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29th December 2012, 06:17 PM | #121 |
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Not all smokers get lung cancer or heart disease. But on average, their smoking puts a burden on society.
Not all drinkers go driving immediately afterward or become alcoholics or need liver transplants. But enough do that it puts a burden on society. Not all of you gun nuts end up shooting up schools, but enough of your toys end up being used in homicides, suicides, and drug crimes that it puts a burden on society. That you can't even admit this simple fact shows how far you're gone. ETA: Here's some facts on this cost. http://www.who.int/violence_injury_p...dimensions/en/
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29th December 2012, 06:25 PM | #122 |
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I wanted to point out that purchasing a motor vehicle can be done with cash on the side of the road, but the motor vehicle analogy only works when certain folks wish to misrepresent the facts.
To answer your question, using common sense, the FF's couldn't have envisioned computers and cell phones, so let's tax and stricly regulate possession and use. |
29th December 2012, 06:30 PM | #123 |
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29th December 2012, 06:32 PM | #124 |
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The Australian Family Association's John Morrissey was aghast when he learned Jessica Watson was bidding to become the youngest person to sail round the world alone, unaided and without stopping. |
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29th December 2012, 06:38 PM | #125 |
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I was around when (let's call him ******* #1) shot up UOT Austin, and don't remember any panic buying.
At the run up to the GCA '68 there was indeed a whole bunch of panic buying, primarily in reponse to the section of the law that outlawed the import of (get ready for it) surplus (overwhelmingly bolt action) military rifles. From there on, mass murders, shootings, riots, you name it, the only mass national panic buying has occured when the government intervened in the market place. |
29th December 2012, 06:49 PM | #126 |
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Mea culpa.
I managed to lose a S&W 9mm pistol. I was driving from S Fl to N GA. I had it in the glove compartment. Got to my N GA home and it was gone. Looked everywhere. Have no idea where it went. Still don't. I don't remember ever leaving the truck unlocked when it was out of my sight. Last place I KNEW I had it was FL, so the police report was made in Broward County. As far as I know the serial # is still in the NCIC system if it's ever recovered. I can't say whether its ever been used in a crime or not. Before anyone gets too holier-than-thou, ***** happens. People lose all sorts of things. Infants and iPads and cameras get forgotten on the tops of cars with some regularity. I don't know that stronger laws against accidental losses and/or thefts would accomplish much. |
29th December 2012, 06:53 PM | #127 |
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29th December 2012, 07:02 PM | #128 |
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The penalties for misuse of a firearm can be life in prison, just failure to register some of them results in ten years/$10,000 fine. Want the same thing for cars? I don't think so. Can you imagine the uproar if your government wanted that kind of punishment just because you forgot to register your car?
Gun owners are already subject to some of the most severe sentencing enhancements around. Guns and ammo are already taxed at 11%, Can you name any other goods that are taxed that high? Some firearms have an additional $200 tax levied no matter how much they cost. $20 firearm? $200 tax. It is BS, why do you want more? Ranb |
29th December 2012, 07:15 PM | #129 |
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To pay for all the damage you guys are doing to society with your guns.
http://www.who.int/violence_injury_p...dimensions/en/
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ETA: Cigarette taxes are much higher. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cigaret...ette_tax_rates Up to $6.86 per pack from the state, with $1.01 per pack from the feds. In New York, the total price is $12.50 for one pack, which means that taxes are well over 100%. So your ammo is taxes much lower than cigarettes, even though WHO says guns cause $155B in costs annually to the rest of us. |
29th December 2012, 07:17 PM | #130 |
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29th December 2012, 07:22 PM | #131 |
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So it is the hobbyists and not the criminals that are doing most of the damage? Who do you want to tax after the hobbyists are driven out and the criminals are still criminals and nutjobs are still offing themselves?
Ranb |
29th December 2012, 07:23 PM | #132 |
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Why do you insist on calling all guns ours? They're not. Mine, nor BStrong's, nor GeeMack's (I'm assuming for theirs) have caused exactly 0 dollars in damage to society.
For the same reason my tax dollars pay for schools that my kids don't use, and the libraries I don't use.... |
29th December 2012, 07:26 PM | #133 |
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Every weekend I work at a gun club and watch many people demonstrate competence with firearms. In fact is is much safer to shoot at the local gun clubs in Kitsap county than it is to drive on the roads that are between home and the shooting area. We also have police that enforce laws concerning misuse of firearms.
Ranb |
29th December 2012, 07:27 PM | #134 |
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Hahaha! You're equating the awesome things in society like libraries and schools to your stupid guns? I've thought I'd heard it all, but that's just the best. You're precious. You think you and your guns are anything but a blight on the rest of us who don't hoard weapons like you do? We all gain from educated citizens. It fuels our economy. It provides skilled and dependable labor to our businesses. It's just a net plus all around. Guns are instruments of death and cost us $155B every year.
"Guns are the same as libraries and schools." Just totally sig material. |
29th December 2012, 07:28 PM | #135 |
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29th December 2012, 08:53 PM | #136 |
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Looks like the one on top has a magazine, thus needs less reloading. Also, the muzzle shroud makes it less likely for a spree killer to burn his hands. The pistol grip makes it more comfortable for the spree killer to shoot. thaiboxerken |
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29th December 2012, 09:18 PM | #137 |
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Not to mention that every sporting firearm and every round of ammunition outside of LE and military use carries a built in 11% federal excise tax:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pittman...estoration_Act |
29th December 2012, 09:38 PM | #138 | |||
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Politicians learn nothing. For the second time tonight:
We can't legislate away random violence. |
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29th December 2012, 09:42 PM | #139 |
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29th December 2012, 09:47 PM | #140 | |||
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She also has no qualms about carrying the best tool available for her protection. Must be nice to be a senator, not only does she get a concealed carry permit in an area that is damn near impossible for a regular citizen to get, but she gets to ignore the hospital's "gun free zone" when going to visit her husband.
