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Old 1st November 2016, 11:31 AM   #81
abaddon
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Originally Posted by Paul Bethke View Post
OK so you win--I have in mind a demonstration with regards to the created things.
Go right ahead, feel free, have at it. You have already demonstrated copiously that you are unable to do so.
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Old 1st November 2016, 11:48 AM   #82
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Originally Posted by abaddon View Post
Go right ahead, feel free, have at it. You have already demonstrated copiously that you are unable to do so.
For his sake I hope he's not planning to try and physically visit my house to assault me. Most the online databases have me munged up with two different people who share my name. One is police officer and the other is a career criminal. I've met the police officer. He's one of the "In peak physical condition to protect and serve" police officers. I don't know much about the career criminal, but I know just hearing the shared name makes many of the town's police officers hover their hands over their guns until they confirm I'm NOT him. Neither man strikes me as one you'd want to target in a home invasion and poor Paul would have a 2 in 3 chance of going to the wrong house.
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Old 1st November 2016, 11:55 AM   #83
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Originally Posted by Paul Bethke View Post
Jesus said none of the laws will disappear—but the Temple has, the sacrifices for sin have.
Which means that:
1. either the laws pertaining to Temple polity and activities have, in fact, "disappeared"; or
2. your Jesus is said to be said to be holding you to a physical impossibility; or
3. you are making this up as you go along.

Interesting concept of "infallibility" and "perfect understanding". Especially in the light of words said to be said to have been said by your Jesus himself (xf Matt.15:14 ff.)

Originally Posted by Paul Bethke View Post
Laws that apply to the people of Israel can be applied to Israel only—judicial laws pertaining to justice are applicable, but are contrary to laws in sovereign countries, like the death penalty.
You have already demonstrated that you make a cafeteria-line out of the "Mitzvot" that you choose to follow, using whatever excuse you can color with plausibility.

Originally Posted by Paul Bethke View Post
All the laws have an application if YHVH were in control—but seasons differ in lands and the time zones are different—so what would you do about the Sabbath, the times zone in Israel differs from many other place.
To be "in control", your 'god' (the 'god' about addressing which you show an odd inconsitency, for an "infallible" "prophet" with "perfect understanding") would have to be demonstrated to exist. That single failing makes everything else you assert simply moot.

Not to mention, the Sabbath is calculated from sundown, local (independent of Daylight Saving Time and time zones). The horizon rises when it rises, giving the appearance of sundown at any locale. Interesting that your "perfect understanding" does not encompass that.

Originally Posted by Paul Bethke View Post
The agricultural laws have a benefit—must people go to Israel to commemorate the feast three times a year—Israel could not accommodate all the people.
Interesting that your own convenience dictates which of the Mitzvot have not "disappeared"...

Originally Posted by Paul Bethke View Post
How do you want me to apply Matthew 23:23?
Correctly. Interesting that your "perfect understanding" does not encompass that.
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Old 1st November 2016, 11:59 AM   #84
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Originally Posted by Paul Bethke View Post
<snip>

I follow them.
Why do you keep ignoring my question about your fringes? And the straps on your phylactery?

Originally Posted by Paul Bethke View Post
<snip>

And as I have stated on so many occasions –a man must marry a virgin, and a virgin must stay with the man who took her virginity—excluding rape.<snip>
How odd that your opinion is at odds with the law. Interesting take on "infallibility" and "perfect understanding"...
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Old 1st November 2016, 12:01 PM   #85
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Originally Posted by Paul Bethke View Post
OK so you win--I have in mind a demonstration with regards to the created things.
Interesting that you hope to hide your "infalliblity" and "perfect understanding" behind vagueness.
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Old 1st November 2016, 12:02 PM   #86
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Originally Posted by Paul Bethke View Post
Yes divorce is an act of violence in that it a destroying of what YHVH constituted. And to remarry is adultery—this is what Jesus stated, and he was talking of divorce.
You know, this all hinges on the bible not being just the work of faillible men.

But even if it's divine inspiration, why should we care? Why should god dictate how human beings live?

I mean, right off the bat, that rule is stupid. The husband is dead. Let her find some love in her life again. Especially if she's still of child-bearing age. I mean, you guys love that stuff, right? Otherwise it clashes with the "be fruitful have **** like rabbits" bit of the book. So, stupid rule. Why should I follow a stupid god? (and, again, we haven't established that he exists! So many hurdles!)

