now?
That question is ambiguous.

Taking "intellectual" as the key word led to these answers:

Originally Posted by phiwum View Post
George Will is still a thoughtful commentator, but of course, he is no longer a Republican.

David Brooks is also pretty good and still a Republican, far as I know, but he's hardly influential in the new GOP.
Originally Posted by portlandatheist View Post
David Frum
Rick Wilson
David Brooks
Tom Nichols
James Kirchick
Originally Posted by Stacko View Post
You missed the most one interesting based on this. Max Boot because he's realized that Buckley and Goldwater were the poison tree that modern "libertarian" conservatism is based on.

And also this lovely response:

Originally Posted by Trebuchet View Post
Doctor Sebastian Gorka. Doctor Gorka is a Doctor, as he'll be the first to tell you.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...rvative-media/

We get different answers by emphasizing "at the top of the Republican...pile now?"

My serious answer: Steven Miller is today's Hedley Lamarr.

Gorka never had Taggart's influence. I'm not sure Rudy Giuliani does either.
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Old 18th February 2019, 04:53 PM   #162
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@Stacko


Quote:
William Barr’s Son-in-Law Just Landed a Job Advising Trump on “Legal Issues”

This "administration" is incestuous beyond the telling of it. Thinking of which, has anything happened yet re Cohen's father-in-law? Perhaps Trump's saving that retribution until after Cohen testifies. Which is soon, is it not? I'm kinda losing track of what's going on, and the Democratic House is still just building up to full operating speed. It's going to be one sweaty summer in the Swamp this year, mark my words.
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Old 18th February 2019, 05:22 PM   #163
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Originally Posted by Norman Alexander View Post
The issue of American independence took 30-odd years and a war to finally resolve. Chess games are not won with just the first move but a series of calculated moves over time. Trump is not going to be gone in the next week or so. The GOP are not going to suddenly get a change of heart. It just doesn't work like that.
Indeed. It happens gradually. And then very suddenly ...

It's 21 months until November 2020. And three months since the GOP holding the Senate in very favourable circumstances had to be proclaimed as a triumph. The mid-terms were, of course, a frickin' disaster. The economy's peaked at the worst possible time. It's almost like nobody in the GOP is even trying anymore. Fatalism has set in amongst the leadership, without a doubt. Their careers are behind them and they're cashing out like bandits. But are there Young Turks, people who'd like to think they have careers ahead of them, prepared to line the old guard up against the Wall, (the Trump Wall, a beautiful wall, the Trump Wall, people are calling it the Trump Wall) and get full-on 2nd Amendment on their asses?


I do hope so.
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Old 18th February 2019, 05:25 PM   #164
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Originally Posted by The_Animus View Post
Is McCabe trying to get Rosenstein fired? Because this is how you get Rosenstein fired.
No it isn't. It's innoculation, not infection.
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Old 18th February 2019, 05:30 PM   #165
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Originally Posted by CapelDodger View Post
Indeed. It happens gradually. And then very suddenly ...

It's 21 months until November 2020. And three months since the GOP holding the Senate in very favourable circumstances had to be proclaimed as a triumph. The mid-terms were, of course, a frickin' disaster. The economy's peaked at the worst possible time. It's almost like nobody in the GOP is even trying anymore. Fatalism has set in amongst the leadership, without a doubt. Their careers are behind them and they're cashing out like bandits. But are there Young Turks, people who'd like to think they have careers ahead of them, prepared to line the old guard up against the Wall, (the Trump Wall, a beautiful wall, the Trump Wall, people are calling it the Trump Wall) and get full-on 2nd Amendment on their asses?


I do hope so.
I suspect it is at that stage in a chess game where the end result is becoming both clear and inevitable but the requisite end-game moves are yet to be played. Unless there are major goofs made by one opponent, it will be checkmate one way or another.

To labour the chess analogy, Donny has demonstrated he doesn't know how the game is played let alone how it is won. He has been losing major pieces at regular intervals through stupid moves at the beginning. Donny would dearly love to "pigeon" the game - ignore the rules, scatter the pieces, **** all over the board and strut around claiming victory. Meanwhile his opponents have been ignoring the ranting and playing to a plan. And they are winning, although it's mostly because Donny is hell-bent on losing.
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Old 18th February 2019, 06:02 PM   #166
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Originally Posted by Norman Alexander View Post
I suspect it is at that stage in a chess game where the end result is becoming both clear and inevitable but the requisite end-game moves are yet to be played. Unless there are major goofs made by one opponent, it will be checkmate one way or another.

