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Tags Jeffrey Epstein , Satanism conspiracies

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Old 6th December 2019, 01:06 PM   #361
Vixen
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Originally Posted by Belz... View Post
I didn't appeal to anything. Do you even know what a logical fallacy is?

I'm making a statement regarding what is going on, not drawing a logical conclusion from premises.

No wonder you don't think you "do" logical fallacies.
You tried to make out you had the backing of the crowd by use of the word 'we'. Saddam had the backing of a few million. See the logic fault in this?
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Old 6th December 2019, 01:08 PM   #362
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Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
You tried to make out you had the backing of the crowd by use of the word 'we'. Saddam had the backing of a few million. See the logic fault in this?
Yes. We see the logic faults in all of your posts. But you don't seem to.
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Old 6th December 2019, 01:10 PM   #363
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Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
You tried to make out you had the backing of the crowd by use of the word 'we'.
I did no such thing. I used "we" because no one in this thread agrees with your claim. It's a fact. Your interpretation is simply incorrect.

But then, adding theories on top of observations is common with you.
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Old 6th December 2019, 01:45 PM   #364
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Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
This is where we disagree.

Indulging in practices that harm others (i.e., young teenage women) is not just 'bad taste and eclectic fantasy'.
I referred above to the issue of whether his apparent ceremonial practices were Satanic. I think we are likely in agreement that his actions were terrible, harmful, and worthy of unequivocal condemnation. I just don't believe that they were the result of some religious or quasi-religious ideology. I think they were the result of his being an evil character with flamboyant adolescent erotic fantasies, and enough money to get away with it.
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Old 6th December 2019, 01:46 PM   #365
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Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
This is where we disagree.

Indulging in practices that harm others (i.e., young teenage women) is not just 'bad taste and eclectic fantasy'.
Wow. You even highlighted the part where bruto specifically says that it's the "toy[ing] with the terminology and allure of a mishmash of occult ideas" that he's referring to as "bad taste and eclectic fantasy"- and you still manage to twist that to mean what you want it to so you can have something to disagree with. Is this deliberate, are you really that bad at basic reading comprehension?
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Old 6th December 2019, 03:09 PM   #366
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Originally Posted by bruto View Post
I referred above to the issue of whether his apparent ceremonial practices were Satanic. I think we are likely in agreement that his actions were terrible, harmful, and worthy of unequivocal condemnation. I just don't believe that they were the result of some religious or quasi-religious ideology. I think they were the result of his being an evil character with flamboyant adolescent erotic fantasies, and enough money to get away with it.
You are in denial if you cannot admit that despite many many years of procuring underage teenage girls, and likely running a blackmail racket, nobody has ever been brought to justice, apart from Epstein, once in 2010 when he 'got off' with a 13-month sentence which gave him day release on his island and he never checked in once, with impunity, and then in July 2019 when NY took it out of Florida's hands, and in weeks we're told he topped himself, that there is some funny deep state stuff going on here.

No, two-bit maths teacher from blue-collar Brooklyn Jeffrey Epstein was not 'just a dirty old man with a lot of money'.
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Old 6th December 2019, 03:13 PM   #367
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Originally Posted by Belz... View Post
Oh my gods, the irony.
Precious, isn't it.
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Old 6th December 2019, 03:13 PM   #368
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Originally Posted by turingtest View Post
Wow. You even highlighted the part where bruto specifically says that it's the "toy[ing] with the terminology and allure of a mishmash of occult ideas" that he's referring to as "bad taste and eclectic fantasy"- and you still manage to twist that to mean what you want it to so you can have something to disagree with. Is this deliberate, are you really that bad at basic reading comprehension?
Having regular orgies with teenage girls passed around world leaders and statesmen is not 'toying with a mishmash of occult ideas' nor is it 'bad taste'. The fact it involves deep state should tell you this is not one individual perv from down the road.
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Old 6th December 2019, 03:15 PM   #369
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Originally Posted by abaddon View Post
Precious, isn't it.
Oh yeah, you're the 'let it all hang out' guru. Nothing wrong with any of it. Nothing exists and history never happened so who cares?
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Old 6th December 2019, 03:16 PM   #370
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Originally Posted by turingtest View Post
Is this deliberate, are you really that bad at basic reading comprehension?
It's the former. Samuel Clemens had an observation about what many are doing in this thread.
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Old 6th December 2019, 03:31 PM   #371
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Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
Originally Posted by abaddon View Post
Sure, and people move about even in ancient times and surprise, their ideas move with them. 40.000 years ago, people were crossing oceans with apparent aplomb.

