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Tags Brilliant Light Power , free energy , Randell Mills

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Old 11th January 2017, 11:13 AM   #361
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Originally Posted by halleyscomet View Post
We could redirect the reverse ionized hydrinos through the rear deflector dish, but that could cause a tachyon burst that could cause the spontaneous decay of local chronons.
Nothing a baryon sweep couldn't solve.
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Old 11th January 2017, 11:18 AM   #362
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Originally Posted by abaddon View Post
Mills first established his company in 1991, over 25 years ago. Ever since, the cycle just repeats. Wild claim, sucker investors, claim a better version, do nothing. Rinse, lather, repeat. Last I checked, this strategy realised 60 odd million from gullible investors just like the now defunct Steorn fiasco.

I don't see how this malarkey is any different from the other, or any of the other "take the money and run" schemes. Like Steorn, milk it for all the money the marks are willing to chuck in, declare bankruptcy and run away with the loot all the while blaming any convenient scapegoat.
I wonder how deep is michaelsuede in all this ... feigned hype and admiration can't hide the careful lay-out of his posting here. When he says they don't need money I think they may need some smoke screen to prevent the owners of previous money from suing.
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Old 11th January 2017, 11:26 AM   #363
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Originally Posted by Giordano View Post
In thinking about economics rather than physics, the discussions of how cheap these devices will be is odd too. If one had produced such a wondrous device, why price it so, so far below the current competition?

It's not that cheap. The initial prototype build-out will cost about 25 grand to do. It only becomes cheap once mass production induces economy of scale.

Initially you will only be able to lease the units, and they will be tied via the internet to BrLPs offices, where they can monitor the system status and power production.

The systems will be installed and maintained by third party distributors, much like the solar industry works today. I'm sure those guys don't work for free either.

Believe me, BrLP isn't going to be giving these things away for free. They will most likely be the world's first trillion dollar company.

In the long run we will see energy prices and unit costs drop down to next to nothing, where units are available for full purchase and have the same size and cost as a small AC unit does today.
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Old 11th January 2017, 11:28 AM   #364
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Originally Posted by michaelsuede View Post
They will most likely be the world's first trillion dollar company.
More Marketin'eese and snake oil.
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Old 11th January 2017, 11:32 AM   #365
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Originally Posted by Porpoise of Life View Post
I find really hard to believe the OP genuinely believes in this project.


Go read this post and then come back here and say all that again.
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Old 11th January 2017, 11:32 AM   #366
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Originally Posted by jrhowell View Post
If such a device actually worked it would have been possible long ago to produce, as a proof of concept, a device that unattached to anything continuously produced large amounts of heat over a period of weeks. It would be obvious that something inexplicable was going on. Instead we get experiments that run very short times and are documented to produce only a tiny amount supposed excess heat that requires calorimetry to detect. The conclusion is obvious.

The discussion of a supposed device that produces enormous amounts of waste heat is laughable. It was mentioned that sufficient insulation would solve this problem when it would obviously only make things much worse. If heat produced exceeds heat removed then temperature will rise. Eventually the device will just melt. What it would actually need is big honking radiators or immersion in flowing water to remove the excess heat as fast as possible.

(Personally I think Steorn was more entertaining.)
Sorry. The bleevers will bleev. It is an article of faith. If you, I or anyone else had such an energy source, it would be get patent and market the mother-loving hell out of it. But no, these lunatics propagate a continuous bait and switch ad infinitum just to sucker in the "marks"..

Oddly, (or perhaps not), it has a cycle all of it's own, but instantly recognisable.

1. Make wild claim.
2. Claim working model.
3. Suck in the gullible.
4. Claim it didn't work because reasons.
5. Hide for about 4 years.
6. Repeat the claims to garner new gullible marks.

People make money out of it.

I refer to it as the sales balaclava terrorism. Many times over my career, I have had to rein in sales lunatics making unreasonable claims. I see this as no different.