As to the first line of your post, it's ridiculous on its face. No definition of the word "violence" fits with your intepretation. Call it "wrong" if you like, but it isn't "violence" any more than me dissassembling the old familiy house "violent".
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Old 1st November 2016, 12:05 PM   #87
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Originally Posted by Paul Bethke View Post
Good questions—at this point of history, my Deity as you call him, has yet to reveal himself as the only Creator, this has to be done by him showing his creative powers.
So presently he is displayed as just another god.
Just another impotent god.

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But because I have the evidence of his sovereignty
No you don't. You're just a man. You don't have divine revelation. You don't get to tell me how the universe works.

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The righteousness of Abraham, was displayed in his readiness to offer Isaac up as a sacrifice with regards to the command of God.
What an asshat. For all her knew, God was testing his ability to stand up for his son and not perform the deed. God's a dick.

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So the END times--will be the END of sin
The end of fun, too. Prepare for an enternity of boredom and submission.
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Old 1st November 2016, 12:13 PM   #88
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Originally Posted by Paul Bethke View Post
When the Kingdom of God is established then there will be a consideration of what Mitsvot will apply—but the Temple and the priestly duties that accompany this will be abolished as Jesus will be on earth.
I thought you have read Tanakh/OT?

Did you miss the part in Ezekiel where it says the Temple will be rebuilt after the war of Gog and Magog?

And that animal sacrifices will return?

Originally Posted by Paul Bethke View Post
but the Temple and the priestly duties that accompany this will be abolished as Jesus will be on earth.
See Ezekiel 45. I thought you said the Tanakh/OT was the "infallible word of God". Is Ezekiel part of that? If you say 'yes', then that throws your ^ quote all to hell.


Originally Posted by Paul Bethke View Post
So stick to the topic of the END times.
I am trying to! But you did not like my question about the "Third Temple". So (as usual) you refused to answer. *sigh*

Originally Posted by Zivan View Post
Do you believe the Third Temple will be rebuilt as it says in the Book of Ezekiel?



Okay, now back to the regularly scheduled programme about the Sumerian Genesis myth.


(And the mitzvot, which clearly seem to confuse Paul B......)

Last edited by Zivan; 1st November 2016 at 12:25 PM. Reason: spelling
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Old 1st November 2016, 12:14 PM   #89
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Originally Posted by Slowvehicle View Post
Interesting that you hope to hide your "infalliblity" and "perfect understanding" behind vagueness.
Well, the few times he's been specific haven't worked out very well for him here. Delving into which Mitzvot he does and does not follow for example.
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Old 1st November 2016, 12:51 PM   #90
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Originally Posted by Argumemnon View Post
You know, this all hinges on the bible not being just the work of faillible men.

But even if it's divine inspiration, why should we care? Why should god dictate how human beings live?

I mean, right off the bat, that rule is stupid. The husband is dead. Let her find some love in her life again. Especially if she's still of child-bearing age. I mean, you guys love that stuff, right? Otherwise it clashes with the "be fruitful have **** like rabbits" bit of the book. So, stupid rule. Why should I follow a stupid god? (and, again, we haven't established that he exists! So many hurdles!)

As to the first line of your post, it's ridiculous on its face. No definition of the word "violence" fits with your intepretation. Call it "wrong" if you like, but it isn't "violence" any more than me dissassembling the old familiy house "violent".
Well Good day to you—without being rude, let me say this is typical of people who have read my posts and then turn them into something that I did not advocate.

On no occasion have I stated that a married woman who has become a widow cannot remarry.

Let me steer you to the injunction---Rom 7:2 For example, by law a married woman is bound to her husband as long as he is alive, but if her husband dies, she is released from the law of marriage.
Rom 7:3 So then, if she marries another man while her husband is still alive, she is called an adulteress. But if her husband dies, she is released from that law and is not an adulteress, even though she marries another man.

But what must be considered is that she cannot marry a divorced man.

Well as the Creator surely he has an interest in how people live—if they live contrary to his likes, then he must interject. He has given laws that when adhered to will yield the best way for people to enjoy life.

Not only that, God enjoys the fellowship of his creation, this fellowship involves keeping his laws, but further to that, a rejection of his laws will result in enmity with him, which then determines one eternal abode.

Divorce is an act of violence—it is the violent separation of a unity—it is ripping apart, it in many cases is the catalyst to violence, because jealousy is involved.
It is love turned to hatred. What about the children?

So as we are dealing with the END times it is appropriate for God to restore the marriage covenant as he intended it to be in the beginning.
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Old 1st November 2016, 12:54 PM   #91
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Originally Posted by Argumemnon View Post
Just another impotent god.



No you don't. You're just a man. You don't have divine revelation. You don't get to tell me how the universe works.



What an asshat. For all her knew, God was testing his ability to stand up for his son and not perform the deed. God's a dick.