No evidence for Moses or the exodus.


So what?

You keep on talking about moses as though he was real.
I see. You are one of these people who thinks if you say a thing it becomes so.
Nope. I am one of those people who will accept any claim for which sufficient testable evidence has been demonstrated. "Moses" fails that test. The Exodus fails that test. Disagree? Present your evidence.

Oh and the stupid bible is evidence of nothing, so don't bother with that. We already know it is filled with mistakes from start to finish.

Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
There are more things in heaven and Earth, Horatio, abaddon, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy.
Demonstrate that a "heaven" even exists. You cannot.

And how exactly would you know what I dream or what my philosophy is?

And before you go off on yet another tangent, I am aware that you provided a quote. I am also aware it comes from a work of fiction just like the bible. I am also aware you intended it as a distraction.


Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
History is just a series of cartoon strips in your blissful world called the realms of Ignorance.
ORLY? Who wrote the pentateuch? Do you know?

Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
You do understand that NatGeo is not a reliable source, right?

Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
Quote:
The identity of Pharaoh in the Moses story has been much debated, but many scholars are inclined to accept that Exodus has King Ramses II in mind. The Bible confirms that the Israelites were to build “supply cities, Pithom and Ramses, for Pharaoh.” Egyptian records confirm that the kings of the 19th dynasty (ca 1293–1185 B.C.E.) launched a major mili*tary program in the Levant. As part of this effort, King Seti I (ca 1290–1279 B.C.E.) built a new garri*son city, which his successor, Ramses II (ca 1279– 1213 B.C.E.), later called Pi-Ramesses. Ramses II also built a second city dedicated to his personal patron, Atum, called Per Atum. These two cities are quite possibly the biblical Ramses and Pithom.
Do you know why it might be that some scholars are merely "inclined to accept" which pharoah it was? Of course not.

The bible confirms nothing. It is a work of fiction.

All you are doing is attempting to ram a religious square peg into a factual round hole.

Let's cut to the chase here. Do you accept that the bible is not a reliable guide in any way to any thing? Not history, not science, not even morality. Once you accept that we can move along. OTOH, if you disagree, I can and will demonstrate you to be incorrect.
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Old 6th December 2019, 03:39 PM   #372
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Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
Having regular orgies with teenage girls passed around world leaders and statesmen is not 'toying with a mishmash of occult ideas' nor is it 'bad taste'. The fact it involves deep state should tell you this is not one individual perv from down the road.
Sure. It is a group of pervs with power, abusing said power. Criminal, despicable and illegal it certainly is. Satanic ring it certainly is not. You are stuck on the notion that nobody could commit horrible acts with out satan. You are stuck in religion.
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Old 6th December 2019, 03:50 PM   #373
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Originally Posted by abaddon View Post
Nope. I am one of those people who will accept any claim for which sufficient testable evidence has been demonstrated. "Moses" fails that test. The Exodus fails that test. Disagree? Present your evidence.

Oh and the stupid bible is evidence of nothing, so don't bother with that. We already know it is filled with mistakes from start to finish.

Demonstrate that a "heaven" even exists. You cannot.

And how exactly would you know what I dream or what my philosophy is?

And before you go off on yet another tangent, I am aware that you provided a quote. I am also aware it comes from a work of fiction just like the bible. I am also aware you intended it as a distraction.


ORLY? Who wrote the pentateuch? Do you know?

You do understand that NatGeo is not a reliable source, right?

Do you know why it might be that some scholars are merely "inclined to accept" which pharoah it was? Of course not.

The bible confirms nothing. It is a work of fiction.

All you are doing is attempting to ram a religious square peg into a factual round hole.

Let's cut to the chase here. Do you accept that the bible is not a reliable guide in any way to any thing? Not history, not science, not even morality. Once you accept that we can move along. OTOH, if you disagree, I can and will demonstrate you to be incorrect.

It seems perfectly clear to me that for Judaism to exist today it must have had a starting point, and Moses is as good as any. Even if you disbelieve the Bible, fact is, millions of Jews accept the precept of the Ten Commandments and the laws as set out in Leviticus and Deuteronomy. It might be fiction but a life-style of not indulging in idol worship, fornicating, stealing, murdering is one enjoyed by many. The first two commandments are 'thou shalt have no other God before me' and 'thou shalt not have a graven image', these go back to antiquity and might be fiction as far as you are concerned.

