Is Menard a Russian Agent?

[caveman1917]

Originally Posted by arayder

Here in the states we've have well documented cases of Russian trolls filling up alt.right websites and Facebook pages with misinformation

Really? Feel free to provide that documentation.

[arayder]

Originally Posted by arayder

Here in the states we've have well documented cases of Russian trolls filling up alt.right websites and Facebook pages with misinformation:

Originally Posted by caveman1917

Really? Feel free to provide that documentation.

No problem.

https://www.cnn.com/2021/03/16/polit...ort/index.html

https://www.npr.org/2021/03/16/97795...-2020-election

But my real point is that the enemies of democracy love it when self-promoting losers like Menard try to convince people that their democratic governments aren't real, that their country's laws aren't enforceable, and that they can create their own money.

My contention is that Menard is a sort of useful idiot for the Russians as opposed an actual agent.

Menard and few other wannabe freeman gurus have teamed up with the incredibly gullible Beth Martens. Giving Bobby just PR boost his little narcissistic heart needs she has interviewed him twice.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1-0DBPevQ5Q&t=2987s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v7ZpINjWaMc

She's recently picked up on a guy named Tom Barnett, who sounds like an Australian Mini-Menard:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dbPLRjvQ9bk&t=4122s

[theprestige]

Beth Martens isn't a Russian Troll, though?

[arayder]

Originally Posted by theprestige

Beth Martens isn't a Russian Troll, though?

Highly unlikely.

To me she seems to be a highly impressionable new ager who hasn't taken the time or put in the effort needed to see through Bobby's con.

He's playing her good by telling her he's the way to freedom. But that's what Bobby does.

[theprestige]

Originally Posted by arayder

Highly unlikely.

To me she seems to be a highly impressionable new ager who hasn't taken the time or put in the effort needed to see through Bobby's con.

He's playing her good by telling her he's the way to freedom. But that's what Bobby does.

I'm struggling to figure out what this has to do with the topic of the thread. Did the Russian Trolls get to Beth Martens? Is she being funded by Russian operatives? Is her promotion of Menard part of a Russian conspiracy?

Enquiring minds want to know.

[arayder]

Originally Posted by theprestige

I'm struggling to figure out what this has to do with the topic of the thread. Did the Russian Trolls get to Beth Martens? Is she being funded by Russian operatives? Is her promotion of Menard part of a Russian conspiracy?

Enquiring minds want to know.

It was an "aside".

I am happy to see that you are getting in your daily quota of pestering today.

[caveman1917]

Originally Posted by arayder

No problem.

https://www.cnn.com/2021/03/16/polit...ort/index.html

I'm sorry, you claimed that there was documentation and were asked for it, this source contains no such documentation, just a bunch of claims. I haven't checked the other sources since the first one didn't contain the claimed documentation.

Perhaps you don't understand the meaning of the word "documentation"? For example, we do have documentation of an American troll farm on Wikipedia making claims of a purported "Russian troll farm" existing on Wikipedia. Note how my links provide actual documentation, such as the actual leaked emails where the actions were discussed and which can be cross-referenced with Wikipedia's public edit history etc, instead of just claims.

Now, for the second time, provide the documentation you contend exists for your claims and don't waste my time again.

[theprestige]

Originally Posted by arayder

It was an "aside".

I am happy to see that you are getting in your daily quota of pestering today.

Just trying to keep up with our regular installments of Two Minutes Menard Hate.

[arayder]

Originally Posted by caveman1917

I'm sorry, you claimed that there was documentation and were asked for it, this source contains no such documentation, just a bunch of claims. I haven't checked the other sources since the first one didn't contain the claimed documentation.

Perhaps you don't understand the meaning of the word "documentation"? For example, we do have documentation of an American troll farm on Wikipedia making claims of a purported "Russian troll farm" existing on Wikipedia. Note how my links provide actual documentation, such as the actual leaked emails where the actions were discussed and which can be cross-referenced with Wikipedia's public edit history etc, instead of just claims.

Now, for the second time, provide the documentation you contend exists for your claims and don't waste my time again.

Your denial of reality is not my problem.

[arayder]

Originally Posted by arayder

It was an "aside".

I am happy to see that you are getting in your daily quota of pestering today.

Originally Posted by theprestige

Just trying to keep up with our regular installments of Two Minutes Menard Hate.

Yeah, I have a problem with con men like Menard who cheat others for profit.

[caveman1917]

Originally Posted by arayder

Your denial of reality is not my problem.

No documentation it is then. Why do you lie about having documentation when you clearly have none?

[arayder]

Originally Posted by arayder

Your denial of reality is not my problem.

Originally Posted by caveman1917

No documentation it is then. Why do you lie about having documentation when you clearly have none?

Edited by zooterkin:

<SNIP> Edited for rule 0 and rule 12.

