ISF Logo   IS Forum
Forum Index Register Members List Events Mark Forums Read Help

Go Back   International Skeptics Forum » General Topics » USA Politics
 


Welcome to the International Skeptics Forum, where we discuss skepticism, critical thinking, the paranormal and science in a friendly but lively way. You are currently viewing the forum as a guest, which means you are missing out on discussing matters that are of interest to you. Please consider registering so you can gain full use of the forum features and interact with other Members. Registration is simple, fast and free! Click here to register today.
Tags Coronavirus

Closed Thread
Old 19th April 2020, 10:14 AM   #401
johnny karate
... and your little dog too.
 
johnny karate's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 12,941
Originally Posted by lomiller View Post
The only way he could be completely innocent of the of collusion with Russia is if he was too incompetent to be in charge of an election campaign in the first place.
It’s currently being argued that Trump had no responsibility in overseeing what his own appointees to federal agencies are doing, so this line of thought is not too farfetched.

In a saner world, Trump’s “I don’t take any responsibility” proclamation would have effectively ended his presidency.

Instead, it’s become a rallying cry.

It’s becoming more and more clear that Trump and his supporters don’t view him as anything more than an avatar of their flailing and misplaced anger.

They certainly don’t expect him to fulfill the duties of the office of the president.

All this just further demonstrates that Trump supporters have no principles and no agenda other than to lash out at their perceived enemies and inflict as much pain and damage as possible, regardless of the consequences.
johnny karate is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 19th April 2020, 10:17 AM   #402
Meadmaker
Penultimate Amazing
 
Meadmaker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 21,904
Originally Posted by lomiller View Post
This sounds like you are floating a conspiracy theory. Do you have evidence the CDC his this information from it's director or that he failed to pass this along to the Trump administration? This seams really unlikely given the circumstances.


It wouldn't matter anyway, TBH, as this would be just another example of Trump and the people he appointed being too incompetent to run the organizations they were in charge of. A competent president would have been demanding regular updates.
It strikes me as fairly likely, especially given what you say in the second paragraph. I can easily imagine doctors in the field saying, "These tests don't work." Bureaucrats at the CDC saying, "Bah. They just must not be using them right." and Trump's team saying, "Testing is covered. We're doing a great job." and never asking any follow up questions.

Incompetence from top to bottom, or at least from top to middle.
Meadmaker is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 19th April 2020, 10:41 AM   #403
Squeegee Beckenheim
Penultimate Amazing
 
Squeegee Beckenheim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 28,886
FEMA have reportedly awarded a $55m contract to supply N95 masks to a bankrupt military tactical training company with 0 employees and no experience in making or supplying medical equipment. Mask manufacturers 3M get paid $0.63 per mask. This company is allegedly being paid $5.50.
__________________
I don't trust atoms. They make up everything.
Squeegee Beckenheim is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 19th April 2020, 10:59 AM   #404
newyorkguy
Penultimate Amazing
 
newyorkguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: NY
Posts: 10,962
This is from the Dallas Morning News site, reporting on Texas governor Abbott's plan to begin loosening restrictions.
Quote:
The number of newly reported cases in Texas continue to spike and dip each day, but have yet not shown a continued downward trend. Over 960 new positive tests were reported on Thursday, up from the 800 reported a day earlier, according to state data. Not quite 160,000 Texans have been tested — just more than half of 1% of the state’s population of 28.9 million people. Texas ranks very low among states in coronavirus testing per capital...Link

Cases are not yet showing a continued downward trend but Abbott made the claim his state has 'corraled' the virus.

Quote:
“We have demonstrated we can corral the coronavirus,” Abbott said. Asked if reopening as he proposes will be safe, with such a low rate of testing, Abbott replied, “Testing will be going up quite a bit.” Citing recent talks with the White House, he said Texans can expect “a massive amount of testing capability coming to Texas by late April or early May.”

