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View Poll Results: Will Trump be indicted for Federal or State crimes?
Yes 62 62.00%
No 38 38.00%
Voters: 100. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 15th August 2022, 11:45 PM   #81
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According to Michael Cohen, Weisselberg is the key to Trump's financial secrets; Basically, "He Who Knows All". His ex-daughter-in-law is quite willing to testify what she knows about how he hid things from the IRS to avoid paying taxes.
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Old 16th August 2022, 11:18 AM   #82
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
Rumor has it that longtime Trump Corporation CFO Alan Weisselberg is making a plea deal with the Manhattan DA. You have to wonder if that changes the dynamics on Trump?
Rumor also has it that Weisselberg's deal does not include an agreement to aid the investigation.
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Old 16th August 2022, 11:20 AM   #83
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Originally Posted by TellyKNeasuss View Post
Rumor also has it that Weisselberg's deal does not include an agreement to aid the investigation.
Then why the hell are they making a deal with him? They should throw the book at him.
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Old 16th August 2022, 11:41 AM   #84
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Originally Posted by TellyKNeasuss View Post
Rumor also has it that Weisselberg's deal does not include an agreement to aid the investigation.
Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
Then why the hell are they making a deal with him? They should throw the book at him.
I realize I'm just speculating but Weisselberg probably doesn’t want Trump and his allies focused on him. So it wouldn't surprise me that Weisselberg has a public deal not to aid the investigation and yet have a private deal to aid the investigation.

I mean why deal? Of course they might not feel they have a very good case. Seems to me that they do however.
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Old 16th August 2022, 11:58 AM   #85
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
Quote:
Rumor also has it that Weisselberg's deal does not include an agreement to aid the investigation.
Then why the hell are they making a deal with him? They should throw the book at him.
Possibly for a guaranteed win (which some prosecutors may prefer compared to going to a trial, where they may get stuck with a MAGAchud on the jury.) Or to free up resources.

I agree... it sucks... I wish they would throw the book at him. He's been dirty for a long time, so its not like this is some sort of momentary lapse of judgement, or an act of desperation.

(And its been discussed before that we don't yet know the details... there is a chance that his deal may include him assisting in the investigation of the Trump organization but not in Trump himself.)
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Old 16th August 2022, 12:03 PM   #86
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That really is the X factor. You give me the choice of being the guy in charge of picking a jury for any hypothetical Trump trial or putting a gun in my mouth I'd have to think on it.

If anyone can imagine a worst case scenario for the concept of an "impartial jury of your peers" then President who prior to being President was a celebrity I'd like to know what it is.
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Old 16th August 2022, 09:28 PM   #87
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Reminded of an old Law and Order episode, I think it was about a guy who had killed a Jewish man with possible hate-crime overtones. The defense lawyer played into that, introducing into testimony evidence of anti-Semitic intent on the part of the defendant. During a recess the prosecutors (main characters that is) asked him what the hell he was doing, that he was hurting his own case. He said, "Go out there and ask twelve guys what they think of Jewish people. All I need is one."

IIRC sure enough it wound up a hung jury.
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Old 17th August 2022, 01:46 AM   #88
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If the crime started in Washington DC, then the jury will be drawn from registered DC voters. That's not a jury pool favorable to Trump at all. Florida is a crap shoot.
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Old 17th August 2022, 02:13 AM   #89
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Originally Posted by Craig4 View Post
If the crime started in Washington DC, then the jury will be drawn from registered DC voters. That's not a jury pool favorable to Trump at all. Florida is a crap shoot.
Emphasis on crap.
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Old 17th August 2022, 07:25 AM   #90
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Originally Posted by Craig4 View Post
Florida is a crap shoot.
Wait…they still use firing squads?


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Old 17th August 2022, 07:55 AM   #91
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Originally Posted by Hellbound View Post
Quote:
Florida is a crap shoot.
Wait…they still use firing squads?
Yeah but in Florida instead of using bullets they fling poo at the condemned.

Hence the name 'crap shoot'.