To labour the chess analogy, Donny has demonstrated he doesn't know how the game is played let alone how it is won. He has been losing major pieces at regular intervals through stupid moves at the beginning. Donny would dearly love to "pigeon" the game - ignore the rules, scatter the pieces, **** all over the board and strut around claiming victory. Meanwhile his opponents have been ignoring the ranting and playing to a plan. And they are winning, although it's mostly because Donny is hell-bent on losing.
To (hopefully) continue and belabor the chess analogy, the majority of games end in resignation.
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Old 18th February 2019, 06:02 PM   #167
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Originally Posted by Norman Alexander View Post
I suspect it is at that stage in a chess game where the end result is becoming both clear and inevitable but the requisite end-game moves are yet to be played. Unless there are major goofs made by one opponent, it will be checkmate one way or another.

To labour the chess analogy, Donny has demonstrated he doesn't know how the game is played let alone how it is won. He has been losing major pieces at regular intervals through stupid moves at the beginning. Donny would dearly love to "pigeon" the game - ignore the rules, scatter the pieces, **** all over the board and strut around claiming victory. Meanwhile his opponents have been ignoring the ranting and playing to a plan. And they are winning, although it's mostly because Donny is hell-bent on losing.
You mean Trump plays chess like Richie

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I AGREE
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Old 18th February 2019, 06:23 PM   #168
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Originally Posted by phiwum View Post
It's not clear to me that he counts as a conservative any more. Does he still identify as a conservative or has he more or less renounced conservatism (rather than just the libertarian leaning conservatism)?
He refers to himself as a confused conservative. Here's a solid interview where he discusses his current journey.
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Old 18th February 2019, 07:09 PM   #169
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Originally Posted by Norman Alexander View Post
I suspect it is at that stage in a chess game where the end result is becoming both clear and inevitable but the requisite end-game moves are yet to be played.
It's not like a chess-game. It's not even like Shogi. Games like that teach certain tactical and strategic principles, but your pieces don't get together after work over drinks and criticise your choices for Bishop and Rook. (Never attack the Prince : attack the Prince's bad servants, who are the cause of your misery. If only the good Prince knew of their perfidy he would bring them low ...)
Quote:
Unless there are major goofs made by one opponent, it will be checkmate one way or another.
Checkmate ends a game, which is an atrificial construct. There is no end in politics, and all of human life is politics.
Quote:
To labour the chess analogy, Donny has demonstrated he doesn't know how the game is played ...
Of course, one should acknowledge that Trump's life is not a human one. He's too damaged for that, for whatever reason. Be it congenital or the result of early-life experience, Trump is a singular being, not a social being. He has never, in his entire life, experienced a moment of intimacy that didn't result in trauma.

Trump never experienced school politics : his allowance and his father's connections provided a cocoon in which he could snuggle and imagine himself a real stand-out guy. In reality, of course, he was being ripped-off by people who ridiculed him off-stage.

Trump never experienced office politics : he worked for Daddie and did what Daddie told him, without resenting the way his father talked down to him because Trump was blind to the fact his father was even doing it. Trump is emotionally deaf, dumb and blind. At best, all the social development of a 2-year old child.

The closest Trump came to the US political world before birthirism was through his Daddie's involvement in stuff Donnie was completely ignorant of, because why would anybody clue this moron in on anything? A sore disappointment to his father, but sometimes it goes that way. And Giuiliani, of course, but that guy's marbles have rolled, lets face it.
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Old 18th February 2019, 07:17 PM   #170
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Originally Posted by Norman Alexander View Post
The issue of American independence took 30-odd years and a war to finally resolve. Chess games are not won with just the first move but a series of calculated moves over time. Trump is not going to be gone in the next week or so. The GOP are not going to suddenly get a change of heart. It just doesn't work like that.
Originally Posted by CapelDodger View Post
Indeed. It happens gradually. And then very suddenly ...

It's 21 months until November 2020. And three months since the GOP holding the Senate in very favourable circumstances had to be proclaimed as a triumph. The mid-terms were, of course, a frickin' disaster. The economy's peaked at the worst possible time. It's almost like nobody in the GOP is even trying anymore. Fatalism has set in amongst the leadership, without a doubt. Their careers are behind them and they're cashing out like bandits. But are there Young Turks, people who'd like to think they have careers ahead of them, prepared to line the old guard up against the Wall, (the Trump Wall, a beautiful wall, the Trump Wall, people are calling it the Trump Wall) and get full-on 2nd Amendment on their asses?


I do hope so.
I sincerely, with zero snark or ulterior-ness of any kind, hope you both are correct.

I will fully admit I've grown a bit kneejerk cynical on an emotional level regarding the ease at which Trump will be dealt with.

