Did Epstein run a World Satanic Ring?

[Axxman300]

A recap for those just tuning in:

Vixen thinks Jeffery Epstein ran a Satanic Cult with global reach. This claim is based on off-the-wall artwork in his home and a variety of sculptures found around his private island.

None of this artwork is Satanic unless you view it through Vixen's version of what Satanism is and thus what is Satanic.

The rest of the claims (secret underground lairs complete with a dock for a submarine, etc) come from Qanon websites, and that pantheon of British journalism, The SUN.

At no point do the actual facts of the Epstein case or cases come into play in this thread unless brought up by others. For some as yet unexplained reason the act of grooming underaged girls and boys to be used as sex -puppets for Epstein and his rich and powerful friends is not evil enough, and a dark supernatural element must be added into the mix. As if Satanism explains everything.

[Belz...]

Originally Posted by Axxman300

The rest of the claims (secret underground lairs complete with a dock for a submarine, etc) come from Qanon websites, and that pantheon of British journalism, The SUN.

Did you mean paragon?

[The Greater Fool]

Originally Posted by Axxman300

A recap for those just tuning in:

Vixen thinks Jeffery Epstein ran a Satanic Cult with global reach. This claim is based on off-the-wall artwork in his home and a variety of sculptures found around his private island.

None of this artwork is Satanic unless you view it through Vixen's version of what Satanism is and thus what is Satanic.

The rest of the claims (secret underground lairs complete with a dock for a submarine, etc) come from Qanon websites, and that pantheon of British journalism, The SUN.

At no point do the actual facts of the Epstein case or cases come into play in this thread unless brought up by others. For some as yet unexplained reason the act of grooming underaged girls and boys to be used as sex -puppets for Epstein and his rich and powerful friends is not evil enough, and a dark supernatural element must be added into the mix. As if Satanism explains everything.

The vibe I'm getting from Vixen is like certain fundamentalist Christian sects that believe anyone not worshiping their god in their way are, in fact, worshiping Satan.

Even the idea that fans of some Celebrity are by their 'devotion' worshiping Satan. The "you worship whats on your mind" is also Satan.

[Vixen]

Originally Posted by The Greater Fool

The vibe I'm getting from Vixen is like certain fundamentalist Christian sects that believe anyone not worshiping their god in their way are, in fact, worshiping Satan.

Even the idea that fans of some Celebrity are by their 'devotion' worshiping Satan. The "you worship whats on your mind" is also Satan.

I don't want to get into theological argument here but didn't Satan say to Jesus in the desert (for 40 days and 40 nights) come up to the top of this mount and look at the sight of the cities spread out ahead of you; all this could be yours if you bow down and worship me. The hidden message here is that Satan owns the world (material things) which he tempts people with in exchange for wealth and material stuff.

Just because you don't believe in the philosophy of good and bad it doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

We are all on this earth for a very short time. It can be meaningless as it is for an animal or it can be on a higher consciousness.

[Vixen]

Originally Posted by Axxman300

A recap for those just tuning in:

Vixen thinks Jeffery Epstein ran a Satanic Cult with global reach. This claim is based on off-the-wall artwork in his home and a variety of sculptures found around his private island.

None of this artwork is Satanic unless you view it through Vixen's version of what Satanism is and thus what is Satanic.

The rest of the claims (secret underground lairs complete with a dock for a submarine, etc) come from Qanon websites, and that pantheon of British journalism, The SUN.

At no point do the actual facts of the Epstein case or cases come into play in this thread unless brought up by others. For some as yet unexplained reason the act of grooming underaged girls and boys to be used as sex -puppets for Epstein and his rich and powerful friends is not evil enough, and a dark supernatural element must be added into the mix. As if Satanism explains everything.

I was putting it forward as a hypothesis as it is starkly obvious to me a conspiracy of a large number of people in positions of power. If these people can simply acquire sex any time they want, they obviously did not need to associate with Epstein to get it.

With Epstein they got authorised orgies in authorised (ritualistic) settings.

