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Tags donald trump , NFL incidents , protest incidents , sports controversies , sports incidents , Trump controversies

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Old 26th September 2017, 01:06 AM   #241
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
What is it about the law cited in post 164 that you think doesn't apply here?
The law has qualifiers. Here they are:

(a) Whoever, being a covered government person, with the intent to influence, solely on the basis of partisan political affiliation, an employment decision or employment practice of any private entity—

(1) takes or withholds, or offers or threatens to take or withhold, an official act,
or
(2) influences, or offers or threatens to influence, the official act of another,
shall be fined under this title or imprisoned for not more than 15 years, or both, and may be disqualified from holding any office of honor, trust, or profit under the United States.
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Old 26th September 2017, 01:08 AM   #242
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The President gave private citizens a very specific demand on how to hurt other citizens, of minority pedigree, financially. Now let' suppose the President did that again, except this time he says to all white, Protestant Americans: "Do not buy from blacks, those sons of bitches!"

That would be problematic, would't it, and perhaps the exact same defense that some here now argue to protect Trump would suddenly sound very spurious.

And when, a year later, perhaps following some hideous crime perpetrated by an underage black, Trump opines that "the People" have a damned right to retaliate, and the next night, thousands of black business and their churches are burnt down, hundreds murderes, you have your own Kristallnacht, and Trump, in the eyes of some here, never did anything legally wrong.

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Old 26th September 2017, 01:18 AM   #243
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From the Wembley clip I saw they were perfectly respectable towards the anthem. They stood right through God save the Queen.
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Old 26th September 2017, 02:08 AM   #244
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Originally Posted by Sherkeu View Post
The law has qualifiers. Here they are:

(a) Whoever, being a covered government person, with the intent to influence, solely on the basis of partisan political affiliation, an employment decision or employment practice of any private entity—

(1) takes or withholds, or offers or threatens to take or withhold, an official act,
or
(2) influences, or offers or threatens to influence, the official act of another,
shall be fined under this title or imprisoned for not more than 15 years, or both, and may be disqualified from holding any office of honor, trust, or profit under the United States.
Would be interesting to know if there is a similar law about State Government Members. If so I'd say that threatening to withdraw funding over protests would more then count as supression of free speach.
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Old 26th September 2017, 02:54 AM   #245
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Originally Posted by NoahFence View Post
I'm rather hoping we don't need to see one of the protesters get assassinated and let the requisite time pass before we address this issue.

I wish we'd stop bitching about the protest and start bitching about systemic racism. I mean all of us.
They don't have to die just wait a few decades like how Muhammad Ali became someone who "transcended race".
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Old 26th September 2017, 03:01 AM   #246
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Originally Posted by quadraginta View Post
Because the POTUS, speaking as President from the "bully pulpit" of the White House has no element of "the use of official powers".
At least Trump really puts the bully in bully pulpit.
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Old 26th September 2017, 04:24 AM   #247
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The owner of the Jaguars referred to his linking arms with his players as a Rosa Parks moment.
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Old 26th September 2017, 04:29 AM   #248
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One of the things I wonder about is how this ends. This protest movement is a real thing now, but what's the next move? Also, does it spread out of the NFL? This Friday, will we see high school students on knees or locking arms?

I'm a member of a FIRST robotics team, and we have a forum. We start our events with the national anthem. There's a thread there about how we ought to react to these events. As you might expect, it's more heated than most threads. Fortunately, our main events don't start until late February, by which time I think we'll be over this national kerfuffle, but I can see that this has escalated to where it's something people talk about, and won't be just limited to a few players on television. Where does it go from here?
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Old 26th September 2017, 04:38 AM   #249
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Originally Posted by Foolmewunz View Post
We got that. We're slow but we figure things out eventually. So how about the further hypothetical? The topic conservatives are assiduously avoiding. What do you think of Trump's statements and his use of his bully pulpit to target political foes, which is what he sees them as.

Forget that Nixon-Agnew patriotism crap. Trump likes to model himself after ******* Richard Nixon! Now those were the days. We had the flag-waving war-supporting right wing in an actual war against those hippies and colored folks who dare to shout for "Peace, Now!" He's trying to rekindle that kind of ugly jingoism.

"Nattering nabobs of negativism".