[caveman1917]

Originally Posted by arayder

Edited by zooterkin:

<SNIP> Edited for rule 0 and rule 12.

You've specifically chosen this venue to promote your CT and explicitly claimed that it was documented. When asked for this documentation you failed to provide any. When this was pointed out you just started ranting about people's "denial of reality" for demanding documentation for your CT.

Sorry, your CT is rejected for lacking evidence, whine and/or rant about it all you want.

[theprestige]

Originally Posted by arayder

Yeah, I have a problem with con men like Menard who cheat others for profit.

If that were true, you'd be starting threads about con men like Menard. Everything from Nestlé to Nigerian Princes. MLMs. Stock market shills. Elon Musk. Hell, Menard probably isn't even the biggest con man in Canadia. But he's the only con man you ever talk about. It's pretty clear that it's not "con men like Menard" you have a problem with, it's Menard specifically and uniquely.

[arayder]

Edited by zooterkin:

<SNIP> Edited for rule 0 and rule 12.

If you read through the links you can see where the articles specifically talk about the Russians filling up American social media with misinformation.

That's what you asked about.

If you want to pretend you asked about something else I guess I can't stop you. But here is the original a statement and question:

Quote:

arayder Here in the states we've have well documented cases of Russian trolls filling up alt.right websites and Facebook pages with misinformation

Quote:

caveman1917 Really? Feel free to provide that documentation.

[arayder]

Originally Posted by arayder

Yeah, I have a problem with con men like Menard who cheat others for profit.

Originally Posted by theprestige

If that were true, you'd be starting threads about con men like Menard. Everything from Nestlé to Nigerian Princes. MLMs. Stock market shills. Elon Musk. Hell, Menard probably isn't even the biggest con man in Canadia. But he's the only con man you ever talk about. It's pretty clear that it's not "con men like Menard" you have a problem with, it's Menard specifically and uniquely.

What a thinly veiled debate trick. I don't have to excoriate every con man on the planet to make my criticism of Menard valid.

And for the record I use other places on the web to get after Gavin Seim, Christopher Bruce, Tommy Barnett and Karl Koenigs to name a few.

I always go by arayder.

I accept your apologies in advance.

[caveman1917]

Originally Posted by arayder

Edited by zooterkin:

<SNIP> Edited for rule 0 and rule 12.

If you read through the links you can see where the articles specifically talk about the Russians filling up American social media with misinformation.

That's what you asked about.

No, I asked you for documentation, which is what you claimed to have. I did not ask you for "articles talking about" your CT.

Quote:

If you want to pretend you asked about something else I guess I can't stop you. But here is the original a statement and question:

Yes exactly, note how it says "documentation" and not "articles talking about it." Would you say that the claim that Menard is a Russian agent is well documented merely because you talked about it in your OP? Can you explain, in your own words, the difference between "evidence" and "claim"?

[arayder]

Cavey, the "articles" make clear references to an official report by the U.S. National Intelligence Council.

The article again:

https://www.npr.org/2021/03/16/97795...-2020-election

And in the very first sentence of the article is a link to that authoritative document:

https://int.nyt.com/data/documenttoo...93e1e/full.pdf

How did you miss this, Cavey?

[zooterkin]

Please keep to the topic, keep it civil, and stop the bickering. Thank you.

Responding to this mod box in thread will be off topic Posted By:zooterkin

[caveman1917]

Originally Posted by arayder

Cavey, the "articles" make clear references to an official report by the U.S. National Intelligence Council.

The article again:

https://www.npr.org/2021/03/16/97795...-2020-election

And in the very first sentence of the article is a link to that authoritative document:

https://int.nyt.com/data/documenttoo...93e1e/full.pdf

How did you miss this, Cavey?

So no documentation it is then, only claims. Your CT remains rejected for lack of evidence. I'll repeat my earlier question:

Originally Posted by caveman1917

Can you explain, in your own words, the difference between "evidence" and "claim"?

[arayder]

Originally Posted by caveman1917

So no documentation it is then, only claims. Your CT remains rejected for lack of evidence. I'll repeat my earlier question:

So I ask just what in your mind would constitute documentation, Cavey?

[arayder]

Originally Posted by caveman1917

So no documentation it is then, only claims. Your CT remains rejected for lack of evidence. I'll repeat my earlier question:

Again, you have moved the goal posts, Cavey. You asked for documentation that the Russians were filling up U.S. social media with disinformation and when you got it you pretended you were asking a different question.

[caveman1917]

Originally Posted by arayder

So I ask just what in your mind would constitute documentation, Cavey?

I have already answered this question earlier, as well as, giving you an example, provided you documentation for a similar case regarding Wikipedia. So, things like emails where the purported conspirators are discussing specific actions, specific edit histories or archived internet sources demonstrating the result of these actions, server logs, etc. You know...documentation.