[BStrong]

Originally Posted by Vixen

I don't want to get into theological argument here but didn't Satan say to Jesus in the desert (for 40 days and 40 nights) come up to the top of this mount and look at the sight of the cities spread out ahead of you; all this could be yours if you bow down and worship me. The hidden message here is that Satan owns the world (material things) which he tempts people with in exchange for wealth and material stuff.

Just because you don't believe in the philosophy of good and bad it doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

We are all on this earth for a very short time. It can be meaningless as it is for an animal or it can be on a higher consciousness.

******** come in all types, but every single time someone played the satan worshiper child abuse card with our department the evidence collected never supported the SW narrative.

Our agency successfully investigated serious child molestation cases that went to trial and ended in convictions but no allegation of satanic abuse or satanic ritual abuse has ever proved out - and in a couple of those cases it was clear from investigating the claim and the evidence that the only abuse that took place was in an adult's imagination.

YMMV, but in my pov Epstein et al were/are a bunch of garden variety pedos and it's too bad they didn't organize a nice boat trip for themselves that ended with the intervention of an iceberg.

[Vixen]

Originally Posted by BStrong

******** come in all types, but every single time someone played the satan worshiper child abuse card with our department the evidence collected never supported the SW narrative.

Our agency successfully investigated serious child molestation cases that went to trial and ended in convictions but no allegation of satanic abuse or satanic ritual abuse has ever proved out - and in a couple of those cases it was clear from investigating the claim and the evidence that the only abuse that took place was in an adult's imagination.

YMMV, but in my pov Epstein et al were/are a bunch of garden variety pedos and it's too bad they didn't organize a nice boat trip for themselves that ended with the intervention of an iceberg.

Doesn't add up. IMV it is likely a CIA-Mossad type project, interfering in the operations of another country (US/UK western values). CIA wasn't above MK_Ultra, was it, so fact can be stranger than fiction and often is.

[bruto]

Originally Posted by Vixen

I don't want to get into theological argument here but didn't Satan say to Jesus in the desert (for 40 days and 40 nights) come up to the top of this mount and look at the sight of the cities spread out ahead of you; all this could be yours if you bow down and worship me. The hidden message here is that Satan owns the world (material things) which he tempts people with in exchange for wealth and material stuff.

Just because you don't believe in the philosophy of good and bad it doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

We are all on this earth for a very short time. It can be meaningless as it is for an animal or it can be on a higher consciousness.

Where does that come from? Who said that? What does that have to do with your off-the-wall condemnation of every religion or cult that doesn't share your Christian ideas with Satanism?

[The Greater Fool]

Originally Posted by Vixen

I don't want to get into theological argument here but didn't Satan say to Jesus in the desert (for 40 days and 40 nights) come up to the top of this mount and look at the sight of the cities spread out ahead of you; all this could be yours if you bow down and worship me. The hidden message here is that Satan owns the world (material things) which he tempts people with in exchange for wealth and material stuff.

Just because you don't believe in the philosophy of good and bad it doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

We are all on this earth for a very short time. It can be meaningless as it is for an animal or it can be on a higher consciousness.

You just landed squarely in fundamentalist country. I knew I had it right. In point of fact, I have a strong sense of your flavor of fundamentalism. You should not be 'associating' with the likes of us, shame on you!

At least I now get why your threads seem to be other worldly. They are. And they just keep on giving.

[Roger Ramjets]

Originally Posted by Vixen

I don't want to get into theological argument here but didn't Satan say to Jesus in the desert (for 40 days and 40 nights) come up to the top of this mount and look at the sight of the cities spread out ahead of you; all this could be yours if you bow down and worship me.

No, that was just another of God's lies. His Satan is a caricature of any rational being who opposes His evil designs.

Quote:

The hidden message here is that Satan owns the world (material things) which he tempts people with in exchange for wealth and material stuff.

Whereas God threatened them with with eternal damnation if they didn't give up their material stuff, and offered in replacement a lie.

Quote:

Just because you don't believe in the philosophy of good and bad it doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

Not me. I absolutely believe. Because I have read the Bible and discerned its true agenda - to trick us into believing that evil is good, to make us distrust our own judgement and put our faith in an evil being who delights in doing horrible things.

