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2nd July 2014, 11:57 PM | #1 |
Penultimate Amazing
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Bitcoin - Part 2
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Found this story about the auction: http://www.chicagotribune.com/busine...,4038036.story
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3rd July 2014, 12:21 AM | #2 |
Penultimate Amazing
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As long as people believe in absurdities they will continue to commit atrocities. - Voltaire. |
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3rd July 2014, 01:47 AM | #3 |
Penultimate Amazing
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3rd July 2014, 02:07 AM | #4 |
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If you use it carefully and the government doesn't get hold of your computers containing unencrypted bit-wallets, then yes. The claims are correct, to a degree.
But the transfer of Bitcoins between wallets is completely transparent and easily traceable. If they find out which wallet is yours (such as checking whose bank account is being used to buy more or sell off the Bitcoins in that account), they can easily watch how many Bitcoins are passing through your wallet and where they're going. (There are anonymous services that can disguise where the Bitcoins are coming from and going to, but they charge a fee, and there's no way to be sure they won't keep all your Bitcoins for themselves.) If the government gets hold of your computer, and your wallet is on it (and not password protected) they can just pretend to be you and transfer the Bitcoins to a government wallet. If it is password protected, they can always try to crack the password or, more simply, pressure you to hand over the password with threats of pressing extra charges. The only way to be absolutely sure your Bitcoins are safe is to keep the wallet on a storage device or piece of paper and hide it somewhere they'll never find it. But that's inconvenient for you, because you'd have to retrieve it every time you want to use it, and they could always pressure you to reveal its location. If you keep your Bitcoins in an exchange, its easy for them to get hold of them, they just have to force the exchange to turn over your account, exactly as they would with a bank account. |
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3rd July 2014, 06:04 AM | #5 |
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“That which can be asserted without evidence, can be dismissed without evidence.” – Christopher Hitchens. |
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3rd July 2014, 06:15 AM | #6 |
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You could bid for the individual blocks and not necessarily for all of them, hence it was kinda newsworthy one bidder outbid all the blocks.
http://www.coindesk.com/18-million-w...us-government/ |
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“That which can be asserted without evidence, can be dismissed without evidence.” – Christopher Hitchens. |
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3rd July 2014, 06:25 AM | #7 |
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“That which can be asserted without evidence, can be dismissed without evidence.” – Christopher Hitchens. |
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3rd July 2014, 12:48 PM | #8 |
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It is none of these things if you are careless. Bitcoin is not idiot proof and what Thomas Tusser had to say about "a fool and his money" applies equally well to bitcoin holders.
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"The process by which banks create money is so simple that the mind is repelled. Where something so important is involved, a deeper mystery seems only decent." - Galbraith, 1975 |
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3rd July 2014, 06:57 PM | #9 |
Penultimate Amazing
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A fool thinks himself to be wise, but a wise man knows himself to be a fool. William Shakespeare |
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5th July 2014, 02:06 PM | #10 |
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Hmmm - so this thread is no longer about "The Most Important Creation In The History Of Man".
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"The process by which banks create money is so simple that the mind is repelled. Where something so important is involved, a deeper mystery seems only decent." - Galbraith, 1975 |
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5th July 2014, 05:16 PM | #11 |
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Sandra's seen a leprechaun, Eddie touched a troll, Laurie danced with witches once, Charlie found some goblins' gold. Donald heard a mermaid sing, Susie spied an elf, But all the magic I have known I've had to make myself. - Shel Silverstein |
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5th July 2014, 10:23 PM | #12 |
Master Poster
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I disagree - they can remove your access to your bitcoins, to your liberty or to your life, but that cannot take your bitcoin.
This issues isn't specific to bitcoin but to personal secret data. It's truly possible to encrypt data st no rational amount of processing power can decrypt it w/o the key. It's always possible that some future mathematician will devise a clever way to crack these crypts more rapidly, but that's tentative and even dubious in the case of certain crypts. So imagine that you carefully manage the key that controls your bitcoin identity or other secret data. The day you get arrested/kidnapped you destroy the key. Now it's impossible for anyone to access the encrypted data. No one can obtain this data.
