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Tags classified information , donald trump , national security issues , Trump controversies

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Old Yesterday, 09:04 AM   #1001
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Theresa May, Prime Minister of the UK, says she'll complain directly to Trump and demand that the Trump administration stop blabbing out secret service information; such as happened wrt to the Manchester bombing, when, soon after, US media were printing classified information that UK services had shared with US counterparts on the understanding that those would be kept confidential.
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Old Yesterday, 12:18 PM   #1002
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Originally Posted by TofuFighter View Post
Thanks for posting this, it probably saves me some future time. I wish I'd known it before I read through those meaningless Snopes links that you posted and written a long rebuttal.
The Snopes links weren't meaningless. Nor are most of the arguments I've made. However, the patently obvious absurdity of my great aunt ambassador complaining to me about some US representative should have been patently obvious as absurdity, while still being able to communicate that "illegal for private citizens to meddle in foreign affairs" is probably not an accurate claim.

Now I need to recalibrate, and make sure I'm sooper XXtra specific. I suppose I just won't assume that you understand anything.
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Old Yesterday, 12:36 PM   #1003
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Originally Posted by Oystein View Post
Theresa May, Prime Minister of the UK, says she'll complain directly to Trump and demand that the Trump administration stop blabbing out secret service information; such as happened wrt to the Manchester bombing, when, soon after, US media were printing classified information that UK services had shared with US counterparts on the understanding that those would be kept confidential.
Do we know who blabbed?
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Old Yesterday, 12:38 PM   #1004
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General comment... I'm pretty concerned about the sheer volume of classified and confidential information that is showing up in the news. The whole damn government is as leaky as a sieve.
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Old Yesterday, 12:47 PM   #1005
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Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
General comment... I'm pretty concerned about the sheer volume of classified and confidential information that is showing up in the news. The whole damn government is as leaky as a sieve.
There are always leaks but it's never been this bad. Not in my lifetime or even my father's lifetime. And like it or not, the reason is Trump. It starts with the leader. He's declared war on the government, our government and for every action there is a reaction.
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Old Yesterday, 12:52 PM   #1006
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
There are always leaks but it's never been this bad. Not in my lifetime or even my father's lifetime. And like it or not, the reason is Trump. It starts with the leader. He's declared war on the government, our government and for every action there is a reaction.
Dahell?

1) How did he "declare war on the government"? That's an amazing absurdity.

2) You seem to be implying that the leaks are Trump's fault, as if he and his supporters are doing the leaking... But there seems to be a lot of leaks coming out that are aimed at discrediting Trump. The "reason" might be Trump, in that the people doing the leaking don't like him... but I don't think that justifies leaking intelligence and classified or confidential information.
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Old Yesterday, 12:57 PM   #1007
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Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
General comment... I'm pretty concerned about the sheer volume of classified and confidential information that is showing up in the news. The whole damn government is as leaky as a sieve.
In this administration I'm thinking transparency is a good thing. Especially with a Republican Congress. It helps keep their feet to the fire and remind them who they are ultimately working for.
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Old Yesterday, 12:58 PM   #1008
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Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
Dahell?

1) How did he "declare war on the government"? That's an amazing absurdity.

2) You seem to be implying that the leaks are Trump's fault, as if he and his supporters are doing the leaking... But there seems to be a lot of leaks coming out that are aimed at discrediting Trump. The "reason" might be Trump, in that the people doing the leaking don't like him... but I don't think that justifies leaking intelligence and classified or confidential information.
By accusing every single branch of working against the interest of the American people? By calling them all incompetent?
Trump has slandered the FBI, CIA, NSA, the Military, Congress, the White House and every single Department.
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Old Yesterday, 01:11 PM   #1009
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Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
Dahell?

1) How did he "declare war on the government"? That's an amazing absurdity.

2) You seem to be implying that the leaks are Trump's fault, as if he and his supporters are doing the leaking... But there seems to be a lot of leaks coming out that are aimed at discrediting Trump. The "reason" might be Trump, in that the people doing the leaking don't like him... but I don't think that justifies leaking intelligence and classified or confidential information.
Your kidding right? Agency after agency, he has proposed cutting. He has no use for Intelligence services.

