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31st December 2018, 06:00 PM | #121 |
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If you observe two giraffes in nature copulating, chances are better than even that they are both male.
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31st December 2018, 06:09 PM | #122 |
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Thank you both for your links. I beleive they confirm some data I have in a book somewhere in a box (I moved recently).
But they don't seem to take into account a major source of noise in a receiver which is thermal noise generated in its front end. They seem to assume that all the static noise is coming from the outside which is what I think I'm disputing here. If the snow on the screen looks about the same regardless of if the antenna is connected or not then I don't think the external contribution makes up such a large part of it. So we'd have to multiply the above 1 % by a factor less than 1, and my suspicion is that it's less than 1 by far. |
31st December 2018, 06:24 PM | #123 |
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31st December 2018, 06:31 PM | #124 |
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IIRC, you were suppose to darken a channel (contrast etc.) that you were already receiving well so there was no discernible picture and just black (which really wasn't black on analog) and a certain amount of the random snow which is still visible is from the BB.
If you have any analog stations broadcasting in your area you can probably still do it. Its just that the digital converter is converting the picture to digital so technically it's a digital representation of a BB dot/pixel. But you can still pretend it's from the BB. |
31st December 2018, 10:19 PM | #125 |
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31st December 2018, 10:30 PM | #126 |
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I don't exactly get what you are saying but I think the discussion is futile anyhow. I don't expect a source to be presented that the noise is not dominated by thermal noise. And that was all I was hoping for I think.
I just have a gut feeling here which, as such, of course is highly suspect. But I also haven't seen any data that oppose it. |
31st December 2018, 10:38 PM | #127 |
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31st December 2018, 11:39 PM | #128 |
Дэлво Δελϝο דֶלְבֹֿ देल्वो
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Incorrect. After cell division, there is no original cell and no new cell. They're the same, so neither can be identified as producing or being produced by the other. One mother-cell becomes two daughter-cells, no more, no less. Of course, either daughter can die if something deadly happens to it, but they're the same, so neither is inherently "the one that's about to die" or "the one that's supposed to live".
If that weren't true, then it would be impossible for multicellular organisms to grow. ...and on the subject of size-outliers: Indricotherium (technically another name is supposed to be preferred but that one sounds stupid) was a mammal with a torso & legs about like those of an average sauropod and a bigger head... just a shorter tail & neck. And it's more closely related to a horse or rhinoceros than to an elephant. Some of my favorite short bits of science are from "evo-devo" (evolution & development; how ontogeny & phylogeny contain & illustrate fragments of each other).
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31st December 2018, 11:49 PM | #129 |
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Prime numbers are always interesting. There is a set of numbers called Wilson Primes. Although there are probably an infinite number of Wilson Primes, only 3 have been discovered. They are 5, 13, and 563.
First, Wilson's Thereom: (P - 1)! + 1= x The x is divisible by P (a prime number). In other words x/P = a whole number. Also, this only works for prime numbers. For example: (7-1)! +1 = 721 and 721/7 = 103 But : (9-1)! +1 = 40,321 and 40,321/9 = 4,480.1111... Only with Wilson Primes, you can do it twice. I mean, you can take the result and it is divisible by P. So, (5-1)! + 1= 25 and 25/5 = 5 and 5/5 = 1 (13 - 1)! +1 = 479,001,601 and 479,001 601/13 = 36,846,277 and 36,846,277/13 = 2,834,329 563 is too big to write here. It doesn't work for any other primes. For example: (11-1)! + 1 = 3,628,801 and 3,628,801/11 = 329,891 But 329,891/11 = 29,990.0909... Wilson Primes don't really serve any purpose, it's just cool that somebody found them. And only 3 have been discovered 5, 13, 563. Also, they know that no other Wilson Primes exist below 20,000,000,000,000. Here are links to the YouTube videos explaining Wilson Primes; https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=eZUa5k_VIZg&t=35s https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=AiplrfFB6h0&t=68s |
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1st January 2019, 12:05 AM | #130 |
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Modern human beings are behavioral omnivores.
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1st January 2019, 12:05 AM | #131 |
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1st January 2019, 12:06 AM | #132 |
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And yet one cell was produced from the other. They aren't the same cell. They haven't "divided". One cell has reproduced a copy of itself.