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The end of fun, too. Prepare for an enternity of boredom and submission.
Well in that case prepare for eternity in hell.
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Old 1st November 2016, 01:04 PM   #92
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Originally Posted by Zivan View Post
I thought you have read Tanakh/OT?

Did you miss the part in Ezekiel where it says the Temple will be rebuilt after the war of Gog and Magog?

And that animal sacrifices will return?



See Ezekiel 45. I thought you said the Tanakh/OT was the "infallible word of God". Is Ezekiel part of that? If you say 'yes', then that throws your ^ quote all to hell.




I am trying to! But you did not like my question about the "Third Temple". So (as usual) you refused to answer. *sigh*






Okay, now back to the regularly scheduled programme about the Sumerian Genesis myth.


(And the mitzvot, which clearly seem to confuse Paul B......)
Well with reference to the third Temple –how can that be when the second Temple was not built?

Yes I have studied the Old Testament, and am aware of what Ezekiel saw as the Temple –but which one did he see?

So now how are the Jews going to build this third Temple when the site is occupied by the Muslims third holy place?

I am not confused in the least---what I referred to was the return of the Jews to Israel—but not all Jews are from the twelve tribes. So which tribe do you come from?
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Old 1st November 2016, 01:09 PM   #93
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Originally Posted by Paul Bethke View Post
Well in that case prepare for eternity in hell.
Unless of course Buddha had it right. If he did, then get ready for another lifetime as something else. I don't think anyone in this thread has achieved Nirvana and therefore escaped the wheel of reincarnation.
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Old 1st November 2016, 01:10 PM   #94
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Originally Posted by Slowvehicle View Post
Interesting that you hope to hide your "infalliblity" and "perfect understanding" behind vagueness.
How can it be vague when on so many occasions I have stated that the creative things will be the objects of YHVH great demonstration of his power, which involves the sun, moon and stars.

Luke_21:25 "There will be signs in the sun, moon and stars.
On the earth, nations will be in anguish and perplexity at the roaring and tossing of the sea.

Nothing vague about that!
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Old 1st November 2016, 01:50 PM   #95
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Originally Posted by Paul Bethke View Post
How can it be vague when on so many occasions I have stated that the creative things will be the objects of YHVH great demonstration of his power, which involves the sun, moon and stars.



Luke_21:25 "There will be signs in the sun, moon and stars.

On the earth, nations will be in anguish and perplexity at the roaring and tossing of the sea.



Nothing vague about that!


How can it be vague? It does not address any of the following, meaning that anything can be understood to be a sign, and to paraphrase the super villain Syndrome, "If everything is a sign, nothing is."

What are the signs that will be visible in the sun, moon and stars? What is meant by "anguish and perplexity"?
What nations are being referred to?
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Old 1st November 2016, 01:54 PM   #96
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Originally Posted by Paul Bethke View Post
How can it be vague when on so many occasions I have stated that the creative things will be the objects of YHVH great demonstration of his power, which involves the sun, moon and stars.

Luke_21:25 "There will be signs in the sun, moon and stars.
On the earth, nations will be in anguish and perplexity at the roaring and tossing of the sea.

Nothing vague about that!
Keep teaching us oh immortal one!
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Old 1st November 2016, 01:58 PM   #97
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Signs of the End Times - Part Two

Originally Posted by Paul Bethke View Post
Well with reference to the third Temple –how can that be when the second Temple was not built?
Dude, you're wrong. Really, really wrong.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Temple

You claim to have read the Bible yet somehow MISSED the fact that the temple Jesus went to was the second temple.

The destruction of Jerusalem, Babylonian exile, reconstruction after the exile, all these events washed over you without you wondering where the Temple Jesus went to and talked about came from if Solomon's temple was destroyed.

Originally Posted by Paul Bethke View Post
Yes I have studied the Old Testament
Apparently not very well.

What temple did you think Jesus preached at when he was 12? Which temple did you think he threw the money changers out of? Did you think that was Solomon's Temple?!?!?

Originally Posted by Paul Bethke View Post
So now how are the Jews going to build this third Temple when the site is occupied by the Muslims third holy place?
You do realize of course that's not a "gotya" question that helps you in any way, right?

Christian mythology about the End Times requires the third temple to be rebuilt as well, in part because of the very passages Zivan brought up. There are a number of groups making all sorts of plans to make the third temple happen. The plans range from the comically optimistic to the overtly terrorist and everything in between.

http://www.templemount.org/tempprep.html

http://www.haaretz.com/news/yatom-je...-plot-1.129418

In trying to fathom the claim that no second temple was ever built I learned that there is a movement to deny any of the temples were ever built:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Temple_Denial

This CAN'T be what is being referred to here as denying the first or second temple existed would mean denying the accuracy of the Bible, something I don't think you would do. The second temple can even be verified by archaeology and historical documents!

