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#761 |
Philosopher
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 7,617
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The article is nonsense.
Oscar Pistorius had opportunity but negative motive, and the phone conversations after her shooting were enduringly consistent with a tragic accident. Release the poor devil and stop all this diatribe masquerading as trite humour. And that includes you dear Atheist. I wish everyone would grow up and understand that Pistorius is a victim of a fear mongering republic. So is Reeva. |
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#762 |
Mafia Penguin
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Netherlands
Posts: 18,539
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He deliberately set out to shoot a human being. Whether Reeve or an intruder, that doesn't matter; he shot and shot to kill. That's what puts him behind bars. This has been explained to you a couple of dozen times already in this thread, and you choose to ignore it every time. It really must get tiring to the regulars in this thread.
(and personally, I think he damned well knew Reeva was in the bathroom stall, and that the whole intruder thing is a poor ruse from him, but that's neither here nor there) |
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Founder of the group "The Truth about Anjezë Gonxhe Bojaxhiu aka Mother Teresa" "I think it is very beautiful for the poor to accept their lot, to share it with the passion of Christ. I think the world is being much helped by the suffering of the poor people." - "Saint" Teresa, the lying thieving Albanian dwarf |
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#763 |
Philosopher
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 7,098
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Your comment is nonsense. The article is a sensible and relevent background piece on the murderer's pathological jealousy and insecurity.
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"The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated." -- Mahatma Gandhi Wollen owns the stage |
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#764 |
Critical Thinker
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Pacific Northwest, USA, near the Isle of Lucy
Posts: 389
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Uh, looks like brother Carl and the rest of the Pistorius family is pissed about the movie and claim they're gonna sue. I'm not sure if Oscar and/or the Pistorius family actually have legal standing to sue.
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I'm not all that interested in the Lifetime movie after following the trial and appeal in real time so I doubt I'll even bother to watch. I'm more interested to see what becomes of the next appeal on November 3. |
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#765 |
Philosopher
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 7,617
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#766 |
Graduate Poster
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,044
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#767 |
Now. Do it now.
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: UK
Posts: 22,764
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"The Conservatives want to keep wogs out and march boldly back to the 1950s when Britain still had an Empire and blacks, women, poofs and Irish knew their place." The Don That's what we've sunk to here. |
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#768 |
Pi
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 14,449
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"I am a Jedi, like my father before me*" *Until such time as it all gets really dark and I abandon my sister and my best friends. When the going gets tough, the tough go hide on an island. Dave Skywalker #Notmyluke |
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#769 |
Anti-homeopathy illuminati member
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: NT 150 511
Posts: 41,829
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You expressed what I was thinking too, in the light of a certain thread elsewhere on the forum. Or indeed multiple threads.
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"The way we vote will depend, ultimately, on whether we are persuaded to hope or to fear." - Aonghas MacNeacail, June 2012. |
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#770 |
Philosopher
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 7,617
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#771 |
Anti-homeopathy illuminati member
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: NT 150 511
Posts: 41,829
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Please don't co-opt my unrelated comment to support your starstruck hero-worship fantasies.
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"The way we vote will depend, ultimately, on whether we are persuaded to hope or to fear." - Aonghas MacNeacail, June 2012. |
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#772 |
Philosopher
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 7,617
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He's a gun nut and the world reaps accordingly. But Masipa got it right in my opinion, I thought that from day one.
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#773 |
Featherless biped
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Aporia
Posts: 18,628
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'The first principle is that you must not fool yourself - and you are the easiest person to fool.' - Richard Feynman |
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#774 |
Anti-homeopathy illuminati member
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: NT 150 511
Posts: 41,829
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Masipa is another star-struck hero-worshipping idiot.
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"The way we vote will depend, ultimately, on whether we are persuaded to hope or to fear." - Aonghas MacNeacail, June 2012. |
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#775 |
Philosopher
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 7,617
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No Rolfe.
I see you as a best quality contributor, but you were captured in the case early by a false analyst. |
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#776 |
In the Peanut Gallery
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 41,529
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A fanatic is one who can't change his mind and won't change the subject. Sir Winston Churchill |
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#777 |
Pi
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 14,449
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"I am a Jedi, like my father before me*" *Until such time as it all gets really dark and I abandon my sister and my best friends. When the going gets tough, the tough go hide on an island. Dave Skywalker #Notmyluke |
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#778 |
Penultimate Amazing
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Moomin Valley
Posts: 12,234
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No she didn't. She allowed her objectivity to be compromised, leading to errors in law which had to be rectified by the Supreme Court. Even then she let Pistorius off with a very short sentence for murder.