Originally Posted by arayder

Again, you have moved the goal posts, Cavey. You asked for documentation that the Russians were filling up U.S. social media with disinformation and when you got it you pretended you were asking a different question.

You have presented no documentation whatsoever for your CT, nor have I moved any goalposts. Your CT remains rejected for lack of evidence.

[Norman Alexander]

Still not seeing any response to my requests about why I should even care about this Menard chap, his daddy, or a certain "Beth Martens" who may or may not be fictitious.

[arayder]

Originally Posted by Norman Alexander

Still not seeing any response to my requests about why I should even care about this Menard chap, his daddy, or a certain "Beth Martens" who may or may not be fictitious.

If you don't buy the freeman philosophy and don't care about those who get duped into it then you might not care.

Robert Menard has, over the years, sold phony legal advice to a great many people who used that advice only to get themselves in greater trouble. He's doing this as we speak.

Others have tried to "be like Robert" only to end up in hot water after subsequent traffic stops or court dates.

Worst of all Robert has scammed money from gullible people via phony projects like Freeman valley (a sort of freeman commune) and the ACCP (a consumer purchasing association). The projects have phony starts. Menard begs money and then blames the eventual, but certain, failure of the project on the bad ole banks or the government. Nobody ever got their money back.

After the freeman scam gambit ran out Bobby started promoting products and inventions for which he raised money but never got to market. Investors left high and dry were told by Bobby that they should have realized the risk in the investments.

A couple of years ago he sank so low as to steal the name of German game company (Real 3Games), pretend it was his company and then ask people to invest in his scam.

Right now he's trying to revive his freeman career by guesting on Beth Marten's Youtube interviews.

In the end he's nothing but a small time grifter.

[phiwum]

Right, Menard is a small time grifter whose days of glory are past. But here you are seriously considering a bizarre conspiracy theory that he's a Russian agent. A conspiracy theory that, far as I can tell, no one on this forum has seen anywhere but here and you're too coy to direct us to other places it's being discussed.

But you're totally not trying to spread it. It's just up for discussion, since it's out there in the wild.

Menard was an interesting character once, back in his heyday. There's still Freeman/Sovereign Citizen stuff out there and it's been adopted by some Qanons, but Menard doesn't seem to be playing any significant role at all.

Of course, I could be wrong about that and if you had something to say about Menard's latest Freeman stuff, that might be interesting. Arguments that he totally could be a Russian agent are a lot less interesting.

[theprestige]

Originally Posted by arayder

What a thinly veiled debate trick. I don't have to excoriate every con man on the planet to make my criticism of Menard valid.

And for the record I use other places on the web to get after Gavin Seim, Christopher Bruce, Tommy Barnett and Karl Koenigs to name a few.

I always go by arayder.

I accept your apologies in advance.

My apologies. I'll take your word for it that you talk about other conmen in other places.

Any particular reason why you segregate your topics and venues like that?

[theprestige]

Originally Posted by phiwum

Right, Menard is a small time grifter whose days of glory are past. But here you are seriously considering a bizarre conspiracy theory that he's a Russian agent. A conspiracy theory that, far as I can tell, no one on this forum has seen anywhere but here and you're too coy to direct us to other places it's being discussed.

But you're totally not trying to spread it. It's just up for discussion, since it's out there in the wild.

Menard was an interesting character once, back in his heyday. There's still Freeman/Sovereign Citizen stuff out there and it's been adopted by some Qanons, but Menard doesn't seem to be playing any significant role at all.

Of course, I could be wrong about that and if you had something to say about Menard's latest Freeman stuff, that might be interesting. Arguments that he totally could be a Russian agent are a lot less interesting.

This.

I found the Freeman stuff interesting when I first heard about it. But once I'd ingested the bulk of the premise and its typical expressions, what's left? Once you've scene Menard's schtick three or four times, it gets stale. I'm not sure the world really needs a newsletter about Menard's continued menarding.

Is there anything new and interesting going on in the world of Freemanitis? Or is it just the same rogue's gallery of dupes and tools in the same circle-jerk we've known about for years? At this point I'm pretty sure arayder spends more time thinking about and reporting on Menard than any Russian troll farm does.

Now, I do agree that it is possible Menard is actually being funded by Russian operatives. I'm not saying that's true. I'm just saying it could be true. Do you think maybe it's true?

[arayder]

Originally Posted by phiwum

Right, Menard is a small time grifter whose days of glory are past. But here you are seriously considering a bizarre conspiracy theory that he's a Russian agent. A conspiracy theory that, far as I can tell, no one on this forum has seen anywhere but here and you're too coy to direct us to other places it's being discussed.

But you're totally not trying to spread it. It's just up for discussion, since it's out there in the wild.