Wild claim, no evidence.
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Old 11th January 2017, 11:35 AM   #367
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Originally Posted by Horatius View Post
Go read this post and then come back here and say all that again.
Ah, so he's extremely gullible and susceptible to conspiratorial thinking.
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Old 11th January 2017, 11:41 AM   #368
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Originally Posted by abaddon View Post
If you, I or anyone else had such an energy source, it would be get patent and market the mother-loving hell out of it.


This now is actually an interesting question: Lets say you did manage to produce some new source of energy which breaks the laws of physics as currently understood.

What would it take to get a patent for that device or process? The fact that it apparently breaks the laws of physics would mean that any reasonable analysis of the patent application (being merely a document, and not a working physical model, after all) would conclude that the device was inoperable as described, and thus not patentable.

How would one go about securing a patent in that case?


I know exactly how I would do it, but I wonder if certain others in this thread will know.
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Old 11th January 2017, 11:46 AM   #369
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Originally Posted by halleyscomet View Post
Ah, so he's extremely gullible and susceptible to conspiratorial thinking.
Yup. The very of opening an Adobe 1.3 doc in Illustrator would reveal layers which the PDF cannot possibly support but which Illustrator imposes on a non native format is utter nonsense.

We have been over this ploppery ad infinitum.

And it really matters not a whit in any event. In a week or so, Obama will be a former president and Mr. Tango will be incumbent president.

Sure, there will be those wingnuts who claim that Obama will declare "marshall" law and appoint himself president for life.

The same was said of Bush, both of them, and Clinton and so forth. It warrants no consideration.
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Old 11th January 2017, 11:47 AM   #370
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Originally Posted by Horatius View Post
This now is actually an interesting question: Lets say you did manage to produce some new source of energy which breaks the laws of physics as currently understood.

What would it take to get a patent for that device or process? The fact that it apparently breaks the laws of physics would mean that any reasonable analysis of the patent application (being merely a document, and not a working physical model, after all) would conclude that the device was inoperable as described, and thus not patentable.

How would one go about securing a patent in that case?


I know exactly how I would do it, but I wonder if certain others in this thread will know.
Pretty easy to do since we have patent treaties that grant reciprocity.
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Old 11th January 2017, 11:55 AM   #371
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Originally Posted by michaelsuede View Post
Pretty easy to do since we have patent treaties that grant reciprocity.
I think the answer is : You need a working prototype ready and available for the patent office (or which ever trusted university) to independently verify it works on their own.

And those patent treaty AFAIK don't protect invalid patent.

That's why software patent which do exists in the US,a re not valid in other countries where in spite of reciprocity treaties , software patent are not recognized.
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Old 11th January 2017, 11:56 AM   #372
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Originally Posted by michaelsuede View Post
Pretty easy to do since we have patent treaties that grant reciprocity.
You're answering a question which wasn't asked. The question was about patent applications which defy the laws of physics, not about patents in other countries.
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Old 11th January 2017, 11:59 AM   #373
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Originally Posted by Aepervius View Post
I think the answer is : You need a working prototype ready and available for the patent office (or which ever trusted university) to independently verify it works on their own. ......
That isn't the way patents work. They don't look at prototypes, working or otherwise. They register drawings and descriptions. I barely recognised my own invention in my patent when I first read it.
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Old 11th January 2017, 12:00 PM   #374
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I would take it to General Electric and get a licensing deal that nade me huge amounts of money.
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Old 11th January 2017, 12:01 PM   #375
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Originally Posted by MikeG View Post
That isn't the way patents work. They don't look at prototypes, working or otherwise. They register drawings and descriptions. I barely recognised my own invention in my patent when I first read it.
In short, another reply from michaelsuede that boils down to "it's not a scam" by acting as if everything is normal and on check in spite it's obvious a scam.
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Old 11th January 2017, 12:03 PM   #376
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Originally Posted by aleCcowaN View Post
In short, another reply from michaelsuede that boils down to "it's not a scam" by acting as if everything is normal and on check in spite it's obvious a scam.
I wonder if he's invested any of his money in this insanity.
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Old 11th January 2017, 12:06 PM   #377
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Originally Posted by aleCcowaN View Post
In short, another reply from michaelsuede that boils down to "it's not a scam" by acting as if everything is normal and on check in spite it's obvious a scam.
To be fair to michaelsuede, my reply was to a post by Aepervius.
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Old 11th January 2017, 12:08 PM   #378
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Originally Posted by michaelsuede View Post
Pretty easy to do since we have patent treaties that grant reciprocity.