Public health officials have warned that pulling back on restrictions too soon could prompt another wave of infections. “We have to proceed cautiously,” said John Carlo, a physician who is chief executive of Prism Health North Texas and former medical director for the Dallas County health department. “We have to be prepared if something happens to shut back down if the circumstances require us to.”
Glad I don't live in Texas.
newyorkguy is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 19th April 2020, 11:10 AM   #405
Skeptic Ginger
Nasty Woman
 
Skeptic Ginger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 81,586
Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim View Post
Tactical training company smacks of Erik Prince's involvement.
__________________
Privatize the profits and socialize the losses. It's the American way. That's how Mnuchin got rich. Worse, he did it on the backs of elderly people who had been conned into reverse mortgages. Mnuchin paid zero, took on the debt then taxpayers bailed him out.

Space Force.
Because feeding poor people is socialism.
Skeptic Ginger is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 19th April 2020, 11:19 AM   #406
Stacyhs
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: United States
Posts: 13,780
Originally Posted by Lurch View Post
Cult leader and Trump supporters really believe in the infallibility of their Chosen One, that the Leader has ultimate Power, but that he be always absolved of responsibility. It's *always* an underling who who is lax, or incompetent, or a wrecker.

The buck *never* stops at the top.
One of Trump's worst traits (and there are so many) is his inability to accept any responsibility for anything that is not positive for him. He blames everyone and everything else. This is a direct result of his narcissism personality disorder; he cannot be wrong because that would mean he isn't 'perfect'


Quote:
A trademark of a narcissistic personality disorder or even a person with a high number of narcissistic traits is this strange problem with accountability. Not only do narcissists lack the ability to give and truly mean empathy, but they consistently blame others for their own mistakes and feelings and have an uncanny way of turning things around and making it someone else’s problem. You are the crazy one, not them. You are at fault, not them. If you show them clear evidence of something they have done, they will deny it or say they don’t remember it. They will say you took it wrong and will rewrite the narrative of what they meant. In this process, they are not owning anything about it. You just got it wrong.


Why do they do this? Narcissists, although covering up with grandiosity, actually are self-loathing, fragile people who do not have a solid sense of self to rely on.
https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/b...in-narcissists

We have seen Trump do this over and over again. For example, a few days ago a reporter quoted Trump. Trump immediately denied having said it despite there being video of him saying it.

Last edited by Stacyhs; 19th April 2020 at 11:21 AM.
Stacyhs is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 19th April 2020, 11:56 AM   #407
slyjoe
Graduate Poster
 
slyjoe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Near Harmonica Virgins, AZ
Posts: 1,987
Originally Posted by newyorkguy View Post
This is from the Dallas Morning News site, reporting on Texas governor Abbott's plan to begin loosening restrictions.



Cases are not yet showing a continued downward trend but Abbott made the claim his state has 'corraled' the virus.



Glad I don't live in Texas.
Doesn't matter. The Texas border won't stop the spread of the virus.

Sorry.
__________________
"You have done nothing to demonstrate an understanding of scientific methodology or modern skepticism, both of which are, by necessity, driven by the facts and evidence, not by preconceptions, and both of which are strengthened by, and rely upon, change." - Arkan Wolfshade
slyjoe is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 19th April 2020, 12:01 PM   #408
Bob001
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: US of A
Posts: 10,809
Another guide to Trump's catastrophic record of program and funding cuts going back pretty much to the day he was inaugurated.
Quote:
It was common knowledge before Trump took office that an infectious outbreak of some kind was likely to occur during his presidency; there were concerns that he wasn’t up to the task because of his ignorance of the subject and indifference to getting up to speed with this crucial part of his job.

According to Peter Nicholas of the Atlantic, “When a senior White House aide would brief President Donald Trump in 2018 about an Ebola-virus outbreak in central Africa, it was plainly evident that hardships roiling a far-flung part of the world didn’t command his attention. He was zoning out. ‘It was like talking to a wall,’ a person familiar with the matter told me.” (1)
https://www.rawstory.com/2020/04/thi...made-disaster/
Bob001 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 19th April 2020, 01:07 PM   #409
Stacyhs
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: United States
Posts: 13,780
Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
Another guide to Trump's catastrophic record of program and funding cuts going back pretty much to the day he was inaugurated.
Quote:
Quote:
It was common knowledge before Trump took office that an infectious outbreak of some kind was likely to occur during his presidency; there were concerns that he wasn’t up to the task because of his ignorance of the subject and indifference to getting up to speed with this crucial part of his job.
According to Peter Nicholas of the Atlantic, “When a senior White House aide would brief President Donald Trump in 2018 about an Ebola-virus outbreak in central Africa, it was plainly evident that hardships roiling a far-flung part of the world didn’t command his attention. He was zoning out. ‘It was like talking to a wall,’ a person familiar with the matter told me.” (1)