Those were the days. Trump hasn't got the vocabulary to come up with gems like that.
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Old 26th September 2017, 04:42 AM   #250
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Originally Posted by Arcade22 View Post
http://www.politico.com/story/2017/0...-nascar-243091

The President can't accomplish anything meaningful so instead he's going to do something he's actually good at: sowing discord and social strife to rile up his white trash base.

Oh and Trump's definitively not racist or prejudiced against black people in any shape of form despite acting like he is. He knows he's not racist and that means he isn't. I mean you'd trust Trump wouldn't you? You're a patriot aren't you?

If Trump were a used car salesman he'd have me looking for a different dealership.

With luck he will ultimately have the same effect on the GOP, but so far they seem content with a transparent liar.
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Old 26th September 2017, 04:54 AM   #251
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Originally Posted by Trebuchet View Post
And the distraction continues to succeed. Graham-Cassidy is essentially dead, but who knows about it? Trump has managed to distract the MSM so that nobody is aware of his latest failure. I've realized he's a lot cleverer than I thought.
More like how a flower bends toward the sun; Trump bends towards attention.
Trump on his NFL comments to attendees at conservative leader dinner at WH tonight: “It’s really caught on. It’s really caught on."
There's no plan just nihilistic malice fueled by a racist worldview.
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Old 26th September 2017, 05:14 AM   #252
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Originally Posted by Meadmaker View Post
One of the things I wonder about is how this ends.
With the NFL's leadership significantly reduced for years to come, and player sallaries cut accordingly.

Here's the thing: people won't be boycotting because Trump told them to. They will be boycotting because football is no longer an escape from politics. That is the NFLs own fault.
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Old 26th September 2017, 05:16 AM   #253
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
With the NFL's leadership significantly reduced for years to come, and player sallaries cut accordingly.

Here's the thing: people won't be boycotting because Trump told them to. They will be boycotting because football is no longer an escape from politics. That is the NFLs own fault.
But at least we can still enjoy watching black men get brain damage. That is the best part after all.
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Old 26th September 2017, 05:17 AM   #254
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
With the NFL's leadership significantly reduced for years to come, and player sallaries cut accordingly.

Here's the thing: people won't be boycotting because Trump told them to. They will be boycotting because football is no longer an escape from politics. That is the NFLs own fault.
I would think that if Trump didn't see fit to yap about it for no reason, it would not have had an impact on ticket sales. Why did he even bring it up?

Originally Posted by ponderingturtle View Post
But at least we can still enjoy watching black men get brain damage. That is the best part after all.
Do white men not get brain damage in the NFL? Do they get better, inertial-dampening helmets?
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Old 26th September 2017, 05:22 AM   #255
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
What is it about the law cited in post 164 that you think doesn't apply here?
It isn't for solely partisan reasons.
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Old 26th September 2017, 05:25 AM   #256
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Originally Posted by Argumemnon View Post
I would think that if Trump didn't see fit to yap about it for no reason, it would not have had an impact on ticket sales. Why did he even bring it up?



Do white men not get brain damage in the NFL? Do they get better, inertial-dampening helmets?
No they just are not hit as much being on special teams and such.

"The spotlight on quarterbacks apparently hasn’t had the same effect on the center position, another up-the-middle spot traditionally reserved for those perceived as the most astute players. Despite a nearly 50-50 split along the offensive line, at center more than 81 percent of the players are white. Conversely, cornerback is the blackest position on the field: 99.4 percent of players are African-American. On defense overall, roughly 80 percent of the players are black. Switching back to offense, among running backs, the numbers are also heavily tilted toward blacks.

According to the annual racial and gender report card published by TIDES, the NFL is almost 70 percent black, and only 12.5 percent of running backs are white in the most recent year for statistics, 2014, while the inverse was true for special teams positions of kicker and punter, where 97.8 percent of players were white."

https://theundefeated.com/features/t...racial-divide/
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Old 26th September 2017, 05:30 AM   #257
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[quote=ponderingturtle;12008484

"The spotlight on quarterbacks apparently hasn’t had the same effect on the center position, another up-the-middle spot traditionally reserved for those perceived as the most astute players.[/QUOTE]

Translation: more stereotyping based on implicit bias. This line reminds me of MMA where so many black fighters are called, "explosive and athletic."
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Old 26th September 2017, 05:37 AM   #258
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Originally Posted by Captain_Swoop View Post
"I prefer somone who burns the flag and then wraps themselves up in the Constitution over someone who burns the Constitution and then wraps themselves up in the flag.”
― Molly Ivins

