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Tags film , bigfoot , patterson gimlin

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Old 23rd September 2008, 04:46 AM   #16401
desertgal
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Originally Posted by carcharodon View Post
For sure sonny Jim, for sure. I mean, just READ the damn posts here. Many of you fruitcakes spend more time reading, analyzing, picking apart and ridiculing posts and posters from various bigfoot forums than a lot of people who would call themselves a proponent of the subject. You understand what irony means? You lot are so obsessed that you even take to ridiculing virtual nobodies on other boards who will likely never ever even read your posts here.

Nope. I was just brought up to recognize that if I think something is a pile of crap then its a pile of crap. I won't spend almost all of my waking time espousing that I think it's a pile of crap. I won't spend almost all of my waking time obsessing and pondering over the pile of crap. I'd move on with my life and spend my time more productively and leave what I consider to be a pile of crap well enough alone. I wouldn't give the pile of crap another thought.

This place is a pile of crap. Hence, I spend very very little time here and only really popped in to say hello to Lu and Sweaty as I don't really come across them on other boards.

And what do you and your obsessive cronies do? Make bullcrap incorrect 'points', false assumptions, idiotic ramblings and dish out inane jibes at posters on other forums who don't even post here? Yeah, real big and clever that is. If you want to address people on other forums then go there and address them. Kitakaze first used this cowardly tactic some time ago. I don't know if he/she/it still does it after I told he/she/it was being a pillock. It wouldn't surprise me.

I was right the first time I came here. Waldorf and Statler would be right at home here. This is peanut gallery central.

The fact that none of you muppets have the guts or the brains to go to a specific bigfoot board (of which there are plenty) and state the same case there as you do here with any level of success, yet Lu and Sweaty Yeti can do the opposite with absolute ease, tells me that yup they run rings around you folks. Lu and Sweaty do a great job of batting you away and knocking you for six despite the heavy majority against them here.

Even Skep Greg turns into a little shrew when he posts on bigfoot boards and can't so much as argue successfully against a can of beans elsewhere.

Well your rabid snarling anti bigfoot crusade here isn't letting it die either, is it? Again, do you understand the word irony? Look at this bloody thread. Over 400 pages long!!!! You talk about bigfoot here EVERY DAMN DAY!!!!

If you don't call that 'obsessive', then what would you call it? You don't magically appear here every day by some freak accident do you? You lot come here by design and meaning every damn day. Why? Because you are OBSESSED.

The bottom line is this. The bigfoot dream won't ever die for those who are convinced there is such an animal. The sooner you accept and deal with that the better it will be for your sanity.

For those who think bigfoot is a pile of crap it will only die when you stop banging on that it's a pile of crap and try to forget about it. Got it? Very simple isn't it?

The regular crowd here are complete fruitcakes.

What is your problem? Why does the idea of bigfoot get under your skin so much that you have to talk about it almost every bloody day? Is cancer research funding being halted and handed over to bigfoot research instead? Are people killing in the name of bigfoot? Are archaic laws being upheld and adhered to in the name of bigfoot? Is bigfoot a paranormal scientific impossibility?

What............is...............the.............. big...............deal????

Why do you care so much that many people are convinced there is such an animal out there? Who is it harming? Are you personally losing something? Did Roger Patterson shag your little sister and leave her pregnant? Did John Green steal your bike when you were a nipper at school? Did Rene Dahinden bash your momma over the head with half a stick of stale French bread when she was carrying you?

I mean..............come on. So much anger, bile and vitriol and TIME SPENT against a subject that is only a flesh and blood animal, should it exist. If it doesn't exist, so what?

If you think there is no such thing as bigfoot then fine. Ignore it. Forget about it. Consign it to the 'monkey' bin. Don't keep obsessing over the damn subject day after day after day and year after year after year.

It's sad, pathetic and more than just a little bit weird.

At least the proponents have a logical and sound reason for spending time pondering this subject. To 'obsess' over something you are sure exists is reasonable. To 'obsess' over something harmless and which you are sure doesn't exist is seriously whacked in the head.

End of.

G'morning.