https://www.rawstory.com/2020/04/thi...made-disaster/
Of course. Africa is just full of ****hole countries. Why would The Donald care what happens there? And they can't vote for him anyway.
Stacyhs is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 19th April 2020, 01:11 PM   #410
Skeptic Ginger
Nasty Woman
 
Skeptic Ginger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 81,586
Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
Another guide to Trump's catastrophic record of program and funding cuts going back pretty much to the day he was inaugurated.

https://www.rawstory.com/2020/04/thi...made-disaster/
Yes and before that...

Vox: Trump is facing a coronavirus threat. Let’s look back at how he talked about Ebola. None of it is reassuring.
Quote:
In the summer and fall of 2014 — less than a year before he officially launched his presidential bid — Donald Trump posted about 100 mostly panicked tweets about the Ebola virus. Many of them attacked then-President Obama for his handling of the outbreak, and some of them went as far as to accuse the Centers for Disease Control (CDC) of lying about what was going on....

The next day, Trump demanded that the health workers not be brought back to the US — “Stop the EBOLA patients from entering the U.S. Treat them, at the highest level, over there. THE UNITED STATES HAS ENOUGH PROBLEMS!” he wrote — and followed that up by insisting that they “must suffer the consequences” for going to Africa in the first place.
__________________
Privatize the profits and socialize the losses. It's the American way. That's how Mnuchin got rich. Worse, he did it on the backs of elderly people who had been conned into reverse mortgages. Mnuchin paid zero, took on the debt then taxpayers bailed him out.

Space Force.
Because feeding poor people is socialism.
Skeptic Ginger is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 19th April 2020, 05:07 PM   #411
Stacyhs
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: United States
Posts: 13,780
Developing news on TX abortion ban during pandemic and largely based on the reasons some brought up in this thread:

Quote:
A federal judge blocked parts of Texas' temporary abortion ban on Thursday evening, allowing some procedures to resume despite a prior appeals court decision to uphold the ban amid the coronavirus pandemic. For more than two weeks, the vast majority of abortion services in Texas have been mostly unavailable, marking the first time the procedure has been not legally accessible in a U.S. state for nearly 50 years.


Beginning immediately, clinics in Texas can offer medication abortion, a pregnancy termination method administered by pill and available to patients up to 10 weeks into their pregnancy. Additionally, patients who would be 18 weeks into a pregnancy by April 22 can also legally receive an abortion, because they would be outside the state's gestational limit for the procedure when the ban is set to be lifted.

"A ban within a limited period becomes a total ban when that period expires. As a minimum, this is an undue burden on a woman's right to a previability abortion," wrote Judge Lee Yaekel, a George W. Bush appointee, in his decision granting a narrow temporary restraining order to Planned Parenthood, the Center for Reproductive Rights and the Lawyering Project.
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/texas-a...federal-judge/
Stacyhs is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 19th April 2020, 05:38 PM   #412
Polaris
Penultimate Amazing
 
Polaris's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 11,385
Originally Posted by newyorkguy View Post
This is from the Dallas Morning News site, reporting on Texas governor Abbott's plan to begin loosening restrictions.



Cases are not yet showing a continued downward trend but Abbott made the claim his state has 'corraled' the virus.



Glad I don't live in Texas.
I moved from Dallas to Seattle last August, and when this first popped up in Washington I chalked it up to more of my terrible luck that I would relocate into ground zero for a pandemic as far as the US goes. Now I'm glad this is where I chose. We have the same idiots not taking it seriously, same as elsewhere, but at least we have responsible, competent people at the top.