Back in the 90s when the flag desecration amendment was being voted on regularly, there was an issue of the Avengers in which Spider-Man jokingly asked Captain America if his costume violated the proposed rules.
Cap's response was something like "As long as you respect the ideals that the flag represents, it doesn't matter what you do with the cloth itself."
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Old 26th September 2017, 05:38 AM   #259
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Originally Posted by Argumemnon View Post
I would think that if Trump didn't see fit to yap about it for no reason, it would not have had an impact on ticket sales. Why did he even bring it up?
It's not Trump yapping that made viewership drop. It was the NFL doubling down on the protests that did. He goaded them into a mistake, and they stupidly fell for it.

As for his motives? Attention, an easy victory, planet X, doesn't really matter. Trump gonna Trump.
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Old 26th September 2017, 05:41 AM   #260
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Originally Posted by Armitage72 View Post
Back in the 90s when the flag desecration amendment was being voted on regularly, there was an issue of the Avengers in which Spider-Man jokingly asked Captain America if his costume violated the proposed rules.
Cap's response was something like "As long as you respect the ideals that the flag represents, it doesn't matter what you do with the cloth itself."
Lets not forget however he was always totally evil and against everything that makes America GreatTM
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Old 26th September 2017, 05:45 AM   #261
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Originally Posted by Brainster View Post
So no doubt the criminal trials of Kaepernick and the other protestors are just around the corner?
Careful! Winter approaches and straw supplies run low.
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Old 26th September 2017, 05:48 AM   #262
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Originally Posted by varwoche View Post
Careful! Winter approaches and straw supplies run low.
I've seen no evidence for this claim!
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Old 26th September 2017, 05:53 AM   #263
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Originally Posted by Gilbert Syndrome View Post
It was a good while before Ali made that leap from the former to the latter, though. He was all but blacklisted for a long time for his refusal to fight for his country.
Against the Vietnamese you mean.
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Old 26th September 2017, 06:09 AM   #264
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Originally Posted by Brainster View Post
So no doubt the criminal trials of Kaepernick and the other protestors are just around the corner?

Criminal trials aren't the only kind of attacks a government can engage in.


Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
It's not Trump yapping that made viewership drop.

Stop right there. This is what you said:

Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
Here's the thing: people won't be boycotting because Trump told them to. They will be boycotting because football is no longer an escape from politics.

You were addressing the future actions of viewers, not their past actions. If anyone, as a result of the recent surge in protests, chooses to no longer watch NFL games, that traces back to Trump. He shoved, and players are shoving back (that is part of their job, after all). If that makes things too uncomfortable for certain viewers, they should be blaming Trump for instigating.

That most people won't be interested or intelligent enough to make the connection is unfortunate, but not the NFL's fault.

Last edited by Cl1mh4224rd; 26th September 2017 at 06:10 AM.
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Old 26th September 2017, 06:16 AM   #265
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
With the NFL's leadership significantly reduced for years to come, and player sallaries cut accordingly.

Here's the thing: people won't be boycotting because Trump told them to. They will be boycotting because football is no longer an escape from politics. That is the NFLs own fault.
The players probably would also prefer football not have politics involved. You have to play the hand you are dealt.
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Old 26th September 2017, 06:16 AM   #266
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Originally Posted by quadraginta View Post
"Nattering nabobs of negativism".

Those were the days. Trump hasn't got the vocabulary to come up with gems like that.
Well, neither did Agnew. William Safire wrote his stuff.
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Old 26th September 2017, 06:17 AM   #267
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NFL's fault.
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Old 26th September 2017, 06:27 AM   #268
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
With the NFL's leadership significantly reduced for years to come, and player sallaries cut accordingly.

Here's the thing: people won't be boycotting because Trump told them to. They will be boycotting because football is no longer an escape from politics. That is the NFLs own fault.
You live in Lalaland. Football has been politicized since the 60s and 70s when they started the paratroop drops, Blue Angel flyovers, AF or Navy flyovers with broken wing formations and the "Let's hear it for our armed forces" crap. Half and then more than half of the country was against the war but the NFL was toeing the minority line of the government.