However, there are millions of decent people in the world who do refrain from worship of idols and deities such as the generic 'Ba'al'.

Therefore - whether fictitious or factual - there are those who will do the opposite. Joining occult organisations means they are suddenly free from the restrictions or marriage, being faithful and not having casual or perverted sex. So don't try to make out occult practitioners don't exist.

It is there in plain sight. Epstein and his astonishing deep state network indulging in underage teenage sex, porn and orgies is really really not about some oversexed dude.
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Old 6th December 2019, 03:51 PM   #374
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Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
You are in denial if you cannot admit that despite many many years of procuring underage teenage girls, and likely running a blackmail racket, nobody has ever been brought to justice, apart from Epstein, once in 2010 when he 'got off' with a 13-month sentence which gave him day release on his island and he never checked in once, with impunity, and then in July 2019 when NY took it out of Florida's hands, and in weeks we're told he topped himself, that there is some funny deep state stuff going on here.

No, two-bit maths teacher from blue-collar Brooklyn Jeffrey Epstein was not 'just a dirty old man with a lot of money'.
Who are you quoting there? Not me, obviously.
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Old 6th December 2019, 03:55 PM   #375
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Originally Posted by abaddon View Post
Sure. It is a group of pervs with power, abusing said power. Criminal, despicable and illegal it certainly is. Satanic ring it certainly is not. You are stuck on the notion that nobody could commit horrible acts with out satan. You are stuck in religion.
If it is as you say 'It is a group of pervs', when will the other pervs be investigated?
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Old 6th December 2019, 03:56 PM   #376
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Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
Oh yeah, you're the 'let it all hang out' guru. Nothing wrong with any of it. Nothing exists and history never happened so who cares?
Wheeeeeee. Just how long did it take you to gather that much straw. Did you use a scythe or a huge combine harvester of some description?

FTR, I am fairly militant when it comes to anything involving abuse of minors. Indeed, I have been involved with exposing some of those.

Everything is wrong with such activities.

The universe exists as does our particular place in it. Whatever has happened, stays happened.

I care. I care about truth as well. It appears that you do not.

Basically, everything you just said is wrong. Again.

At some point, you are going to have to come up against the simple fact that you are not always right, you do not know the motivations of others, and you cannot continue to make crap up and expect to be taken seriously.

I get that you think that there is a magic demon orchestrating all of these activities. To me you might as well be claiming that there are magic fairies at the bottom of your garden that make flowers grow. It is really that level of superstitious nonsense.

The simple fact is that humans, all of their lonesome, really are capable of horrible, unspeakable acts. No imaginary satan needed at all.

Should such people be judged for such acts? Absolutely. And, if found guilty, punished to the full extent of the law.

But loading all of that with a veritable crowd of supernatural ghosts, angels and demons is utter nonsense. Because those are not real.
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Old 6th December 2019, 03:58 PM   #377
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Originally Posted by bruto View Post
Who are you quoting there? Not me, obviously.
You said, to paraphrase, that Epstein was just a pervy old dude with lots of money.
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Old 6th December 2019, 04:02 PM   #378
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Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
If it is as you say 'It is a group of pervs', when will the other pervs be investigated?
What? How the **** do I know? I am busy enough investigating my own local pervs, TYVM. I have no further time to investigate the pervs in another country 3,000 mile away.

Get off your butt and actively do something if you want to make a difference. Do not rock up here and denigrate the real efforts of myself and many others to overturn that rock and expose those worms.

You really know nothing, do you. That was a statement, not a question.
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Old 6th December 2019, 04:08 PM   #379
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Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
Having regular orgies with teenage girls passed around world leaders and statesmen is not 'toying with a mishmash of occult ideas' nor is it 'bad taste'. The fact it involves deep state should tell you this is not one individual perv from down the road.
Who here has said that it is? Quote, please, no paraphrasing- you've demonstrated that you only do that so you can have something to rail against.
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Old 6th December 2019, 04:09 PM   #380
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Originally Posted by abaddon View Post
Wheeeeeee. Just how long did it take you to gather that much straw. Did you use a scythe or a huge combine harvester of some description?

FTR, I am fairly militant when it comes to anything involving abuse of minors. Indeed, I have been involved with exposing some of those.

Everything is wrong with such activities.

