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Tags don piper , nde , near death experience

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Old 30th June 2009, 05:35 AM   #41
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Originally Posted by ExMinister View Post
From Mr. Piper's web site:

How To Go To Heaven
The vast majority of people living today believe that there is another place beyond this world. There is. Don Piper experienced it.

In his book 90 Minutes in Heaven, Don made a decision to take a different route home from a church growth conference that he attended in 1989. It didn't seem like an important choice at the time, but it turned out to be one that changed his life. Waiting down an East Texas highway on his way back to Houston was a large truck that took his life.

In retrospect, the decision to take a different route might appear to be a crucial one. But the most important decision in Don's life occurred NOT on his drive home but when he accepted Christ as Lord at the age of sixteen. Deciding to accept Christ meant Don had an eternal home in Heaven no matter when he died. Acknowledging Christ as Savior guarantees that you will spend eternity with Him.
Hang on .... can't they even make their minds up in the blurb what the 'most important' event was? Good grief.

Originally Posted by JFrankA View Post
The guy doesn't even remember the accident, and, as it was stated before, it was years after the fact when he wrote the book, so it's been confirmed that he has a faulty memory of the indecent. So how could this possibly be true?
But then the accident wasn't the actual most important event anyway ... or something.
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Old 30th June 2009, 05:55 AM   #42
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Originally Posted by kurious_kathy View Post
I have read this book and I believe this really did happen to Mr.Piper.

I also believe God can do anything in a persons life, unlike many of you here on this board. Scripture even tells us with God all things are possibe!
Just like they are without god.
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Old 30th June 2009, 06:00 AM   #43
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Originally Posted by kurious_kathy View Post
If Jesus could resurrect people like Lazerus from the dead then I think he can repair anything that was damaged because of the trauma of death. Many people have claimed to be resurrected after death, why is that so hard for people to believe? God can do anything he wants to do, he's God!
Except forgive people who break the rules. Those he has to punish.
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Old 30th June 2009, 07:06 AM   #44
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Awhile back I sat in Barnes & Noble and skimmed through Heaven is Real, Piper's second book. He maintained throughout the book that the only way to get to heaven (and avoid hell) is to accept Jesus Christ as your savior.

All I could think of is how many people would read that who had lost loved ones who hadn't done this, and how much pain and worry that would cause.

How horrible to write something so capable of compounding another's grief.
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Old 30th June 2009, 08:02 AM   #45
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Originally Posted by ExMinister View Post
Awhile back I sat in Barnes & Noble and skimmed through Heaven is Real, Piper's second book. He maintained throughout the book that the only way to get to heaven (and avoid hell) is to accept Jesus Christ as your savior.

All I could think of is how many people would read that who had lost loved ones who hadn't done this, and how much pain and worry that would cause.

How horrible to write something so capable of compounding another's grief.
As is the thought of the universe being controlled by a being who is so depressingly arbitrary in his judgements.

It's as if he were to say, "Sorry, anyone who hasn't tried raw oysters can't get in."

Sure, you could have been warned that you had to try raw oysters, but how would you know the people telling you this aren't crazy?
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Old 30th June 2009, 08:11 AM   #46
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Old 30th June 2009, 08:15 AM   #47
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Originally Posted by ImaginalDisc View Post
Because God hates amputees, of course.
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Old 30th June 2009, 09:32 AM   #48
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Originally Posted by kurious_kathy View Post
If Jesus could resurrect people like Lazerus from the dead then I think he can repair anything that was damaged because of the trauma of death. Many people have claimed to be resurrected after death, why is that so hard for people to believe? God can do anything he wants to do, he's God!
Many people claim to be taken aboard alien spacecraft. Many people claim to have been touched by the grace of Allah, Zeus, Hindu god, et al. So I guess that makes it true. Many people claim to have been helped by Astrology; I guess that's true too. Many people claim that Nostradamus has made accurate predictions as to the future. Why is it so hard for you to believe that people make up gods? Why is it so hard for you to examine history and learn that humans make claims that aren't true? He, or she, who doesn't learn from history is damned to repeat it.
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Old 30th June 2009, 11:14 AM   #49
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Originally Posted by bobcarp View Post
Many people claim to be taken aboard alien spacecraft. Many people claim to have been touched by the grace of Allah, Zeus, Hindu god, et al. So I guess that makes it true.
...I've been touched by Tera Patrick. In fact, she hugged me.

