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Old 2nd September 2019, 01:31 AM   #1
cullennz
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This would be a mess ya pants moment

First flying lesson, trainer passes out.

Well done that man

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/trave...id-flight.html

Quote:
An Australian student pilot was forced to make a dramatic emergency landing after his Kiwi flight instructor passed out mid-flight.

On Saturday afternoon, Max Sylvester was just over an hour into his first flying lesson when he was forced to call air traffic control at Perth's Jandakot Airport.

In an audio recording of the call provided to ABC, Sylvester says his flight instructor - named by the media outlet as Kiwi Robert Mollard - had passed out and he was requiring assistance to land the Cessna aircraft.

"Do you know how to operate the airplane?" the air traffic control operator asks the student pilot.

"This is my first lesson," he says......................
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Old 2nd September 2019, 01:34 AM   #2
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According to this report, he relied on his homework to get him safe on the ground.
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Old 2nd September 2019, 04:13 AM   #3
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He actually said it was his third lesson, first in that type of plane, first landing. Still, well done. Could have easily had a worse outcome.
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Old 2nd September 2019, 08:31 AM   #4
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Those Cessna 152's and 172's are easy to land. Wouldn't want to solo in one after only 3 hours though.

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Old 2nd September 2019, 10:32 PM   #5
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I wonder if he had any practice on a flight simulator.
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Old 3rd September 2019, 01:26 AM   #6
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Well done that man. It reminded me of the 17-year old student pilot on a solo flight, who lost a wheel on takeoff.
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Old 3rd September 2019, 06:52 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by Puppycow View Post
I wonder if he had any practice on a flight simulator.
It was my impression that training programs don't use simulators unless/until you're working on an instrument rating. Could be wrong, though.
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Old 3rd September 2019, 07:20 AM   #8
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Doesn't mean he couldn't have had P3D or MSFS at home, though.
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Old 3rd September 2019, 09:14 AM   #9
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Originally Posted by Puppycow View Post
I wonder if he had any practice on a flight simulator.
As in Microsoft Flight Simulator on a home computer? I tried it several times before and after lessons in the air. It was of no help at all to me at all when I was initially learning to fly.
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Old 4th September 2019, 04:00 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by Ranb View Post
As in Microsoft Flight Simulator on a home computer? I tried it several times before and after lessons in the air. It was of no help at all to me at all when I was initially learning to fly.
Not even a little bit?

Well I suppose that a professional grade flight simulator with a cockpit like a real plane would be better than Microsoft Flight Simulator on a home computer.
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Old 4th September 2019, 04:06 PM   #11
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There was an incident, many years ago, when the pilot of a two-seater plane died suddenly of a heart attack leaving his entirely inexperienced passenger alone in the cockpit. I can't remember if the passenger was having a flying lesson or was just a passenger. As far as I recall they sent up another plane with a pilot who was able to talk to the guy by radio and they managed to instruct him well enough to get the plane down. I think everybody had expected a crash though. I actually think I read about it in the Readers' Digest!
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Old 4th September 2019, 04:57 PM   #12
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If it's the one I'm thinking of, that was close. He had several attempts and it was getting quite dark when he finally got it down.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-joystick.html
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Old 4th September 2019, 06:07 PM   #13
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Good gracious, that isn't the incident I was thinking about, that was only six years ago and the one I had in mind goes back a lot longer than that. I think it was in the West Country somewhere. But very similar, except in the one I'm thinking about the pilot died suddenly and instantly.
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Old 4th September 2019, 06:12 PM   #14
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TVTropes calls it Crash Course Landing. (Warning: TVTropes link. Be prepared to spend way too much time there.)

There is a section of the page about this occurring in Real Life. Here's the part that might be of interest to Rolfe:

Quote:
This has never happened in a big jumbo jet, but there was an early 1980s episode of Thats Incredible where they tell the story of a husband-and-wife who went up in his small plane. During the flight, he has a heart attack and falls unconscious. The wife, getting instructions from the aircraft control tower, successfully landed the plane.
A similiar (or possibly the same) incident was recounted in an issue of Reader's Digest.
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Old 4th September 2019, 06:24 PM   #15
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The person who landed the plane in the case I'm thinking of was a man, so not the same case. Interesting how often it has happened though. Maybe a case for the mandatory carrying of a parachute in two-seater aircraft? Of course, in a big Jumbo Jet, there are two pilots.

(That page won't let me read it unless I agree to have it tailor ads to my personality or something. So no, basically.)
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Old 4th September 2019, 07:11 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by Rolfe View Post
(That page won't let me read it unless I agree to have it tailor ads to my personality or something. So no, basically.)
Suggestion. I recently started using a browser extension called NoScript which seems to block that sort of nonsense nicely and just lets you read the text without ads, pop-up videos or pop-up demands to agree to this or that:

https://noscript.net/

You can also disable it temporarily and set the sites you use regularly to trusted
for sites that use a lot of script.
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Old 4th September 2019, 07:13 PM   #17
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I'm using a browser in a controlled environment where we aren't allowed to install extensions, and I don't get that popup. There are google ads at the bottom of the screen, but nothing so intrusive.

But yeah, install a script blocker if you're concerned. There's literally no downside to that.
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Old 4th September 2019, 11:47 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by Puppycow View Post
Not even a little bit?