Pst) Hello again Lu and Sweaty. Keep up the good work you are doing.
Wow. Speaking of anger, bile, and vitriol...
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Old 23rd September 2008, 05:19 AM   #16402
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Originally Posted by doctoratlantis View Post
Nope. But I think it should have its own YouTube video:

Where are the Bones - a video analysis.


In my research I found this PDF which highlights 20 years of Black Bear study in PA.
Thanks for posting that. You saved me the trouble of typing it out from the book. Where did you get the clip of Grover?

"In medicine, death by natural causes is a loosely-defined term used by coroners describing death when the cause of death was a naturally occurring disease process, or is not apparent given medical history or circumstances. Thus, deaths caused by active human intervention (as opposed to the failure of medical intervention to prevent death) are excluded from this definition, and are described as unnatural deaths." -Wikipedia

I would not consider death by drowning "natural causes".

Grover was pointing out how unlikely it is to find bones of a sasquatch when we don't find bones of naturally dying bears when bears may be 100 times more numerous.

Maybe with a funded study some would turn up.

Start looking here:

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Last edited by LAL; 23rd September 2008 at 05:33 AM.
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Old 23rd September 2008, 05:24 AM   #16403
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Skeptical Videos

Originally Posted by tube View Post
Outstanding! I think it's a great idea for skeptics to post YouTube videos that rebut various pieces of nonsense. Your video was very well put together, and really shows what a crank Krantz was. It's amazing how widely held in the Bigfoot subculture his ludicrous position still is.

BTW, I've put up a two skeptical YouTube videos myself, though they are both basically the same:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C6uLyJHKBsE

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N5ar2z4-_8k

If you google the term "dermal ridges" with or without quotation marks, my website is the first hit.
Yeah - I sent you an off-line message through YouTube. I think it can be a great vehicle for sharing information and it is time that some people (like Captain Disillusion") use it to spread logic and reason since there is a grossly disproportionate amount of nonsense perpetuated out there.

But I'm slowly (in my so-called "free time") working on what I call "skeptisode guides" to paranormal TV shows on my website www.doctoratlantis.com/skeptisode.htm. If I can get all the parts together my next Bigfoot video will address Patty's walk.
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Old 23rd September 2008, 06:12 AM   #16404
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Originally Posted by LAL View Post
If you mean RayG, he was talking about the book. He doesn't have the DVD. Kitakaze does - it puts him to sleep.

If you haven't seen it, just say so.
Oh, LAL, I already answered. Once again, since it seems you haven't noticed it - I saw it. Too bad you fail to acknoweledge the real nature and the many shortcomings of the material presented there - wild speculations mostly based on anecdotes.

Bigfootery has been repacking and reselling the same decades-old pieces of unreliable evidence, sometimes adding some new (usually baseless) speculations. LMS (the book and the video) is an example of this; may eventually be entertaining, but that's all- entertainement purposes only. Since wild speculations and anecdotes can not substitute absence of reliable evidence and poor methodology, these works have little chances to convince skeptics.

If the material were half as good as footers claim, it would have made to Nature. But we all know that a paper based on evidence suspected of being hoaxed will not make it.

Come to think of it, what happened at bigfootery lastly? Nothing but hoaxes coupled with the odd anecdote. The bigfoot body recently found surely put an end to the whole "silly suit business"... The stunning Tomagami bigfoot imagery surely are high-quality evidence...
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Old 23rd September 2008, 06:15 AM   #16405
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Originally Posted by LAL View Post
I've already mentioned there could be bodies under the ash if they weren't blown to bits. That stuff's hundreds of feet thick.
No. It isn't.

The ash deposit was merely inches thick and the lateral blast deposits were only 3ft thick at the volcano.

The resulting landslide due to the collapse of the side of the volcano was an average of 150ft thick but was confined to the valley of the Toutle River.

All rather moot anyway as the majority of reported BF sightings in Washington are west and north of Mt. St.Helens, according to the map of BF sightings for Washington at BFRO , whereas the area most affected by the eruption was to the northeast and east. So, not that many BF in the area to be buried, by the looks of things.

Again, it's always handy to check facts before speculating.
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Last edited by EHocking; 23rd September 2008 at 06:24 AM. Reason: directions from St.Helens
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Old 23rd September 2008, 06:19 AM   #16406
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Originally Posted by Mad Hom View Post
Why? Was Mt St.Helens considered a hotbed of Wolverine and Wolf activity?? From what I understand this area is pretty much Sasquatchville USA yet none were found among the estimated 7,000 animals dead..Imagine that.
Do you actually think 7000 dead animals were found? It was an estimate.

