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8th January 2016, 03:28 PM | #441 |
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8th January 2016, 03:28 PM | #442 |
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8th January 2016, 03:45 PM | #443 |
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And? The prosecutors go with the evidence they have, not the evidence they wish they had. Believe it or not, not all evidence holds up in court - even that which the prosecutors think is rock solid.
Perhaps if it was so 'troubling' they should have excluded it. Or perhaps it's not as 'troubling' as one person thinks it was. If 'the police' cleaned the key and put Avery's DNA on it, why not put Halbach's DNA on it too? And where did they get the key from? But somebody had possession of that key and cleaned it - the most obvious culprit being Avery himself (since he is the one most likely to have wanted to erase any evidence of its former owner). |
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8th January 2016, 03:48 PM | #444 |
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8th January 2016, 04:03 PM | #445 |
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preponderance
1: a superiority in weight, power, importance, or strength Like most jurors, I weigh up the evidence for and against. That which has the greatest power and importance wins. I would have convicted O.J. Simpson despite the glove not fitting.
Quote:
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8th January 2016, 04:06 PM | #446 |
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Actually, that's not too far from how it's supposed to work.
Quote:
Quote:
I then eat seven. Oversight or deliberate lie? |
8th January 2016, 04:13 PM | #447 |
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It's not about freeing murderers but rather keeping the power of the state in check.
No one wants murderers roaming the streets. But each of us as individuals are in much more danger from a criminal justice system that blithely steamrolls due process in order to secure convictions. |
8th January 2016, 04:16 PM | #448 |
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8th January 2016, 04:21 PM | #449 |
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Yes, it is a form of circular reasoning.
"But somebody had possession of that key and cleaned it". But who was that somebody? No circular reasoning here. "the most obvious culprit being Avery himself (since he is the one most likely to have wanted to erase any evidence of its former owner)." Its circular reasoning to suggest that the person who had the key cleaned it? Or that the perpetrator would be the one most likely to clean forensic evidence off something he took from the scene of the crime? Oh right, I get it now. You think it's just as likely that the police would wipe clean all the evidence that they collect! |
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8th January 2016, 04:22 PM | #450 |
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8th January 2016, 04:29 PM | #451 |
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"Preponderance of clean evidence" (your exact words) is not synonymous with beyond a reasonable doubt. You even admit as much in your last paragraph, so I'm not sure why you're giving the definition of preponderance as if that changes anything.
Preponderance is enough for civil cases. Not criminal cases. End of. Unless you don't care about a just and fair justice system. The attitudes, biases, and prejudices on show in this thread are a perfect microcosm of exactly why miscarriages of justice occur. |
8th January 2016, 04:50 PM | #452 |
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Curious to know how many people here believe the murder took place in:
a.) the bedroom b.) the garage c.) the crime spanned both scenes Would love to see some timelines that people have put together. |
8th January 2016, 04:57 PM | #453 |
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8th January 2016, 05:26 PM | #454 |
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Injustice Followed By Justice
MATTHEW: You clearly didn't read my first few posts on this thread. It seems rather obvious that Avery's rape conviction qualifies as a gross injustice, but unlike the murder charge, there was definitive proof of his innocence. This included DNA evidence and corroborative testimony indicating that local law enforcement ignored exculpatory data.
In the past several pages, I've focused on the lack of hard evidence that would exculpate Avery and the inculpatory evidence that was powerful enough to keep Avery in prison for the past 10 years. Most of the posters on this thread have relied on hyperbolic rhetoric and unsubstantiated conspiracy claims in an attempt to muddy the waters on a relatively straight forward murder case. Given the evidence found on the Avery compound, any criminal investigator worth a salt would consider Avery the PRIME suspect in the murder of Teresa Halbach. A burned body found in a fire pit, some of the victim's personal belongings found in a burn barrel, the victim's DNA found on a bullet sourced to a weapon owned by the perp, and the perp's DNA found inside the victim's vehicle/under the hood of the vehicle. Many posters don't trust that evidence, but to an investigator, that evidentiary list is a virtual treasure trove. That same list also convinced a jury, a district court judge, and 3 circuit court judges that Steven Avery is a cold-blooded killer. |
8th January 2016, 05:34 PM | #455 |
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Can we strike the "victim's DNA found on a bullet sourced to a weapon owned by the perp"? It's legitimately contaminated. Not even in a "well the defense says it's contaminated" sense. The prosecution admits it. It's their own witness. Oh yeah, and then she failed to disclose that she was breaking protocol by admitting the evidence as a match to Avery instead of inconclusive as she should have. When called on why they broke protocol, they said it's common sense. This is mind-boggling.
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8th January 2016, 05:38 PM | #456 |
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8th January 2016, 05:40 PM | #457 |
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8th January 2016, 05:52 PM | #458 |
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After watching two hours of it I have to agree. I don't find much of probative value in it at all. It reminds me of a demonstration of recovered memories by hypnosis - garbage in, garbage out.
There seems to be quite a bit of "training" by the cops, correcting where the narrative doesn't fit and reinforcing when it does. Maybe "assisted communication" would be a better analogy, because the kid can't even remember which version was the one the cops wanted to hear the last time through it. |
8th January 2016, 05:55 PM | #459 |
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8th January 2016, 05:55 PM | #460 |
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8th January 2016, 05:55 PM | #461 |
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8th January 2016, 05:57 PM | #462 |
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8th January 2016, 06:03 PM | #463 |
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8th January 2016, 06:11 PM | #464 |
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I'm sure the cops in the Amanda Knox case thought their cause noble. You no doubt disagree.
This is not off topic, by the way, but illustrative of how people can either dismiss tainted evidence as irrelevant or demand that cases be thrown out because of such evidence depending on their biases. |
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8th January 2016, 06:24 PM | #465 |
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8th January 2016, 06:31 PM | #466 |
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8th January 2016, 06:42 PM | #467 |
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8th January 2016, 07:45 PM | #468 |
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I haven't seen the movie nor know much of anything about the case. But what evidence showed that a key was cleaned? Traces of solvent or cleanser or what?
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8th January 2016, 07:53 PM | #469 |
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8th January 2016, 08:13 PM | #470 |
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8th January 2016, 08:17 PM | #471 |
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So it's strictly an assumption that the key was cleaned? Was science brought forth in the trial to show that the key was cleaned?
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8th January 2016, 08:28 PM | #472 |
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8th January 2016, 08:32 PM | #473 |
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People are saying that Avery is innocent because they believe police tampered with that key?
Sorry I'm uninformed but this case has been in the news a lot because people watched it on Netflix. |
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8th January 2016, 08:36 PM | #474 |
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8th January 2016, 08:48 PM | #475 |
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If the key was not tampered with by police is Avery guilty?
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8th January 2016, 08:54 PM | #476 |
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8th January 2016, 08:59 PM | #477 |
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8th January 2016, 09:00 PM | #478 |
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8th January 2016, 09:03 PM | #479 |
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8th January 2016, 09:11 PM | #480 |
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