Quote:
Quote:
I was simply pointing out that while there is a continuous chain of DNA replication going back billions of years to the origins of life on earth, this statement: "You have been alive for more than 4.5 billion years, sort of. Literally every living cell in your body has been functioning continuously for all that time." Is untrue. |
1st January 2019, 04:33 AM | #133 |
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If I remember correctly.
You started your life in your grandmother’s womb. Human females are born with all their ova which become the next generation so the ova that went on to form you was formed when your mother was formed in your grandmother’s womb. |
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1st January 2019, 06:42 AM | #134 |
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I don't trust atoms. They make up everything. |
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1st January 2019, 07:04 AM | #135 |
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The volume of a sphere is 2/3 the volume of a cylinder of those dimensions. It works with a hemi-sphere too. Duh. Now I wonder if it works for any partial sphere?
I learned it in a machine shop, so it may only de true to a couple decimal places. |
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1st January 2019, 07:18 AM | #136 |
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Which one is "the original" cell, and which one the "new" cell?
When the DNA replicates the original DNA splits into two strands, both of which replicate the other strand from molecules in the environment. So which is the original and which is new? I'd say both are the original. |
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1st January 2019, 07:25 AM | #137 |
I would save the receptionist.
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The words "chaos" and "gas" are derived from the same Greek root.
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1st January 2019, 08:23 AM | #138 |
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I don't understand your point at all.
When a cell divides it splits in two. There is no original and copy. Both daughter cells are are on equal footing. That "continuous chain of DNA replication going back billions of years" all happened inside living cells. How is that not continuously alive? |
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1st January 2019, 08:46 AM | #139 |
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We're pretty much arguing a "Ship of Theseus" problem at this point.
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1st January 2019, 09:09 AM | #140 |
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I don't think so, which is the original, or if the original is still the original after all it's parts have been replaced is beside the point.
The point is that it's alive before it split and both cells are alive afterwards and nowhere between was it dead. The most basic parts of your metabolism has probably been continuously running since before there were any cells as such. |
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1st January 2019, 10:59 AM | #141 |
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1st January 2019, 11:21 AM | #142 |
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The New Horizons spacecraft is today doing a flyby of a TNO nicknamed "Ultima Thule". We have very little idea what it looks like or, indeed, what it is. Soon we'll have a better idea.
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1st January 2019, 11:42 AM | #143 |
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Scott "Permaculture is a philosophy of working with, rather than against nature; of protracted & thoughtful observation rather than protracted & thoughtless labour; & of looking at plants & animals in all their functions, rather than treating any area as a single-product system." Bill Mollison Biome Carbon Cycle Management |
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1st January 2019, 11:51 AM | #144 |
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This is essentially absolutely accurate. Most cells represent the stuff of the parent cell. Sometimes the division is asymmetric and the two cells are not identical. But they both have guts from the parent, identical copies of the DNA (one strand each of the parents and one strand each newly synthesized) and both start metabolically active. In asymmetric stem cell reproduction one of the resulting cells continues to replicate and the other differentiates, but both cells start with guts from the parent.
As noted upthread gametes are put aside early in embryonic development and can be considered to be half stem cells that come together at fertilization. By all criteria our cells have true continuity with those of the primordial ooze. One might make a George Washington’s Ax argument, but that is true of the cell development in each of use from fertilized zygote to adult: virtually all of the molecules in the single cell zygote are replaced with new ones as we grow but the process is continuous. |
1st January 2019, 11:58 AM | #145 |
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1st January 2019, 12:04 PM | #146 |
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If the giraffe could leap, pound for pound, as high as the grasshopper, they’d avoid a lot of trouble.
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1st January 2019, 12:47 PM | #147 |
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How "Split Brain" Patients react and what it tells us about how our brains operates.
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1st January 2019, 12:50 PM | #148 |
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AGW is real and if you don't believe it you're an idiot or ignorant.
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1st January 2019, 01:55 PM | #149 |
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Toronto (Ontario, Canada) is farther south than Minneapolis (Minnesota, USA) is.
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1st January 2019, 01:58 PM | #150 |
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There really is a Sonic Hedge Hog gene.
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1st January 2019, 02:00 PM | #151 |
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1st January 2019, 03:10 PM | #152 |
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It is kind of irrelevant, because neither of them has been living continuously for 4.5 billion years. The process by which they reproduce has been operating for billions of years, but those cells in your body each live for a finite amount of time (a few years typically).