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Old 1st November 2016, 02:34 PM   #98
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Originally Posted by Paul Bethke View Post
How can it be vague when on so many occasions I have stated that the creative things will be the objects of YHVH great demonstration of his power, which involves the sun, moon and stars.
"Vagueness" because you have learned not to be specific.

"Vagueness" because every single time you have pretended to specificity, you have been demonstrated to be a false prophet...which is odd for someone "infallible", with "perfect understanding".

Originally Posted by Paul Bethke View Post
Luke_21:25 "There will be signs in the sun, moon and stars. On the earth, nations will be in anguish and perplexity at the roaring and tossing of the sea.

Nothing vague about that!
Nonsense. It is nothing but vagueness.

WHAT "signs" in the sun?

WHAT "signs" in the moon?

WHAT "signs" in the stars?

If you are not specific, ahead of time, than you are not making "prophecies", but postdictions. Puny "infallibility, that.

You may not be aware of it, but the "sea" is always "roaring and tossing" somewhere. What kind of "sign" is something that is always goijng on?

Yep. Vagueness.

Odd thing for "perfect understanding" to hide behind.
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Old 1st November 2016, 02:35 PM   #99
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Originally Posted by Paul Bethke View Post
Well with reference to the third Temple –how can that be when the second Temple was not built?
halleyscomet has already answered this very well.

Your bible OT says there were two Temples. A 1st and a 2nd Temple.

According to you, is the Tanakh/OT true? Or false?


Originally Posted by Paul Bethke View Post
Yes I have studied the Old Testament, and am aware of what Ezekiel saw as the Temple –but which one did he see?
Obviously you are not very "aware". (As halleyscomet already has shown you).

The 2nd Temple was not built according to the description in Ezekiel.

There is a record (other than the Tanakh) of the destruction of the 2nd Temple.

Ever heard of the Arch of Titus in Rome?

Josephus?

Archeology?

Originally Posted by Paul Bethke View Post
So now how are the Jews going to build this third Temple when the site is occupied by the Muslims third holy place?
You claim you are "infallible" and "perfect in understanding". Do you not have all the answers?

Originally Posted by Paul Bethke View Post
I am not confused in the least---
I will just leave this one alone.

The mods are watching.

I. Will. Not. Touch. This. One.

Originally Posted by Paul Bethke View Post
So which tribe do you come from?
Levi
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Old 1st November 2016, 02:37 PM   #100
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Originally Posted by halleyscomet View Post
Dude, you're wrong. Really, really wrong.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Temple

You claim to have read the Bible yet somehow MISSED the fact that the temple Jesus went to was the second temple.
...ooopsie.

Originally Posted by halleyscomet View Post
The destruction of Jerusalem, Babylonian exile, reconstruction after the exile, all these events washed over you without you wondering where the Temple Jesus went to and talked about came from if Solomon's temple was destroyed.

Apparently not very well.

What temple did you think Jesus preached at when he was 12? Which temple did you think he threw the money changers out of? Did you think that was Solomon's Temple?!?!?
...ooopsie...

Originally Posted by halleyscomet View Post
You do realize of course that's not a "gotya" question that helps you in any way, right?

Christian mythology about the End Times requires the third temple to be rebuilt as well, in part because of the very passages Zivan brought up. There are a number of groups making all sorts of plans to make the third temple happen. The plans range from the comically optimistic to the overtly terrorist and everything in between.

http://www.templemount.org/tempprep.html

http://www.haaretz.com/news/yatom-je...-plot-1.129418

In trying to fathom the claim that no second temple was ever built I learned that there is a movement to deny any of the temples were ever built:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Temple_Denial

This CAN'T be what is being referred to here as denying the first or second temple existed would mean denying the accuracy of the Bible, something I don't think you would do. The second temple can even be verified by archaeology and historical documents!
Interesting, given the poster's "infallibility" and "perfect understanding"...
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Old 1st November 2016, 03:01 PM   #101
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Signs of the End Times - Part Two

Originally Posted by Zivan View Post
I will just leave this one alone.



The mods are watching.



I. Will. Not. Touch. This. One.

I'm right with you there. After pages of him insisting Genesis is literal and Noah's flood happened exactly as described in the Bible, he goes and denies the second temple, one of the historically and archaeologically verifiable details.

And it's not like it's a trivial detail. The destruction of Solomon's temple was a big deal. The conquest of Jerusalem was built up to in passages covering the decline and fall of the nation of Israel after Solomon failed to provide for a clean line of succession. Multiple kings of both kingdoms had to screw up to make it happen.

