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Old 17th September 2021, 06:08 PM   #281
Fidelio
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Originally Posted by Warbler View Post
That also doesn't make one a medical expert. My Mom having been a nurse for over 40 years probably has more medical knowledge than the average forum member, doesn't mean she qualifies as medical expert. She is not a doctor and certainly not an MD.
Not to put too fine a point in this but I'm probably more a "medical expert" than any ******** claiming that ******** malaria, worms, treatments and
uv lamps, and bleach can be used to treat a virus. Hell I finished high school on 1970.

I'm old enough to remember when science was taken seriously.

Also welcome Warbler

Oh and I made sure the shot was next to my smallpox vac scar and where I got the Salk vac and I ate a sugar cube in honor of Saban.
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Last edited by Fidelio; 17th September 2021 at 06:27 PM. Reason: Add stuff...kind of important
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Old 17th September 2021, 06:54 PM   #282
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Originally Posted by Warbler View Post
That also doesn't make one a medical expert. My Mom having been a nurse for over 40 years probably has more medical knowledge than the average forum member, doesn't mean she qualifies as medical expert. She is not a doctor and certainly not an MD.
Thanks to your mom and her many years of service to the medical community. I would take your mom's advice over any governor, or other politician who does not have a background in the medical fields, and/or doesn't listen to those who do. As for chiropractors... woo is as woo does.

Not to say that there aren't medical professionals that have lost their way.

Last edited by kevbo; 17th September 2021 at 06:56 PM.
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Old 17th September 2021, 07:12 PM   #283
Warbler
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Originally Posted by Fidelio View Post
Not to put too fine a point in this but I'm probably more a "medical expert" than any ******** claiming that ******** malaria, worms, treatments and
uv lamps, and bleach can be used to treat a virus. Hell I finished high school on 1970.

I'm old enough to remember when science was taken seriously.

Also welcome Warbler

Oh and I made sure the shot was next to my smallpox vac scar and where I got the Salk vac and I ate a sugar cube in honor of Saban.
rest assured, my mother would never claim Malaria, worms, 'treatments', uv lamps and/or bleach can be used treat covid. and thanks for the welcome
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Old 17th September 2021, 07:13 PM   #284
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Originally Posted by kevbo View Post
Thanks to your mom and her many years of service to the medical community. I would take your mom's advice over any governor, or other politician who does not have a background in the medical fields, and/or doesn't listen to those who do. As for chiropractors... woo is as woo does.

Not to say that there aren't medical professionals that have lost their way.
Thanks for your kind words about my Mom.
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Old 17th September 2021, 07:21 PM   #285
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Originally Posted by Warbler View Post
That also doesn't make one a medical expert. My Mom having been a nurse for over 40 years probably has more medical knowledge than the average forum member, doesn't mean she qualifies as medical expert. She is not a doctor and certainly not an MD.
My sister was a nurse for over 40 years, too. Ran the OB/GYN clinic at the King Faisal Royal Hospital in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia for 3 years, was an active Air Force nurse, Army Reserve nurse, worked the liver transplant floor and ER at a Veteran's hospital for the last 20 years. She's no doctor either, but she saved more than one newbie doctor from making a critical...and deadly... mistake by questioning an order! Doctors get the glory...nurses do the dirty work.
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Old 17th September 2021, 07:24 PM   #286
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Originally Posted by Fidelio View Post
Not to put too fine a point in this but I'm probably more a "medical expert" than any ******** claiming that ******** malaria, worms, treatments and
uv lamps, and bleach can be used to treat a virus. Hell I finished high school on 1970.

I'm old enough to remember when science was taken seriously.

Also welcome Warbler

Oh and I made sure the shot was next to my smallpox vac scar and where I got the Salk vac and I ate a sugar cube in honor of Saban.
Sabin. Normally I'd let that go as a typo but the man deserves his name to be spelled right if anyone does!
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Old 17th September 2021, 07:45 PM   #287
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
They probably have more medical knowledge than the average forum member, though. You'd have to take it on a case-by-case basis.
I don't get this. I don't see many forum members pretending they are experts on medical science.