The universe exists as does our particular place in it. Whatever has happened, stays happened.

I care. I care about truth as well. It appears that you do not.

Basically, everything you just said is wrong. Again.

At some point, you are going to have to come up against the simple fact that you are not always right, you do not know the motivations of others, and you cannot continue to make crap up and expect to be taken seriously.

I get that you think that there is a magic demon orchestrating all of these activities. To me you might as well be claiming that there are magic fairies at the bottom of your garden that make flowers grow. It is really that level of superstitious nonsense.

The simple fact is that humans, all of their lonesome, really are capable of horrible, unspeakable acts. No imaginary satan needed at all.

Should such people be judged for such acts? Absolutely. And, if found guilty, punished to the full extent of the law.

But loading all of that with a veritable crowd of supernatural ghosts, angels and demons is utter nonsense. Because those are not real.
Don't put words in my mouth. If I believe someone is say, Wiccan, it doesn't mean I believe what they believe. Just that such people do exist and have those beliefs.

You take Mossad for example. Now spies no longer work for a country, they work for a power circle. A non-western intelligence agency (let's say, Russian to keep it objective) won't care about our values in the UK or USA. Why should it? Let's imagine it is not Christian. So to interfere in a foreign power it can use the tactic of compromising values by offering freedom from that country's normal social mores, like being faithful to your wife, sex by consent only, no public orgies, etcetera and the only way to do that is to offer an exclusive 'fraternity' type organisation that offers discretion on remote islands and protection from being prosecuted or outed Before you know it, this deep state, within perhaps another deeper state, has brought down the moral values of our civilisation as we know it and that was the intent.

It seems Epstein and Maxwell were connected to Mossad.
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Old 6th December 2019, 04:10 PM   #381
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Originally Posted by turingtest View Post
Who here has said that it is? Quote, please, no paraphrasing- you've demonstrated that you only do that so you can have something to rail against.
It is what we are talking about in this thread.
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Old 6th December 2019, 04:24 PM   #382
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Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
You said, to paraphrase, that Epstein was just a pervy old dude with lots of money.
Paraphrase it may be but it is your paraphrase and a little basic etiquette would keep quotation marks (or even half-quotes) away from a paraphrase. What I actually said was that I think Epstein "an evil character with flamboyant adolescent erotic fantasies, and enough money to get away with it." Paraphrases may vary here. Quotations never should.
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Old 6th December 2019, 04:30 PM   #383
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Originally Posted by bruto View Post
Paraphrase it may be but it is your paraphrase and a little basic etiquette would keep quotation marks (or even half-quotes) away from a paraphrase. What I actually said was that I think Epstein "an evil character with flamboyant adolescent erotic fantasies, and enough money to get away with it." Paraphrases may vary here. Quotations never should.
So we are agreed.

You believe Epstein to have been a one-man band. I believe he was in a conspiracy.
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Old 6th December 2019, 04:47 PM   #384
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Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
Don't put words in my mouth. If I believe someone is say, Wiccan, it doesn't mean I believe what they believe. Just that such people do exist and have those beliefs.
You have declared such beliefs to be "satanic" and thus worthy of legal action. Do no attempt to pretend that you have not. Do not make me quote you very own words.

Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
You take Mossad for example.
For an example of what?

Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
Now spies no longer work for a country, they work for a power circle.
Evidence? Why am I asking, I know you have none.

Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
A non-western intelligence agency (let's say, Russian to keep it objective) won't care about our values in the UK or USA. Why should it?
I am in the west. I don't care about your values because they are plainly messed up.

Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
Let's imagine it is not Christian.
You are imagining all of this. I agree.

Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
So to interfere in a foreign power it can use the tactic of compromising values by offering freedom from that country's normal social mores, like being faithful to your wife, sex by consent only, no public orgies, etcetera
Not a problem if one does not adhere to a religion. It is your sexual hang-up and your alone. You have no beeswax examining what may or may not happen in other peoples underpants.

Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
and the only way to do that is to offer an exclusive 'fraternity' type organisation that offers discretion on remote islands and protection from being prosecuted or outed
Baloney. Post divorce, I have no shortage of partners. If one is in the mood, one can get it. WITH CONSENTING ADULTS.

Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
Before you know it, this deep state, within perhaps another deeper state, has brought down the moral values of our civilisation as we know it and that was the intent.
BS. Sex is a normal human drive. Why on earth you feel the need to pile endless guilt upon such a normal human activity is beyond me. Next you will be claiming that the missionary position is the only correct one.