Please explain how this "reciprocity" works with relation to patents.
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Old 11th January 2017, 12:10 PM   #379
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Originally Posted by MikeG View Post
That isn't the way patents work. They don't look at prototypes, working or otherwise. They register drawings and descriptions. I barely recognised my own invention in my patent when I first read it.
Then you patent all single part of the machine, none of which has a claim of free energy. Since they break law of physic they should be novel enough in a way or another.

So you have not patented the whole but since you hold every single part... You still have the patent which counts.
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Old 11th January 2017, 12:11 PM   #380
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Originally Posted by Aepervius View Post
I think the answer is : You need a working prototype ready and available for the patent office (or which ever trusted university) to independently verify it works on their own.
Originally Posted by MikeG View Post
That isn't the way patents work. They don't look at prototypes, working or otherwise. They register drawings and descriptions. I barely recognised my own invention in my patent when I first read it.


A working model presented to the office likely would work, but I agree that such presentations are rare. The various patent offices just don't have the in-house resources needed for long-term testing of industrial models. While being possible, it's not the way I was thinking of.
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Old 11th January 2017, 12:13 PM   #381
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Originally Posted by Aepervius View Post
Then you patent all single part of the machine, none of which has a claim of free energy. Since they break law of physic they should be novel enough in a way or another.

So you have not patented the whole but since you hold every single part... You still have the patent which counts.


Ah, but most of the parts we see them using are, by themselves, not inventive. See the application for the TPV system I posted earlier. The only real difference between that device and BLP's current device is the source of energy.
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Old 11th January 2017, 12:14 PM   #382
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Originally Posted by Aepervius View Post
Then you patent all single part of the machine, none of which has a claim of free energy. Since they break law of physic they should be novel enough in a way or another.

So you have not patented the whole but since you hold every single part... You still have the patent which counts.
You'll enjoy paying your patents lawyer to do this for you! The searches alone will cost a fortune.

I wonder how many novel parts there are in anything these days.
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Old 11th January 2017, 12:15 PM   #383
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Originally Posted by michaelsuede View Post
Pretty easy to do since we have patent treaties that grant reciprocity.
Are you proposing that if one gets a patent in one jurisdiction, one automatically or easily gets it in the next?

You would be wrong. Been there and done that. It is a nightmare of epic proportions.
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Old 11th January 2017, 12:15 PM   #384
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Originally Posted by Horatius View Post
A working model presented to the office likely would work, but I agree that such presentations are rare. The various patent offices just don't have the in-house resources needed for long-term testing of industrial models. While being possible, it's not the way I was thinking of.
Seriously, they don't, in my experience, offer anything like this facility. They record a paper application. If you turn up with a working model, they'll tell you to go away and get a patent application drafted by a specialist.
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Old 11th January 2017, 12:20 PM   #385
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Originally Posted by MikeG View Post
To be fair to michaelsuede, my reply was to a post by Aepervius.
Which means he is increasingly finding troubles to post Nedflanderian diddle-dee-doos that make him look like having a sound voice here.

He's now more like "invest your money in BS Light Power, don't eat dairy products and Obama is a foreigner" all for similar reasons.
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Old 11th January 2017, 12:21 PM   #386
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Originally Posted by abaddon View Post
Are you proposing that if one gets a patent in one jurisdiction, one automatically or easily gets it in the next?

You would be wrong. Been there and done that. It is a nightmare of epic proportions.

Hey, don't go ruining my fun with your spoilers!


Originally Posted by MikeG View Post
Seriously, they don't, in my experience, offer anything like this facility. They record a paper application. If you turn up with a working model, they'll tell you to go away and get a patent application drafted by a specialist.

Well, yeah, if you do that as the first step! We're talking after you've filed the application, and the patent office has denied it for lack of utility (that is, it doesn't work).