But if you believe nothing else, please believe I've never wanted to be wrong about something more in my life.
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Old 18th February 2019, 07:20 PM   #171
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Originally Posted by CapelDodger View Post
It's not like a chess-game. It's not even like Shogi. Games like that teach certain tactical and strategic principles, but your pieces don't get together after work over drinks and criticise your choices for Bishop and Rook. (Never attack the Prince : attack the Prince's bad servants, who are the cause of your misery. If only the good Prince knew of their perfidy he would bring them low ...)
Checkmate ends a game, which is an atrificial construct. There is no end in politics, and all of human life is politics.
Readily agreed. One of the purposes of analogy is to simplify the situation to make it comprehensible in easily understood terms. In doing so, accuracy and total relevance does get lost.


Quote:
Of course, one should acknowledge that Trump's life is not a human one. He's too damaged for that, for whatever reason. Be it congenital or the result of early-life experience, Trump is a singular being, not a social being. He has never, in his entire life, experienced a moment of intimacy that didn't result in trauma.

Trump never experienced school politics : his allowance and his father's connections provided a cocoon in which he could snuggle and imagine himself a real stand-out guy. In reality, of course, he was being ripped-off by people who ridiculed him off-stage.

Trump never experienced office politics : he worked for Daddie and did what Daddie told him, without resenting the way his father talked down to him because Trump was blind to the fact his father was even doing it. Trump is emotionally deaf, dumb and blind. At best, all the social development of a 2-year old child.

The closest Trump came to the US political world before birthirism was through his Daddie's involvement in stuff Donnie was completely ignorant of, because why would anybody clue this moron in on anything? A sore disappointment to his father, but sometimes it goes that way. And Giuiliani, of course, but that guy's marbles have rolled, lets face it.
Trump is behaving for all the world like some two-bit mafia thug out of a third-rate Godfather movie. The attitude, the words, the mannerisms, the disdain for the law... That's the world he was raised in by his father, and he thinks that's how the whole world works. Your opinion is the only one that matters, and you buy people to do your bidding and get your way, or failing that, heavily threaten them. It's a ridiculous cartoon caricature come to life who now can't escape the movie they have put themselves in.
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Old 18th February 2019, 07:39 PM   #172
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Originally Posted by The_Animus View Post
But for Trump, his cronies, and his base this is spun as traitorous actions. An attempted administrative coup. He doesn't care if that looks credible. It's just the excuse he needs to get Rosenstein out of the way. Further if the 25th were to be invoked or Trump loses in 2020 this is another thing priming his base and fellow Republicans that this is just another illegal coup attempt via 25th amendment or vote rigging to prevent the rightfully elected POTUS from office.

And now he can say that Rosenstein has always been against Trump, wanted to wear a wire and invoke the 25th amendment and this is the guy who oversaw the Mueller investigation. All this feeds into Trump's narratives.
I still can't wrap my head around how a legal avenue specifically created for removing the executive can be referred to as "illegal" or a "coup."
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Old 18th February 2019, 07:40 PM   #173
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Originally Posted by Delphic Oracle View Post
I still can't wrap my head around how a legal avenue specifically created for removing the executive can be referred to as "illegal" or a "coup".
Even Nixon just tried to sell it as "It's not illegal because the President is doing it" instead of "It's illegal for you to point it out because the President is doing it."
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Old 18th February 2019, 07:41 PM   #174
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Not sure if this is the right place for it, but apparently Roger Stone posted a picture of the judge overseeing his case in DC. Not noteworthy in and of itself. The fact that the picture had crosshairs on it might be of interest to the judge.

This was just reported on Rachel Maddow’s show. Is Stone playing 3D chess, or is there something seriously wrong with him. If the judge doesn’t revoke his bail, I’ll be very surprised.

Edited to add:

Found the image:



The crosshairs are less obvious and prominent than I had imagined, but a very poor choice regardless.
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Last edited by Fast Eddie B; 18th February 2019 at 07:45 PM.
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Old 18th February 2019, 07:46 PM   #175
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Originally Posted by Fast Eddie B View Post
Not sure if this is the right place for it, but apparently Roger Stone posted a picture of the judge overseeing his case in DC. Not noteworthy in and of itself. The fact that the picture had crosshairs on it might be of interest to the judge.
It's weirdly formatted picture. The "crosshairs" are like behind her head and (to me at least) looks like the cut-off part of a logo or something similar since it's next to a couple of words that get cut off.
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Old 18th February 2019, 07:50 PM   #176
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
Hmm, the person who knows everything about it in detail from reading the actual documents and OIG reports and on and on and on mischaracterized something?

