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Tags abortion issues , abortion laws , Texas issues

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Old 2nd October 2014, 05:26 PM   #1
thaiboxerken
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Texas bans abortion.

Well the conservatives won in Texas. Abortion is now banned in the state.
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Old 2nd October 2014, 05:29 PM   #2
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Originally Posted by thaiboxerken View Post
Well the conservatives won in Texas. Abortion is now banned in the state.
Cite?
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Old 2nd October 2014, 05:32 PM   #3
thaiboxerken
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http://www.miamiherald.com/news/nati...le2486386.html

For rural areas, abortion has been practically banned.
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Old 2nd October 2014, 05:38 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by thaiboxerken View Post
Well the conservatives won in Texas. Abortion is now banned in the state.
Originally Posted by thaiboxerken View Post
For rural areas, abortion has been practically banned.
For certain values of "practically". And "Texas".
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Old 2nd October 2014, 05:50 PM   #5
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What has become of this ruling?
AUG. 29, 2014

Quote:
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/08/30/us...-law.html?_r=0

A federal judge in Austin, Tex., blocked a stringent new rule on Friday that would have forced more than half of the state’s remaining abortion clinics to close, the latest in a string of court decisions that have at least temporarily kept abortion clinics across the South from being shuttered.
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Old 2nd October 2014, 06:00 PM   #6
thaiboxerken
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Originally Posted by Olowkow View Post
What has become of this ruling?
AUG. 29, 2014
The appeals court overruled that decision.
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Old 2nd October 2014, 07:10 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by thaiboxerken View Post
The appeals court overruled that decision.
Missed that somehow. Just the point of the thread! Ouch. Sorry.
I need some sleep.

Last edited by Olowkow; 2nd October 2014 at 07:12 PM.
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Old 2nd October 2014, 07:17 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by thaiboxerken View Post
http://www.miamiherald.com/news/nati...le2486386.html

For rural areas, abortion has been practically banned.
And there it is.

Elective abortions are legal in Texas, and there are several clinics in the state that offer the service.

So much for "Texas bans abortion".
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Old 2nd October 2014, 07:33 PM   #9
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Yes, it's only banned for those who can't get to the remaining 7 clinics that are not anywhere near them.

This is a major step towards a complete prohibition of abortion.
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Old 2nd October 2014, 07:36 PM   #10
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Texas bans abortion for the rural poor. Because you can't tell women what to do with their bodies, but you can tell poor people what to do as much as you want.
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Old 2nd October 2014, 07:44 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
And there it is.

Elective abortions are legal in Texas, and there are several clinics in the state that offer the service.

So much for "Texas bans abortion".
So, if Texas only allowed guns to be purchased in 7 locations, that would be okay? After all, it wouldn't be a ban, so it should be fine, right?
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Old 2nd October 2014, 07:49 PM   #12
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The dishonesty of the anti-woman crowd in this thread is equivalent to open, direct, public lying.

Just like other evidence, the anti-woman, anti-rights, pro-slavery crowd now feels like it's safe to come out of the woodwork.

And yes, compelling any woman to carry a child to term, regardless of how it's done, is an act of slavery. The so-called pro-life movement is simply a slavery movement. A pro-life movement would care about the woman and the child, not just the fetus.
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Old 2nd October 2014, 07:56 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
For certain values of "practically". And "Texas".
I do not understand your objection. I get the objection to saying 'banned' outright, but the further qualifiers are spot on. If you think any of the qualifiers are wrong or misleading, please explain how. I'd say that the common use of 'practically' and 'Texas' are closer to the use in the post you're complaining about than the use you seem to be saying.

When someone says 'for certain values', they're usually saying that what was said could technically be true, but as they are generally understood what was said was not accurate.

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For those more interested in addressing the exact accuracy of description of what is happening than in discussing what is happening (as evidenced by saying nothing else), what do you all think of these rules? Do you think they are being put forth honestly (that the claimed reason for them is the actual reason)? Do you think they are not overly burdensome? Do you think they are a bad end-around? Apart from 'it's not technically a ban', what do you all have to say about it? How do you think similar restrictions on gun ownership/purchases wouldn't be overly burdensome either, or that they'd pass muster?