Quote:

We are all on this earth for a very short time. It can be meaningless as it is for an animal or it can be on a higher consciousness.

Yes, such a short time to correct the evil that God and his followers have done, and no afterlife to look forward to either. We are animals, but our lives are not meaningless.

[Axxman300]

Originally Posted by Belz...

Did you mean paragon?

Probably...I haven't updated my Illuminati Thesaurus...

[Axxman300]

Originally Posted by Vixen

I was putting it forward as a hypothesis as it is starkly obvious to me a conspiracy of a large number of people in positions of power. If these people can simply acquire sex any time they want, they obviously did not need to associate with Epstein to get it.

With Epstein they got authorised orgies in authorised (ritualistic) settings.

1. You assume "people in positions of power" can acquire sex "any time they want" but that's not as simple as you seem to think it is. They just don't get on the internet or look through the phone book, introductions have to be made and both sides have to be vetted before a transaction is made.

2. Epstein offered a way around #1. He threw parties where attractive young women were available for "massages" and so on. Also at these parties were other wealthy people. There were many reasons a politician would attend and many more reasons a rich pervert would RSVP Jeffrey.

3. These parties are held in his homes in NYC, Florida, New Mexico, and the US Virgin Islands.

4. Not everyone who attended these parties was there for sex or even knew about that activity.

5. There is no evidence of ritual activity at any of Epstein's properties.

6. You assume that Epstein was hands-on with his Island's decor. In many cases people with his money just hire a landscape artist and interior decorator and give them a budget and tell them to make it look good.

[Axxman300]

Originally Posted by Vixen

Doesn't add up. IMV it is likely a CIA-Mossad type project, interfering in the operations of another country (US/UK western values). CIA wasn't above MK_Ultra, was it, so fact can be stranger than fiction and often is.

Now we've arrived in Crazy Town.

First off, Honey Traps are tailored to the target and are carefully set up. Second, Epstein's parties would have been targeted by just about every intelligence service on the globe as many upscale events are because they are great locations to pick up gossip and intelligence.

Nothing about Epstein suggests he was an intelligence asset but there is a lot of circumstantial evidence that he was a blackmailer who used people to enrich himself and win favors from others.

[Vixen]

Originally Posted by Axxman300

1. You assume "people in positions of power" can acquire sex "any time they want" but that's not as simple as you seem to think it is. They just don't get on the internet or look through the phone book, introductions have to be made and both sides have to be vetted before a transaction is made.

2. Epstein offered a way around #1. He threw parties where attractive young women were available for "massages" and so on. Also at these parties were other wealthy people. There were many reasons a politician would attend and many more reasons a rich pervert would RSVP Jeffrey.

3. These parties are held in his homes in NYC, Florida, New Mexico, and the US Virgin Islands.

4. Not everyone who attended these parties was there for sex or even knew about that activity.

5. There is no evidence of ritual activity at any of Epstein's properties.

6. You assume that Epstein was hands-on with his Island's decor. In many cases people with his money just hire a landscape artist and interior decorator and give them a budget and tell them to make it look good.

If you look at parties 'for the rich and famous' you'll see the guys are expected to bring their wives /girlfriends/ first lady / partners along.

With Epstein, guys (like Clinton, Trump, Prince Andrew, Alan Dershowitz) can just turn up without their SO. (Dershowitz claims he was never alone with Epstein without his wife. Ha! 'He who denies it...')

Likewise look who it is. It is some bum from blue-collar Brooklyn, a would be maths teacher turned trader then partner, zero talent for anything much.

Look next at Jimmy Savile, a mediocre DJ (who unlike Peel, Harris, Freeman and even Tony Blackburn [Motown]) didn't even have good taste in pop music, from a lowly working class area of Yorkshire - Leeds, IIRC, one of the poorest cities in the UK, in terms of slums. No great skill other than tv presenting and even then he was largely overbearing and unbearable. YET. Jimmy Savile was a close friend of Prince Charles, heir apparent.

So, like Jimmy Savile - a prolific and notorious paedophile who was never arrested - Jeffrey Epstein, too, was in the inner circle of the Royal Family, even turning up at Balmoral and Windsor Castle.