I find that far more uplifting and fufilling that any god can do....
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Old 30th June 2009, 06:04 PM   #50
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Originally Posted by kurious_kathy View Post
God can do anything he wants to do, he's God!
Apparently not, because I'm sure He'd shut you up if he could, considering the damage you're doing to His name.
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Old 30th June 2009, 07:31 PM   #51
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Originally Posted by Tricky View Post
Apparently not, because I'm sure He'd shut you up if he could, considering the damage you're doing to His name.
Wait, I get moderated for calling a troll a troll, but you don't get moderated for this?

Mind you, I agree with you.
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Old 30th June 2009, 10:43 PM   #52
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Originally Posted by kurious_kathy
Quote:
I have read this book and I believe this really did happen to Mr.Piper.
I can only vouch for myself and say, that these things are real and this is a spiritual world and I can also vouch for darkness on that side, itís there waiting for you.
The darkness is calming at the moment of your death or dying, itís purpose is, to calm you and your mind at the time of death, at the point of realization that you are dying, because it is scary no doubt about it.


Falling into darkness won't matter, falling into the light will, those are the choices and on this side is where we make our decisions on belief and faith.
I think that forgiveness can be achieved even on that side and that God is more forgiving than he lets on through biblical writings.

I base that on one statement, So that all can be saved....

But there are defiantly limits set in place for the really bad.
All one can do is stay in certain parameters and pray.

We are all going back to where we came from and that is to the light of God and God specifically, and if that one statement is true then it all is a test and Kathy is right when she says God can do anything because maybe, we are all there before birth and all there after death.

This means in general there is no death.
This can also mean that before we are born that we are told what will happen to usÖ. the reason we wonít remember what was before our births, the only thing I can figure out isÖso we can develop faith and for God through our free will know our true hearts.


I could give you one hell of a scenario but you would call it special pleading so I wonít.

Let me just say that it is possible that we are given some information before birth about how long we will live and in which way we will die, a choice in circumstances and length of time on earth and in the test knowing where and under what circumstances we are going to be born into.

Then again it could be nothing but darkness.
Which canít be true either and you must go there to get there so why would you pass to a universe of darkness from one of light?
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Old 1st July 2009, 06:46 AM   #53
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Originally Posted by edge View Post
Originally Posted by kurious_kathy

I can only vouch for myself and say, that these things are real and this is a spiritual world and I can also vouch for darkness on that side, itís there waiting for you.
The darkness is calming at the moment of your death or dying, itís purpose is, to calm you and your mind at the time of death, at the point of realization that you are dying, because it is scary no doubt about it.


Falling into darkness won't matter, falling into the light will, those are the choices and on this side is where we make our decisions on belief and faith.
I think that forgiveness can be achieved even on that side and that God is more forgiving than he lets on through biblical writings.

I base that on one statement, So that all can be saved....

But there are defiantly limits set in place for the really bad.
All one can do is stay in certain parameters and pray.

We are all going back to where we came from and that is to the light of God and God specifically, and if that one statement is true then it all is a test and Kathy is right when she says God can do anything because maybe, we are all there before birth and all there after death.

This means in general there is no death.
This can also mean that before we are born that we are told what will happen to usÖ. the reason we wonít remember what was before our births, the only thing I can figure out isÖso we can develop faith and for God through our free will know our true hearts.


I could give you one hell of a scenario but you would call it special pleading so I wonít.

Let me just say that it is possible that we are given some information before birth about how long we will live and in which way we will die, a choice in circumstances and length of time on earth and in the test knowing where and under what circumstances we are going to be born into.

Then again it could be nothing but darkness.
Which canít be true either and you must go there to get there so why would you pass to a universe of darkness from one of light?

Special pleading or not, this might make more sense if you did. Darkness is good, darkness is bad? I'm not sure what you mean.

Sure your scenario is possible, but so are lots of other things.

I don't understand the last paragraph at all, or the question.
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Old 1st July 2009, 04:18 PM   #54
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ExMinister say:
Sure your scenario is possible, but so are lots of other things.