I absolutely do believe that the sheer volume of leaks is Trump's fault. Not specifically any of them. It's the culture Trump fosters. Trust is something one earns. Do you think his staff admires him or sees him as a means to an end?

Do you think the thousands of non-partisan civil service employees who work to serve the American people who's goals for their country and livelihood that are threatened are on board with Team Trump?

And yes I agree, it doesn't justify leaking classified information.
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Old Yesterday, 01:11 PM   #1010
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Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
Dahell?

1) How did he "declare war on the government"? That's an amazing absurdity.

2) You seem to be implying that the leaks are Trump's fault, as if he and his supporters are doing the leaking... But there seems to be a lot of leaks coming out that are aimed at discrediting Trump. The "reason" might be Trump, in that the people doing the leaking don't like him... but I don't think that justifies leaking intelligence and classified or confidential information.
The ship of state is the only ship that leaks from the top.


If you treat your staff badly and blurt out state secrets to one's antagonists, and ignore advice about compromised potential staff members, then one's staff are going to get into the habit of leaking. Especially when most of the leaks can be considered to be in the public interest.

The Manchester photos are the first that I am aware of that aren't.
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Old Yesterday, 02:22 PM   #1011
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
Your kidding right? Agency after agency, he has proposed cutting. He has no use for Intelligence services.

I absolutely do believe that the sheer volume of leaks is Trump's fault. Not specifically any of them. It's the culture Trump fosters. Trust is something one earns. Do you think his staff admires him or sees him as a means to an end?

Do you think the thousands of non-partisan civil service employees who work to serve the American people who's goals for their country and livelihood that are threatened are on board with Team Trump?

And yes I agree, it doesn't justify leaking classified information.
I end up seeing the two highlighted statements as being contradictory. I'm certain that isn't your perspective. How do you reconcile them?
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Old Yesterday, 02:28 PM   #1012
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
By accusing every single branch of working against the interest of the American people? By calling them all incompetent?
Trump has slandered the FBI, CIA, NSA, the Military, Congress, the White House and every single Department.
Lemme get this straight. Trump says bad things about the intelligence community, congress, and white house staff. They retaliate against him calling them incompetent, by leaking classified and confidential information to the press.

Is it acceptable to you simply because it makes Trump look bad?

Well Mr. President, if you didn't say bad things about me, I wouldn't have to violate protocol and leak info to the press in order to show people how bad you are... You know you shouldn't make me have to beat you.
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Old Yesterday, 02:32 PM   #1013
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Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
I end up seeing the two highlighted statements as being contradictory. I'm certain that isn't your perspective. How do you reconcile them?
Roughly: two wrongs don't make a right.

Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
Lemme get this straight. Trump says bad things about the intelligence community, congress, and white house staff. They retaliate against him calling them incompetent, by leaking classified and confidential information to the press.

Is it acceptable to you simply because it makes Trump look bad?

Well Mr. President, if you didn't say bad things about me, I wouldn't have to violate protocol and leak info to the press in order to show people how bad you are... You know you shouldn't make me have to beat you.
It seems an explanation, not justification.
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Old Yesterday, 02:32 PM   #1014
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Originally Posted by jimbob View Post
If you treat your staff badly and blurt out state secrets to one's antagonists, and ignore advice about compromised potential staff members, then one's staff are going to get into the habit of leaking. Especially when most of the leaks can be considered to be in the public interest.

The Manchester photos are the first that I am aware of that aren't.
What part of "Israeli Agent placed inside ISIS" is in the public's best interest? That isn't something that ANYONE has accused Trump of revealing. He was accused of telling Russia the info originated from a particular city. Everything else was very kindly supplied by other people.

Trump sharing one piece of information outside of protocol somehow justifies all of the staff and other agencies proceeding to leak confidential and classified information left and right? How does that logic work for you?
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Old Yesterday, 03:35 PM   #1015
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Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
I end up seeing the two highlighted statements as being contradictory. I'm certain that isn't your perspective. How do you reconcile them?
...er... that Trump does bad things that foster a culture of leaks which are also bad?