Wolves and wolverines were thought to be extinct in the area but later were found to not be extinct in the area. They may just have been there all along. (Of course I heard anecdotes about them still being around so I wasn't overly surprised when the officials caught up with local lore.)

Quote:
Nice story Lu...relevance??
Things got blown to bits. If something resembling a bit of bacon turned up in the ash and wasn't readily identifiable do you think someone would collect it as possible sasquatch or just assume it was another piece of baked deer?


Quote:
The important part is that they didn't "estimate" a single solitary dead Bigfeetsus....not even one.
Probably for fear of being laughed at.

A cyber friend sent me information on how estimates are made (she took a course in it) when I was wondering how they got a remnant of 3-6 mountain lions in Great Smokies National Park. I'll post it later when I find it if you're interested.
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Old 23rd September 2008, 06:26 AM   #16407
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Originally Posted by Correa Neto View Post
Oh, LAL, I already answered. Once again, since it seems you haven't noticed it - I saw it. Too bad you fail to acknoweledge the real nature and the many shortcomings of the material presented there - wild speculations mostly based on anecdotes.

Please point me to the post where you already answered. I can't find it.

Call analysis, films and casts don't seem to be anecdotes to me. Just how was any of that based on anecdotes? And how were the analyses "wild speculation"?

Do you remember Dr. Andrew Nelson's conclusions on the PGF?
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Old 23rd September 2008, 06:32 AM   #16408
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Originally Posted by desertgal View Post
Wow. Speaking of anger, bile, and vitriol...
Comes from months of being called affectionate names like "Pattycakes", most likely, but Lyndon isn't afraid to tell it like it is. I thought it was a pretty fair summation, actually.

He's done his homework on the PGF and I've learned from his posts.
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Old 23rd September 2008, 06:49 AM   #16409
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Originally Posted by LONGTABBER PE View Post
They also request garlic frequently, recognize and know what cameras are and what they do, convert barns into outhouses, visit BFRO expeditions frequently, like to be brushed, use underground tunnels and destroy log trucks on impact without getting a scratch
Wow, I am always amazed by the ammount of information that can be gathered from anecdotes...
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Old 23rd September 2008, 07:30 AM   #16410
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Originally Posted by LAL View Post
I thought it was a pretty fair summation, actually.
Well, of course. Why wouldn't you?
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Old 23rd September 2008, 07:36 AM   #16411
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Originally Posted by LAL View Post
Please point me to the post where you already answered. I can't find it.
http://www.internationalskeptics.com...ostcount=16183

Originally Posted by LAL View Post
Call analysis, films and casts don't seem to be anecdotes to me. Just how was any of that based on anecdotes? And how were the analyses "wild speculation"?
The calls- Not confirmed as being from bigfeet, other options not
The film- Suspected of being a hoax, too blurry
The casts- Suspected of being hoaxes and misidentifications

Lots of things regarding PGF are anecdotal- all we have are actually anecdotes. Patterson and Gimlim claim the film is from a female bigfoot; they and other people claim that the footprints were made by the film subject; Hieronimus claims to be the guy in the suit and Morris claims he was involved on making it. None of the above individuals managed to back the claims propperly. Anecdote.

Originally Posted by LAL View Post
Do you remember Dr. Andrew Nelson's conclusions on the PGF?
The "hoaxers would not replicate hernia" stuff?
Not sure if it was from the book or video.
Would you be surprised to know I was not impressed?
Would you be surprised to know that this is because I doubt PGF has enough definition to support such level of detail analysis (hernias, moving toes/fingers, facial expressions, braids, poops, bullet wounds, etc. are a no-go)?
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Old 23rd September 2008, 07:56 AM   #16412
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Well, as the #1 fruitcake in this thread, thanks sharky, I'd just like to congratulate the troops. Well done. Just a reminder that the burden is not on us and I am proud of the fact that we take the burden on anyway.
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2 prints, same midtarsal crock..., I mean break?
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Old 23rd September 2008, 08:03 AM   #16413
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Originally Posted by LAL View Post
Thanks for posting that. You saved me the trouble of typing it out from the book. Where did you get the clip of Grover?