I don't understand the last paragraph at all, or the question.

Quote:
Then again it could be nothing but darkness.
Which canít be true either and you must go there to get there so why would you pass to a universe of darkness from one of light?

We live in a universe of star light skeptics believe that when we die there is nothing but darkness but we are told that Gods light is there waiting on the other side and all questions will be answered.
Even in our natural surroundings at night we are continuously lighting our way in the night to move forward in our travels.

We are moving forward in time, we are allowed time to learn how we are flawed with out Godsí light guiding our way allowing us to keep moving forward.
Motion is the key to everything IMHO, so in the darkness do you move forward if you canít see?
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Old 1st July 2009, 04:22 PM   #55
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Originally Posted by edge View Post
We live in a universe of star light skeptics believe that when we die there is nothing but darkness but we are told that Gods light is there waiting on the other side and all questions will be answered.
Even in our natural surroundings at night we are continuously lighting our way in the night to move forward in our travels.

We are moving forward in time, we are allowed time to learn how we are flawed with out Godsí light guiding our way allowing us to keep moving forward.
Motion is the key to everything IMHO, so in the darkness do you move forward if you canít see?
Well... when you are alive it is possible to move around in darkness....your toes may not like it, but it is possible.

When you're dead, you don't move. Whether the place is dark or brightly lit.

I'm sorry, you are making no sense to me either.....
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Old 1st July 2009, 04:23 PM   #56
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The answer to Suffering, from a different perspctive.

So we all have power to create and live our lives as we see proper or rebel and do wrong and in some cases extremely wrong.

So from a perspective of no time on that other side knowing what it is like down here, souls might sit there and decide how much time they need before death to prove themselves.
It might be voluntary or it might be a choice that God makes with you or maybe with out.
At any rate the soul would be prepped in advance and told certain things of the upcoming test the decision might be left to them, (the Soul).

So the conversation might go like this, ď God gathers a certain amount of spirits/souls and says, ď I have gathered you here to ask for volunteers I have a position that needs filling and this is what will happen to you, I have chosen you amongst the many because I know that each of you can handle this assignment and you will be just fine after freewill is exercised by the soul/souls that are in the process of deciding between right and wrong choosesĒ.


So when you say how about the deaths of souls early in life by whatever events they will encounter, they may have accepted that life that will end in a short time because God isnít testing them as muchÖ but rather those left behind, the mother the father, those that are doing the crimes and all those that blame God for a souls freewill to commit the crime, they are being tested too.
Those souls know in advance that they are going to face the most horrific events they will ever face and that their memories will be wiped clean before that experience, they will be the strongest of souls they will not falter even under those conditions and they are allowed to fill those positions because God knows they will not falter in their belief, which allows them an immediate entry into Heaven; back in the presences of Gods light, they may even get another chance down here if they want.

Whether they choose to maybe to come back or not, they can move even farther forward on that side towards what we are destined for.
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Old 1st July 2009, 04:25 PM   #57
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Originally Posted by JFrankA View Post
Well... when you are alive it is possible to move around in darkness....your toes may not like it, but it is possible.

When you're dead, you don't move. Whether the place is dark or brightly lit.

I'm sorry, you are making no sense to me either.....
Only because you have made up your mind.
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Old 1st July 2009, 04:27 PM   #58
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Originally Posted by edge View Post
Only because you have made up your mind.
Well, it seems to me that you've made up your mind that I've made up my mind. And if that is so, then maybe you've made up your mind as well, but that is just a speculation. I haven't decided.
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Old 1st July 2009, 04:42 PM   #59
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Originally Posted by JFrankA View Post
Well, it seems to me that you've made up your mind that I've made up my mind. And if that is so, then maybe you've made up your mind as well, but that is just a speculation. I haven't decided.
If God is not un-caring then I would think the senerio would be like I discribed and I really don't know if you have made up your mind but even I question and this is the only way I can see that question being ansewered from a beliver perspective.

Have at it, I am.
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Old 1st July 2009, 04:49 PM   #60
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Originally Posted by ImaginalDisc View Post
Wait, I get moderated for calling a troll a troll, but you don't get moderated for this?