And he MISSED it.

How does that HAPPEN to someone who supposedly read the entire Old Testament?

Dear Moderators,

For the record, I stated the above not as an attack on Paul, but to directly address his claims of Biblical knowledge and perfect understanding. He claims to be infallible, yet appears ignorant of the bulk of the dress and grooming laws he claims he should be following. Now he has demonstrated quite clearly he does not know Jesus wasn't visiting Solomon's temple. Missing the destruction of the first temple is not quite as bad as claiming to be an expert on WWII's Pacific theater and being unaware of Pearl Harbor, but it's close. It's not as humiliating as claiming a comprehensive, encyclopedic knowledge of WWII's European theater and saying, "Poland? What's that? A drink?" But it's close.

It is however a perfectly reasonable mistake for a second grade Sunday School student to make, as they've rarely gotten that far in the Bible. It's a perfectly reasonable error for many laypeople, as Churches tend to gloss over most of the period from Solomon to Jesus. It's not an excusable lapse in knowledge for someone who claims an infallible understanding of the Bible.

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Old 1st November 2016, 03:44 PM   #102
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Originally Posted by halleyscomet View Post
I'm right with you there. After pages of him insisting Genesis is literal and Noah's flood happened exactly as described in the Bible, he goes and denies the second temple, one of the historically and archaeologically verifiable details.
You have pointed out even more irony. Paul B accepts myths as "facts", but ignores actual facts as "myths".

Originally Posted by halleyscomet View Post
Is there a resource you can recommend as an alternative to Strong's?
Sorry I did not answer this sooner. (I missed it during the split).

The only one I know about in English is the Brown-Driver-Briggs Lexicon. It is old (an update is being written) but over all it is much better than Strong's. (I feel bad for how much Strong's misleads people with SO MANY of the errors in it).

But, you have to be careful with online BDB "sources". Many Christian sites claim to reference BDB, BUT, they then add their own "translations" (which are wrong) to it. (They do this as the only way to make their JC "proof-texts" "work").

The 'biblehub' website seems to quote BDB accurately, even when they add their own inaccurate "meanings". Here is an example (the Strong's is incorrect, but the BDB entry along with it is correct)
http://biblehub.com/hebrew/5959.htm

Unlike this site which claims they are referencing BDB, but they are just using their own false interpretation (which can easily be proven as false)
http://www.biblestudytools.com/lexic...nas/almah.html


You can buy the BDB Lexicon here:
https://www.amazon.com/Brown-Driver-.../dp/1565632060

The listings in BDB are in Hebrew, so it can be difficult to look up a word for a non-speaker. But in the back is an index with Strong's numbers, cross referenced to the page in BDB where you can find the word.

You can look up a word online using Strong's to get the number for the cross reference. Just ignore what Strong's says(!) you only need the Strong's number to get the correct info from BDB.

Sorry if that is confusing!

(I found out about Strong's by non-Hebrew speaking missionaries "proving" I do not know Hebrew, and they will "teach" me proper Hebrew----by using Strong's).

(From looking up online Strong's, I found the BDB).

Last edited by Zivan; 1st November 2016 at 04:01 PM.
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Old 1st November 2016, 04:50 PM   #103
halleyscomet
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Originally Posted by Zivan View Post
The only one I know about in English is the Brown-Driver-Briggs Lexicon. It is old (an update is being written) but over all it is much better than Strong's. (I feel bad for how much Strong's misleads people with SO MANY of the errors in it).

Thank you very much! I've added it to my Amazon wish list. I'll check with my wife to see if she already has a copy.

I'll also look up what the pending rewrite will consist of.

As for the Christians trying to school you on Hebrew, I hope you were able to set them straight but I wouldn't be surprised if they didn't listen. My mother is a big fan of Joseph Prince, who makes all sorts of weird claims about secret messianic messages "hidden" in Hebrew. I ran one of the claims my mother repeated to me by some Jewish friends, a rabbi and an Episcopalian minister friend of mine who studied Hebrew and Aramaic heavily. They all said his claims were crap and largely agreed in the tortured stretches needed to even try to imagine a justification for his claims.

When I took their conclusions back to my mother she replied that these Hebrew scholars, who'd never heard of Charismatic Televangelist Joseph Prince, were lying because they were "jealous of his success." Somehow, the fact that these completely disconnected people whose only common bind was ME all came to the SAME conclusion by the same reasoning, was somehow proof they were conspiring against Jospeh Prince.
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Old 1st November 2016, 05:18 PM   #104
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Originally Posted by Paul Bethke View Post
This one thing I am certain about, Malachi says that God originally made only one woman for one man, though He could have made many. It was a sin, therefore, against the original constitution of the race for a man to have more than one wife, and this is the argument that our Lord employed in Mat_19:4. The one man for the one woman is the secret of a happy home-life and of a godly seed.
The only good thing about communism is that no man can have two women until all men have one.