"In medicine, death by natural causes is a loosely-defined term used by coroners describing death when the cause of death was a naturally occurring disease process, or is not apparent given medical history or circumstances. Thus, deaths caused by active human intervention (as opposed to the failure of medical intervention to prevent death) are excluded from this definition, and are described as unnatural deaths." -Wikipedia

I would not consider death by drowning "natural causes".

Grover was pointing out how unlikely it is to find bones of a sasquatch when we don't find bones of naturally dying bears when bears may be 100 times more numerous.
1) I got the clip from A&E's "Ancient Mysteries: Bigfoot".

2) Longer answer required:

Grover was saying we don't find bears of "naturally dying bears" to distinguish the rarity of finding a corpse of a bear that died from non-human intervention (rare) from those that die at the hand of man through hunting or car-accidents (extremely common).

It's a form of special pleading. He's saying if you take this subset of the population of this known living creature and only look for the those we find which were "stumbled upon" (my words) then you won't find any.

Only you do.

Now you want to exclude those that drowned? Be serious. At best he's making a strained comparison. We know there are bears. We see bears. We find their bodies. We hunt them. We photograph them.

There is a lot more evidence for bears than just the bodies, mind. Even if you didn't see bears their population is known from hair traps which carry their DNA, and scat samples which also carry DNA. But we do see bears.

So if Bigfoot are so rare that we'll never find bones, then how come people keep seeing them? And if they're so common that people see them frequently, then how come they're never hit by cars or shot - in other words why do we have no bodies?

People see animal bodies all the time. I live in North Georgia (which I would not characterize as Bigfoot Country). I see dead deer, raccoons, opossum, squirrels, birds, cats, dogs, and turtles on the road with such frequency and regularity that I barely take notice unless the kill is either spectacularly gruesome or unusually stinky.

The bones should be there if the creature is there. A lack of bones isn't proof that there is no Bigfoot - but a surfeit of bones would certainly stick in the craw of skeptics who wanted to deny the creature's existence. As a skeptic myself, I still admit that Bigfoot is my favorite cryptid. Much to the dismay of my wife who has to endure me TIVOing every show to do with "Big & Hairy."

I'm waiting for the bones, the body, or the live specimen. Costumes in a freezer just aren't to my taste, despite their being such a local delicacy.
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Old 23rd September 2008, 09:03 AM   #16414
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Originally Posted by LAL View Post
Comes from months of being called affectionate names like "Pattycakes", most likely, but Lyndon isn't afraid to tell it like it is. I thought it was a pretty fair summation, actually.

He's done his homework on the PGF and I've learned from his posts.
Another interesting thing to do would be to stop playing the victim role, since many a footer quite often abuse the freedom of speech that exists here.

Skeptics at this (and other boards) are frequently offended by footers. After countless pages of verbal abuse from certain posters, no wonder sometimes a skeptic will send one or two flaming torpedoes aimed towards a footer.
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Old 23rd September 2008, 09:07 AM   #16415
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Originally Posted by carcharodon View Post
For sure sonny Jim, for sure. I mean, just READ the damn posts here. Many of you fruitcakes spend more time reading, analyzing, picking apart and ridiculing posts and posters from various bigfoot forums than a lot of people who would call themselves a proponent of the subject. You understand what irony means? You lot are so obsessed that you even take to ridiculing virtual nobodies on other boards who will likely never ever even read your posts here.

Nope. I was just brought up to recognize that if I think something is a pile of crap then its a pile of crap. I won't spend almost all of my waking time espousing that I think it's a pile of crap. I won't spend almost all of my waking time obsessing and pondering over the pile of crap. I'd move on with my life and spend my time more productively and leave what I consider to be a pile of crap well enough alone. I wouldn't give the pile of crap another thought.

This place is a pile of crap. Hence, I spend very very little time here and only really popped in to say hello to Lu and Sweaty as I don't really come across them on other boards.