Except for the hot sauce options, there's nothing I miss about Texas. The GOP government there was already trying to kill be before this all started!
__________________
"There's vastly more truth to be found in rocks than in holy books. Rocks are far superior, in fact, because you can DEMONSTRATE the truth found in rocks. Plus, they're pretty. Holy books are just heavy." - Dinwar

"Let your ears hear this beautiful song that's hiding underneath the sound," Ed Kowalczyk.
Polaris is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 19th April 2020, 05:42 PM   #413
Stacyhs
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: United States
Posts: 13,780
The only place in TX I could possibly live would be Austin. It's an island of blue surrounded by the Red Sea. But I can't take the hot summers. Give me the Great Northwest anytime.
Stacyhs is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 19th April 2020, 05:56 PM   #414
Regnad Kcin
Philosopher
 
Regnad Kcin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: New York
Posts: 9,865
Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim View Post
Can we please focus on the real criminal issue amidst all of the currently ongoing calamity: her emails.
__________________
My heros are Alex Zanardi and Evelyn Glennie.
Regnad Kcin is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 19th April 2020, 06:40 PM   #415
AnonyMoose
Muse
 
AnonyMoose's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Land of the Frozen Chosen
Posts: 822
So Texas will be the next covid hotspot?

I don't get it, why is the GOP so determined to kill off it's voting base?
__________________
"Some mornings it's just not worth chewing through the leather straps." ~ Emo Phillips
AnonyMoose is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 19th April 2020, 06:42 PM   #416
Stacyhs
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: United States
Posts: 13,780
Originally Posted by Regnad Kcin View Post
Can we please focus on the real criminal issue amidst all of the currently ongoing calamity: her emails.
Benghazi! Whitewater! Vince Foster! Lock her up!
Stacyhs is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 19th April 2020, 07:48 PM   #417
newyorkguy
Penultimate Amazing
 
newyorkguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: NY
Posts: 10,962
Finally -- finally! -- some Republicans are speaking up. Showing some integrity.
Quote:
Maryland Gov. Larry Hogan, a Republican, told CNN's "State of the Union" his state is "doing everything we possibly can to reopen in a safe manner," but "I don’t think it’s helpful to encourage demonstrations and encourage people to go against the president’s own policy. The president's policy says you can't start to reopen under his plan until you have declining numbers for 14 days, which those states and my state do not have," he said. "So then to go encourage people to go protest the plan you just made recommendations on Thursday — it just doesn't make any sense. We're sending completely conflicting messages out to the governors and to the people as if we should ignore federal policy and federal recommendations." Link
newyorkguy is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 19th April 2020, 07:59 PM   #418
Stacyhs
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: United States
Posts: 13,780
Originally Posted by newyorkguy View Post
Finally -- finally! -- some Republicans are speaking up. Showing some integrity.
Of course it doesn't make any sense but that won't deter Trump supporters/apologists. They just make up excuses why Trump is right.
Stacyhs is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 19th April 2020, 08:16 PM   #419
Skeptic Ginger
Nasty Woman
 
Skeptic Ginger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 81,586
Originally Posted by AnonyMoose View Post
So Texas will be the next covid hotspot?

I don't get it, why is the GOP so determined to kill off it's voting base?
Trump isn't sophisticated enough to think that through. Besides in his fantasy world he simply denies the pandemic is real. He probably fluctuates between imagining himself to be the great fixer and imagining the pandemic has already passed.
__________________
Privatize the profits and socialize the losses. It's the American way. That's how Mnuchin got rich. Worse, he did it on the backs of elderly people who had been conned into reverse mortgages. Mnuchin paid zero, took on the debt then taxpayers bailed him out.

Space Force.
Because feeding poor people is socialism.
Skeptic Ginger is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 20th April 2020, 04:02 AM   #420
Captain_Swoop
Penultimate Amazing
 
Captain_Swoop's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 26,278
Oil crashes below $19, falling to an 18-year low

Quote:
President Donald Trump's victory lap for convincing Russia and Saudi Arabia to cut production looks awfully premature.
US oil prices plunged another 8% Friday, finishing at a fresh 18-year low of $18.27 a barrel. At one point, crude dropped to $17.33 a barrel -- the weakest price since November 2001.
The accelerating crash in the oil market reflects a realization that the record-setting OPEC+ output cuts aren't nearly enough to offset the epic collapse in demand caused by the coronavirus crisis.
Quote:
Barrels have been piling up up at an unprecedented pace, raising the risk the world will soon run out of space to store it all. The number of oil barrels in commercial storage spiked in the latest week by the most on record, a US Energy Information Administration report earlier this week showed.
"At that pace, storage capacity will be full in the not too distant future," said Fitzmaurice.
https://edition.cnn.com/2020/04/17/b...ump/index.html