Mind you, I agree with you.
you got moderated because you broke the forum rules, not for any other reason
or is this another one of those "the mods have an agenda" whines ?
doesn't matter, as you have just broken the rules again in exactly the same manner I have again reported your post to the mod team
thanks for playing


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Old 1st July 2009, 05:14 PM   #61
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Duplicate

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Old 1st July 2009, 06:26 PM   #62
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Originally Posted by edge View Post
We live in a universe of star light skeptics believe that when we die there is nothing but darkness...
No they don't. When you die, you simply cease to exist. No light. No darkness. No perception of any kind. Do you remember what it was like before you were conceived? Sort of like that.


Originally Posted by edge View Post
...but we are told that Gods light is there waiting on the other side and all questions will be answered.
Even in our natural surroundings at night we are continuously lighting our way in the night to move forward in our travels. rything IMHO, so in the darkness do you move forward if you canít see?
You may be told that. You may even choose to believe it. But you do so because it makes you feel good, not because it is supported by evidence. If you badly need to be made to feel good and not be afraid of death, then I can understand why this myth is so important to you. It is too scary for you to try to imagine simply not being. Enjoy your comforting story if it keeps you from being scared.

Some of us don't scare so easily.

Originally Posted by edge View Post
We are moving forward in time, we are allowed time to learn how we are flawed with out Godsí light guiding our way allowing us to keep moving forward.
Motion is the key to everything IMHO, so in the darkness do you move forward if you canít see?
Of course we are moving forward in time. (Hint: Time only moves forward.) But your metaphor is badly flawed. If knowledge is light, then science has shed more light on the world than any God or gods ever imagined by mankind. Thanks to science, even blind people have a chance to see in the dark. That is because science works. God doesn't.
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Old 1st July 2009, 06:47 PM   #63
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Originally Posted by edge View Post
If God is not un-caring then I would think the senerio would be like I discribed and I really don't know if you have made up your mind but even I question and this is the only way I can see that question being ansewered from a beliver perspective.

Have at it, I am.
Funny, my reply wasn't about any god, whether it's yours or anyone Else's concept of what a god would be or act. It was a response because it seemed to me that you have made the decision for me that I have decided. And further, being someone who used to believe, I can see from a believer's perspective can make a question and answer it.

However, from a purely factual, scientific perspective, without beliefs, with just facts, I can see how those answers are given as well.

I do not belittle your beliefs. Indeed, if believing in a god makes you a better person, so much the better, go for it.

However, for me personally, removing the beliefs and replacing them with evidence, science and verifiable facts, makes me a better person.

I don't worry about an "after-life". I worry about this life: the only life that has been factually verified. Therefore, friends and even strangers are worth more to me now because I do not believe, since there is no evidence to any kind of "after life". So the result is that I am a good person not because I'm afraid of the "dark".

And this expands beyond just this planet. The workings of the universe is much more amazing and real because there isn't an all powerful being planning it all out. See, knowing that there is a god, being sure of an afterlife, completely confident that an omnipotent being created everything in the universe gives away the secret. Everything is answered. There is no mystery. If there is no mystery, then the only thing left is "I know".

I don't. That's the beauty of being an atheist. I don't know. I want to learn, but I don't want to be misled simply because of what another person or people may believe. I need facts. I need things that have can stand the test of what has been previously solidly proven scientifically. And god hasn't stood to that. The stories in the bible don't stand. The belief of a "light" or a "dark" after someone dies doesn't stand.

People may have claimed to see it, or feel it, but, being a magician, I know how to fool people into seeing and feeling things so that they come away believing that I can perform miracles.

So again, you may believe. That's what you need. That's fine with me. I'm not trying to "convert" you. Not my business, desire nor right to do so.

But please, don't tell me that "I know". I don't believe. That is not "I know".

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Old 1st July 2009, 07:55 PM   #64
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Originally Posted by Marduk View Post
you got moderated because you broke the forum rules, not for any other reason
or is this another one of those "the mods have an agenda" whines ?
doesn't matter, as you have just broken the rules again in exactly the same manner I have again reported your post to the mod team
thanks for playing

No, the point is that "attack the argument, not the arguer" is a rule here and it's highly inconsistent kk to be an acceptable target.
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Old 1st July 2009, 10:59 PM   #65
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sleep time bye...