And what do you and your obsessive cronies do? Make bullcrap incorrect 'points', false assumptions, idiotic ramblings and dish out inane jibes at posters on other forums who don't even post here? Yeah, real big and clever that is. If you want to address people on other forums then go there and address them. Kitakaze first used this cowardly tactic some time ago. I don't know if he/she/it still does it after I told he/she/it was being a pillock. It wouldn't surprise me.

I was right the first time I came here. Waldorf and Statler would be right at home here. This is peanut gallery central.

The fact that none of you muppets have the guts or the brains to go to a specific bigfoot board (of which there are plenty) and state the same case there as you do here with any level of success, yet Lu and Sweaty Yeti can do the opposite with absolute ease, tells me that yup they run rings around you folks. Lu and Sweaty do a great job of batting you away and knocking you for six despite the heavy majority against them here.

Even Skep Greg turns into a little shrew when he posts on bigfoot boards and can't so much as argue successfully against a can of beans elsewhere.

Well your rabid snarling anti bigfoot crusade here isn't letting it die either, is it? Again, do you understand the word irony? Look at this bloody thread. Over 400 pages long!!!! You talk about bigfoot here EVERY DAMN DAY!!!!

If you don't call that 'obsessive', then what would you call it? You don't magically appear here every day by some freak accident do you? You lot come here by design and meaning every damn day. Why? Because you are OBSESSED.

The bottom line is this. The bigfoot dream won't ever die for those who are convinced there is such an animal. The sooner you accept and deal with that the better it will be for your sanity.

For those who think bigfoot is a pile of crap it will only die when you stop banging on that it's a pile of crap and try to forget about it. Got it? Very simple isn't it?

The regular crowd here are complete fruitcakes.

What is your problem? Why does the idea of bigfoot get under your skin so much that you have to talk about it almost every bloody day? Is cancer research funding being halted and handed over to bigfoot research instead? Are people killing in the name of bigfoot? Are archaic laws being upheld and adhered to in the name of bigfoot? Is bigfoot a paranormal scientific impossibility?

What............is...............the.............. big...............deal????

Why do you care so much that many people are convinced there is such an animal out there? Who is it harming? Are you personally losing something? Did Roger Patterson shag your little sister and leave her pregnant? Did John Green steal your bike when you were a nipper at school? Did Rene Dahinden bash your momma over the head with half a stick of stale French bread when she was carrying you?

I mean..............come on. So much anger, bile and vitriol and TIME SPENT against a subject that is only a flesh and blood animal, should it exist. If it doesn't exist, so what?

If you think there is no such thing as bigfoot then fine. Ignore it. Forget about it. Consign it to the 'monkey' bin. Don't keep obsessing over the damn subject day after day after day and year after year after year.

It's sad, pathetic and more than just a little bit weird.

At least the proponents have a logical and sound reason for spending time pondering this subject. To 'obsess' over something you are sure exists is reasonable. To 'obsess' over something harmless and which you are sure doesn't exist is seriously whacked in the head.

End of.

G'morning.

Pst) Hello again Lu and Sweaty. Keep up the good work you are doing.
Wow.... just ....wow.... methinks Carch that you might just want to look into some anger management classes,but seeings how you went to all the trouble of typing out your little cry baby tirade I'll play along.

Have you ever for one second thought that maybe just maybe some of us are intrigued by the thought processes involved with a person who BLEEVS that a heretofore undiscovered 8 foot tall Hairy Biped roams throughout every stretch of tall trees across the whole of the US in great enough numbers to sustain a breeding population and has done so for at least 400 years despite the utter dirth of any meanigful evidence.

Furthermore that enaging these people and their lack of any real criitical thinking skills might just be considered interesting to some of us??

Have you ever allowed that thought to squeeze it's way into your skull Carchy ol bean??

This is what's called a hobby Carch...and interesting activity that we like to spend a bit of our day doing....I "waste" as you like to put it roughly an hour a day doing this...hardly an obsession.

There's also a wee bit of fighting the good fight involved....can't allow TRU BLEEVER to gain any ground don't ya know...lest the entire world be overrun with Ghost researchers and Bigfeetsus Field Reps.
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Old 23rd September 2008, 09:10 AM   #16416
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Originally Posted by captain koolaid View Post
Yessssss...Kool Aid get's 500 pts for the Manos,The Hands of Fate reference
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Old 23rd September 2008, 09:24 AM   #16417
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Originally Posted by LAL View Post
Do you actually think 7000 dead animals were found? It was an estimate.
Lu do you actually think that they didn't find dead animals in any numbers at all to base this estimate on?? Do you think they saw one dead example of each species and leapt to an arbitrary number of 7,000 individuals??