I've had a few inventors actually bring in or send their devices to my office in such cases. But those were for rather small-ish items, in which the apparent utility was easy to see when you had the item in your hands.

It's rare, but it does happen.
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Old 11th January 2017, 12:23 PM   #387
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Originally Posted by michaelsuede View Post
It's not that cheap. The initial prototype build-out will cost about 25 grand to do. It only becomes cheap once mass production induces economy of scale.
Econ101. Pretty sure everyone was taking that into account, or more to the point going with the numbers Mills throws out himself as to the cost per unit,,, retail.

Quote:
The systems will be installed and maintained by third party distributors, much like the solar industry works today. I'm sure those guys don't work for free either.
I've seen you post this a few times. At my cottage I have two solar panels I purchased, installed and maintain myself, no third party involved.
The "solar industry" you speak of I assume, is the solar power to grid portion of large scale grid systems. You said that there would be no need of a power grid, nor any need to be on-the-grid.

Quote:
Believe me, BrLP isn't going to be giving these things away for free. They will most likely be the world's first trillion dollar company.
No said "free" except you.

Quote:
In the long run we will see energy prices and unit costs drop down to next to nothing, where units are available for full purchase and have the same size and cost as a small AC unit does today.
Then why the intermediary term of only leases? It makes no sense.
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Old 11th January 2017, 12:24 PM   #388
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Originally Posted by Horatius View Post
Go read this post and then come back here and say all that again.
Which makes it clear. He's not gullible. He's a troll. Don't feed trolls ..
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Old 11th January 2017, 12:27 PM   #389
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Originally Posted by jaydeehess
Originally Posted by michaelsuede View Post
In the long run we will see energy prices and unit costs drop down to next to nothing, where units are available for full purchase and have the same size and cost as a small AC unit does today.
Then why the intermediary term of only leases? It makes no sense.
All of that wasn't meant to be put together.

What do you expect if you're going to reason?
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Old 11th January 2017, 12:30 PM   #390
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Originally Posted by michaelsuede View Post
It's not that cheap. The initial prototype build-out will cost about 25 grand to do. It only becomes cheap once mass production induces economy of scale.

Initially you will only be able to lease the units, and they will be tied via the internet to BrLPs offices, where they can monitor the system status and power production.

The systems will be installed and maintained by third party distributors, much like the solar industry works today. I'm sure those guys don't work for free either.

Believe me, BrLP isn't going to be giving these things away for free. They will most likely be the world's first trillion dollar company.

In the long run we will see energy prices and unit costs drop down to next to nothing, where units are available for full purchase and have the same size and cost as a small AC unit does today.

This is not going to happen, given that if the reaction works as claimed, it releases into the atmosphere (41:35 in the linked video) a waste product that essentially represents a previously unknown state of matter with properties unknown to the material, biomedical, and environmental sciences, which by BLP's own claims cannot be contained (1:22:10 in the linked video), but which can accumulate in certain materials (1:20:50 in the linked video) including carbon (1:20:00 in the linked video).

They're going to need to do some work (a few decades' worth, it appears; they should have started in the 1990s!) to establish safe exposure limits, health and environmental impacts. Or to prove the lack of any hazard with thorough and well-controlled studies.

As of late 2016, they had one "new hire" investigating the properties of the hydrino gas waste product (1:20:29 in the linked video). I'm sure the EPA will find that very reassuring.

Of course, if the whole thing is actually a scam and there's no such thing as hydrino gas, they won't have that concern.
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Old 11th January 2017, 12:31 PM   #391
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Originally Posted by Horatius View Post
Ah, but most of the parts we see them using are, by themselves, not inventive. See the application for the TPV system I posted earlier. The only real difference between that device and BLP's current device is the source of energy.
Originally Posted by MikeG View Post
You'll enjoy paying your patents lawyer to do this for you! The searches alone will cost a fortune.

I wonder how many novel parts there are in anything these days.
Don't you only need a patent for the lamp itself?
In that case you ignore the supposed hydrino talk altogether and patent it as a novel, super bright, silver/hydrogen powered, UV lamp.
Then you can put the parts together, including solar cells, and patent the electrical power generator.