Hmmm... maybe it might be better for Trump to be tried in florida after all. Sure, there is a greater chance of a mistrial, but if he loses it will be much more entertaining.
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Old 19th August 2022, 05:54 AM   #92
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In what some are calling a stunning development, former trump organization chief financial officer Allen Weisselberg has agreed to testify against the donald trump organization, though not necessarily against trump personally. Yesterday Weisselberg pleaded guilty to fifteen felony counts relating to tax fraud. The 75-year-old Weisselberg will almost certainly get some jail time, though it could be as little as 100 days.
CNN reported:
Quote:
Allen Weisselberg, the former chief financial officer of the Trump Organization, pleaded guilty Thursday to his role in a 15-year-long tax fraud scheme, and as part of the deal he has agreed to testify against former President Donald Trump's real estate company at trial....Weisselberg has been fiercely loyal to the Trump family, having worked for them since 1973. Yet even by providing testimony against the company Weisselberg will not implicate any Trump family members, who were not accused of any wrongdoing. If the Trump Organization is convicted, it could be required to pay back taxes and fines, but no individual will go to prison. CNN news link
Weisselberg is still not cooperating with New York City prosecutors in a criminal investigation that does involve trump personally.
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Old 19th August 2022, 06:09 AM   #93
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Originally Posted by newyorkguy View Post
In what some are calling a stunning development, former trump organization chief financial officer Allen Weisselberg has agreed to testify against the donald trump organization, though not necessarily against trump personally. Yesterday Weisselberg pleaded guilty to fifteen felony counts relating to tax fraud. The 75-year-old Weisselberg will almost certainly get some jail time, though it could be as little as 100 days.
CNN reported:


Weisselberg is still not cooperating with New York City prosecutors in a criminal investigation that does involve trump personally.
15 felonies and he got 5 months jailtime. Man the rich really do get a different justice than the poor.
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Old 19th August 2022, 06:25 AM   #94
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Originally Posted by newyorkguy View Post
In what some are calling a stunning development, former trump organization chief financial officer Allen Weisselberg has agreed to testify against the donald trump organization, though not necessarily against trump personally.
That may be a bigger deal that I originally thought. If he doesn't testify accurately at that trial his plea deal is out the window and he could face up to 15 years in jail.

https://www.npr.org/2022/08/18/11179...-guilty-felony

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Old 19th August 2022, 06:28 AM   #95
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The Trump organisation should be fined to the total value of all the US real estate property it holds or has interests in, fittings and all, or forfeit the same in lieu. Trump can keep one passport...the Russian one. And he should be barred from running any businesses in the USA ever again.
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Old 19th August 2022, 10:44 AM   #96
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Originally Posted by wareyin View Post
15 felonies and he got 5 months jailtime. Man the rich really do get a different justice than the poor.
Isn't that the truth!

Quote:
On Monday, James Steele Saunders, of Kingman, Arizona, was sentenced by U.S. District Judge John J. Tuchi to 12 months and 1 day in prison. Saunders previously pleaded guilty to Tax Evasion.

Saunders evaded paying taxes for 15 years. Between 2003 and 2013, Saunders failed to file timely income tax returns with the IRS. In 2009, an IRS revenue officer was assigned to collect taxes owed by Saunders for tax year 2003 and to solicit the filing of tax returns for tax years 2004-2008. Saunders did not cooperate with the IRS and failed to pay what he owed. In 2014, Saunders began to funnel his income through third parties in an attempt to deceive the IRS. He continued this practice until February 2018.

In addition to his prison sentence, the Court ordered Saunders to pay $180,079 in restitution to the IRS, which represents the federal income taxes Saunders failed to pay for tax years 2008 through 2017.
https://www.irs.gov/compliance/crimi...or-tax-evasion

Quote:
A Middletown man was sentenced to two and a half years in prison and ordered to pay more than $725,000 in restitution to the federal government for a scheme to avoid paying income taxes, officials said in a Tuesday release.
David Fraley, 55, pleaded guilty to income tax evasion in June 2020, officials said. He was accused of evading payment of income taxes connected with his 2009 through 2012 tax returns.
Quote:
Fraley "took extensive measures in an effort to hide his income and to defeat his tax liabilities,” said Stephen Wajert, acting assistant special agent in charge of the IRS Criminal Investigation's Cincinnati Field Office. “His sentence is a warning that those who intentionally hide income from the IRS will be held accountable.”
https://www.cincinnati.com/story/new...ud/9475498002/
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Old 19th August 2022, 11:06 AM   #97
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Originally Posted by Norman Alexander View Post
The Trump organisation should be fined to the total value of all the US real estate property it holds or has interests in, fittings and all, or forfeit the same in lieu. Trump can keep one passport...the Russian one. And he should be barred from running any businesses in the USA ever again.
That likely won't happen with the upcoming tax evasion case (the one that Bragg is involved in). I can imagine that resulting in no more than a few million in back taxes/fine.

On the other hand, the case by the NY Att. General (Laticia James) is directed at a wider range of Trump's shenanigans (including fraud associated with property evaluations.) She seems to be a lot more aggressive than Bragg, and there is the chance that the Trump organization might be severely harmed as a result.
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Old 19th August 2022, 02:05 PM   #98
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Criminal status of The Trump Orbit

I thought was about time I updated this.

Ran out of space on the inner track, so I had to add the outer track




Candidates for "Who's Next?"

John Eastman?
Jeffrey Clark?
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Old 19th August 2022, 02:26 PM   #99
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Originally Posted by Craig4 View Post
If the crime started in Washington DC, then the jury will be drawn from registered DC voters. That's not a jury pool favorable to Trump at all. Florida is a crap shoot.
As I said in another thread, Paul Manafort's trial was held in the so called "rocket docket" - U.S. District Court for the Eastern District of Virginia, and Virginia is not exactly an overwhelmingly blue state... plenty of MAGA morons in that region, and yet they still found Manafort guilty.

Voir dire is very good at weeding out jury nullifiers, and I'm betting the DoJ/FBI will conduct thorough and detailed background checks on every single member of the jury pool (and by "jury pool" I mean the legal definition - the list of prospective jurors, actually summoned to appear from whom the jury is selected to serve in a jury trial.

Trumpers don't exactly hide their political lights under bushels. Anyone who has so much as flown a Trump flag in their front yard will be challenged for cause.

It is unlikely that he will be found not guilty... the very best might be a hung jury, and then the government just retries him.

The Federal Rule of Criminal Procedure 31(b)(3) states that If the jury cannot agree on a verdict on one or more counts, the court may declare a mistrial on those counts. The government may retry any defendant on any count on which the jury could not agree. The U.S. Court of Appeals for the Third Circuit held that this rule places no limits on the number of retrials in U.S. v. Wright in 2019: "The word 'may' means that the government has the discretion to retry a case, and nothing in the rule or its commentary provides or even suggests a limit on the number of retrials it may conduct"
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Old 19th August 2022, 03:36 PM   #100
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Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
I thought was about time I updated this.

Ran out of space on the inner track, so I had to add the outer track

https://www.dropbox.com/s/xv8z5xv0nm...bit6.png?raw=1


Candidates for "Who's Next?"

John Eastman?
Jeffrey Clark?
Yes.
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Old 21st August 2022, 08:04 PM   #101
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Originally Posted by Apathia View Post
I'll Be satisfied with anything that puts him out to pasture where he can't run for any office again and must eek out a retirement based on charity from what remains of his cult.

Personally, I wish that in whatever state of mind one chooses to call it, that Trump truly believes that the election was really stolen from him and I want him to arise every morning with that thought being the first thing in his head, that he was gypped, swindled, outwitted ,and that he realizes there's not a damned thing he can do about it and I hope it eats him up from the inside.

The USA's royalty is reluctant to penalize one of their own so imprisoning his mental health is the best we can hope for.
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Old 21st August 2022, 10:18 PM   #102
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Originally Posted by Athyrio View Post
Personally, I wish that in whatever state of mind one chooses to call it, that Trump truly believes that the election was really stolen from him and I want him to arise every morning with that thought being the first thing in his head, that he was gypped, swindled, outwitted ,and that he realizes there's not a damned thing he can do about it and I hope it eats him up from the inside.

The USA's royalty is reluctant to penalize one of their own so imprisoning his mental health is the best we can hope for.
I have a feeling you've already gotten your wish.
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Old 21st August 2022, 11:33 PM   #103
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This is an interesting point: because Trumpers are so open in their support for him on social media, any Prosecutor would have no trouble getting rid of all of them on a potential Jury... which would lead to a Jury rather unlike the current make-up of American society.
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Old 21st August 2022, 11:36 PM   #104
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
This is an interesting point: because Trumpers are so open in their support for him on social media, any Prosecutor would have no trouble getting rid of all of them on a potential Jury... which would lead to a Jury rather unlike the current make-up of American society.

Huh? Like, you think all people who support Trump shout about it on social media, and would be easily identified?

Surely that isn't what you are suggesting.
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Old 22nd August 2022, 02:27 AM   #105
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
Huh? Like, you think all people who support Trump shout about it on social media, and would be easily identified?

Surely that isn't what you are suggesting.
True. Some people deny being Trump supporters when their actions prove otherwise.
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Old 22nd August 2022, 03:22 AM   #106
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
True. Some people deny being Trump supporters when their actions prove otherwise.
Oh, you!

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Old 22nd August 2022, 03:39 AM   #107
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
Huh? Like, you think all people who support Trump shout about it on social media, and would be easily identified?

Surely that isn't what you are suggesting.
I think it is reasonable to conclude that the kind of people who support The Fat Orange Turd so vehemently and blindly that they would wilfully ignore overwhelming evidence of his guilt in order to commit jury nullification, are also the same types of people who will tell the world they support him any way they can.