FFS, Tomorrow, I am on a blind date. She is 50, same as me. Will sex be involved? One can hope. But I will play it however it lays. You somehow seem to think that would be "fornication". And a "sin" against some "god" that is entirely invented out of your own fevered imagination.

I expect a pleasant, civilised date, but if sex does happen, I will PM you all the gory detail if you wish just so you realise that sex is a normal human activity, indeed a human driving force. At any age.

Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
It seems Epstein and Maxwell were connected to Mossad.
And straight into wild conspiracy theories. Colour me surprised. Got evidence? Of course not.
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Old 6th December 2019, 05:26 PM   #385
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Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
It seems perfectly clear to me that for Judaism to exist today it must have had a starting point, and Moses is as good as any.
That is the informal fallacy of an argument from ignorance. You cannot think of any other reason, therefore it MUST have been Moses.

Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
Even if you disbelieve the Bible, fact is, millions of Jews accept the precept of the Ten Commandments and the laws as set out in Leviticus and Deuteronomy.
Jews accept the 613 commandments (if observant). Didn't you know that? And which version of the so called ten commandments are you citing? There are three in the bible and none of them agree. Furthermore, jesus in the bible endorsed only five of those and added two more not in the ten. Which he plagiarised. Do you know which? I do.

Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
It might be fiction but a life-style of not indulging in idol worship,
Who cares about idols? Not me. Anyone can worship whatever they like. I don't care right up to the point when people like you attempt to impose your particular idol upon me or anyone else. At that point the imposer can foxtrot right oscar.

Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
fornicating,
What do you mean by "fornicating" exactly? If extra-marital sex, then you are talking utter BS. And I speak from experience. If other, specify what you mean.

Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
stealing,
Plagiarised from elsewhere by the bible.
Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
murdering is one enjoyed by many.
Is it? So you mean to suggest that before the wandering jews reached Mt. Sinai, none of them knew that murder was not a good thing? Really? In that case they would never have reached Sinai in the first place, being busy murdering each other.

Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
The first two commandments are 'thou shalt have no other God before me' and 'thou shalt not have a graven image', these go back to antiquity and might be fiction as far as you are concerned.
Nope, it is one of those "tells" that jahweh was quite aware that there were other gods. But as the bible tells us jahweh was a jealous god. What else would he say?

Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
However, there are millions of decent people in the world who do refrain from worship of idols and deities such as the generic 'Ba'al'.
Baal is not generic. Only you have tried to make him so under instruction from a priesthood with a vested interest in having you and everyone else accept such a proposition.

To me, Baal is just another in the thousands of false claimed gods. No more real that the pixies that make flowers grow.

Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
Therefore - whether fictitious or factual - there are those who will do the opposite. Joining occult organisations means they are suddenly free from the restrictions or marriage,
False. I am all for fidelity in a relationship. But when such a relationship stops, one does not have to become a celibate forever.

Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
being faithful and not having casual or perverted sex.
Your prudishness is not impressive. Why should YOU care what consenting adults do in the privacy of their bedroom? What business is it of yours?

Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
So don't try to make out occult practitioners don't exist.
Why should I? I was one such. Of course they exist. Nothing satanic about it, though. That is all in your imagination.

Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
It is there in plain sight. Epstein and his astonishing deep state network indulging in underage teenage sex, porn and orgies is really really not about some oversexed dude.
And nobody here is denying that. Everyone is simply pointing out that this breathless satanic crap is utter nonsense akin to the whole reds under the bed baloney. It's superstitious nonsense.
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Old 6th December 2019, 05:27 PM   #386
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Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
So we are agreed.

You believe Epstein to have been a one-man band. I believe he was in a conspiracy.
Stop shovelling words into other's mouths. That is not what he said. Try reading with comprehension for a change.
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Old 6th December 2019, 05:57 PM   #387
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Well, I for one have been convinced by OP that Epstein conquering the Baltic was justifiable because he was 'civilising' it, and we can't all be descended from Charlemagne even statistically speaking, because royal blood is magic.

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Old 6th December 2019, 06:48 PM   #388
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Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
It is what we are talking about in this thread.
Yeah, that's... pretty weak. Somehow, though, I'm not surprised you weren't able to quote somebody actually saying what you need them to be saying. I guess if you need to be the only righteous person in the room, making sinners of everyone else is the easiest way to do it.