What about wolves?? What about wolverines? They may have been there all along??

Ahh but they may not have either Lu...ever allow that to enter your thinking??

On the other hand Bigfeetsus were said to have been in the area...hell it was a relative Hot Zone of Hairy Bipedal shenanigans...yet not a single Sasquatch body among the known dead.

Oh yeah...I forgot...they were buried under a mile of ash...yeah.....that's the ticket.
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Old 23rd September 2008, 09:38 AM   #16418
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What happened to PGF?

Hey, Sweaty, #27.
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Old 23rd September 2008, 09:57 AM   #16419
Correa Neto
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Diferent pattyfaces... Lots of artistic freedom IMHO.
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Old 23rd September 2008, 10:05 AM   #16420
Mad Hom
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Originally Posted by GT/CS View Post
What happened to PGF?

Hey, Sweaty, #27.
The PGF has pretty much been slapped silly on this thread for 3 years.

The timeline,the suit,the detail,the filmstock,the frame speed,the editing, Rodge's past,Bob H's past,shadow angle ...pretty much all of it.

It all ends up devolving though into Lu incessantly reciting long passages of anecdotal evidence or Sweetsy yammering on and on about "replicate the suit...aaaaaaaahh"

Given this knowledge...to me this has become the Bigfeetsus thread not just the PGF thread...and all Bigfeetsus lore is open to debate.

But anyone can feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.
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Old 23rd September 2008, 11:45 AM   #16421
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Yeah, somebody should make up a list of bigfoot myths that keep popping up in this thread. That way when somebody starts talking about the gait can not be duplicated, everyone can respond "see answer to bigfoot myth #1" where this video clip/experiment is described with the appropriate link. That would save a lot of time and commentary IMO.
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Old 23rd September 2008, 12:10 PM   #16422
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Well, it'll take me a long time to get to all of them, but here's a start:
www.doctoratlantis.com/bigfoot_myths.htm
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Old 23rd September 2008, 01:11 PM   #16423
Correa Neto
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Originally Posted by crowlogic
This brings up an interesting point. Exactly why should Bigfooters give up their belief no matter how misguided or irrational? Assuming lightning did somehow strike the minds of every footer at once and all of a sudden there was no more belief in Bigfoot. Would that change the human condition in any meaningful way? Is there the possibility that there is an untapped genius among the ranks of the Bigfooters whose genius is being being laid to waist by Footery? Are there vast fortunes of treasure, mind, science and soul being funneled away from human betterment because of Footery?

For decades I labored under the misconception that somehow if an absoloute truth could be put in universal terms that the human condition would somehow blossom into the "potential" that the poets dream. It dawned on me one day that none of it mattered worth a fig. The Greek gods came and went, the Renaissance came and went, the so called son of god came and went, the war to end all wars came and went, the New Deal, The Fair Deal, JFK, LBJ, the moonshot, the transistor, the bloody internet put that in it too. And guess what? None of it has had a lasting or much of a material effect on the better angels of the human species. None of it! Not one molecule rubbed off!

So a couple of thousand middle aged folks need to change their belief system? For what? What is there to believe in? All of the great beliefs have been put on the table and none of it has mattered. But I'll tell you what. I'll throw in a little wisdom I picked up somewhere under a hot sun and parched landscape. The only thing that's worth having a belief in is the knowledge that we are beings on our way to our own deaths. Stack that up against Bigfoot belief or any of the other tripe we waste our beliefs in and see if it holds a serious candle to the the last lights out.
I can perfectly understand your points, crow. But I feel a comment could be made.

First lets not to mix apples with oranges. One thing is an individual tendering a belief – this boils down to individual rights and choices. Want to spend money buying bigfoot books, bigfoot videos, cameras to capture bigfoot images, etc.? Want to spend days hunting for bigfoot among the woods? OK. It’s your hobby, it’s not my problem or anyone else’s (#1). It is the very same thing as collecting Star Wars or Star Trek memorabilia. Some might consider silly, but so what? Note that discussing pseudoscience may also be a hobby. And don’t even dare mentioning my Klingon cruiser plastic model kit.