Yet all you guys can do is fail to put two and two together, and claim, 'oh he was just a rich old perv.'

Peeps, wake up! It is staring at you.

[Vixen]

Originally Posted by Axxman300

Now we've arrived in Crazy Town.

First off, Honey Traps are tailored to the target and are carefully set up. Second, Epstein's parties would have been targeted by just about every intelligence service on the globe as many upscale events are because they are great locations to pick up gossip and intelligence.

Nothing about Epstein suggests he was an intelligence asset but there is a lot of circumstantial evidence that he was a blackmailer who used people to enrich himself and win favors from others.

No, this wasn't a 'honey trap'. It was a concerted attempt by a non-western intelligence to devalue the social mores of a western one. (Is the hypothesis.)

Robert Maxwell was linked to Mossad long before Epstein came on the scene. So not as far-fetched as you might think. After all, both appeared immune from prosecution until the DAILY MIRROR pensioners kicked up a stink about the emptying of their pension funds. Robert Maxwell had cleared it out and it was only then discovered he'd set up a whole load of fake cardboard cut-out investment companies each transferring money amongst each other that the house of cards collapsed. Daughter Ghislaine pops up a couple of decades later seemingly swimming in money when the family were supposedly bankrupted, so it is likely Maxwell stashed away a few million away from the prying eyes of the Official Receivers and Proceeds of Crime guys.

Ghislaine has never been interviewed nor investigated either.

[Vixen]

Originally Posted by bruto

Where does that come from? Who said that? What does that have to do with your off-the-wall condemnation of every religion or cult that doesn't share your Christian ideas with Satanism?

Whoa! A barrage of straw man arguments! I have the greatest respect for other people's religions. I would never ever mock or show contempt for other people's beliefs. Let's get that straight.

[Vixen]

Originally Posted by The Greater Fool

You just landed squarely in fundamentalist country. I knew I had it right. In point of fact, I have a strong sense of your flavor of fundamentalism. You should not be 'associating' with the likes of us, shame on you!

At least I now get why your threads seem to be other worldly. They are. And they just keep on giving.

Logical fallacy #101 comes along just in time: the ad hominem abuse.

[Vixen]

Originally Posted by Roger Ramjets

No, that was just another of God's lies. His Satan is a caricature of any rational being who opposes His evil designs.

Whereas God threatened them with with eternal damnation if they didn't give up their material stuff, and offered in replacement a lie.

Not me. I absolutely believe. Because I have read the Bible and discerned its true agenda - to trick us into believing that evil is good, to make us distrust our own judgement and put our faith in an evil being who delights in doing horrible things.

Yes, such a short time to correct the evil that God and his followers have done, and no afterlife to look forward to either. We are animals, but our lives are not meaningless.

Yeah! Let's all go back to the Dark Ages when anything goes. Eat, drink and be merry for tomorrow we die! Yay!

[Axxman300]

Originally Posted by Vixen

If you look at parties 'for the rich and famous' you'll see the guys are expected to bring their wives /girlfriends/ first lady / partners along.

With Epstein, guys (like Clinton, Trump, Prince Andrew, Alan Dershowitz) can just turn up without their SO. (Dershowitz claims he was never alone with Epstein without his wife. Ha! 'He who denies it...')

Likewise look who it is. It is some bum from blue-collar Brooklyn, a would be maths teacher turned trader then partner, zero talent for anything much.

Look next at Jimmy Savile, a mediocre DJ (who unlike Peel, Harris, Freeman and even Tony Blackburn [Motown]) didn't even have good taste in pop music, from a lowly working class area of Yorkshire - Leeds, IIRC, one of the poorest cities in the UK, in terms of slums. No great skill other than tv presenting and even then he was largely overbearing and unbearable. YET. Jimmy Savile was a close friend of Prince Charles, heir apparent.

So, like Jimmy Savile - a prolific and notorious paedophile who was never arrested - Jeffrey Epstein, too, was in the inner circle of the Royal Family, even turning up at Balmoral and Windsor Castle.

Yet all you guys can do is fail to put two and two together, and claim, 'oh he was just a rich old perv.'

Peeps, wake up! It is staring at you.