Or something like that, only slightly more screwy than the claptrap in the bible.

How's that whole "the end is near" jive working out? have you stocked up on magic underwear and unleavened bread?
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Old 1st November 2016, 05:24 PM   #105
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Originally Posted by halleyscomet View Post
Thank you very much! I've added it to my Amazon wish list. I'll check with my wife to see if she already has a copy.
You are very welcome!

Originally Posted by halleyscomet View Post
As for the Christians trying to school you on Hebrew, I hope you were able to set them straight but I wouldn't be surprised if they didn't listen.
You are 100% correct. They refuse to listen!

Originally Posted by halleyscomet View Post
My mother is a big fan of Joseph Prince, who makes all sorts of weird claims about secret messianic messages "hidden" in Hebrew. I ran one of the claims my mother repeated to me by some Jewish friends, a rabbi and an Episcopalian minister friend of mine who studied Hebrew and Aramaic heavily. They all said his claims were crap and largely agreed in the tortured stretches needed to even try to imagine a justification for his claims.

When I took their conclusions back to my mother she replied that these Hebrew scholars, who'd never heard of Charismatic Televangelist Joseph Prince, were lying because they were "jealous of his success." Somehow, the fact that these completely disconnected people whose only common bind was ME all came to the SAME conclusion by the same reasoning, was somehow proof they were conspiring against Jospeh Prince.
Yes, this is how they all *think*. They are very frustrating to deal with. All the "hidden" meaning must mean 'Jesus'!

One of the funny ones is the Hebrew 'et' (את) which is the direct object marker in a sentence. There is no translation for it. It is a marker. So, missionaries get all excited because in Genesis it says "In the beginning God created (et) the heavens and (et) the earth". 'Et' in Hebrew is spelled with the alef (א) and (ת) tav, first and last letters of the alef-bet. Therefore, it means-----Jesus!! See! Proof! Jesus is God!

So, we like to makes jokes about it, since את is written everywhere. Pick up a bag of crisps in Israel and on the label includes the את. Obviously, the bag of crisps really is about Jesus! Same with ice cream, toothpaste, toilet paper, socks, arak, you name it. Jesus is everywhere! But, Jews are too blind to see!

And there is sooo much more........

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Old 1st November 2016, 06:10 PM   #106
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Clearly my mother and the missionaries harassing you are using a shared playbook.

Originally Posted by Zivan View Post
One of the funny ones is the Hebrew 'et' (את) which is the direct object marker in a sentence. There is no translation for it. It is a marker. So, missionaries get all excited because in Genesis it says "In the beginning God created (et) the heavens and (et) the earth". 'Et' in Hebrew is spelled with the alef (א) and (ת) tav, first and last letters of the alef-bet. Therefore, it means-----Jesus!! See! Proof! Jesus is God!

So, we like to makes jokes about it, since את is written everywhere. Pick up a bag of crisps in Israel and on the label includes the את. Obviously, the bag of crisps really is about Jesus! Same with ice cream, toothpaste, toilet paper, socks, arak, you name it. Jesus is everywhere! But, Jews are too blind to see!

And there is sooo much more........
Lo and behold, Jospeh Prince makes that very error:

http://www.josephprince.org/daily-gr...he-final-word/

And then adds this to it:

Quote:
Each Hebrew letter has a corresponding picture. Interestingly, aleph is associated with an ox and tav, a cross. Together, they make up a beautiful picture of what Jesus did for us—He is the sacrificial “animal” on the cross. It was for us that He suffered, bled and died.
Apparently your socks were sacrificed to G_d to atone for your sins.

Although I will admit, searching for a pro-Jesus error in Joseph Prince's Hebrew is REALLY low hanging fruit. It's the foundation of his career.
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Old 1st November 2016, 07:43 PM   #107
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Originally Posted by halleyscomet View Post
Clearly my mother and the missionaries harassing you are using a shared playbook.
I wish there was a *rolling on the floor laughing* smiley


Originally Posted by halleyscomet View Post
Lo and behold, Jospeh Prince makes that very error:

http://www.josephprince.org/daily-gr...he-final-word/

And then adds this to it:
Quote:
Each Hebrew letter has a corresponding picture. Interestingly, aleph is associated with an ox and tav, a cross. Together, they make up a beautiful picture of what Jesus did for us—He is the sacrificial “animal” on the cross. It was for us that He suffered, bled and died.
How thick can they be? Mixing up Hebrew square script (ashuri) used today, (since Babylon times) with paleo-hebrew script. Paleo-hebrew was not consistent and the letters varied a lot. But the tav usually looks like a 'X', not a cross.