For me this is blatantly bad end around trying to regulate legal abortion out of existence, a de facto attempt at bans. It's effect will be deaths from illegal abortions in rural areas and won't have any of the benefits proponents claim. Further I believe the proponents are not making these claims in good faith. They know what they're doing, why they're doing it, and how they're lying about it.

EDIT: Ninja by crescent on that point.
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Old 2nd October 2014, 07:56 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by crescent View Post
So, if Texas only allowed guns to be purchased in 7 locations, that would be okay? After all, it wouldn't be a ban, so it should be fine, right?
Ask thaiboxerken. He's the one who seems to think that the only possible options are "okay" and "ban". Well, he and you. Not really a conversation I need to be a part of, don't you think?
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Old 2nd October 2014, 08:54 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by thaiboxerken View Post
Well the conservatives won in Texas. Abortion is now banned in the state.
Good.
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Old 2nd October 2014, 09:00 PM   #16
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This may be the catalyst that wins the Governor's race for Wendy Davis.
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Old 2nd October 2014, 09:25 PM   #17
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Libertarians have a strange idea of liberty.
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Old 2nd October 2014, 10:33 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by Unabogie View Post
Libertarians have a strange idea of liberty.
Their idea is that YOU shall act the way they compel you to act under threats of state violence.

Ironic, that.
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Old 2nd October 2014, 11:06 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
And there it is.

Elective abortions are legal in Texas, and there are several clinics in the state that offer the service.

So much for "Texas bans abortion".
How many is several?
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Old 2nd October 2014, 11:30 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by thaiboxerken View Post
This may be the catalyst that wins the Governor's race for Wendy Davis.

Last edited by Brainster; 2nd October 2014 at 11:32 PM.
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Old 3rd October 2014, 06:11 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by tyr_13 View Post
I do not understand your objection. I get the objection to saying 'banned' outright, but the further qualifiers are spot on.
The ban isn't very effective if you just need to drive a bit of a distance to overcome it. That may be unfair, that may be restrictive for certain people, that may be bad policy, but it's not a ban, nor is it even "practically" a ban. And the "further qualifier" of rural Texas is also quite different than "Texas".
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Old 3rd October 2014, 06:14 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by thaiboxerken View Post
This may be the catalyst that wins the Governor's race for Wendy Davis.
Mmmm... I can almost taste the false hope ripening on the vine! I can't wait for it to get crushed into whine.
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Old 3rd October 2014, 06:18 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
The ban isn't very effective if you just need to drive a bit of a distance to overcome it.

Nothing in Texas is "a bit of distance" from anything.
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Old 3rd October 2014, 06:32 AM   #24
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Originally Posted by Loss Leader View Post
Nothing in Texas is "a bit of distance" from anything.
Fort Bliss to Austin. I've made that drive. It's a bit of distance. Fort Bliss is in a dry county. Austin is not. I can tell you from direct personal experience that nothing about that arrangement equates to "Texas bans bar hopping." Not even "practically". Not even "rural".

Tyr is right. The discussion is poorly framed. I think there's a place for well framed discussion of this issue,but this thread probably isn't it, and defending the poor framing of the OP probably won't get you there.
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Old 3rd October 2014, 06:51 AM   #25
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
The ban isn't very effective if you just need to drive a bit of a distance to overcome it. That may be unfair, that may be restrictive for certain people, that may be bad policy, but it's not a ban, nor is it even "practically" a ban. And the "further qualifier" of rural Texas is also quite different than "Texas".
Your answer suggests to me you've never driven, or worse ridden greyhound, across Texas.
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Old 3rd October 2014, 07:19 AM   #26
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if the Republicans continue, IS will get jealous for all those "godly" policies
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Old 3rd October 2014, 07:20 AM   #27
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Originally Posted by thaiboxerken View Post
Well the conservatives won in Texas. Abortion is now banned in the state.
No, it isn't.