What is staring me in the face are guys like Joaquin Guzman, John Gotti, Sam Giancana, Bill Gates, Steve Jobs, Mark Zuckerberg, Larry Ellison and a list of other rich and powerful men who had little or no college education and yet somehow came to run syndicates of various size and power.

Many of these guys are ethically challenged but none of them got to the top by Satan worship.

[Vixen]

Originally Posted by Axxman300

What is staring me in the face are guys like Joaquin Guzman, John Gotti, Sam Giancana, Bill Gates, Steve Jobs, Mark Zuckerberg, Larry Ellison and a list of other rich and powerful men who had little or no college education and yet somehow came to run syndicates of various size and power.

Many of these guys are ethically challenged but none of them got to the top by Satan worship.

I think you'll notice from the above list, these guys had great talent, especially in IT. IT guys have amongst the highest IQ's, I read somewhere.

Those guys invented things or dreamt up start ups that become exceedingly popular.

What did Jeffrey Epstein ever do for mankind?

Or come to think of it, Jimmy Savile?

[Cosmic Yak]

Originally Posted by Vixen

With Epstein they got authorised orgies in authorised (ritualistic) settings.

You keep saying this.
Are you ever going to back it up with evidence?

[Cosmic Yak]

Originally Posted by Vixen

What did Jeffrey Epstein ever do for mankind?

Well, he seems to have been the best ever recruiter for Satanism.
You, by the way, having enrolled everyone from the Ancient Egyptians to Bill Clinton, are the second best.

Originally Posted by Vixen

Or come to think of it, Jimmy Savile?

Jim'll Fix It ran for years, and brought happiness to countless people.
That was one reason why it was such a shock when the truth about him came out.
Same with Rolf Harris.

[Vixen]

Originally Posted by Cosmic Yak

You keep saying this.
Are you ever going to back it up with evidence?

The massive group shower rooms. The rooms piled high with dozens of cushions. The large underground 'nightclub' rooms where staff were forbidden to tread. The 'baby-making' ranch, with Epsteins crazy-but-true plan to impregnate fifty women at a time with the seed of top scientists and himself.

This is factual.

[Vixen]

Originally Posted by Cosmic Yak

Well, he seems to have been the best ever recruiter for Satanism.
You, by the way, having enrolled everyone from the Ancient Egyptians to Bill Clinton, are the second best.



Jim'll Fix It ran for years, and brought happiness to countless people.
That was one reason why it was such a shock when the truth about him came out.
Same with Rolf Harris.

I never knew anyone who liked Jimmy Savile or his taste in music.

Rolf Harris: I like 'Sun Arise'. That's about it.

[Jack by the hedge]

Originally Posted by Vixen

This is factual.

Where is it on a scale of "citation needed" factual to "evidence which would stand up in court" factual?

[Belz...]

Originally Posted by Vixen

Doesn't add up.

And you've got a nose for such things.

[Belz...]

Originally Posted by Vixen

Logical fallacy #101 comes along just in time: the ad hominem abuse.

That's not an ad hominem, but not understanding fallacies is a given here.

[Craig4]

Did any victim from the first trial or the ones who made statements in court after Epstein's suicide mention anything about Satanic rituals?

[Cosmic Yak]

Originally Posted by Vixen

The massive group shower rooms. The rooms piled high with dozens of cushions. The large underground 'nightclub' rooms where staff were forbidden to tread. The 'baby-making' ranch, with Epsteins crazy-but-true plan to impregnate fifty women at a time with the seed of top scientists and himself.

This is factual.

Cushions? Seriously? This is absolute desperation.

None of this remotely resembles evidence for ritualised orgies.

[Cosmic Yak]

Originally Posted by Vixen

I never knew anyone who liked Jimmy Savile or his taste in music.

Rolf Harris: I like 'Sun Arise'. That's about it.

None of which changes the fact that many people did.

Which was the point of my post.

[Thermal]

Originally Posted by Vixen

...Likewise look who it is. It is some bum from blue-collar Brooklyn, a would be maths teacher turned trader then partner, zero talent for anything much....