And will they make up their mind what kind of animal Jesus was? Human? Godling? Lamb? Ox?


Originally Posted by halleyscomet View Post
Apparently your socks were sacrificed to G_d to atone for your sins.
Because nailing ice cream would have been too tricky?



Originally Posted by halleyscomet View Post
Although I will admit, searching for a pro-Jesus error in Joseph Prince's Hebrew is REALLY low hanging fruit. It's the foundation of his career.

I have never heard of him until you told me. Maybe he will come to Israel and we can tell him to look for converts in Mea She'arim (ultra-ultra orthodox section of Jerusalem. They will stone your car if you try to drive through there on shabbat) and just let nature takes its course...........
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Old 1st November 2016, 07:51 PM   #108
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Old 1st November 2016, 09:02 PM   #109
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Originally Posted by halleyscomet View Post
Apparently your socks were sacrificed to G_d to atone for your sins.

Originally Posted by Zivan View Post
Because nailing ice cream would have been too tricky?
Now, who's going to come clean brandy off my laptop?
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Old 1st November 2016, 09:38 PM   #110
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Originally Posted by Slowvehicle View Post
Now, who's going to come clean brandy off my laptop?
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Old 2nd November 2016, 12:36 AM   #111
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Originally Posted by Border Reiver View Post
How can it be vague? It does not address any of the following, meaning that anything can be understood to be a sign, and to paraphrase the super villain Syndrome, "If everything is a sign, nothing is."

What are the signs that will be visible in the sun, moon and stars? What is meant by "anguish and perplexity"?
What nations are being referred to?
Well for starters some of the signs that are recorded as having been done---the one occasion where the sun was redirected to go backwards, and the other occasion where the sun stood still for a day.

My thinking is that this will cause a lot of anguish and perplexity---surely a scientific mind can tell you what the consequences will be—but take into account that this did happen and the world is still here.

So this will be an END time demonstration to end all blasphemy.
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Old 2nd November 2016, 12:48 AM   #112
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Originally Posted by Paul Bethke View Post
take into account that this did happen and the world is still here.
The fact that the world is still here is proof that it did not happen. It's just one of the many fictional stories in the Bible.
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Old 2nd November 2016, 02:17 AM   #113
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Originally Posted by Paul Bethke View Post
Well for starters some of the signs that are recorded as having been done---the one occasion where the sun was redirected to go backwards, and the other occasion where the sun stood still for a day.

My thinking is that this will cause a lot of anguish and perplexity---surely a scientific mind can tell you what the consequences will be—but take into account that this did happen and the world is still here.

So this will be an END time demonstration to end all blasphemy.

The sun "standing still for a day" would result in an end all right - the end of all life on the planet.

And, before going on about this having happened before, no it most certainly did not. The conquest of Canaan did not happen as described - the archeological evidence does not indicate that it happened AT ALL. The events described in Exodus, etc are falsehoods written down centuries after they are alleged to have happened to give a the ruling elites of the time they were written a basis for their control - we rule here because our God gave us control.
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Old 2nd November 2016, 02:42 AM   #114
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Originally Posted by Paul Bethke View Post
Well for starters some of the signs that are recorded as having been done---the one occasion where the sun was redirected to go backwards, and the other occasion where the sun stood still for a day.
Are you, personally, taking credit for those supposed "signs"?

You were not here, nor was anyone alive, to see those "signs" happen. In fact, your only evidence for those "signs" is "recorded" in a source that you, personally, cannot read; a source that also claims that snakes and donkeys talk.

I am curious--do you, personally, think the sun goes around the earth, or the other way 'round?

Originally Posted by Paul Bethke View Post
My thinking is that this...
To what "this" do you refer? You have yet to make any actual prediction (other than the ones that demonstrated you to be a false propet; a blind guide...

Originally Posted by Paul Bethke View Post
...will cause a lot of anguish and perplexity---surely a scientific mind can tell you what the consequences will be—but take into account that this did happen and the world is still here.
What would you have us suppose "happened"?

A "scientific mind" will point out that the "sun standing still in the sky" is exactly as much a fairy tale as ƴ ͤ fludde, or the "plagues" of the "exodus"; uqually detatched from reality.