(You should just consider that a paraphrase of all the things you've said )
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Old 6th December 2019, 08:45 PM   #389
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Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
You are in denial if you cannot admit that despite many many years of procuring underage teenage girls, and likely running a blackmail racket, nobody has ever been brought to justice,...
No, nobody's confused. What we have here is a real live conspiracy with all the bells and whistles: Sex trafficking out in the open, high-profile political figures attending parties and taking money and going to his island, evidence of camera use in private spaces for possible blackmail use, and under these conditions a DoJ uncomfortably slow to act.

None of this is in dispute. The investigation is ongoing.


Quote:
apart from Epstein, once in 2010 when he 'got off' with a 13-month sentence which gave him day release on his island and he never checked in once, with impunity, and then in July 2019 when NY took it out of Florida's hands, and in weeks we're told he topped himself, that there is some funny deep state stuff going on here.
And now we have the Deep State involved.

Epstein was hardly the first wealthy convict to get special treatment from the Feds. His treatment is what money buys in the US with powerful lawyers, and witnesses who often refuse to testify.

As for "The Deep State"? The FBI conducted an investigation into Esptein from 2006 to 2007 called Operation Leap Year which was never presented to a grand jury.

I'm not seeing Satanism here, I'm seeing Alan Dershowitz, I'm seeing what money and influence can do. Par for the course in the US.

Quote:
No, two-bit maths teacher from blue-collar Brooklyn Jeffrey Epstein was not 'just a dirty old man with a lot of money'.
Yes he was but he was not a Satanist.
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Old 6th December 2019, 08:53 PM   #390
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Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
If a lowly SUN or DAILY MAIL reader understands what is meant by satanic goings on then I am not sure why people on a sceptics forum are unable to grasp it.
So you rant about the evil Satan-worshiping Jeffry Epstein but somehow The SUN gets a pass for 40 years of Page 3? (which is the only reason to subscribe to The SUN).

What does The Independent think of this Satanism theory?
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Old 6th December 2019, 09:05 PM   #391
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Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
Look, when Moses raged at his people for building a golden calf it was because they reverted back to the gods served in Egypt which they had just escaped from. Did you really expect Exodus to go off on a tangent as to the 'history of Ba'al in Canaan and the Levant and how the worship of same spread to the Middle Egyptian dynasty'?
Except that "The Devil" doesn't appear in the Bible until after the Babylonian Captivity. The serpent in the Garden of Eden is later interpreted as being the devil but that was not the intentions of the original authors of that Old Testament text. Moreover the point of the golden calf in Exodus was about the dangers of the Israelites backsliding into the same kind of culture and religious beliefs of the kingdom they'd just escaped from, and to which the Ten Commandments represented a marked evolutionary departure from Egypt, Rome, and the tribal religions of northern Europe at that time.
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Old 6th December 2019, 11:27 PM   #392
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I would not entirely rule out some sort of conspiracy here, but I am guessing the conspiracy was one established and led by Epstein, and enabled by those who found his services useful, entertaining or lucrative. I think those who insist on finding hidden agencies and devils make the mistake of underestimating the ability of fairly ordinary people to be just plain evil, and the susceptibility of people to glib b.s. and promises of forbidden pleasures.
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Old 7th December 2019, 03:16 AM   #393
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Originally Posted by abaddon View Post
You have declared such beliefs to be "satanic" and thus worthy of legal action. Do no attempt to pretend that you have not. Do not make me quote you very own words.

For an example of what?

Evidence? Why am I asking, I know you have none.

I am in the west. I don't care about your values because they are plainly messed up.

You are imagining all of this. I agree.

Not a problem if one does not adhere to a religion. It is your sexual hang-up and your alone. You have no beeswax examining what may or may not happen in other peoples underpants.

Baloney. Post divorce, I have no shortage of partners. If one is in the mood, one can get it. WITH CONSENTING ADULTS.

BS. Sex is a normal human drive. Why on earth you feel the need to pile endless guilt upon such a normal human activity is beyond me. Next you will be claiming that the missionary position is the only correct one.

FFS, Tomorrow, I am on a blind date. She is 50, same as me. Will sex be involved? One can hope. But I will play it however it lays. You somehow seem to think that would be "fornication". And a "sin" against some "god" that is entirely invented out of your own fevered imagination.

I expect a pleasant, civilised date, but if sex does happen, I will PM you all the gory detail if you wish just so you realise that sex is a normal human activity, indeed a human driving force. At any age.