Yeah, in the States a hustler can get pretty far, with a combination of luck and sociopathy. There's nothing remotely implausible about this.

Originally Posted by Vixen

The massive group shower rooms...

As noted before, y'all have not been around high end baths much. Huge showers are a staple in luxury homes. They are not meant to indicate occupancy, just extravagance. The one pictured earlier had one shower head, and the cosmetics alcoves were consistent with a single rich user's products. If you see any large space, do you assume that it was designed around the concept of uncomfortable group sex on hard flooring and sharp edges with glass walls?

Quote:

...The large underground 'nightclub' rooms where staff were forbidden to tread...

This is factual.

Factual. I see. You sure this isn't rumor? You, uh...are familiar with cleaning and maintenance personnel there? Hey, how we doing on factual pictures of this nightclub? Throw in the submarine docks while we are at it.

[Belz...]

Originally Posted by Cosmic Yak

Cushions? Seriously? This is absolute desperation.

None of this remotely resembles evidence for ritualised orgies.

But dude, there were cushions. Not chairs, CUSHIONS! What more do you need to prove that orgies took place there? What, was the giant chess board not enough for ya?

[BStrong]

Originally Posted by Vixen

Doesn't add up. IMV it is likely a CIA-Mossad type project, interfering in the operations of another country (US/UK western values). CIA wasn't above MK_Ultra, was it, so fact can be stranger than fiction and often is.

Opinions are not facts.

If you wish to believe that various gov/intel/whatever agencies are running interference for pedos that's your prerogative, but aside from connect-the-dots CT loons the evidence for the theory doesn't exist.

[Vixen]

Originally Posted by Craig4

Did any victim from the first trial or the ones who made statements in court after Epstein's suicide mention anything about Satanic rituals?

Hello? Acosta arranged a plea deal. IOW no evidence was presented as Epstein pleaded guilty in exchange for a 13-month out-of-jail sentence, no questions asked.

[Vixen]

Originally Posted by BStrong

Opinions are not facts.

If you wish to believe that various gov/intel/whatever agencies are running interference for pedos that's your prerogative, but aside from connect-the-dots CT loons the evidence for the theory doesn't exist.

MK-ULTRA project is an historical fact, not an opinion.

[Vixen]

Originally Posted by Cosmic Yak

None of which changes the fact that many people did.

Which was the point of my post.

Many people liked Noel Edmonds or Chris Tarrant. They never became part of the Royal Family inner circle like Jimmy Savile, profligate child abuser, did.

[Belz...]

Originally Posted by Vixen

MK-ULTRA project is an historical fact, not an opinion.

And what does it have to do with this case?




Oh, sorry, I forgot who I was talking to.

[Vixen]

Originally Posted by Thermal

Yeah, in the States a hustler can get pretty far, with a combination of luck and sociopathy. There's nothing remotely implausible about this.



As noted before, y'all have not been around high end baths much. Huge showers are a staple in luxury homes. They are not meant to indicate occupancy, just extravagance. The one pictured earlier had one shower head, and the cosmetics alcoves were consistent with a single rich user's products. If you see any large space, do you assume that it was designed around the concept of uncomfortable group sex on hard flooring and sharp edges with glass walls?



Factual. I see. You sure this isn't rumor? You, uh...are familiar with cleaning and maintenance personnel there? Hey, how we doing on factual pictures of this nightclub? Throw in the submarine docks while we are at it.

Factual in the sense eye witness ex-staff described it as thus.

There was a submarine dock at Little St Thomas as it was a tourist spot for people to visit for submarine sightseeing.

Ghislaine Maxwell was an enthusiastic submarinist and founded TarraMar (_sp?). She was video at a conference bragging that 65% of ocean was outside any legal jurisdiction. Strange topic to have done your homework on.

[Vixen]

Originally Posted by Belz...

And what does it have to do with this case?




Oh, sorry, I forgot who I was talking to.

Sorry, are you personalising your post?

if you read back you can discover the reference.

[Belz...]

Originally Posted by Vixen

Sorry, are you personalising your post?

Well, I tried using reason and requests for evidence but clearly you're not interested in that. You're too in love with your own speculation. So yeah, derision is the only thing left for you.