How the individual communicates this belief to the society, the influence of this belief with his/hers relationships within the society are completely different things. It is true that no substantial resources are being diverted from good science towards bigfootery (at least this seems to be the case). However, some footers quite often (willing or not) spread misinformations and half truths. This is what skeptics are fighting. No one is fighting someone’s right to believe in bigfoot. It’s the spreading of lies, of half-truths, of misinformation which is being fought. Make no mistake, misinformation spreading can be potentially harmful. No big motivation to change the world. Just setting a couple of things straight.



#1- Unless you are using the money supposed to buy your toddler’s milk or will need to be rescued…
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Old 23rd September 2008, 04:32 PM   #16424
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Originally Posted by Correa Neto View Post
That was no answer. I asked if you'd seen it and got a dismissal of sources. And then you asked me a question you would have known the answer to if you'd actually seen it.
Quote:
The calls- Not confirmed as being from bigfeet, other options not
But not matching known animals (or sirens) and appearing to be primate (human not excepted).
Quote:
The film- Suspected of being a hoax, too blurry.
It was digitalized from John Green's copy. The government's suspected of blowing up the world Trade Center and the CIA's suspected of killing JFK and NASA's suspected of faking the moon landing. So what?
Quote:
The casts- Suspected of being hoaxes and misidentifications
And a forensic fingerprint expert who is the only expert on ape fingerprints showed some pretty good reasons why they're not. (No "dessication ridges" in mud, BTW. I got clarification from him on some of that, BTW.)

See above.
Quote:
Lots of things regarding PGF are anecdotal- all we have are actually anecdotes. Patterson and Gimlim claim the film is from a female bigfoot; they and other people claim that the footprints were made by the film subject; Hieronimus claims to be the guy in the suit and Morris claims he was involved on making it. None of the above individuals managed to back the claims propperly. Anecdote.
None of that was in LMS.

Quote:
The "hoaxers would not replicate hernia" stuff?
Not sure if it was from the book or video.
Would you be surprised to know I was not impressed?
Would you be surprised to know that this is because I doubt PGF has enough definition to support such level of detail analysis (hernias, moving toes/fingers, facial expressions, braids, poops, bullet wounds, etc. are a no-go)?
I have the DVD, the video and the book if you want me to check anything out for you. Dr. Nelson pointed out that biomechanics was in its infancy in 1967.

MK Davis wasn't in LMS either.
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Old 23rd September 2008, 05:10 PM   #16425
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Monsterquest .. No bias there ... Nosiree ..

Besides they didn't try to do the walk - they tried to pose like the subject of the film .. Not exactly the same task ..
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Old 23rd September 2008, 05:14 PM   #16426
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Originally Posted by EHocking View Post
No. It isn't.
I didn't mean just ash; I didn't make that clear. I've read (somewhere other than on the Internet) Harry Truman was buried under 200' of mud and ash. I couldn't find that but I did find this:

"From: Tilling, Topinka, and Swanson, 1990, Eruptions of Mount St. Helens: Past, Present, and Future: USGS General Interest Publication.

... Part of the avalanche ( May 18, 1980 eruption of Mount St. Helens) surged into and across Spirit Lake, but most of it flowed westward into the upper reaches of the North Fork of the Toutle River. At one location, about 4 miles north of the summit, the advancing front of the avalanche still had sufficient momentum to flow over a ridge more than 1,150 feet high. The resulting hummocky avalanche deposit consisted of intermixed volcanic debris, glacial ice, and, possibly, water displaced from Spirit Lake. ... The dumping of avalanche debris into Spirit Lake raised its bottom by about 295 feet and its water level by about 200 feet. ..."

Rick Noll noted in his presentation at the Willow Creek Symposium 2003 an area may have reported activity, then nothing for 10 years, then reported activity again. He didn't know why.
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Old 23rd September 2008, 05:25 PM   #16427
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Originally Posted by LAL View Post
Rick Noll noted in his presentation at the Willow Creek Symposium 2003 an area may have reported activity, then nothing for 10 years, then reported activity again. He didn't know why.
LSD supply might be worth looking at. The standard and strength of batches varies over the years. Similar with Moonshine, depends who's making it at the time.
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Old 23rd September 2008, 06:50 PM   #16428
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Originally Posted by LAL View Post
....