Menard was an interesting character once, back in his heyday. There's still Freeman/Sovereign Citizen stuff out there and it's been adopted by some Qanons, but Menard doesn't seem to be playing any significant role at all.

Of course, I could be wrong about that and if you had something to say about Menard's latest Freeman stuff, that might be interesting. Arguments that he totally could be a Russian agent are a lot less interesting.

Menard still has his legal advice business going and is giving out bad advice to at least one dupe, a dog breeder in trouble with animal control in New Brunswick. There may be others getting the shaft.

The law societies are watching him.

Bobby is attempting to revive his act by doing interviews with Beth Marten via Youtube. It's all the same stuff he droned on about a decade ago.

As for the CT, I think he could be thought of, at most, as a useful idiot that the Russians love to see for the simple fact that he preaches that western democracies are not real and their laws are mere fiction.

The Russians are all over western social media and I suppose it's possible that Russian trolls send a few likes Bobby's way so as to feed his little narcissistic soul.

That's all the poor boy needs.

He's a cheap date.

[arayder]

Originally Posted by theprestige

My apologies. I'll take your word for it that you talk about other conmen in other places.

Any particular reason why you segregate your topics and venues like that?

Think about it. On the forums where everyone knows all about Seim and the others the conversations about them are easier.

Over on Fogbow the conversations about Christopher Bruce are 30% about making jokes about "Sporky". Same jokes won't work here.

It's sorta like not going on a firearm forum to talk about your new compound bow.

[dudalb]

If Meanard is a Russian agent, then Putin is a lot more desperate to find Russian agents then I thought.....

[arayder]

You can bet the Kremlin loves all Canadians who act as traitors to their country.

As part of his phony peace officer oath Menard swore to uphold the laws of Canada and preserve the peace. But for an $800 fee he'll will give you phony legal advice telling you how he imagines you can ignore any law you want.

As we speak he's in the process of bilking money out of a dog breeder in New Brunswick by telling her the province's laws regulating breeders and outlawing animal cruelty just don't apply to her.

The reason Menard can't more effectively do the the bidding of his country's enemies is because he's a self deluding narcissist.

So maybe that makes him a useless idiot rather than a useful idiot?

[theprestige]

Originally Posted by arayder

The reason Menard can't more effectively do the the bidding of his country's enemies is because he's a self deluding narcissist.

And also there's no evidence his country's enemies are bidding him to do anything, remember?

[arayder]

Originally Posted by arayder

The reason Menard can't more effectively do the the bidding of his country's enemies is because he's a self deluding narcissist.

Originally Posted by theprestige

And also there's no evidence his country's enemies are bidding him to do anything, remember?

Yeah. It's a conspiracy theory.

But ya' gotta' wonder why Traitor Bobby is taking a page right out of Putin's playbook.

Just saying.

[theprestige]

Originally Posted by arayder

Yeah. It's a conspiracy theory.

But ya' gotta' wonder why Traitor Bobby is taking a page right out of Putin's playbook.

Just saying.

"Traitor."

And no, I don't "gotta wonder" at all. It's not an obscure or esoteric playbook. There's no reason to believe Menard needed Putin to inspire him to perpetrate his menarderies. It's extremely plausible that he came up with them on his own, or built them up from the efforts of previous freetards.

But you're really doubling down on this conspiracy theory angle, aren't you? You might wanna drag your gaze away from the abyss for a bit.

[arayder]

Yeah, traitor.

He says he loves Canada and has sworn to uphold it's laws. Then he does everything he can (in his limited boozy way) to get people to ignore the law.

If that's not a traitor, it'll do until one comes along.

[theprestige]

LOL. When you put it that way, it gives me the mental image of a guy sitting on his front porch with a shotgun, taking pot-shots at the squatter in the vacant lot across the street, while he waits for a "real" traitor to show up.

[arayder]

Good to hear ya' laugh.

Ole Bobby openly supported legislation in Quebec that denied Muslim women the freedom to cover their faces in public.

When holocaust deniers and nazi apoligists took up residence on the forum on his old freeman web site he dismissed their prejudice as merely an alternative way of looking at history.

He seems like a badly closeted authoritarian to me.

[phiwum]

Supporting legislation is not usually regarded as traitorous. Especially when the legislation has nothing to do with overthrowing the gov't or benefiting an enemy. That's a really weak argument.

If I were to support the legalization of slavery through legislation, there's a lot you could call me, but treasonous isn't plausible.

And the notion that Menard is authoritarian is equally laughable. He's cottoned onto ridiculous exagerations of libertarianism, not authoritarianism. Mind you, supporting the law against face coverings is a poor fit with his political "theory", but so what? Doesn't make him an authoritarian.

[TheSupermeerkat]

Has anyone just considered that Menard is just an opportunist, conman and dickhead and nothing more?