And straight into wild conspiracy theories. Colour me surprised. Got evidence? Of course not.
Good luck on your blind date.

However, the principles of sexual hygiene (protecting children, preventing STDs, HIV, unwanted pregnancies) I am afraid protects our society from amoral anti-social, anti-establishment predators who would love to see the family and the nation's mores fall into chaos and disarray.

I've got nothing against free will, this is what true responsibility is about. However, when someone like Epstein and his calculated scheme comes along to try to bring down governments (POTUS, ex-POTUS) legal systems (Attorney Acosta/Dershowitz [named by teenage girl 'survivors' in depositions citing sex trafficking, rape and abuse] who secured a lenient plea deal for this depraved walking abomination, then I am afraid I would rather see all of the perps involved brought to justice and if that makes me a prig then so be it.
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Old 7th December 2019, 03:22 AM   #394
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Originally Posted by abaddon View Post
That is the informal fallacy of an argument from ignorance. You cannot think of any other reason, therefore it MUST have been Moses.

Jews accept the 613 commandments (if observant). Didn't you know that? And which version of the so called ten commandments are you citing? There are three in the bible and none of them agree. Furthermore, jesus in the bible endorsed only five of those and added two more not in the ten. Which he plagiarised. Do you know which? I do.

Who cares about idols? Not me. Anyone can worship whatever they like. I don't care right up to the point when people like you attempt to impose your particular idol upon me or anyone else. At that point the imposer can foxtrot right oscar.

What do you mean by "fornicating" exactly? If extra-marital sex, then you are talking utter BS. And I speak from experience. If other, specify what you mean.

Plagiarised from elsewhere by the bible.
Is it? So you mean to suggest that before the wandering jews reached Mt. Sinai, none of them knew that murder was not a good thing? Really? In that case they would never have reached Sinai in the first place, being busy murdering each other.

Nope, it is one of those "tells" that jahweh was quite aware that there were other gods. But as the bible tells us jahweh was a jealous god. What else would he say?

Baal is not generic. Only you have tried to make him so under instruction from a priesthood with a vested interest in having you and everyone else accept such a proposition.

To me, Baal is just another in the thousands of false claimed gods. No more real that the pixies that make flowers grow.

False. I am all for fidelity in a relationship. But when such a relationship stops, one does not have to become a celibate forever.

Your prudishness is not impressive. Why should YOU care what consenting adults do in the privacy of their bedroom? What business is it of yours?

Why should I? I was one such. Of course they exist. Nothing satanic about it, though. That is all in your imagination.



And nobody here is denying that. Everyone is simply pointing out that this breathless satanic crap is utter nonsense akin to the whole reds under the bed baloney. It's superstitious nonsense.
In which way is it crap. I am curious to know why you are 'all for fidelity in a relationship'? Where does that come from as you don't believe in all this 'crap'. Don't tell us. Suddenly you believe in morals after all.

IMV the Jews have got it right. Stop worshipping statues and material objects. There is such a thing as good and evil otherwise our brains would not have evolved to be wired to such concepts. IMV every evolved individual is free to choose the path of good or the path of evil. The less evolved can carry on worshipping idols and know not why they are living in darkness.
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Old 7th December 2019, 03:33 AM   #395
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Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
In which way is it crap. I am curious to know why you are 'all for fidelity in a relationship'? Where does that come from as you don't believe in all this 'crap'. Don't tell us. Suddenly you believe in morals after all.
What an idiotic statement. Of course I have morals. I just do not get them from a stupid magic book.

Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
IMV the Jews have got it right. Stop worshipping statues and material objects.
I don't worship anything. Why would I?

Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
There is such a thing as good and evil otherwise our brains would not have evolved to be wired to such concepts.
Who created evil?

Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
IMV every evolved individual is free to choose the path of good or the path of evil.
Not so. Are you free to choose to murder somebody? Yes. Will there be consequences? Yes.

Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
The less evolved can carry on worshipping idols and know not why they are living in darkness.
There is no such thing as a "less evolved" person. That is an utterly bovine statement. Go learn what evolution is.
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Old 7th December 2019, 04:14 AM   #396
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Originally Posted by Axxman300 View Post
No, nobody's confused. What we have here is a real live conspiracy with all the bells and whistles: Sex trafficking out in the open, high-profile political figures attending parties and taking money and going to his island, evidence of camera use in private spaces for possible blackmail use, and under these conditions a DoJ uncomfortably slow to act.