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Truly destroying recorded data is another issue - but not unreachable. |
5th July 2014, 11:13 PM | #13 |
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"The process by which banks create money is so simple that the mind is repelled. Where something so important is involved, a deeper mystery seems only decent." - Galbraith, 1975 |
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8th July 2014, 12:46 AM | #14 |
Penultimate Amazing
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The EU (EBA, European Banking Authority) agrees with me that an officially regulated virtual currency (VC) is needed:
"A governance authority may, at first, appear incompatible with the conceptual origins of VCs as a decentralised scheme that does not require the involvement of a central bank or government. However, the mandatory creation of a scheme governance body does not imply that VC units have to be centrally issued. This function can remain decentralised and be run through, for example, a protocol and a transaction ledger." -- EBA Opinion on ‘virtual currencies’ pp. 40 -- http://www.eba.europa.eu/documents/1...Currencies.pdf |
9th July 2014, 01:04 AM | #15 |
Penultimate Amazing
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Not quite, they say that virtual currencies should be regulated not that:
You've also made it sound like they've taken you up on your suggestion rather than you happening to share the same view. |
9th July 2014, 01:35 AM | #16 |
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..... and even then, they are more interested in ensuring that existing financial services are quarantined from "virtual currencies". From page 44:
Until a comprehensive regulatory regime is developed, (if it is developed at all), only those risks can be mitigated that arise in the interaction between VC schemes and the regulated financial services sector (but not those that arise from activities within or between VC schemes). This would include risks of money laundering and financial crime, the risks to conventional payment systems, and some risks to individual users. To that end, the EBA recommends that national supervisory authorities discourage credit institutions, payment institutions, and e-money institutions from buying, holding or selling VCs, thereby 'shielding' regulated financial services from VCs. |
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"The process by which banks create money is so simple that the mind is repelled. Where something so important is involved, a deeper mystery seems only decent." - Galbraith, 1975 |
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10th July 2014, 03:30 AM | #17 |
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As human right is always something given, it always in reality reduces to the right which men give, "concede," to each other. If the right to existence is conceded to new-born children, then they have the right; if it is not conceded to them, as was the case among the Spartans and ancient Romans, then they do not have it. For only society can give or concede it to them; they themselves cannot take it, or give it to themselves. |
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10th July 2014, 11:58 PM | #18 |
Scholar
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But how would that work exactly? There's a bang on the door and you look outside - it's the pigs, delete! "Sorry to bother you sir but you've left your headlights on".
If you get arrested (or kidnapped!), there's no guaranteed grace period where you get a chance to delete your stuff. |
11th July 2014, 02:08 AM | #19 |
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"The process by which banks create money is so simple that the mind is repelled. Where something so important is involved, a deeper mystery seems only decent." - Galbraith, 1975 |
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11th July 2014, 02:32 AM | #20 |
Non credunt, semper verificare
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12th July 2014, 03:48 AM | #21 |
Muse
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That sounds safe. You end up in hospital or end up in jail over some petty stuff. Boom, your drug fortune is gone..
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12th July 2014, 06:10 AM | #22 |
Penultimate Amazing
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Share the key between a number of people. divide it in to say 4 parts then tell 8 people who don't know each other a part of the key. That way each part is copied twice (in case one of your people loses it or isn't available.
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23rd July 2014, 07:47 PM | #23 |
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23rd July 2014, 09:40 PM | #24 |
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Yawn. Nothing new here; they're laying off the volatility risk on Coinbase, same as Overstock.com did. If a big company decided to accept Bitcoins directly, then you'd have news.
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8th August 2014, 09:50 PM | #25 |
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Bitcoin prices have been ho-humming along in the $550 to $650 range for over 2 months now (will it never get down to $150? ).
This is a clear indication that it is not a major news item ATM and that I have not made any predictions on its price for over 2 months. |
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"The process by which banks create money is so simple that the mind is repelled. Where something so important is involved, a deeper mystery seems only decent." - Galbraith, 1975 |
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29th August 2014, 10:46 AM | #26 |
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9th September 2014, 08:01 AM | #27 |
Illuminator
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Looks like eBay will now too.