Last edited by Captain_Swoop; 20th April 2020 at 04:03 AM.
Captain_Swoop is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 20th April 2020, 04:19 AM   #421
a_unique_person
Director of Hatcheries and Conditioning
 
a_unique_person's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Waiting for the pod bay door to open.
Posts: 42,458
Originally Posted by slyjoe View Post
Doesn't matter. The Texas border won't stop the spread of the virus.

Sorry.

They just have to build more corrals.
__________________
Continually pushing the boundaries of mediocrity.
Everything is possible, but not everything is probable.
“Perception is real, but the truth is not.” - Imelda Marcos
a_unique_person is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 20th April 2020, 06:01 AM   #422
Segnosaur
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 15,664
Originally Posted by slyjoe View Post
Doesn't matter. The Texas border won't stop the spread of the virus.



Sorry.
Maybe we can reroute Trump's border wall to go along the northern border of Texas instead of the southern border

Sent from my LM-X320 using Tapatalk
__________________
Trust me, I know what I'm doing. - Sledgehammer

I'm Mary Poppin's Y'all! - Yondu

We are Groot - Groot
Segnosaur is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 20th April 2020, 06:05 AM   #423
newyorkguy
Penultimate Amazing
 
newyorkguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: NY
Posts: 10,962
From the Dallas Morning News today:
Quote:
Dallas County hit an average of 100 new cases per day for the first time since the outbreak began, fueled by single-day highs on Friday and Saturday. At the same time, Collin and Denton both continued their decline in averge daily cases. Denton County cautions that the low number of cases over the weekend is likely due to a database update and warns that new cases could rise later this week. Link
This is from the Texas Tribune:
Quote:
State data indicates that Donley County in the Panhandle has the highest coronavirus infection rate in Texas. But county Judge John Howard — also the only local doctor — believes that's because he's testing far more than other counties.

Ray Powell, judge of Donley’s neighbor to the south, said, “If we have anyone in Hall County with that virus, we don’t know it.” A hospital in Hall County went bankrupt in 2002, and the county’s health clinic closed two years ago when the nurse practitioner running it retired. A couple of years ago, when Powell’s wife was diagnosed with lung cancer, they had to travel 90 miles each way to Amarillo for appointments. “So if anybody gets tested, they have to leave the county to do it,” he said. “We’re just sitting here wondering — do we have any running around? Surely we do because of our neighbor, Donley County.” Link
One problem in Texas is, they are only testing a very small number of persons. Less than one percent. Health officials have cautioned, the more testing a state does, the higher the numbers are going to be. But in Texas, the governor is already moving to open businesses back up. The attitude seems to be, 'C'mon. lets roll the dice. I feel lucky!'
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Texas cases.jpg (48.6 KB, 5 views)
newyorkguy is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 20th April 2020, 06:09 AM   #424
Segnosaur
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 15,664
Originally Posted by AnonyMoose View Post

I don't get it, why is the GOP so determined to kill off it's voting base?
Actually I am not so sure that is the case...

While the virus does tent to be dangerous to older persons (a demographic that often leans Republican), it also seems to hit minorities very hard too (who usually favour democrats), partly because they are often stuck in urban areas (where virus transmission is more common) and have less access to health care.


Not sure if anyone has done any sort of analysis yet to see which party will see more of its voters die because of the virus but at this point don't assume it will be the Republicans.



Sent from my LM-X320 using Tapatalk
__________________
Trust me, I know what I'm doing. - Sledgehammer

I'm Mary Poppin's Y'all! - Yondu

We are Groot - Groot
Segnosaur is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 20th April 2020, 07:00 AM   #425
newyorkguy
Penultimate Amazing
 
newyorkguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: NY
Posts: 10,962
Infowars' Alex Jones appeared at the Reopen Texas rally Saturday at the state capitol.
Quote:
The conspiracy theorist Alex Jones was pictured shaking hands with protesters at a Texas rally against social distancing measures on Saturday...At the Texas rally against stay-at-home orders attended by Jones on Saturday, The New York Times reported that some protesters shook hands, hugged or otherwise broke social distancing rules aimed at curbing the spread of COVID-19.