Rick Noll noted in his presentation at the Willow Creek Symposium 2003 an area may have reported activity, then nothing for 10 years, then reported activity again. He didn't know why.
Do tell..

Any other juicy stories about stuff Rick didn't know ?
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Old 23rd September 2008, 07:49 PM   #16429
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Originally Posted by Correa Neto View Post
Another interesting thing to do would be to stop playing the victim role, since many a footer quite often abuse the freedom of speech that exists here.
There weren't any when I came in. I was here alone for about nine months and at no time did I denigrate, mock, swear or abuse the freedom of speech. I did use the term "scoftic" at one point (but not directed at anyone in particular) borrowed from Roger Knights because it seemed appropriate. When Huntster joined he was greeted with, "Oh good, another wacko." I can't imagine Roger Knights, or Kathy Strain or Henry May abusing the freedom of speech here. "Many a footer"? You mean Sweaty and carcharodon? That's two They're more than outnumbered.

Did you read this?

"Let's cool off the discussion a little please. Remember the MA, and do not resort to attacking each other. Let's keep it civil, and on topic, and also let's not start off topic arguments about other boards.

All posts after this point need to be civil, and on the topic of Bigfoot - nothing else.

Posted By:chillzero"

I'm not a bigfoot. You can't talk about me.
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Old 23rd September 2008, 08:47 PM   #16430
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I'm just gonna hop in here for 2 minutes and say that I did my own Bigfoot search a few years back. I lived near a huge forest and me and some friends decided to go look for it. We went prepared, carrying baseball bats, a tape recorder and video camera. We went deep into the middle somewhere on a trail, and sat down. We then took the tape recorder and played a bigfoot sound (which we found on the internet) as loud as it could. Waited.....waited......

We heard some sounds returning, enough to scare the crap out of us, and we got up and ran away. The video tape showed nothing visual or audio, and so we concluded that we were pansies and probably ran away from a raccoon. But that didn't stop us from going to school with the bigfoot sound on the recorder, and telling everybody that we recorded bigfoot in a forest.

What happened next? Well we got people to actually believe (and try to make other people believe) that we were authentic. Teachers knew about it, other students. It was great.

Moral of the story. Bigfoot seems to be more of a legend that's passed down to people, and people will believe it whether or not they've had any experience with it. It's quite possible that an animal exists that's been called bigfoot, that hasn't been documented. I'd put my money on that option, instead of sound bytes and videos.

And the last conclusion that I heard a comedian say about Bigfoot is that, Bigfoot must be blurry. The videos are fine, the animal is just blurry.
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Old 23rd September 2008, 10:19 PM   #16431
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Originally Posted by doctoratlantis View Post
Now you want to exclude those that drowned? Be serious.
I am serious. If a person drowns would you call that natural causes or accidental death?
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Old 24th September 2008, 01:23 AM   #16432
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Mod WarningHi everyone.
I know this will disappoint some of you, but this thread has grown too large and unweildy for the forum database. In the interests of good housekeeping, I am closing it, and I have moved some posts to a new thread here (I tried to copy them, but that failed):
http://www.internationalskeptics.com...d.php?t=124690
to discuss the 'walk'. That seemed to be the main line of discussion on the final page.

I would like to advise that instead of dedicating yourselves to one monster thread, you start new threads when you want to discuss a different aspect of anything Bigfoot related. For example, this new one is about whether the walk can be replicated. There was a post on the final page that that member is free to use for another new thread to discuss Bigfoot mythology and how that makes hoaxes easier (Toblerowned's post 16430). And so on. You are all free to make a copy of a post you put here as a new thread starter, but please double-check first that the specific topic you wish to cover is not already under discussion.

Some people have suggested a new subforum solely for Bigfoot discussions. We are open to reviewing that should we find this section completely flooded with Bigfoot related threads over a long term period.

So, I apologise for any inconvenience, but I'm sure you will agree this is preferable to killing the forum.
Responding to this modbox in thread will be off topic Posted By:chillzero

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