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29th December 2012, 10:07 PM | #141 |
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And it didn't keep her from carrying a firearm when she felt threatened, and it doesn't stop her today from availing herself of professional armed protection.
And if benefiting from bloody tragedy is a disqualifier from polite society, it didn't take Brady or the VPC long to start begging for donations behind the Newtown murders, or for politicians to get face time on the networks. |
29th December 2012, 10:09 PM | #142 |
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29th December 2012, 10:20 PM | #143 |
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29th December 2012, 10:28 PM | #144 |
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My gun collection has caused at least five fewer deaths than the Kennedy clan has with airplanes automobiles and golf clubs. The reason for that is I am responsible and others are not. I pay for those mistakes like everyone else.
I also get figuratively spit on just for owning guns, when was the last time anyone one this forum insulted you for not owning a gun? Ranb |
29th December 2012, 11:15 PM | #145 |
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Gee, I'm so sorry, I didn't realize how difficult the past couple of weeks have been for you. Here is a link to a place that I'm sure can refer you to a counselor. Be sure to explain to them how traumatic it's been for you.
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30th December 2012, 02:58 AM | #146 |
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30th December 2012, 04:02 AM | #147 |
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One of these things is not like the other...
Oh, wait, no reason to continue as you won't respond. I have a TOOL OF MURDER in my avatar. http://www.upi.com/Top_News/US/2012/...4411351616086/ |
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30th December 2012, 04:05 AM | #148 |
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Will you quit driving the first time some nut plows into a group of first graders?
I don't suppose you'd like to answer to the fact that the main sponsor of this bill conceal carried. Are politicians above normal citizens? Would you support our politicians carrying firearms after they ban everyone else? |
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30th December 2012, 04:07 AM | #149 |
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30th December 2012, 05:55 AM | #150 |
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As a datapoint, I went to a local store yesterday that was having a store wide sale, including firearms.
It began at 8AM and ran to noon. We got there about 8:10. The gun counter had a crush of buyers about five deep along it's entire length. Kinda like a WalMart sale crush, but more polite. LOTS of long guns and handguns were sold in the hour or so we were there. I suspect few were to first time owners - most of those I saw presented concealed weapons permits which eliminates the need for a background check in GA. I did hear the salesman say they had no Ruger Mini14's, Mini30's or 10/22's. He said they were "impossible to get". I got the impression that some of the activity was driven by fear of future bans, but I can't say for sure - I had never been to that particular shop before in "normal" times. The salesman did say it was normally less "crazy". In any case, guns are always popular around here and most people probably have at least a half dozen or so, if not a LOT more. Its what a lot of locals "collect" when they have discretionary funds. Not much violent crime overall, and gun crime is pretty rare, though not unheard of. I can tell you any law involving either the registration of guns or certain classes of guns, much less the mandatory surrender of them, would meet truly massive civil disobedience across the south, and probably much of the rest of the country as well. |
30th December 2012, 07:33 AM | #151 |
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"Everyone takes the limits of his own vision for the limits of the world." - Arthur Schopenhauer "New and stirring things are belittled because if they are not belittled, the humiliating question arises, 'Why then are you not taking part in them?' " - H. G. Wells |
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30th December 2012, 08:32 AM | #152 |
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30th December 2012, 08:35 AM | #153 |
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30th December 2012, 08:38 AM | #154 |
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The folks who are actually dancing in blood are the manufacturers and retailers. Every slaughter of innocents helps pump up sales.
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30th December 2012, 08:47 AM | #155 |
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30th December 2012, 08:56 AM | #156 |
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No, I'm equating your dumb logic to other things in society that not everyone uses.
Thanks. Glad to hear that. Well, considering the vast majority of the guns that are in the US, do nothing to harm society, I would say that my hoarding weapons are not a blight on you, or anyone else. Correct. Which is why I don't have a problem with schools and libraries. So does gun sales. In fact, right now, guns and ammo are FLYING off the shelves faster than they can be produced. Yep. You're right. Can you cite that again? I've found varying stats, most nowhere near that. ETA: Nevermind, I found it. It's from the WHO who got it from a BOOK called "Gun Violence: The real costs" by Philip J. Cook, Jens Ludwig A book. Can you cite an actual source I can read? Well, considering I never said that, you'd be wrong, again. Do you ever tire of being so wrong, so often? |
30th December 2012, 09:13 AM | #157 |
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Nope.
You missed the point. There are tens of thousands AR15's, Mini14's, AK47's and the like in citizen's hands right now. In gun safes. In closets. Hanging on walls. Can you tell me what percentage are used in mass shootings? Or in any sort of crime? It's an honest question and I'm curious whether real numbers exist. My guess would be a vanishingly small percentage. It comes down to both fairness and constitutional rights. At what point is it unfair to penalize 9,999 law abiding citizens on the outside chance of keeping one class of firearm out of the hands of one criminal/madman? It's a debatable question, but society will have to decide if certain "solutions" are merely "feelgood", or will be effective - and whether such solutions do, in fact, infringe on rights guaranteed to us by the Constitution. |
30th December 2012, 09:16 AM | #158 |
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30th December 2012, 09:19 AM | #159 |
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30th December 2012, 09:25 AM | #160 |
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