Originally Posted by Tricky View Post
No they don't. When you die, you simply cease to exist. No light. No darkness. No perception of any kind. Do you remember what it was like before you were conceived? Sort of like that.



You may be told that. You may even choose to believe it. But you do so because it makes you feel good, not because it is supported by evidence. If you badly need to be made to feel good and not be afraid of death, then I can understand why this myth is so important to you. It is too scary for you to try to imagine simply not being. Enjoy your comforting story if it keeps you from being scared.

Some of us don't scare so easily.


Of course we are moving forward in time. (Hint: Time only moves forward.) But your metaphor is badly flawed. If knowledge is light, then science has shed more light on the world than any God or gods ever imagined by mankind. Thanks to science, even blind people have a chance to see in the dark. That is because science works. God doesn't.
Some believe we can go back in time but not forward.
You missed everything I was getting at.
The *Idea here as KK stated was that God can do anything.
Therefore all things are covered, that blankness that darkness that a skeptical person says happens upon death, or if you choose nothingness you will be aware of it.

As far as science, itís a great tool to learn how things work, just because a person believes in God doesn't mean we stop learning about how things work I want to know how and what God knows since I believe he created it all I think there fore he is the greatest scientist of all.. To know that is science whether you believe in God or not.

What your missing is your body was conceived your soul was created....

Just because I believe doesn't make me scared of dying on the contrary I am giving you what I know from several experiences I have had, personally I can't hardly wait and am joyfully that it will happen one day.

Trust me on this, on your way to death you will be aware of the darkness, believe it or not.
JfrankA say:
Quote:
Funny, my reply wasn't about any god, whether it's yours or anyone Else's concept of what a god would be or act. It was a response because it seemed to me that you have made the decision for me that I have decided. And further, being someone who used to believe, I can see from a believer's perspective can make a question and answer it.
Well lets see if I read you right?
JfrankA says:
Quote:
However, for me personally, removing the beliefs and replacing them with evidence, science and verifiable facts, makes me a better person.
because I do not believe, since there is no evidence to any kind of "after life". So the result is that I am a good person not because I'm afraid of the "dark".

[/quote]

You donít believe, So I read you rightÖ whatís the problem Frank?
I am not trying to get you to believe in what i do just to think differently about the subject at hand.

I never said to be afraid of the dark I said itís something that calms you after death.
I am trying to give you a scenario where by God can be righteous when we canít see it, concerning suffering.
What could be the reason he doesnít stop the bad that happens to people here and now?
If he did who would know that he did with out God directly telling us and showing us that he did, that would nullify faith and would take away free will from the person he stopped and I am afraid that would nullify all free will.
Why take it away from one and not all?
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Old 2nd July 2009, 04:02 PM   #66
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Originally Posted by edge View Post
You donít believe, So I read you rightÖ whatís the problem Frank?
I am not trying to get you to believe in what i do just to think differently about the subject at hand.
As I've already stated, I used to be a believer. I have seen the "other side of the coin", so to speak, and earlier in my life, I would have believed that this man had actually went to heaven. or that his soul seen light, or the one of the thousands of different beliefs that thousands of different people believed what might have happened.

But I have learned a lot since then. I can't now "just believe". Belief is not proof. Belief is not solid. I can consider it, but the evidence and the facts just can't support those beliefs. Sorry.

What if somoene said "No, there is no god. But I believe that our souls is really energy from the sun and when we die, our souls go to a nebula and get reincarnated as sun with our own solar system. You should just try 'to think differently about the subject at hand.'"

Would you? I mean, there is real science in this idea, because sun do come from some nebuli. But would that make you think differently about your own beliefs? Would you consider a person who believes this to be right?

As an athiest, I would be asking questions: the first being, simply, Where's the proof?

Quote:
I never said to be afraid of the dark I said itís something that calms you after death.
I am trying to give you a scenario where by God can be righteous when we canít see it, concerning suffering.
What could be the reason he doesnít stop the bad that happens to people here and now?
Well, let me ask you 'to think differently about the subject at hand.'"

In all you've just stated, consider this simple statement. There is no god. Now there's no reason to ask "why". Bad things happen because they do. No hand directing it, no plan, just is. Some things you can control, some things you can't.