And the basis for your opinion is?
Government emails showing up places they don't belong is not exceptional. Every time two government employees exchange info directly about their work on gmail we have government emails being backed up on private computers. Human operators suck at computer security.
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Old 18th February 2019, 07:57 PM   #177
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Originally Posted by Norman Alexander View Post
Readily agreed. One of the purposes of analogy is to simplify the situation to make it comprehensible in easily understood terms. In doing so, accuracy and total relevance does get lost.
The venerable board-game Risk taught me a lot more than Chess. It made me who I was before D&D ground off the last rough spots.

Quote:
Trump is behaving for all the world like some two-bit mafia thug out of a third-rate Godfather movie.
I think he's acting like a comedy wrestling star, who appeal to infantile types exactly like Trump. Arrested developers - and Trump is so getting arrested before this affair is all over. There, I've said it.
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Old 18th February 2019, 08:09 PM   #178
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Originally Posted by Delphic Oracle View Post
I still can't wrap my head around how a legal avenue specifically created for removing the executive can be referred to as "illegal" or a "coup."
There's that, and the fact that McCabe's report of hearing that cabinet members were discussing the option (McCabe was not a cabinet member, of course) has resulted in him being presented as party to a conspiracy by cabinet members (amongst whom McCabe did not number) to replace an incompetent Presdent by Constitutional means.

The Big Dog can, according to the Big Dog hisself, expertly explain how that works. Or he could tell us how Trump gets there, which is an even greater challenge.
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Old 18th February 2019, 08:10 PM   #179
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Originally Posted by Fast Eddie B View Post
Not sure if this is the right place for it, but apparently Roger Stone posted a picture of the judge overseeing his case in DC. Not noteworthy in and of itself. The fact that the picture had crosshairs on it might be of interest to the judge.

This was just reported on Rachel Maddow’s show. Is Stone playing 3D chess, or is there something seriously wrong with him. If the judge doesn’t revoke his bail, I’ll be very surprised.

Edited to add:

Found the image:

https://thenypost.files.wordpress.co...=300&strip=all

The crosshairs are less obvious and prominent than I had imagined, but a very poor choice regardless.
First prior use of the image I find is at "cosmiconvergence dot org," which is a site filled with anti-Semitic New World Order conspiracies (with a side of Mayan calendar end-times crazy).
He's clearly in a good place right now.
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Old 18th February 2019, 08:12 PM   #180
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Originally Posted by CapelDodger View Post
The venerable board-game Risk taught me a lot more than Chess. It made me who I was before D&D ground off the last rough spots.

I think he's acting like a comedy wrestling star, who appeal to infantile types exactly like Trump. Arrested developers - and Trump is so getting arrested before this affair is all over. There, I've said it.
Right from the first of Trump's rallies, I instantly saw the pro wrestling elements in the whole shtick, with him and his stadia full of doting, deluded deplorables. A sickening display of doltish dullards, coarse cretins, fearful fundamentalists and hateful hypocrites.
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Old 18th February 2019, 08:13 PM   #181
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Originally Posted by CapelDodger View Post
There's that, and the fact that McCabe's report of hearing that cabinet members were discussing the option (McCabe was not a cabinet member, of course) has resulted in him being presented as party to a conspiracy by cabinet members (amongst whom McCabe did not number) to replace an incompetent Presdent by Constitutional means.

The Big Dog can, according to the Big Dog hisself, expertly explain how that works. Or he could tell us how Trump gets there, which is an even greater challenge.
Sure, McCabe was lying.
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Old 18th February 2019, 08:17 PM   #182
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Originally Posted by Delphic Oracle View Post
I still can't wrap my head around how a legal avenue specifically created for removing the executive can be referred to as "illegal" or a "coup."
Just hit yourself in the head with a hammer and then watch 1,000 hours of Fox and it'll make perfect sense!
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Old 18th February 2019, 08:21 PM   #183
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
Sure, McCabe was lying.
Another statement pulled out of one's ass.

What can be asserted without evidence, can be dismissed without evidence.
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Old 18th February 2019, 08:26 PM   #184
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We have always been at War with Eurasia.
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Old 18th February 2019, 08:31 PM   #185
Stacko
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Things have gotten weirder.
The President of the United States is tweeting about the former deputy FBI director using the bathroom.
ETA:
Fact-check: As special assistant to both, this is false.

Last edited by Stacko; 18th February 2019 at 08:34 PM.
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Old 18th February 2019, 08:36 PM   #186
CapelDodger
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
Sure, McCabe was lying.
About what?