How are they contradictory?
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Old Yesterday, 03:48 PM   #1016
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Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
I end up seeing the two highlighted statements as being contradictory. I'm certain that isn't your perspective. How do you reconcile them?
I don't see how they are contradictory. There is no need to reconcile.
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Old Yesterday, 04:12 PM   #1017
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Originally Posted by jimbob View Post
The ship of state is the only ship that leaks from the top.


If you treat your staff badly and blurt out state secrets to one's antagonists, and ignore advice about compromised potential staff members, then one's staff are going to get into the habit of leaking. Especially when most of the leaks can be considered to be in the public interest.

The Manchester photos are the first that I am aware of that aren't.
Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
What part of "Israeli Agent placed inside ISIS" is in the public's best interest? That isn't something that ANYONE has accused Trump of revealing. He was accused of telling Russia the info originated from a particular city. Everything else was very kindly supplied by other people.

Trump sharing one piece of information outside of protocol somehow justifies all of the staff and other agencies proceeding to leak confidential and classified information left and right? How does that logic work for you?

And let's not forget that CNN had that all that code-word secret info back in March when they were asked not to disclose it for their story on laptop bombs.
The leak predated Trump's revelation to the Russians.
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Old Yesterday, 04:36 PM   #1018
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Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
1) How did he "declare war on the government"? That's an amazing absurdity.
Does the phrase, "I'm going to drain the swamp and fix all of the corruption in Washington", or something loosely close to that, ring a bell? How about do an extremely simplistic "Trump War on Government" google search? I mean, this is literally the most basic level of research one can do, but trust me it's been implied and even stated multiple times during his election. Him saying, "I know more than the generals" was insulting to the military just in and of itself. Then the derogatory way he treated a gold star family, the comments on McCain. Seriously, beginner level stuff.

Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
2) You seem to be implying that the leaks are Trump's fault, as if he and his supporters are doing the leaking... But there seems to be a lot of leaks coming out that are aimed at discrediting Trump. The "reason" might be Trump, in that the people doing the leaking don't like him... but I don't think that justifies leaking intelligence and classified or confidential information.
As stated before, you seem to be confusing "justifies" with "explanation as to why". Then you posted another post where you acted completely oblivious to the fact that the ability to reverse investigate something even exists led me to believe that you just didn't know the difference.

The ends people will go to in order to justify, which is what you're doing, the behavior of Trump is insane to me. I can't even imagine.
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Old Yesterday, 09:53 PM   #1019
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Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
What part of "Israeli Agent placed inside ISIS" is in the public's best interest? That isn't something that ANYONE has accused Trump of revealing. He was accused of telling Russia the info originated from a particular city. Everything else was very kindly supplied by other people.

Trump sharing one piece of information outside of protocol somehow justifies all of the staff and other agencies proceeding to leak confidential and classified information left and right? How does that logic work for you?
The part where the papers disclosed that Trump had revealed this information to the Russians on an impulse but nit what the information was. The fact that it came from Israel seems to have been put into the public domain by the Israelis, presumably because their source had already been compromised and they wanted to make yhe US public aware of how it became compromised.
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Old Yesterday, 10:33 PM   #1020
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Originally Posted by jimbob View Post
The part where the papers disclosed that Trump had revealed this information to the Russians on an impulse but nit what the information was.
Are you channelling the spirit of Officer Crabtree ?
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Old Today, 12:27 AM   #1021
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Originally Posted by Emily's Cat View Post
The Snopes links weren't meaningless. Nor are most of the arguments I've made. However, the patently obvious absurdity of my great aunt ambassador complaining to me about some US representative should have been patently obvious as absurdity, while still being able to communicate that "illegal for private citizens to meddle in foreign affairs" is probably not an accurate claim.

Now I need to recalibrate, and make sure I'm sooper XXtra specific. I suppose I just won't assume that you understand anything.
You do it often. " I'm surprised by how often things like this are taken seriously". Throwing out half-arguments based on half-complete information.
So let me save you some time as well and tell you not to trouble yourself with explaining at length since I won't be wasting time on them again.
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