Mods: Please move to conspiracy section.
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Old 3rd October 2014, 07:29 AM   #28
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Originally Posted by thaiboxerken View Post
Well the conservatives won in Texas. Abortion is now banned in the state.
I appreciate the sentiment, but as we see, the basic issue gets lost in the noise trumpeting the error in wording
Originally Posted by crescent View Post
So, if Texas only allowed guns to be purchased in 7 locations, that would be okay? After all, it wouldn't be a ban, so it should be fine, right?
You didn't expect an honest did you?
Originally Posted by Unabogie View Post
Libertarians have a strange idea of liberty.
It is consistent with my observation that Libertarian belief is a religious belief and like religious beliefs the believers pick and choose what they want to believe. It's also consistent with the concept that the overtly religious are Republicans first and religious second.
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Old 3rd October 2014, 07:53 AM   #29
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Originally Posted by Loss Leader View Post
Nothing in Texas is "a bit of distance" from anything.
Especially for women who don't own cars, don't have jobs, can't afford to take days of work, can't afford a hotel in another city, or can't spare time away from their jobs or kids. Again, conservatives have a bizarre sense of personal freedom. They claim freedom is sacrosanct and therefore Obamacare is evil, but shrug their shoulders at the government dictating what women can do with their own bodies.
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Old 3rd October 2014, 07:56 AM   #30
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The purpose of the law is to make it hard to access abortion, especially for those in the poor, rural areas. It's just another step towards the ban that Conservatives want.
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Old 3rd October 2014, 08:12 AM   #31
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
Mmmm... I can almost taste the false hope ripening on the vine! I can't wait for it to get crushed into whine.
It won't be easy, but the gerrymandering and voter suppression can be overcome.
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Old 3rd October 2014, 08:15 AM   #32
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Originally Posted by ApolloGnomon View Post
Your answer suggests to me you've never driven, or worse ridden greyhound, across Texas.

Driving across Texas, while a great name for a band, is a horrible thing to actually do.
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Old 3rd October 2014, 08:20 AM   #33
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Originally Posted by thaiboxerken View Post
It won't be easy, but the gerrymandering and voter suppression can be overcome.
I eagerly await your explanation for how gerrymandering affects gubernatorial elections.
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Old 3rd October 2014, 08:22 AM   #34
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Originally Posted by Unabogie View Post
Especially for women who don't own cars, don't have jobs, can't afford to take days of work, can't afford a hotel in another city, or can't spare time away from their jobs or kids. Again, conservatives have a bizarre sense of personal freedom. They claim freedom is sacrosanct and therefore Obamacare is evil, but shrug their shoulders at the government dictating what women can do with their own bodies.
Pop quiz time:

Does Ziggurat think abortion should be legal or illegal?
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Old 3rd October 2014, 08:25 AM   #35
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
I eagerly await your explanation for how gerrymandering affects gubernatorial elections.
Too true, that only affects national elections. However, the voter suppression is still a hard rock to climb.
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Old 3rd October 2014, 08:31 AM   #36
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
Pop quiz time:

Does Ziggurat think abortion should be legal or illegal?
Who cares? Does Ziggurat engage in constant apologia and vote consistently for people who want abortion to be a crime? You betcha.
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Old 3rd October 2014, 08:34 AM   #37
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Originally Posted by Unabogie View Post
Who cares?
You, apparently.
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Old 3rd October 2014, 08:38 AM   #38
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
You, apparently.
No, I don't. I just think sophistry and apologia is worthy of condemnation and your posts are low hanging fruit.
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Old 3rd October 2014, 08:38 AM   #39
thaiboxerken
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
You, apparently.
But, apparently, you don't. As you constantly apologize for anti-abortion legislation and vote for anti-abortionists.
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1. He'd never do that. 2. Okay but he's not currently doing it. 3. Okay but he's not currently technically doing it. 4. Okay but everyone does it. 5. He's doing it, we can't stop him, no point in complaining about it. 6. We all knew he was going to do it which... makes it okay somehow. 7. It's perfectly fine that's he's doing it.
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Old 3rd October 2014, 08:51 AM   #40
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Originally Posted by thaiboxerken View Post
The purpose of the law is to make it hard to access abortion, especially for those in the poor, rural areas. It's just another step towards the ban that Conservatives want.
Limiting the number of clinics makes it easier to put a cordon of protesters around every clinic.
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