What compromised her objectivity? She too was a cripple, from childhood polio. She should have recused herself. |
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If man has no tea in him, he is incapable of understanding truth and beauty. ~ Japanese Proverb |
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#779 |
Philosopher
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 7,617
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Go back to your Knox friend Thoughtful. Damn fine mathematician and criminoligist. She analysed the postal police in Knox and the phone calls in Pistorius, and got the right answer both times. Brilliant.
Just wrong on culpability on one of the cases. |
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#780 |
Featherless biped
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Aporia
Posts: 18,628
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'The first principle is that you must not fool yourself - and you are the easiest person to fool.' - Richard Feynman |
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#781 |
The Grammar Tyrant
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 21,080
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The point of equilibrium has passed; satire and current events are now indistinguishable. |
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#782 |
Anti-homeopathy illuminati member
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: NT 150 511
Posts: 41,829
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__________________
"The way we vote will depend, ultimately, on whether we are persuaded to hope or to fear." - Aonghas MacNeacail, June 2012. |
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#783 |
Philosopher
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 7,617
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I know a retired now dead law professor who visited Arthur Allan Thomas in jail and pronounced him guilty.
Except Len Demmler killed his daughter when she discovered he forged her mother's will. If this retired professor of law knows something we don't I would be pleased to hear it. I have no dog in the fight, but I agreed with judge Masipa Icerat Thoughtful and MikeG among others. Far greater damage is done with wrongful convictions than wrongful acquittals in New Zealand, and while Pistorius is hardly a classic miscarriage even if he is telling the truth, Reeva's family deserves the truth whatever it may be. |
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#784 |
Philosopher
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 7,098
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"The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated." -- Mahatma Gandhi Wollen owns the stage |
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#785 |
Philosopher
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 7,098
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__________________
"The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated." -- Mahatma Gandhi Wollen owns the stage |
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#786 |
Now. Do it now.
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: UK
Posts: 22,764
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"The Conservatives want to keep wogs out and march boldly back to the 1950s when Britain still had an Empire and blacks, women, poofs and Irish knew their place." The Don That's what we've sunk to here. |
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#787 |
Philosopher
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 7,617
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Jesus wept, to quote the long lost Charlie Wilkes.
I am accused on different message boards of being all sorts, but I apply only rational thought to arrive at conclusions. Oscar Pistorius had means and opportunity but no motive. Reeva was bearer of a valentine card that evening, I LOVE YOU. |
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#788 |
Philosopher
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 7,617
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#789 |
Philosopher
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 7,617
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#790 |
Philosopher
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 7,098
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__________________
"The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated." -- Mahatma Gandhi Wollen owns the stage |
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#791 |
Now. Do it now.
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: UK
Posts: 22,764
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A deliberate decision to kill. That's all. It doesn't require you have knowledge of who your victim is.
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"The Conservatives want to keep wogs out and march boldly back to the 1950s when Britain still had an Empire and blacks, women, poofs and Irish knew their place." The Don That's what we've sunk to here. |
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#792 |
Anti-homeopathy illuminati member
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: NT 150 511
Posts: 41,829
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And that is exactly what the retired professor of law living in South Africa says about it. Actually, he's not so sure that he accepts Pistorius's story on a personal level, but he believes that the story can't be disproved to the level of legal certainty that would be required to convict him of intentionally killing Reeva. He is absolutely clear that on the known facts of the case Pistorius is guilty of murder, since he deliberately shot through that door at somebody he intended to kill. |
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"The way we vote will depend, ultimately, on whether we are persuaded to hope or to fear." - Aonghas MacNeacail, June 2012. |
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#793 |
Philosopher
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 7,617
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Which is why the debate should be initially constrained to deciding who Pistorius believed was behind the door.
There is spurious discussion about a loud argument that morphs into a possibility of Pistorius screaming in anguish when he finds Reeva absent and thus certainly behind the door. |
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#794 |
Now. Do it now.
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: UK
Posts: 22,764
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This one sentence sums up your entire post history in this thread. The stubborn refusal to concede that it is utterly irrelevant who was behind the door is mind-boggling after so long. It doesn't matter if he thought Reeva was behind the door, or if he thought the Texas Chainsaw Massacrer was behind the door. Shooting through the door to kill was the crime, not shooting to kill Reeva. She is a red herring.