Originally Posted by Paul Bethke View Post
So this will be an END time demonstration to end all blasphemy.
...and you have no intention of making any specific prediction. You need the veil of vagueness behind which you are hiding, in order to avoid having it demonstrated, once again, how false a prophet you are.

surprise
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Old 2nd November 2016, 03:45 AM   #115
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Originally Posted by Slowvehicle View Post
Are you, personally, taking credit for those supposed "signs"?

You were not here, nor was anyone alive, to see those "signs" happen. In fact, your only evidence for those "signs" is "recorded" in a source that you, personally, cannot read; a source that also claims that snakes and donkeys talk.
Nasty, you know I can read so why are you so unenlightened—you see it was like this in the days of Noah, they also ridiculed Noah, but the day did come according to the Scriptures, and they were all swept away.

(Luke_17:27 People were eating, drinking, marrying and being given in marriage up to the day Noah entered the ark. Then the flood came and destroyed them all.)

Quote:
I am curious--do you, personally, think the sun goes around the earth, or the other way 'round?
It was as they understood it.

Quote:
To what "this" do you refer? You have yet to make any actual prediction (other than the ones that demonstrated you to be a false propet; a blind guide...
Not blind can see quite good—what I am saying is that these signs will be repeated, as a result the whole world of humans will see this phenomena at the same time.

Quote:
What would you have us suppose "happened"?

A "scientific mind" will point out that the "sun standing still in the sky" is exactly as much a fairy tale as ƴ ͤ fludde, or the "plagues" of the "exodus"; uqually detatched from reality.
Well when the time comes we will see how much of a fairy tale it is—but till the !
Quote:
...and you have no intention of making any specific prediction. You need the veil of vagueness behind which you are hiding, in order to avoid having it demonstrated, once again, how false a prophet you are.

surprise
Yes at the right time I will make the prediction, but first there are some other situations to attend to.
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Old 2nd November 2016, 03:51 AM   #116
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Originally Posted by Border Reiver View Post
The sun "standing still for a day" would result in an end all right - the end of all life on the planet.
Not so—the Creator can institute a change that will not destroy all life as he did in the first demonstration.

Quote:
And, before going on about this having happened before, no it most certainly did not. The conquest of Canaan did not happen as described - the archeological evidence does not indicate that it happened AT ALL. The events described in Exodus, etc are falsehoods written down centuries after they are alleged to have happened to give a the ruling elites of the time they were written a basis for their control - we rule here because our God gave us control.
Well that may be what you read—but do not be deceived, that which is written did happen, otherwise it would be a blatant lie, which it is not. Ask Zivan, she certainly will know!!
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Old 2nd November 2016, 03:55 AM   #117
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Originally Posted by Pixel42 View Post
The fact that the world is still here is proof that it did not happen. It's just one of the many fictional stories in the Bible.
Not fictional, but a true account—this type of demonstration will have a worldwide effect on the people, and will open up the means to present the terms YHVH will make.
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Old 2nd November 2016, 04:12 AM   #118
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Originally Posted by Paul Bethke View Post
And as I have stated on so many occasions –a man must marry a virgin, and a virgin must stay with the man who took her virginity—excluding rape.
False! There is no such exclusion. Read the Torah: a woman must remain with the man who rapes her, as long as he lives. Only difference is that the rapist must pay the woman's father fifty shekels - around half a kilo - of silver, in compensation for his daughter's virginity. See Deuteronomy 22
28 If a man find a damsel that is a virgin, which is not betrothed, and lay hold on her, and lie with her, and they be found; 29 then the man that lay with her shall give unto the damsel’s father fifty shekels of silver, and she shall be his wife; because he hath humbled her, he may not put her away all his days.
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Old 2nd November 2016, 04:35 AM   #119
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Originally Posted by Craig B View Post
False! There is no such exclusion. Read the Torah: a woman must remain with the man who rapes her, as long as he lives. Only difference is that the rapist must pay the woman's father fifty shekels - around half a kilo - of silver, in compensation for his daughter's virginity. See Deuteronomy 22
28 If a man find a damsel that is a virgin, which is not betrothed, and lay hold on her, and lie with her, and they be found; 29 then the man that lay with her shall give unto the damsel’s father fifty shekels of silver, and she shall be his wife; because he hath humbled her, he may not put her away all his days.


More to the point his "excluding rape" is a new addition to his despotic mantra. We have an entire discussion where he was insisting a raped virgin was married to her rapist, like it or not.

I wonder what caused Paul to change his mind...
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Old 2nd November 2016, 04:43 AM   #120
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Originally Posted by Slowvehicle View Post
Now, who's going to come clean brandy off my laptop?


This is why I try not to read the forum while drinking anything.
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