Quote:
If he did who would know that he did with out God directly telling us and showing us that he did, that would nullify faith and would take away free will from the person he stopped and I am afraid that would nullify all free will.
Why take it away from one and not all?
Why does taking away faith nullify free will? I don't get that at all. Are you telling me that in order to make my own decsions I need a superior being with a plan?

Seems to me that someone who is responsible for her/his own actions, without the belief that a superior being is, at the very least, looking over her/his neck all the time, has free will.
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Old 2nd July 2009, 04:27 PM   #67
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Originally Posted by edge View Post
Some believe we can go back in time but not forward.
Some believe that, but they are wrong, according to every piece of evidence ever discovered.

Originally Posted by edge View Post
You missed everything I was getting at.
The *Idea here as KK stated was that God can do anything.
Therefore all things are covered, that blankness that darkness that a skeptical person says happens upon death, or if you choose nothingness you will be aware of it.
No, I understood it just fine. It is simply wrong. When you die, you will not be aware of anything, not even "nothingness". Your brain will not work and the brain is required for awareness, according to the overwhelming mass of evidence. I realize that you cannot seem to wrap your brain around "nothingness". You keep talking about it as if it were "something". You are making a strawman of the skeptical position. They do not say "all things are covered by by blackness or darkness upon death." You are putting words into their mouths while trying and failing to understand the skeptical position.

Originally Posted by edge View Post
As far as science, itís a great tool to learn how things work, just because a person believes in God doesn't mean we stop learning about how things work.
It doesn't have to mean that, but for some, when "how things work" conflicts with their concept of God, they stop being scientific. They start to believe without evidence. That is not the way to "find out how things work".

Originally Posted by edge View Post
I want to know how and what God knows since I believe he created it all I think there fore he is the greatest scientist of all.. To know that is science whether you believe in God or not.
The concept of God is completely meaningless to science. Even if He did exist, He would not be a part of any truly scientific examination of a topic. No kind of magic is part of science. They are, by definition, irreconcilably incompatible.
Originally Posted by edge View Post
What your missing is your body was conceived your soul was created....
What you're missing is any evidence for that statement... or whatever it was. It didn't quite pass the test for being a real sentence. You don't seem to get it, Edge. Just because you believe something doesn't make it true, no matter how hard and how piously you believe it. The only thing that makes something true is evidence.

Originally Posted by edge View Post
Just because I believe doesn't make me scared of dying on the contrary I am giving you what I know from several experiences I have had, personally I can't hardly wait and am joyfully that it will happen one day.
That is because you don't believe you will really die. You believe you will live on in some poorly-defined afterlife. Why do you believe this? I think it is because the actual and total unawareness that accompanies real and permanent death scares the pants off of you. If not, why can't you accept it as one possibility? Instead, you have accepted and invented a fairy tale life to replace actual death and you will not, by admission, allow for any other possibility. Oh, I don't blame you. People have been doing this for many centuries and with countless different fairy tales to comfort them. Real death is so scary to you that you cannot begin to accept it as true, in spite of the fact that nobody you know who has died has ever returned in any way that you can give evidence for. There is a mountain of evidence for this, yet you continue to deny it.

Originally Posted by edge View Post
Trust me on this, on your way to death you will be aware of the darkness, believe it or not.
Here we go again. It comes down to "Just believe what I say, just because". You're asking me to trust you on this, yet you cannot give me a scrap of evidence to counter the masses of evidence that it is not true. Sorry Edge, I cannot trust you. Oh, you're a nice guy and all, but as a source of reliable information, you are quite simply one of the worst I have ever encountered. And you seem to like it that way.