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"The Conservatives want to keep wogs out and march boldly back to the 1950s when Britain still had an Empire and blacks, women, poofs and Irish knew their place." The Don That's what we've sunk to here. |
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#795 |
Now. Do it now.
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: UK
Posts: 22,764
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__________________
"The Conservatives want to keep wogs out and march boldly back to the 1950s when Britain still had an Empire and blacks, women, poofs and Irish knew their place." The Don That's what we've sunk to here. |
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#796 |
Pi
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 14,449
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__________________
"I am a Jedi, like my father before me*" *Until such time as it all gets really dark and I abandon my sister and my best friends. When the going gets tough, the tough go hide on an island. Dave Skywalker #Notmyluke |
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#797 |
Featherless biped
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Aporia
Posts: 18,628
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__________________
'The first principle is that you must not fool yourself - and you are the easiest person to fool.' - Richard Feynman |
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#798 |
Anti-homeopathy illuminati member
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: NT 150 511
Posts: 41,829
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As others have said, this is irrelevant nonsense. Even if one accepts that Pistorius thought it was an intruder behind the door, or at least accepts that his assertion to that effect can't be disproved, he is still guilty of murder because he knowingly shot at a person with the intent to kill them, and did in fact kill them. That's what he was convicted of. He wasn't convicted of knowingly murdering Reeva Steenkamp in the course of an acrimonious domestic dispute because that cannot be proved to be what happened. He was convicted of intentionally murdering whoever it was behind the door. That it happened to be Reeva Steenkamp is not the point, nor is it relevant whether or not he knew it was her or believed it was someone else. You have been told this so often by so many posters in this thread I am beginning to wonder about your reading comprehension skills. |
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"The way we vote will depend, ultimately, on whether we are persuaded to hope or to fear." - Aonghas MacNeacail, June 2012. |
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#799 |
Illuminator
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Fort Wayne, Indiana, USA
Posts: 4,242
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Sorry if this has been mentioned earlier in the thread; I've read the whole thing, but it's been a while. IANAL, but the reason that Pistorius is guilty of murder even if he's telling the truth about what he believed, is that he had no legal right to kill the person behind the door when he did, even if that person was an intruder. He wasn't being directly threatened; he could have retreated and kept his gun pointed down the hall toward the bathroom while telling Reeva to call for help.
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Handy responses to conspiracy theorists' claims: 1) "I am not able rightly to apprehend the kind of confusion of ideas that could provoke such a question." --Charles Babbage 2) "This isn't right. This isn't even wrong." --Wolfgang Pauli 3) "You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means." --Inigo Montoya |
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#800 |
Anti-homeopathy illuminati member
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: NT 150 511
Posts: 41,829
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That is certainly how I understand it. He wasn't being directly threatened. That he came out with a story that he believed something that clearly was not what was happening doesn't confer him the right to kill.
In the threads about the US cops the law seems to be that the cop only has to say "but I was in mortal terror for my life because I believed that person had a gun and was going to shoot me" and it's an automatic free pass. And it doesn't matter if it's proved that the person didn't have a gun and didn't make the slightest threatening move, so long as the cop says he was mortally terrified then it's OK that he killed the person. This however was in South Africa where apparently it isn't enough just to assert that you were in mortal terror and shot because you believed the other person had a gun and was going to shoot you. There has to be some rational basis for that opinion. However, in this case it was actually Reeva behind the door and she didn't have a gun and it's essentially impossible to see where the rational basis for the opinion that he was in mortal danger came from. Add to that the fact that he had a perfectly clear line of escape but chose to advance on the closed door rather than making his escape, and he's toast. Personally I incline to the view that he had had a steaming row with Reeva, she ran away from him and shut herself in the toilet, and he chased after her and shot at her in a red mist of fury which he regretted about three seconds later. But I recognise there are arguments as to why this may not be an unassailable scenario. He shot through a door, intending to kill the person who was behind the door. That person hadn't made any threatening moves towards him, and if he was apprehensive he had every opportunity to get the hell out. That makes him guilty of murder under SA law. |
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"The way we vote will depend, ultimately, on whether we are persuaded to hope or to fear." - Aonghas MacNeacail, June 2012. |
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