I fully admit my knowledge of medicine is very limited. This is why I seek medical advice from medical professionals and value the expertise of those that are specialists inthat field.
I'm not going to an ophthalmologist if the issue is with my gastrointestinal tract or the issue is virology or epidemiology.

I think it's ok to get second opinions. But in the end I am going to trust the medical doctors.
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Old 17th September 2021, 08:45 PM   #288
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
I'm not going to an ophthalmologist if the issue is with my gastrointestinal tract
You'll need to see both if you ever come down with the ailment (common in restaurants) where your eyes are bigger than your stomach.
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Old 17th September 2021, 10:20 PM   #289
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Originally Posted by TragicMonkey View Post
You'll need to see both if you ever come down with the ailment (common in restaurants) where your eyes are bigger than your stomach.
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Old 17th September 2021, 10:28 PM   #290
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This is great, from the Trevor Noah Daily Show: "We made Desi Lydic watch 87 hours of Fox News to explain why Biden's vaccine mandate is North Korea times Apartheid plus 9/11." It's hilarious.

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I AGREE
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Old 17th September 2021, 10:35 PM   #291
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
I'm not going to an ophthalmologist if the issue is with my gastrointestinal tract or the issue is virology or epidemiology.
And that reminds me of a story...

[comic relief time]

A man goes to see an ophthalmologist, and takes with him a shoebox. The ophthalmologist asks him what the matter is, and the man opens the lid and shows him. In the bottom of the shoebox is an enormous, hard, brown turd about the size of a cucumber.

"Good God!" exclaims the ophthalmologist, "did you do that?"

"Yes" says the man

"I think you have come to the wrong place sir" says the ophthalmologist "You need to see a gastrointestinal specialist"

"No" says the man "Its you I need to see alright. The problem is, every time I do one of these, my eyes water!"
.
.
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If you don't like my posts, opinions, or directness then put me on your ignore list. This will benefit both of us; you won't have to take umbrage at my posts, and I won't have to waste time talking to you... simples!

Last edited by smartcooky; 18th September 2021 at 12:07 AM.
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Old 17th September 2021, 10:39 PM   #292
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
This is great, from the Trevor Noah Daily Show: "We made Desi Lydic watch 87 hours of Fox News to explain why Biden's vaccine mandate is North Korea times Apartheid plus 9/11." It's hilarious.

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I AGREE
After visiting Mark Dice's site and reading what his followers have to say....yep...Desi has it down pat.

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Old 18th September 2021, 02:12 AM   #293
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Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
And that reminds me of a story...

[comic relief time]

A man goes to see an ophthalmologist, and takes with him a shoebox. The ophthalmologist asks him what the matter is, and the man opens the lid and shows him. In the bottom of the shoebox is an enormous, hard, brown turd about the size of a cucumber.

"Good God!" exclaims the ophthalmologist, "did you do that?"

"Yes" says the man

"I think you have come to the wrong place sir" says the ophthalmologist "You need to see a gastrointestinal specialist"

"No" says the man "Its you I need to see alright. The problem is, every time I do one of these, my eyes water!"
.
.


I think my dad would have liked your joke, and then told it to me. My mom, not so much. But then that was part of the fun of the telling for my dad.
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Old 18th September 2021, 12:25 PM   #294
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
My sister was a nurse for over 40 years, too. Ran the OB/GYN clinic at the King Faisal Royal Hospital in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia for 3 years, was an active Air Force nurse, Army Reserve nurse, worked the liver transplant floor and ER at a Veteran's hospital for the last 20 years. She's no doctor either, but she saved more than one newbie doctor from making a critical...and deadly... mistake by questioning an order! Doctors get the glory...nurses do the dirty work.
Yeah, my Mom had to question Doctor's orders a few time too.
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Old 18th September 2021, 01:16 PM   #295
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Originally Posted by TragicMonkey View Post
You'll need to see both if you ever come down with the ailment (common in restaurants) where your eyes are bigger than your stomach.
:.

I have that problem a lot.