It was also reported that Alex Jones compared stay-at-home orders to the actions of Nazis as he called the COVID-19 pandemic shutdowns a "21st Century war. Don't let them tell you, like the Nazis did, that you are not essential," Jones told protesters. Link
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Put 'er there pardner.jpg (117.0 KB, 6 views)

Last edited by newyorkguy; 20th April 2020 at 07:57 AM.
newyorkguy is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 20th April 2020, 07:13 AM   #426
Craig4
Penultimate Amazing
 
Craig4's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Alexandria, VA Home to the Deep State.
Posts: 20,319
Originally Posted by newyorkguy View Post
Finally -- finally! -- some Republicans are speaking up. Showing some integrity.
I just moved to Maryland. I don't give a flying **** what Trump has to say but I listen to Larry Hogan. We're lucky to have him as governor right now.
__________________
A MAGA hat = a Swastika arm band. A vote for Trump is a vote for treason.
Craig4 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 20th April 2020, 07:14 AM   #427
Beerina
Sarcastic Conqueror of Notions
 
Beerina's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 29,969
Accusing the other side of being like Nazis is old hat 'round these here parts.
__________________
"Great innovations should not be forced [by way of] slender majorities." - Thomas Jefferson

The government should nationalize it! Socialized, single-payer video game development and sales now! More, cheaper, better games, right? Right?
Beerina is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 20th April 2020, 07:22 AM   #428
crescent
Illuminator
 
crescent's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Colorado
Posts: 3,565
Originally Posted by newyorkguy View Post
Finally -- finally! -- some Republicans are speaking up. Showing some integrity.

Quote:
Maryland Gov. Larry Hogan, a Republican, told CNN's "State of the Union" his state is "doing everything we possibly can to reopen in a safe manner," but "I don’t think it’s helpful to encourage demonstrations and encourage people to go against the president’s own policy. The president's policy says you can't start to reopen under his plan until you have declining numbers for 14 days, which those states and my state do not have," he said. "So then to go encourage people to go protest the plan you just made recommendations on Thursday — it just doesn't make any sense. We're sending completely conflicting messages out to the governors and to the people as if we should ignore federal policy and federal recommendations." Link


Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
Of course it doesn't make any sense but that won't deter Trump supporters/apologists. They just make up excuses why Trump is right.
My guess is that if you were to question any of the protesters by pointing out that they were protesting against the President's plan, they they would stop protesting for a few moments to defend the plan and accuse libs of being the ones who oppose the plan. They would be supporting the president by doing this.

Then go back, within moments, to opposing the President's plan and blaming the existence of the plan on the libs. They would also be supporting the president by doing this.

I've been seeing this behavior frequently on social media. People contradict themselves within moments and then flip back again. Because we have a president who issues plans and then tweets out support for opposition to his plans.

Regardless of what position one supports on most any issue regarding the virus, one can find statements from Trump or his office or direct subordinates both supporting and opposing that position.

The catch being that the more reasonable positions are either not presented by Trump himself (but instead delivered through written statements or by spokespeople) or are presented by Trump reading out statements verbatim. This statements that seem to most directly contradict facts on the ground and to encourage irresponsible behavior tend to be those that he ad-libs in front of of the press or puts out on twitter.
crescent is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 20th April 2020, 07:36 AM   #429
newyorkguy
Penultimate Amazing
 
newyorkguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: NY
Posts: 10,962
Originally Posted by Beerina View Post
Accusing the other side of being like Nazis is old hat 'round these here parts.
And apparently in Michigan too.

What I don't get is, if people want to protest a governor's stay-at-home orders, they have that right. Heck, if they want to protest school books that teach kids the Earth is round instead of flat, they have the right to do that too. The only people that would argue demonstrations shouldn't be allowed are, ironically, probably the people demonstrating. You know, if libtards were the ones demonstrating.