I could honestly give a rat's ass if professional sports teams go broke and/or all their employees have to learn to make livings doing other things.
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Old 26th September 2017, 06:35 AM   #269
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Not to mention how a number of Major League baseball teams now ask people to stand during the 7th inning for the playing of God Bless America. I believe the New York Yankees were the first to do it back in 2001 following the terrorist attacks. After what New York City experienced collectively on September 11th, it was a moving tribute to our resilience and loss at the time. But now, sixteen years later, it has become a tad tiresome.

As for The Dunce, Samuel Johnson predicted him very well, and over 232 years ago:

Quote:
Patriotism is the last refuge of a scoundrel.
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Old 26th September 2017, 06:51 AM   #270
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To paraphrase a line from late night last night.... Trump has a problem when black people loudly protest and when black people silently protest....
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Old 26th September 2017, 07:07 AM   #271
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Originally Posted by Cl1mh4224rd View Post
You were addressing the future actions of viewers, not their past actions.
Oh, FFS. I played loose with verb tense. So what?

Quote:
If anyone, as a result of the recent surge in protests, chooses to no longer watch NFL games, that traces back to Trump.
Which traces back to Trump's dad, without whom Trump never would have been born.

But there's no point in tracing the cause back farther than the immediate one. And the immediate one is that a lot of viewers aren't interested in watching player protests, regardless of the cause. Players were not forced to protest because of Trump. They made a choice. And so did viewers

Quote:
He shoved, and players are shoving back (that is part of their job, after all).
Responding to tweets is part of their job? No, it isn't.

Quote:
If that makes things too uncomfortable for certain viewers, they should be blaming Trump for instigating.
And maybe some of them are. But that doesn't help the NFL. They can't make money off of blame.

Quote:
That most people won't be interested or intelligent enough to make the connection is unfortunate, but not the NFL's fault.
And I'm sure the NFL can console themselves with that as their income shrinks. Yet no matter who you want to blame, the NFL could have avoided it. They could have chosen a different path.

They chose poorly.
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Old 26th September 2017, 07:24 AM   #272
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
Oh, FFS. I played loose with verb tense. So what?



Which traces back to Trump's dad, without whom Trump never would have been born.

But there's no point in tracing the cause back farther than the immediate one. And the immediate one is that a lot of viewers aren't interested in watching player protests, regardless of the cause. Players were not forced to protest because of Trump. They made a choice. And so did viewers



Responding to tweets is part of their job? No, it isn't.



And maybe some of them are. But that doesn't help the NFL. They can't make money off of blame.



And I'm sure the NFL can console themselves with that as their income shrinks. Yet no matter who you want to blame, the NFL could have avoided it. They could have chosen a different path.

They chose poorly.
People always ask companies to be good corporate citizens. Here it is.
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Old 26th September 2017, 07:28 AM   #273
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Originally Posted by BobTheCoward View Post
People always ask companies to be good corporate citizens. Here it is.
There is no universal definition of what that even means. It's more accurate to say that people want companies to advance the interests of those same people, which they label as being good citizens.
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Old 26th September 2017, 07:34 AM   #274
BobTheCoward
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
There is no universal definition of what that even means. It's more accurate to say that people want companies to advance the interests of those same people, which they label as being good citizens.
True. It is why i feel like I'm the only person wanting powerful groups advancing interests different than mine.
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Old 26th September 2017, 07:41 AM   #275
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Have the ratings come out yet for the weekend? Were they up, down, or flat?
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Old 26th September 2017, 07:44 AM   #276
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Saw a funny comment yesterday by someone who was like, "I don't care if they protest, but don't do it during the game!"

And the response was, duh, the National Anthem is BEFORE the game, you dolt.

Once again, a good sign that they are disingenuous.
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Old 26th September 2017, 08:11 AM   #277
applecorped
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Originally Posted by Dr. Keith View Post
Have the ratings come out yet for the weekend? Were they up, down, or flat?
Deflated
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Old 26th September 2017, 08:13 AM   #278
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Originally Posted by applecorped View Post
Deflated
isn't the new term 'brady-ed'?
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Old 26th September 2017, 08:14 AM   #279
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Originally Posted by applecorped View Post
Quote:
Have the ratings come out yet for the weekend? Were they up, down, or flat?
Deflated
More or less than Tom Brady's balls?
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Old 26th September 2017, 08:18 AM   #280
Ziggurat
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Originally Posted by applecorped View Post
Originally Posted by BobTheCoward View Post
True. It is why i feel like I'm the only person wanting powerful groups advancing interests different than mine.
Deflated
Who could have guessed?

Oh, wait. I did.
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