But I don't think either can help me with that.
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Old 18th September 2021, 03:47 PM   #296
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If your eyes are bigger than your stomach, you've had gastric bypass surgery!
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Old 20th September 2021, 05:58 AM   #297
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Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
If only that photo was not in black and white... then I could have captioned it... "Well, colour me surprised!!!"
Here you go:
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Old 20th September 2021, 07:58 AM   #298
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Originally Posted by Steve View Post
Both high lighted statements are true. But also rather contradictory, don't you think? And I doubt that either qualifies a chiropractor to sign off mask exemptions.
They should have to sign off mask exemptions every single day, just like they have to pop your back over and over for you to feel good for a little while.
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Old 20th September 2021, 11:30 AM   #299
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the U.S. Government has a deadline of November 22 for all federal employees to be "fully vaccinated". This means two-weeks after the final shot.

That leads to this timeline:

• October 11: First dose deadline (Moderna COVID-19 vaccine)
• October 18: First dose deadline (Pfizer COVID-19 vaccine)
• November 8: Second dose deadline (Moderna and Pfizer vaccine)
• November 8: First (only) dose deadline (Johnson and Johnson COVID-19 vaccine)
• November 22: Federal employees must be fully vaccinated

Interesting to see how this plays out. Lots of federal agencies have a lot of federal employees in conservative rural areas. I support the mandates, but with some unease - this is going to be painful. I'm expecting a number of early retirements, maybe an extension of the deadline.

Then the lawsuits and legal processes get started - how long to do all the paperwork to fire a Fed who refuses to get vaccinated? Would they be terminated due to administrative procedures for bad conduct, or would it be bad performance? Can they start the process as early as Nov. 8, or wait until after the 22? Do they suspend a person starting on the 22 and keep them on unpaid suspension until the firing process is complete? I mean, some of the adverse disciplinary actions that result in firing happen fast, in a matter of weeks - but others drag on for literal years.

Those federal employee terminations that drag on for years often seem to be the ones with the most grey areas, where both parties involved are overly touchy and dramatic, and where the supervisor is an idiot who consistently screws up the paperwork. Contrary to popular perception, its not all that difficult to fire a fed for bad conduct, it just needs a supervisor who knows how to do the job right. Bad performance is a separate issue, much harder to deal with.

If a person finally gets the shot after all, do they drop the process and retain the employee even if they have initially blown past the deadline?

I guess one of the regions of the federal agency I work for had an "all employees reply-all" email chain going this past Friday, regarding this issue. My agency has the ability to shut down such email chains, I gather some agencies don't (which seems outdated and surprising, but that's a subject for another thread), so this one was shut down after just a few dozen replies. I expect more of that to happen. It's being compared to Reagan firing the Air Traffic Controllers, and that's just the less dramatic comparison.

This is going to be a big thing.
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Old 20th September 2021, 11:36 PM   #300
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Originally Posted by Earthborn View Post
Thank you!

Well, colour me surprised!
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If you don't like my posts, opinions, or directness then put me on your ignore list. This will benefit both of us; you won't have to take umbrage at my posts, and I won't have to waste time talking to you... simples!
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Old 24th September 2021, 04:19 AM   #301
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Football covid! (no masks outdoors)

I think most of the university staff is vaccinated, the students only 40-50%.

Because we had football games, we get a spike on mondays for covid. A week ago it was 400, last Mon it was 1000. The previous one day peak was in December, some 300. So the delta variant and the college operating normally except masks in class to end of Sep has brought single day peaks. The 7 day average never goes over 250.
(I'm in a state capitol, county has 290 000 people).

The entire 2020 football season went with no real audience, limited family members of the team players.
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Old 24th September 2021, 06:16 AM   #302
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
This is great, from the Trevor Noah Daily Show: "We made Desi Lydic watch 87 hours of Fox News to explain why Biden's vaccine mandate is North Korea times Apartheid plus 9/11." It's hilarious.

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I AGREE
That has to be considered cruel and inhuman to Desi, lol. I can watch maybe 5 to 10... minutes of Faux News before I have to change the channel. If I had to do all that for a comedy bit, I don't know if I would have the strength.

Definitely channeled the paranoid and unhinged behavior of the anti-vaxxers and anti-maskers.
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Old 24th September 2021, 07:49 AM   #303
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Not sure which vaccine thread to post this in, but HERE is a smart hospital's response to employees claiming a religious exemption.

"The list includes Tylenol, Pepto Bismol, aspirin, Tums, Lipitor, Senokot, Motrin, ibuprofen, