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View Poll Results: Are you willing to work for free if the goods and services are free?
Yes 23 31.94%
No 35 48.61%
I don't know 14 19.44%
Voters: 72. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 26th July 2021, 07:19 AM   #3241
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
Now on it is good to pay tax because it is a kind of system that redistributes money but in the past it was a system to take the money from people and redistribute it between rich, the king and their pigs. When Jesus said to render to Cesar what belongs to Cesar and to God what belongs to God it means to give back money to devils while people of God don't use money and do it for free.
Why is this wisdom not in Leviticus, where we find all the rules about not killing, wearing mixed fabrics and all the other rules are clearly spelled out? Why did god bury it in the parables, which are left to interpretations, through Jesus? I mean, if it's the only way to haven, why is it not in the 10 commandments? Surely it has to be more important that stoning to death disobedient children?
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Old 26th July 2021, 09:24 AM   #3242
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Jesus and his closest followers are forbidden to use money, ok. How far can the be removed from money and still remain true?

They consumed fish, bread and wine. Were the farmers, millers, bakers, fishermen, market stalls just happily handing over whatever they needed?
Were friendly folks just buying it for them to give it over?

Or did the boat maker have to get free lumber, make a free boat, give it to fishermen, then fish to the non-seller so they could get truly correct fish to consume?

Did you think this through Gaetan? Where is the point everything they used would be pure enough to ensure Haven?
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Old 26th July 2021, 12:43 PM   #3243
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Gaetan do you think that disobedient children should be stoned to death?

Do you think that Jews are evil?

Do you think that non Christians should be tortured for eternity?

Jesus does.
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Old 26th July 2021, 03:36 PM   #3244
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
If he use money it is not because he liked to do that but because he was forced to do so
I see you can't cite a single Bible verse to back up your claim.
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Old 27th July 2021, 07:40 AM   #3245
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Originally Posted by 8enotto View Post
They consumed fish, bread and wine. Were the farmers, millers, bakers, fishermen, market stalls just happily handing over whatever they needed?
Were friendly folks just buying it for them to give it over?

Or did the boat maker have to get free lumber, make a free boat, give it to fishermen, then fish to the non-seller so they could get truly correct fish to consume?

Did you think this through Gaetan? Where is the point everything they used would be pure enough to ensure Haven?
Let's not confuse Jesus being given goods and services, and Gaetan demanding or flat out taking them. A subtle difference he would rather not address.
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Old 27th July 2021, 08:03 AM   #3246
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Originally Posted by Joecool View Post
I see you can't cite a single Bible verse to back up your claim.
That's not a road we should travel again. It's the same step. Find something written hundreds of years later, translated dozens of times, tortured more than a POW at Gitmo, and interpreted by a man suffering from insomnia. Thousands of years of people reading the same text and one man finds the "truth" but is unwilling to follow it.

How many of Jesus's teaching requires everyone else to do it before you can do it? I can't find any. So this teaching is so far removed from the rest it's almost like someone pulled it out of his own ass.
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Old 27th July 2021, 09:07 AM   #3247
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
If he use money it is not because he liked to do that but because he was forced to do so
So not even Jesus is in Haven?
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Old 27th July 2021, 04:11 PM   #3248
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Originally Posted by Leftus View Post
So not even Jesus is in Haven?
Doesn't have to be, as the co-owner (with his other two triadic selves) he just rents it out. Should have seen how the prices jumped when it went condo. Most had to hock their harps and halos.
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Old 27th July 2021, 10:34 PM   #3249
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Originally Posted by Leftus View Post
Let's not confuse Jesus being given goods and services, and Gaetan demanding or flat out taking them. A subtle difference he would rather not address.

If I reword it to jesus demanding and flat out taking goods and services is it possible to get an answer?
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Old 28th July 2021, 07:12 AM   #3250
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Originally Posted by 8enotto View Post
If I reword it to jesus demanding and flat out taking goods and services is it possible to get an answer?
First problem, Gaetan doesn't answer, he asserts. The second problem is that Jesus never demanded goods or services, they were just provided. He never took from the unwilling. Gaetan took that example, **** all over it, and condemned us all to be his slaves.
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Old 28th July 2021, 08:27 AM   #3251
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Originally Posted by Leftus View Post
So not even Jesus is in Haven?
I'm pretty sure Jesus could afford a better holiday than going to a Haven.

Haven. For when Butlins is too posh for you.
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Old 29th July 2021, 06:50 AM   #3252
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Originally Posted by MarkCorrigan View Post
I'm pretty sure Jesus could afford a better holiday than going to a Haven.

Haven. For when Butlins is too posh for you.
Haven seems right up his alley. Jesus was a man of the people, and haven would be in his wheelhouse. His posse would would book it for 12 and sneak him in, freeloading all the way.
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Old 29th July 2021, 10:41 AM   #3253
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This very thread had a poll and the majority of respondents would not work for free in exchange for goods and services.

Doesn't that invalidate Gaetan's theory that people are willing to work for free?
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Old 30th July 2021, 06:37 AM   #3254
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Originally Posted by Joecool View Post
This very thread had a poll and the majority of respondents would not work for free in exchange for goods and services.

Doesn't that invalidate Gaetan's theory that people are willing to work for free?
No, that just means he needs to market it better. He said, a while ago, he just needs like 4 or 5 people to switch sides and then it is a majority and we all become chattel.
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Old 30th July 2021, 08:16 PM   #3255
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Yesterday was the day the earth spends what could be renew, it is just to show you what profit can do.
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Old 30th July 2021, 08:42 PM   #3256
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
Yesterday was the day the earth spends what could be renew, it is just to show you what profit can do.
Profit is the goal of businesses. It is not a bad thing. The profits are used to pay employees, rent, other bills, taxes and it's what makes the economy run.

Your fantasy no money world will be a sloth like existence with people only doing the bare minimum in exchange for taking what they want.

In a no money world, only the strongest will survive. If there's a dispute over the last piece of food or merchandise, the physically strong will prevail, or those with guns.

Gaetan wants us to live in a violent "Escape From New York" type of world.
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Old 31st July 2021, 11:37 AM   #3257
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Originally Posted by MarkCorrigan View Post
Gaetan do you think that disobedient children should be stoned to death?

Do you think that Jews are evil?

Do you think that non Christians should be tortured for eternity?

Jesus does.
Well Gaetan? Or are you just going to spout pidgin English nonsense again?
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Old 31st July 2021, 03:50 PM   #3258
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Originally Posted by MarkCorrigan View Post
Well Gaetan? Or are you just going to spout pidgin English nonsense again?
Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
Yesterday was the day the earth spends what could be renew, it is just to show you what profit can do.
Apparently, pidgin english nonsense it is.
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Old 1st August 2021, 04:36 PM   #3259
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
Yesterday was the day the earth spends what could be renew, it is just to show you what profit can do.
Let me guess, was that International Tiger Day or perhaps National Chili Dog Day?

https://www.thereisadayforthat.com/calendars/2021/7/29
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Old 2nd August 2021, 06:52 AM   #3260
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Originally Posted by abaddon View Post
Apparently, pidgin english nonsense it is.
I've seen predictive text make more coherent ideas. Random word generators too.
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Old 7th August 2021, 10:01 AM   #3261
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People on earth consume natural ressources and the end of july is the day where the people have consumed what the earth can provide in one year. We use more what the earth can produce and if we keep on like that will come one time where there will be no ressource left.
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Old 7th August 2021, 10:11 AM   #3262
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Some of that vaguely parsable pidgin english is true, but the problem is not the system of barter but the drive for consumption itself. Money is just the medium of consumption.

I note that you have declined to respond to my last post. I wonder why.
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Old 7th August 2021, 10:25 AM   #3263
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
People on earth consume natural ressources and the end of july is the day where the people have consumed what the earth can provide in one year. We use more what the earth can produce and if we keep on like that will come one time where there will be no ressource left.
And your plan to reduce the over-consumption of resources is to make them all free. Well, how will that help?
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Old 7th August 2021, 11:49 AM   #3264
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Originally Posted by Jack by the hedge View Post
And your plan to reduce the over-consumption of resources is to make them all free. Well, how will that help?
In a world of money profit is the insentive of over exploitation and waste of ressources, for exemple, to make product repairable and recyclable is not profitable in term of money.
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Old 7th August 2021, 12:56 PM   #3265
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
In a world of money profit is the insentive of over exploitation and waste of ressources, for exemple, to make product repairable and recyclable is not profitable in term of money.
People don't buy stuff because they want to make profits for the manufacturers, manufacturers make stuff people want. Money limits how much of it they can get. When you make it free they can take as much as they please and when something is worn or just needs a wash they can throw it away and take another free one. Where's the incentive to repair or recycle when you can just help yourself to a new one?
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Old 7th August 2021, 01:00 PM   #3266
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Don't be rude Gaetan. Answer my questions please.
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Old 8th August 2021, 12:08 AM   #3267
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Originally Posted by Jack by the hedge View Post
People don't buy stuff because they want to make profits for the manufacturers, manufacturers make stuff people want. Money limits how much of it they can get. When you make it free they can take as much as they please and when something is worn or just needs a wash they can throw it away and take another free one. Where's the incentive to repair or recycle when you can just help yourself to a new one?
This is where Gaetan's claims fall apart like a cheap suit. We know that people are capable of stealing, looting and hoarding.

Gaetan's assertion is that people will only take what they "need". That is totally false or Gaetan is completely off the rails.

We also know that when people have no skin in the game, they tend to not care about things like maintenance or saving for a rainy day. Why take care of your home when you can trash it and just take another one? Same goes for your car.

Gaetan has yet to prove he is serious about his no money world by sending me all of his money to get things started.
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Old 8th August 2021, 04:22 AM   #3268
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Originally Posted by Joecool View Post
This is where Gaetan's claims fall apart like a cheap suit. We know that people are capable of stealing, looting and hoarding.

Gaetan's assertion is that people will only take what they "need". That is totally false or Gaetan is completely off the rails.
Why people will take 2 chickens when they can only eat one? Why a guy would take 2 chain saws when he only need one?
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Old 8th August 2021, 05:27 AM   #3269
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Gaetan, stop being rude.
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Old 8th August 2021, 07:32 AM   #3270
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
Why people will take 2 chickens when they can only eat one? Why a guy would take 2 chain saws when he only need one?
They'll take 2 chickens because if they only take 1 and come back in a few days other people will have taken all the chickens.

Does abolishing money magically make chickens a limitless resource.
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Old 8th August 2021, 08:13 AM   #3271
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Originally Posted by Jack by the hedge View Post
They'll take 2 chickens because if they only take 1 and come back in a few days other people will have taken all the chickens.

Does abolishing money magically make chickens a limitless resource.
Even if you say the opposite we all know here that in a world of no money people won't take more than what they need and it have been like that for ever, it doesn't make any sense to waste ressources.
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Old 8th August 2021, 11:27 AM   #3272
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Absurd nonsense yet again Gaetan. You are simply declaring yourself correct and claiming you know more about what people want than they do.

At this point you're nothing more than a troll, and a pretty poor one at that.
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Old 8th August 2021, 01:31 PM   #3273
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
Even if you say the opposite we all know here that in a world of no money people won't take more than what they need and it have been like that for ever, it doesn't make any sense to waste ressources.
Garbage. That's just not true. A small tribe or band of related humans will share and look after their own resources but they will compete with other bands for control of other resources. That is how we evolved and it made us what we are now. You can't change human nature by abolishing money.
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Old 8th August 2021, 04:34 PM   #3274
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
Even if you say the opposite we all know here that in a world of no money people won't take more than what they need and it have been like that for ever, it doesn't make any sense to waste ressources.
As already cited before people waste (in the USA) about 1/3 of the food they purchase. So even when they do have to pay for it, people take and waste more then they need or even just eat.
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Old 9th August 2021, 07:14 AM   #3275
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Originally Posted by The Man View Post
As already cited before people waste (in the USA) about 1/3 of the food they purchase. So even when they do have to pay for it, people take and waste more then they need or even just eat.
That what i say, when people pay for it they waste but in a world of no money you see things differently. In food banks when it is free people don't take more than they need.
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Old 9th August 2021, 07:51 AM   #3276
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This is nonsense. Absolute gibberish.


Address peoples points Gaetan don't just handwave them away.
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Old 9th August 2021, 12:13 PM   #3277
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
That what i say, when people pay for it they waste but in a world of no money you see things differently. In food banks when it is free people don't take more than they need.
So in Gaetan-Land the Tragedy of the Commons has been solved! Without actually addressing it! Magic!

Would you be so kind as to address the questions asked by MarkCorrigan, and stop being ever so rude?

Edit - It's also clear that you don't know how food banks work.

Last edited by Leftus; 9th August 2021 at 12:23 PM.
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Old 9th August 2021, 12:22 PM   #3278
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Originally Posted by Gaetan View Post
In food banks when it is free people don't take more than they need.
So the future of society you want is food banks.
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Old 9th August 2021, 12:45 PM   #3279
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Originally Posted by Jack by the hedge View Post
So the future of society you want is food banks.
I wonder if Gaetan knows that food banks are rich in highly processed foodstuff and not so much in fresh produce? And currently in Covid-land, it's mostly here is a box of foodstuff, next customer.

Don't worry, your master will provide you with your daily rations, if your work is satisfactory.
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Old 9th August 2021, 01:22 PM   #3280
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Originally Posted by Jack by the hedge View Post
So the future of society you want is food banks.
Off course, groceries will be food banks where people will take what they need
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