Was McCabe lying about hearing that cabinet members (the people with the power, in this case) were discussing the removal of President Trump on the grounds of incompetence? If so, where's the evidence that a coup was being planned, as Trump insists it was? Is Trump lying? Are you lying? Is God messing with your mind? Who's with your wife right now? Better pray it's not your father-in-law, because what a scandal that would be.



For your own safety, I think it's best you just convey to us what Trump has explained to you.
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Old 18th February 2019, 08:40 PM   #187
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
Sure, McCabe was lying.
Excuse me, professor, but you forgot to tell us what McCabe lying about, and how that explains what you were asked to explain?
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Old 18th February 2019, 08:44 PM   #188
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Originally Posted by WilliamSeger View Post
Excuse me, professor, but you forgot to tell us what McCabe lying about, and how that explains what you were asked to explain?
Where to start?

Literally everything, from Page’s role, to the warrants, to why he sat on the emails, to why he leaked information to when he lied about it, to why he got fired, to people offering to wear a wire.

****, it would be easier to say what he has not lied bout.
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Old 18th February 2019, 09:04 PM   #189
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
Where to start?

Literally everything, from Page’s role, to the warrants, to why he sat on the emails, to why he leaked information to when he lied about it, to why he got fired, to people offering to wear a wire.

****, it would be easier to say what he has not lied bout.

Can someone say BULL? More assertions pulled out of an ass. Man, it stinks in here. What is it about conservatives today? Projection and out an out fabrications. I guess they watch Donnie do it, so they figure they can too?
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Old 18th February 2019, 09:19 PM   #190
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Originally Posted by Stacko View Post
Stone is eat-the-snake crazy and has been for many years.
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Old 18th February 2019, 09:28 PM   #191
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So Trump hired a liar and backstabbing snake? ( According to TBD)
Only the best people...
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Old 18th February 2019, 09:32 PM   #192
WilliamSeger
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
Where to start?

Literally everything, from Page’s role, to the warrants, to why he sat on the emails, to why he leaked information to when he lied about it, to why he got fired, to people offering to wear a wire.

****, it would be easier to say what he has not lied bout.
Well, sorry, but you certainly haven't impressed me with your instinctive ability to detect liars, and you certainly haven't explained the idiotic "25th Amendment coup" conspiracy theory.
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Old 18th February 2019, 09:39 PM   #193
BobTheCoward
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
Where to start?

Literally everything, from Page’s role, to the warrants, to why he sat on the emails, to why he leaked information to when he lied about it, to why he got fired, to people offering to wear a wire.

****, it would be easier to say what he has not lied bout.
Where is the evidence he lied about rosenstein offering to wear a recording device?
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Old 18th February 2019, 10:36 PM   #194
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Threatening any judge is an act of pure stupidity; threatening the judge who is hearing your case? I mean, what the actual **** was Roger Stone thinking?
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Old 18th February 2019, 10:38 PM   #195
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Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
Threatening any judge is an act of pure stupidity; threatening the judge who is hearing your case? I mean, what the actual **** was Roger Stone thinking?
He thinks he's untouchable - which, given his history, seems to be a sentiment supported by empirical data.
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Old 18th February 2019, 10:43 PM   #196
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Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
Threatening any judge is an act of pure stupidity; threatening the judge who is hearing your case? I mean, what the actual **** was Roger Stone thinking?
Is he actually TRYING to get a conviction? What would be the advantage of that? Some assurance of protection against "accidents" before his trial? (Not that it would help that...) To ingratiate himself to earn a presidential pardon??
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Old 19th February 2019, 12:28 AM   #197
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
He thinks he's untouchable - which, given his history, seems to be a sentiment supported by empirical data.
I'd give more credence to his wanting to appear badass, with a touch of the martyr thrown in.
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Old 19th February 2019, 02:22 AM   #198
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https://twitter.com/kathrynw5/status...93941795500032

Quote:
Roger Stone texts me this in response to my inquiry about his Instagram post of Judge Amy Berman Jackson that featured crosshairs in the background:
Quote embedded in tweet. Essentially "it wasn't a threat, but people are misinterpreting it as such so even though it's 100% factual I'm taking it down". There are a couple of follow-ups in the subsequent tweets.
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Old 19th February 2019, 02:24 AM   #199
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https://twitter.com/RMac18/status/1097649033533739008

Quote:
Wow. Roger Stone just filed an apology with the US District Court in DC apologizing for the Instagram post he made about Judge Amy Berman Jackson.
Document embedded in tweet.
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Old 19th February 2019, 02:25 AM   #200
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https://twitter.com/Popehat/status/1097652491926130688

Quote:
I've been doing federal criminal law for 24 years and I've never seen anything like this. This is not normal.
More of the document embedded in this tweet.
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