Well I suppose that a professional grade flight simulator with a cockpit like a real plane would be better than Microsoft Flight Simulator on a home computer.
Not even a little bit. It is like the difference between a small radio controlled car and driving a real car. I certainly did not feel connected to the plane while playing with the simulator

Now if I had an instructor next to me coaching me while flying the simulator, it might have been helpful.
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Old 5th September 2019, 12:00 AM   #19
cullennz
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Originally Posted by Rolfe View Post
The person who landed the plane in the case I'm thinking of was a man, so not the same case. Interesting how often it has happened though. Maybe a case for the mandatory carrying of a parachute in two-seater aircraft? Of course, in a big Jumbo Jet, there are two pilots.

(That page won't let me read it unless I agree to have it tailor ads to my personality or something. So no, basically.)
Most big aircraft have 3 now days.

Captain
First Officer
Flight Engineer

All pilots with the same level of training, just different responsibilities
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Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000

Last edited by cullennz; 5th September 2019 at 12:01 AM.
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Old 5th September 2019, 03:15 AM   #20
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Flight engineers haven't been required on modern aircraft since at least the 1980's*. Are you perhaps thinking of the second officer?

Depending on the length of the flight, usually those approaching 16+ hours there might even be a another captain or first or second officer onboard as relief crew, for a total of 4 type-rated pilots.

* Fun fact, despite the aircraft being designed for a two-person crew, Ansett ordered their 767's with a few instruments swapped around, in order to justify a Flight engineer's position. After a few years, they were converted to the standard 2-man cockpit.

Last edited by KDLarsen; 5th September 2019 at 03:19 AM.
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Old 5th September 2019, 03:40 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by KDLarsen View Post
Flight engineers haven't been required on modern aircraft since at least the 1980's*. Are you perhaps thinking of the second officer?

Depending on the length of the flight, usually those approaching 16+ hours there might even be a another captain or first or second officer onboard as relief crew, for a total of 4 type-rated pilots.

* Fun fact, despite the aircraft being designed for a two-person crew, Ansett ordered their 767's with a few instruments swapped around, in order to justify a Flight engineer's position. After a few years, they were converted to the standard 2-man cockpit.
Sorry

Just thinking of massive flights to my in laws in the UK. Always 3.

Flights is usually getting to 14 hours though, so it probably is just to give someone a sleep.

Odd fact I learnt the other day.

Pilots aren't allowed to have the same meals each time in case of severe food poisoning /other messing with it, at each meal time.

Must cause a few tense "I was first!"s

.... "Bags the steak!!!!"
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Last edited by cullennz; 5th September 2019 at 03:41 AM.
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Old 5th September 2019, 03:46 AM   #22
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It's only going to get worse, as Qantas are going to run some trials on the effects extreme longhaul flights on the body, ahead of their Project Sunrise programme (non-stop Sydney/Melbourne/Brisbane-London/Paris/New York flights). Presumably that'll mean as many as 5 pilots onboard, if not more, to counter the fatigue levels the crew will be experiencing.
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Old 5th September 2019, 03:49 AM   #23
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This is similar, but not quite the same.

Wing Cmdr Taffy Holden had some experience in single engine trainers when he inadvertently turned on the afterburner of the EE Lightning he was maintaining.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holden...ghtning_flight

"Unable to disengage the afterburner, Holden ran down the runway narrowly missing a crossing fuel bowser and a de Havilland Comet taking off, before taking off himself. Flying without a helmet or canopy, the ejection seat disabled, and the landing gear locked down, "

He talks about it here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GfeN3FoZYj0
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Old 5th September 2019, 04:50 AM   #24
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Originally Posted by KDLarsen View Post
It's only going to get worse, as Qantas are going to run some trials on the effects extreme longhaul flights on the body, ahead of their Project Sunrise programme (non-stop Sydney/Melbourne/Brisbane-London/Paris/New York flights). Presumably that'll mean as many as 5 pilots onboard, if not more, to counter the fatigue levels the crew will be experiencing.
I know it is probably a bit over kill, but personally think of it as flights get longer, as a bit of a needs must type thing.

If it means I get there safely on an extremely long flight and this takes 4-5 pilots then so be it.
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Old 5th September 2019, 11:17 AM   #25
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Originally Posted by KDLarsen View Post
Well done that man. It reminded me of the 17-year old student pilot on a solo flight, who lost a wheel on takeoff.
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That one reduced me to tears the first time I heard it and it's done it again now. The pilot's voice in the first few communications just kills me.
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Old 5th September 2019, 12:15 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by Puppycow View Post
I wonder if he had any practice on a flight simulator.
Originally Posted by Checkmite View Post
It was my impression that training programs don't use simulators unless/until you're working on an instrument rating. Could be wrong, though.
Originally Posted by Ranb View Post
As in Microsoft Flight Simulator on a home computer? I tried it several times before and after lessons in the air. It was of no help at all to me at all when I was initially learning to fly.

Similar experience here. I landed a real plane many times before ever doing it well on a home computer based simulator.
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Old 5th September 2019, 01:01 PM   #27
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Incidently, the same channel now has a video up of the incident in Australia, with the radio communication between the tower and the aircraft.
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Last edited by KDLarsen; 5th September 2019 at 01:04 PM. Reason: Thought it had radar as well, as these videos usually do.
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Old 5th September 2019, 01:40 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by KDLarsen View Post
Incidently, the same channel now has a video up of the incident in Australia, with the radio communication between the tower and the aircraft.
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Ah, from the conversation near the end of the first video it appears he had flown a different small aircraft before. Probably with some practice with landings but not solo. So "It's my first lesson..." (omitting "...in this model of plane") is a bit misleading.

A very impressive performance, though. He comes across as very competent with the actual landing. He only had problems with specific pieces of equipment that were unfamiliar (such as the transponder). The biggest issue was not knowing how to turn up the headset volume, so he had to ask the controller to repeat things a lot.
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