But why would you bring a rifle with you?
Attached Images
File Type: jpeg Heil Witmer.jpeg (50.3 KB, 11 views)
newyorkguy is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 20th April 2020, 07:46 AM   #430
Trebuchet
Penultimate Amazing
 
Trebuchet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Port Townsend, Washington
Posts: 27,715
Originally Posted by newyorkguy View Post
And apparently in Michigan too.

What I don't get is, if people want to protest a governor's stay-at-home orders, they have that right. Heck, if they want to protest school books that teach kids the Earth is round instead of flat, they have the right to do that too. The only people that would argue demonstrations shouldn't be allowed are, ironically, probably the people demonstrating. You know, if libtards were the ones demonstrating.

But why would you bring a rifle with you?
Because you're a colossal *******. I did see someone yesterday mocking the one guy's purple magazine.
__________________
Cum catapultae proscribeantur tum soli proscripti catapultas habeant.
Trebuchet is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 20th April 2020, 07:49 AM   #431
thaiboxerken
Penultimate Amazing
 
thaiboxerken's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 31,014
Originally Posted by newyorkguy View Post

But why would you bring a rifle with you?
I bet if they were mostly black people doing this, it would be a very different response.
__________________
1. He'd never do that. 2. Okay but he's not currently doing it. 3. Okay but he's not currently technically doing it. 4. Okay but everyone does it. 5. He's doing it, we can't stop him, no point in complaining about it. 6. We all knew he was going to do it which... makes it okay somehow. 7. It's perfectly fine that's he's doing it.
thaiboxerken is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 20th April 2020, 07:52 AM   #432
pgwenthold
Suspended
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 19,097
Originally Posted by thaiboxerken View Post
I bet if they were mostly black people doing this, it would be a very different response.
I was just going to say that.

Imagine it was crowds of black people protesting the stay at home orders, carrying rifles?

Yeah, the Proud Boys would be right there with them, right?
pgwenthold is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 20th April 2020, 07:53 AM   #433
newyorkguy
Penultimate Amazing
 
newyorkguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: NY
Posts: 10,962
The image below is the protest at the Michigan statehouse last Wednesday. (The local NBC news affilaite reported, at one point the protesters were chanting, "Lock her up," meaning Gov. Whitmer.) The demonstration's organizers had also requested people stay in their cars but many -- see below -- refused to comply.

One guy looks like he's got two rifles. And a handgun!
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Damn right.jpg (106.2 KB, 15 views)
newyorkguy is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 20th April 2020, 08:10 AM   #434
johnny karate
... and your little dog too.
 
johnny karate's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 12,941
Originally Posted by thaiboxerken View Post
I bet if they were mostly black people doing this, it would be a very different response.
There’s actually no need for speculation.

We have the Republican response to the Black Lives Matter protests to look back on. I’m pretty sure the word “terrorist” got thrown around.
johnny karate is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 20th April 2020, 08:24 AM   #435
Squeegee Beckenheim
Penultimate Amazing
 
Squeegee Beckenheim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 28,886
Physician explains how the surgery's entire staff has had to be furloughed because social distancing has seen income drop and they have had no financial help from the government
__________________
I don't trust atoms. They make up everything.
Squeegee Beckenheim is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 20th April 2020, 08:49 AM   #436
johnny karate
... and your little dog too.
 
johnny karate's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 12,941
Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim View Post
Hopefully, a Trump supporter will explain to him that he needs to go to China.
johnny karate is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 20th April 2020, 09:10 AM   #437
Giordano
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 17,275
Originally Posted by johnny karate View Post
It’s currently being argued that Trump had no responsibility in overseeing what his own appointees to federal agencies are doing, so this line of thought is not too farfetched.

In a saner world, Trump’s “I don’t take any responsibility” proclamation would have effectively ended his presidency.

Instead, it’s become a rallying cry.

It’s becoming more and more clear that Trump and his supporters don’t view him as anything more than an avatar of their flailing and misplaced anger.

They certainly don’t expect him to fulfill the duties of the office of the president.