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-0...-payments.html Looks like that dumb old Bitcoin just keeps on shrinking and falling apart, now they're "down" to being picked up by billion-dollar mainstream companies. |
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"So if a tard came up to me and offered to sell me 10 bitcoins for $100, not only would I not do it, I think I'd punch him in the head, just for being stupid." -The Central Scrutinizer |
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9th September 2014, 08:10 AM | #28 |
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Yawn, again. They're laying the risk off on Coinbase, same way the other companies have. I'm waiting for Coinbase to get hacked. That would be the sure and certain end of BTC as we now know it; they're pretty much the only game in town any more.
Oh, and the price has dropped to $470. |
9th September 2014, 09:22 AM | #29 |
Illuminator
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Rationalization and backpedaling are unbecoming of JREF members. Now, can I hold you to these claims? That Coinbase is "the only game in town anymore," meaning that no other Bitcoin transaction insurers or services will exist, and that if Coinbase gets hacked (ignoring how likely or unlikely that is) that that's "the sure and certain end of BTC as we now know it?"
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So tell me again what it's "down to?" |
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"So if a tard came up to me and offered to sell me 10 bitcoins for $100, not only would I not do it, I think I'd punch him in the head, just for being stupid." -The Central Scrutinizer |
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9th September 2014, 09:50 AM | #30 |
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9th September 2014, 10:00 AM | #31 |
Illuminator
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"So if a tard came up to me and offered to sell me 10 bitcoins for $100, not only would I not do it, I think I'd punch him in the head, just for being stupid." -The Central Scrutinizer |
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9th September 2014, 10:20 AM | #32 |
Muse
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Bitcoin is one of the accepted payment methods for purchasing compromised credit card numbers at rescator.cc
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9th September 2014, 10:27 AM | #33 |
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9th September 2014, 12:27 PM | #34 |
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Almo! My Music Blog "No society ever collapsed because the poor had too much." — LeftySergeant "It may be that there is no body really at rest, to which the places and motions of others may be referred." –Issac Newton in the Principia |
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9th September 2014, 01:38 PM | #35 |
Muse
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9th September 2014, 01:49 PM | #36 |
Muse
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The value of a Bitcoin is barely connected to the number of Bitcoins in circulation. It's wildly fluctuating value is based on wildly fluctuating desire. That makes it an almost purely speculative fantasy. An investment commodity. Property, not currency.
Dutch tulips. |
9th September 2014, 06:46 PM | #37 |
Skeptical about skeptics
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Are you really determined to recycle this lengthy debate about the meaning of a word?
Legally, it is classified as a virtual currency in the US so that it falls under FinCEN regulations. Other countries may classify it as not-a-currency because it is not a debt instrument and is not issued by a government. For practical purposes, it is a currency if you can buy things with it, otherwise not. IOW who cares? |
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"The process by which banks create money is so simple that the mind is repelled. Where something so important is involved, a deeper mystery seems only decent." - Galbraith, 1975 |
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9th September 2014, 07:22 PM | #38 |
Illuminator
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sure it is. Snickers comes out extremely low on "store of value" grounds, which is an attribute of mediums of exchange.
Money also needs to be relatively scarce, which is a way of saying it has high value in compact form. As compared with say, sand. Or snickers. Gold does pretty well, as with silver or platinum - but Bitcoins come out just fine there too. This is strange hyperbole - I mean, you can do all manner of transactions with bitcoins, even get people killed! Apparently. From these criminal charges on Silk Road. I don't think I can recall of a hit being done with payment in snickers. So why say such a thing? |
10th September 2014, 12:07 AM | #39 |
Penultimate Amazing
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I found someone willing to "kill for a Snickers", does that count? Although the offer may no longer be valid.
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A fool thinks himself to be wise, but a wise man knows himself to be a fool. William Shakespeare |
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10th September 2014, 04:50 AM | #40 |
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"So if a tard came up to me and offered to sell me 10 bitcoins for $100, not only would I not do it, I think I'd punch him in the head, just for being stupid." -The Central Scrutinizer |
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