By the by, I assume that this BLP electricity generator would require a DC to AC converter in order to power the usual household appliances?
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Old 11th January 2017, 12:34 PM   #392
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Originally Posted by aleCcowaN View Post
All of that wasn't meant to be put together.

What do you expect if you're going to reason?
I thought I was on the International Skeptics Forum though!
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Old 11th January 2017, 12:42 PM   #393
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Originally Posted by jaydeehess View Post
Don't you only need a patent for the lamp itself?
In that case you ignore the supposed hydrino talk altogether and patent it as a novel, super bright, silver/hydrogen powered, UV lamp.
Then you can put the parts together, including solar cells, and patent the electrical power generator.

And if the examiner didn't notice the utter lack of any explanation of where the energy ultimately comes from, that might work to get the patent issued. But the patent itself would likely be invalid, and be likely to be thrown out if it ever ended up in court.

Which, if the device works, it absolutely would.

Think about it: a revolutionary new power source, that will upend every tradition energy industry in the world, protected only by a patent that is invalid? There would be rival companies chomping at the bit for a chance to have the patent declared invalid, so they can get their slice of the new energy pie. Take look at what happened to Viagra in Canada, for an example.



Quote:
By the by, I assume that this BLP electricity generator would require a DC to AC converter in order to power the usual household appliances?

Yes, it would have the same issues as any other photovoltaic power systems.
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Old 11th January 2017, 12:43 PM   #394
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Peel away the (literal) layers of cooling jacket, vacuum (or pressure, depending on version) vessel, concentrator solar dome, blackbody radiator, electromagnetic pumps making molten silver electrode-streams… and it comes down to the same thing most energy scams come down to. A secret "catalyst" that releases energy from something not known to contain thermodynamically usable energy. (1:18:48 in the video linked in my previous post).
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Old 11th January 2017, 12:43 PM   #395
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Originally Posted by aleCcowaN View Post
All of that wasn't meant to be put together.

What do you expect if you're going to reason?
It is fun to have what-if scenario, outside of the humor section .
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Old 11th January 2017, 01:11 PM   #396
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Has Mills, or anyone else ever explained why the company changed it's name from Black Light Power to Brilliant Light Power?
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Old 11th January 2017, 01:17 PM   #397
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Originally Posted by Prometheus View Post
Has Mills, or anyone else ever explained why the company changed it's name from Black Light Power to Brilliant Light Power?

I can think of two reasons why they'd do that. First, to hide from investors. Making the company slightly harder to find might be enough to evade the morons who invest in scams like that. The other, might've been hiring a decent marketing rep. "Black Light Power" sounds like they provide A/V equipment for Raves.
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Old 11th January 2017, 01:19 PM   #398
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Would you read this book?

"The Hydrino Incident"

Quote:
It was a new source of energy, virtually limitless, safe, clean. The only byproduct? Hydrinos. Slightly altered hydrogen atoms. Just a few extra electrons. Harmless, reactionless, never documented in nature before. No need to research it. No need to test it. Everything will be just fine.

Richard Trident was an independent researcher working from a small grant to test the effects of Hydrino gas on living organisms. After decades of NewSun Energy advertising, he was expecting a few minor effects, if any. He was wrong, and what he found put life itself in the balance, pitting him against a corporation willing to kill to cover up the truth, and a public indifferent to ďalarmist environmentalists.Ē
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Old 11th January 2017, 01:23 PM   #399
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Originally Posted by Prometheus View Post
Has Mills, or anyone else ever explained why the company changed it's name from Black Light Power to Brilliant Light Power?
It is the MO. Change your name and hide. It has been going on for decades.
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Old 11th January 2017, 01:36 PM   #400
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Originally Posted by halleyscomet View Post
Would you read this book?

"The Hydrino Incident"

If it was 99 cents through Amazon Kindle, I'd give it a whirl.



Originally Posted by abaddon View Post
It is the MO. Change your name and hide. It has been going on for decades.

Yep. They even went through a round of patent applications that didn't even mention the word "hydrino" a couple of cycles ago.
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