Enjoy your fairy tales while you live. Once you don't live, you will be unaware of fairy tales and of everything else. That's just how life works. Be brave and face up to it.
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Old 2nd July 2009, 05:05 PM   #68
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Originally Posted by Tricky View Post
No, I understood it just fine. It is simply wrong. When you die, you will not be aware of anything, not even "nothingness". Your brain will not work and the brain is required for awareness, according to the overwhelming mass of evidence. I realize that you cannot seem to wrap your brain around "nothingness". You keep talking about it as if it were "something". You are making a strawman of the skeptical position. They do not say "all things are covered by by blackness or darkness upon death." You are putting words into their mouths while trying and failing to understand the skeptical position.
The simplest was to understand it is to compare it to the "nothingness" that precedes one's birth.
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Old 2nd July 2009, 05:23 PM   #69
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Originally Posted by Foster Zygote View Post
The simplest was to understand it is to compare it to the "nothingness" that precedes one's birth.
I agree. I tried that. Sometimes the simplest is not simple enough for some people.

Originally Posted by Tricky View Post
No they don't. When you die, you simply cease to exist. No light. No darkness. No perception of any kind. Do you remember what it was like before you were conceived? Sort of like that.
Originally Posted by edge View Post
What your missing is your body was conceived your soul was created....
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Old 2nd July 2009, 05:41 PM   #70
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I used to think that doctors, medical people, and the police had a special kind of competence: a knowledge of right, wrong, and what was just; and could do almost anything. Ministers mattered, could pray and miracles would sometimes happen.

This story has it all. Amazing how real life can be just like a fairy tale.
:|
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Old 2nd July 2009, 07:44 PM   #71
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Originally Posted by Kopji View Post
This story has it all. Amazing how real life can be just like a fairy tale.
:|
Yes, sometimes it's pretty grimm.
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Old 3rd July 2009, 11:40 PM   #72
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Originally Posted by Ducky View Post
Apparently not. There's been prayers you'd stop posting here for years.
What if God is the one who purposed me to find jref and start sharing here?, I really do not remember how I even came across this website. Was it coincidence or could it be perhaps a divine appointment?
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Old 4th July 2009, 01:31 AM   #73
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Originally Posted by kurious_kathy View Post
What if God is the one who purposed me to find jref and start sharing here?, I really do not remember how I even came across this website. Was it coincidence or could it be perhaps a divine appointment?
What if you are wrong?
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Old 4th July 2009, 01:33 AM   #74
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Originally Posted by ImaginalDisc View Post
Isn't it obvious, god hates them...bloody useless gimps, How dare they lose his divine limbs!
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Old 4th July 2009, 01:12 PM   #75
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Originally Posted by kurious_kathy View Post
What if God is the one who purposed me to find jref and start sharing here?, I really do not remember how I even came across this website. Was it coincidence or could it be perhaps a divine appointment?
Hmmm, well, if it were "divine appointment," you'd think that a number of people would have been converted by now thanks to your proselytizing.

Everyone who's been saved, raise your hand.
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Old 4th July 2009, 01:39 PM   #76
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Originally Posted by kurious_kathy View Post
What if God is the one who purposed me to find jref and start sharing here?, I really do not remember how I even came across this website. Was it coincidence or could it be perhaps a divine appointment?
I bet it was neither. Maybe someone mentioned it or referred to it and you just decided to come here. Why does it have to be divine intervention? Why isn't just simply your decision?

Let me put it this way:

What if you saw a reference to this site, (it's not hard to find, links are all over), and you made the decision to come here? Maybe because you were curious, maybe to make a point to atheists, maybe to vent, whatever.

Maybe, just maybe, it was your choice to come here. It's certainly your choice to stay and post more comments.....


ETA:
Originally Posted by Lucian
Everyone who's been saved, raise your hand.
- My hand is down.

Last edited by JFrankA; 4th July 2009 at 01:41 PM.
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Old 5th July 2009, 07:03 AM   #77
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Originally Posted by kurious_kathy View Post
What if God is the one who purposed me to find jref and start sharing here?, I really do not remember how I even came across this website. Was it coincidence or could it be perhaps a divine appointment?
You think maybe God wanted you to come here to drive people as far away from Christianity as possible? I thought he was supposed to be smart.
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Old 5th July 2009, 07:09 AM   #78
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Originally Posted by kurious_kathy View Post
What if God is the one who purposed me to find jref and start sharing here?, I really do not remember how I even came across this website. Was it coincidence or could it be perhaps a divine appointment?
If that was really your calling, you dropped the ball. You should have been more aware of what your holy text actually says. You should be more aware of what your opposition actually says and thinks. You should be more aware of well, most everything regarding the debate.
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