None of this is in dispute. The investigation is ongoing.




And now we have the Deep State involved.

Epstein was hardly the first wealthy convict to get special treatment from the Feds. His treatment is what money buys in the US with powerful lawyers, and witnesses who often refuse to testify.

As for "The Deep State"? The FBI conducted an investigation into Esptein from 2006 to 2007 called Operation Leap Year which was never presented to a grand jury.

I'm not seeing Satanism here, I'm seeing Alan Dershowitz, I'm seeing what money and influence can do. Par for the course in the US.



Yes he was but he was not a Satanist.

Are you sure 'the investigation is ongoing'? Didn't the charges die with Epstein, together with the sealed evidence?

You are living in Cloud Cuckoo Land if you think the case is still open.

Sure there is a queue of victims who will get compensation from his estate.

That's finito. And of course, posters here will be glad about that as they no believe in conspiracy theory. He was just a randy old guy. Just like Jimmy Savile. Never had to face justice.
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Old 7th December 2019, 04:16 AM   #397
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Originally Posted by turingtest View Post
Yeah, that's... pretty weak. Somehow, though, I'm not surprised you weren't able to quote somebody actually saying what you need them to be saying. I guess if you need to be the only righteous person in the room, making sinners of everyone else is the easiest way to do it.

(You should just consider that a paraphrase of all the things you've said )
Your projection.

All in your mind.
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Old 7th December 2019, 04:24 AM   #398
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Originally Posted by bruto View Post
I would not entirely rule out some sort of conspiracy here, but I am guessing the conspiracy was one established and led by Epstein, and enabled by those who found his services useful, entertaining or lucrative. I think those who insist on finding hidden agencies and devils make the mistake of underestimating the ability of fairly ordinary people to be just plain evil, and the susceptibility of people to glib b.s. and promises of forbidden pleasures.
I don't think it was established and led by Epstein. He was just an agent. Why do I think that? The Nobel Prize winning scientists he mixed with didn't think he was at all brilliant. They thought his platitudinous utterings dumb and revealed shallow knowledge.

As for financial acumen. There was only one known investor, Les Wexner. All the accountant types I know have portfolios of hundreds, even thousands of clients.
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Old 7th December 2019, 07:53 AM   #399
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Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
I don't think it was established and led by Epstein. He was just an agent. Why do I think that? The Nobel Prize winning scientists he mixed with didn't think he was at all brilliant. They thought his platitudinous utterings dumb and revealed shallow knowledge.

As for financial acumen. There was only one known investor, Les Wexner. All the accountant types I know have portfolios of hundreds, even thousands of clients.
Scientists saw him as dumb and shallow, or so they say now, and apparently went along with him because he had money and influence and they, in areas other than science, would appear to have been dumb and shallow in their own ways. Look how scientists and institutions are backpedalling now from their greedy feeding at the Sackler trough.

As for financial acumen, who knows? Maybe he was just lucky, or his skills were limited. Like the proverbial hedgehog, he did not have to know everything if he knew one thing well. And in the financial world you don't actually even have to know one thing well if you are lucky. Look at the financial crisis a few years ago. It was fueled largely by people whose overall ignorance was hidden by luck, unaware or unconcerned that they were essentially playing russian roulette.

The world is full of people who have skills and abilities in one area and are fools in others. I think you underestimate the degree to which a person with a certain form of cleverness can snow others, and the degree to which people, when they see a crowd, will simply join it. Now after the fact, after it's unfashionable to be associated with him, everyone says what a shallow fool Epstein was, but when it was fashionable, they were in the line.
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Old 7th December 2019, 10:56 AM   #400
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Originally Posted by Vixen View Post
You just don't get it. Do you really believe these people did the posh person equivalent of hiring a motel room or massage parlour for bog standard common or garden variety prostitution?

Think about it it. What was the need for remote islands, ranches in semi-arrid desert and 42 roomed-mansions?
If I were an incredibly wealthy, evil bloke, and trying to impress teenage girls, there are two chat up options. Would you a) Like a quicky in the local Travel Lodge? b) Come on holiday to my private island in the Caribbean?

Shameless name drop alert: I did sit opposite and chatted with Michael Spencer - said to be worth about £1.15B - a few years ago at a mutual friend's birthday lunch, so that might be my 'in' to middle aged debauchery. And the local Premier Inn is two minutes' walk from my home.

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