All this just further demonstrates that Trump supporters have no principles and no agenda other than to lash out at their perceived enemies and inflict as much pain and damage as possible, regardless of the consequences.
Insightful point! He can’t fail as President because fulfilling that role is not what they expect of him. How could he be responsible for the failures of the Federal government in the Covid-19 outbreak, no matter how inept he or his appointees have been? He is there to fulfill their revenge fantasies; nothing else.
Giordano is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 20th April 2020, 09:53 AM   #438
Bogative
Graduate Poster
 
Bogative's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 1,355
Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
This is a typical way to debate dishonestly: nitpick on something and dismiss the whole point.
Again, you said Trump banned test kits from foreign countries. That is a lie.

Quote:
Technically, yes Trump banned the use of the tests. By ordering or stopping the FDA from approving private and outside tests, no one in healthcare could use them. In this country FDA approval for medical tests is required.

He also made sure private companies' tests were not FDA approved for use until the complaining about test shortages became too public for his liking.
No. Non-FDA approved test kits were "banned" long before Trump ever showed up. All the way back to 20 04. 2004 was under Bush, which should make you happy. Not only does it prove Trump wrong about the FDA regulations being created under Obama, you can go back to blaming the regulations on a Republican.

Quote:
They could have overridden their usual processes sooner like they eventually did.

So who ordered that change?
See above.

Quote:
And why wasn't the emergency provision used sooner?
That is a very good question. I plan on waiting for the answer before pointing a finger of blame.

Quote:
The article says the WHO test wasn't offered. Well neither was it asked for when it could have been. That would have taken an action by Trump.
Any evidence to back up your assertion that it would've taken action by Trump?

Quote:
It would be very foolish to think these idiots installed by Trump aren't also doing his bidding.
Doing the bidding of the president is part of the job. Gonna need some evidence that it was harmful in any way.
Bogative is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 20th April 2020, 10:11 AM   #439
Skeptic Ginger
Nasty Woman
 
Skeptic Ginger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 81,586
Originally Posted by Bogative View Post
Again, you said Trump banned test kits from foreign countries. That is a lie.

No. Non-FDA approved test kits were "banned" long before Trump ever showed up. All the way back to 20 04. 2004 was under Bush, which should make you happy. Not only does it prove Trump wrong about the FDA regulations being created under Obama, you can go back to blaming the regulations on a Republican.

See above.

That is a very good question. I plan on waiting for the answer before pointing a finger of blame.

Any evidence to back up your assertion that it would've taken action by Trump?

Doing the bidding of the president is part of the job. Gonna need some evidence that it was harmful in any way.
Oh stop. You're not convincing anyone. We can all see just how Trump facilitated the delays that have cost lives.

You don't think he's responsible, that's your problem.

Will no one rid me of this turbulent priest?
__________________
Privatize the profits and socialize the losses. It's the American way. That's how Mnuchin got rich. Worse, he did it on the backs of elderly people who had been conned into reverse mortgages. Mnuchin paid zero, took on the debt then taxpayers bailed him out.

Space Force.
Because feeding poor people is socialism.

Last edited by Skeptic Ginger; 20th April 2020 at 10:13 AM.
Skeptic Ginger is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Old 20th April 2020, 10:14 AM   #440
Stacyhs
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: United States
Posts: 13,780
I saw many signs in the PA demonstrations protesting not only against the lockdown, but expressing homophobic sentiments like 'No gay marriage' and"Obey Jesus" in the same group. Other signs accused the government of faking the Covid 19 death statistics and calling the lockdown 'fascist'. Gun rights were also a topic with the usual flag waving and pro-Trump signs. “Freedom isn’t free if vaccine mandated” and “Wolf is a dictator This is communism” signs were also present. As one reporter put it "This is more like a Trump campaign rally". Few were wearing masks and there was little to no distancing.

And they wonder why I think they're stupid.
Stacyhs is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Back to Top
Closed Thread

International Skeptics Forum » General Topics » USA Politics

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 03:15 PM.
Powered by vBulletin. Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

This forum began as part of the James Randi Education Foundation (JREF). However, the forum now exists as
an independent entity with no affiliation with or endorsement by the JREF, including the section in reference to "JREF" topics.

Disclaimer: Messages posted in the Forum are solely the opinion of their authors.