Because a cell is more than the process of DNA replication. A cell contains more than just DNA: https://training.seer.cancer.gov/ana...structure.html
Originally Posted by Seer website
Deep in the past, the first self-replicating molecule was probably some kind of primitive form of RNA floating around its environment not enclosed by any membrane and copying itself as much as possible. Eventually there were enough of these things making copies of themselves with occasional errors that natural selection came into play and more efficient forms evolved. Membranes, respiration, colonies, complex cells, multi-cellular organisms etc etc... Throughout this process cells formed, divided and died over and over again evolving more efficient forms, complexity and different ways of exploiting their environments. The cells now living in your body are not the same as that original primitive self-replicating RNA any more than your car is the same as the first palaeolithic hand-cart because they both have wheels. The statement: "You have been alive for more than 4.5 billion years, sort of. Literally every living cell in your body has been functioning continuously for all that time." Remains untrue because a cell is more than a replicating strand of DNA. Plus, I have grown a whole lot of new cells since I was a baby and all of the cells that made up my body when I was a baby have since died and been replaced. My current compliment of cells contain (among other things) copies of my specific DNA which didn't exist prior to my conception some time in 1963, a long time ago to be sure, but not 4.5 billion years... Is this the ship of Theseus? Only if someone claimed that the USS Mount Whitney (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Mount_Whitney_(LCC-20)) was the same as a viking long-ship because of a continual tradition of ship building since the middle ages. |
1st January 2019, 04:05 PM | #153 |
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I've always been a little bit fascinated by how fortunate we are that water ice is one of the few common solids that is less dense that it's liquid phase.
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1st January 2019, 04:28 PM | #154 |
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Take a cell living now. It divides. Now there are two cells. Which one was living before the division and which one wasn't yet alive? In my view they are both the original, so both were living prior to division. It's certainly not the case that neither was.
Now one of those two cells divides again. Once again both of them were alive prior to that division. If you can't differentiate between the two cells to determine that one is the original and one is the copy, then clearly both are the original. If both are the original then both were alive prior to division. But in that case both can trace their lives back for billions of years in this way. This doesn't mean that cells don't die. There's always some chance that a particular cell will die before it divides again. |
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1st January 2019, 07:52 PM | #155 |
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When you pass through the Panama Canal from Pacific to Caribbean, you are traveling in a westerly direction.
Speaking of canals, Hood Canal in WA state isn't a canal. It's a fjord. (The tourism dept blew it with that name.) Grape Nut Flakes contains no grapes, no raisins, no nuts. |
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1st January 2019, 08:10 PM | #156 |
Дэлво Δελϝο דֶלְבֹֿ देल्वो
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And all the rest of it gets retained through mitosis as well. It's 100% the same stuff as before in there.
The analogy would only work if ships were produced by dismantling and reassembling the parts of previous ships, instead of with new raw materials. The opposing claim appears to be not that one of the two daughters is the original and the other is just a copy, but that both are just copies, and thus neither is original. |
1st January 2019, 08:11 PM | #157 |
Дэлво Δελϝο דֶלְבֹֿ देल्वो
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1st January 2019, 08:22 PM | #158 |
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1st January 2019, 08:23 PM | #159 |
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What has my inability to differentiate between two cells got to do with the fact that they are both more complex than a strand of DNA?
The first life on earth was not a cell. Cells didn't evolve until millions of years after life started. Cells continue to evolve as time goes on. The cells which make up your body right now are made from food that you have consumed during your lifetime. None of them has existed as a living cell for 4.5 billion years. Take one cell. Now trace its existence backwards in time. At some point you will see its beginning as it divided from its mother cell. Before then it didn't exist, its mother cell did. It contains copies of the mother cell's DNA, but it isn't the same as the mother cell, anymore than you are the same as your parents. You contain copies of their DNA, are you your parents? Are clones the same as the parent? What about identical twins, are they the same individual because they contain the same genetic material? Cells are complex structures which exist for a time and then die. The process continues for billions of years, a great chain stretching back to the beginning of life on earth. Any one link in that chain is connected to all the others, but it also exists as its own thing. The latest link in the chain is ultimately connected to the first link, but it isn't the same as the first link. |
1st January 2019, 09:04 PM | #160 |
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