Joe Morgue calls them "The Proudly Wrong" (although in this case, I would argue that "The Proudly Ignorant" or "The Proudly Stupid" might be more accurate descriptions). You only have to look at the actions of that bunch of moronic MAGA hats at the Capitol to see this - people who could not help bragging on social media about what they did, and posting videos of themselves committing felonies and participating in an insurrection.
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Old 22nd August 2022, 05:45 AM   #108
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Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
I thought was about time I updated this.

Ran out of space on the inner track, so I had to add the outer track

https://www.dropbox.com/s/xv8z5xv0nm...bit6.png?raw=1
That graphic is still showing Steve Bannon as indicted. Although Bannon was pardoned by then-President Trump before he could prove his innocence of mail fraud and money laundering in a court of law, Bannon was subsequently found guilty on two criminal charges of contempt of Congress, each implying a minimum sentence of 30 days in prison. Sentencing is scheduled for October.
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Old 22nd August 2022, 11:02 AM   #109
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
Huh? Like, you think all people who support Trump shout about it on social media, and would be easily identified?

Surely that isn't what you are suggesting.
Thank you for pointing this out and providing an example of this as well.
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Old 28th August 2022, 09:33 PM   #110
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Originally Posted by Hercules56
Will he be indicted? I say its 50/50.

What say you?
 
I say what we all have been saying: Any day now
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Old 29th August 2022, 08:32 AM   #111
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Lindsey Graham warns that there will be riots if Trump is prosecuted.


So ya, that's where we are at. Threats of violence if we America's most dangerous criminal in jail....
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Old 29th August 2022, 08:45 AM   #112
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Originally Posted by thaiboxerken View Post
Lindsey Graham warns that there will be riots if Trump is prosecuted.

So ya, that's where we are at. Threats of violence if we America's most dangerous criminal in jail....
Conspiracy theory tags on. . .

Trump has the goods on "Lady G" thus explaining LG's sudden turn around regarding Trump's character in 2016.

Trump is fearful he going to get tried and convicted, so he sends his boy out to throw a scare into the DOJ hoping they'll be convinced not to prosecute lest they start a civil war.

Conspiracy theory tags off. . .
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Old 29th August 2022, 09:06 AM   #113
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Fairly interesting article in yesterday's Observer, concerning the likeliest indictment - 'his greatest peril'.
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Old 29th August 2022, 11:16 AM   #114
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Wouldn't Brian Kemp just pardon 45?
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Old 29th August 2022, 11:42 AM   #115
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Originally Posted by SteveAitch View Post
Fairly interesting article in yesterday's Observer, concerning the likeliest indictment - 'his greatest peril'.
He went through two impeachments. The "Greatest Peril" argument has sailed.
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Old 29th August 2022, 11:44 AM   #116
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Originally Posted by DallasDad View Post
Wouldn't Brian Kemp just pardon 45?
Maybe. But remember that Trump turned on Kemp and endorsed his rival, Perdue. I don't think there is any love for Trump from Kemp.

Quote:
"Today, the worst 'election integrity' Governor in the country, Brian Kemp, loaded the great state of Georgia up with RINOs," Trump said in a statement on Wednesday. "That's right, he had them all. Chris Christie, Doug Ducey from Arizona, and Pete Ricketts from Nebraska. That tells you all you need to know about what you are getting in Georgia—just a continuation of bad elections and a real RINO if you vote for Brian Kemp."
https://www.newsweek.com/donald-trum...n-kemp-1705812
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Old 29th August 2022, 12:08 PM   #117
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Originally Posted by thaiboxerken View Post
Lindsey Graham warns that there will be riots if Trump is prosecuted.


So ya, that's where we are at. Threats of violence if we America's most dangerous criminal in jail....
Considering that POS Trump has often said how much he appreciates "Law and Order", then riots in the street should be just the type of "Law and Order" that one should expect from a POS like Trump and a POS like Graham.
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Old 29th August 2022, 12:32 PM   #118
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Originally Posted by thaiboxerken View Post
Lindsey Graham warns that there will be riots if Trump is prosecuted.


So ya, that's where we are at. Threats of violence if we America's most dangerous criminal in jail....
Who will they blame that rioting on? Antifa? BLM? FBI plants?
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Old 29th August 2022, 12:37 PM   #119
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
Who will they blame that rioting on? Antifa? BLM? FBI plants?
My guess would be something like:

'Woke, Liberal, FBI Agents abetted by Caravans of Illegal Immigrants and Numerous RHINOs who are Inflamed by Critical Race Theory'.
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Old 29th August 2022, 01:05 PM   #120
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Originally Posted by DallasDad View Post
Wouldn't Brian Kemp just pardon 45?
there is no upside for Kemp - Trump would not thank him
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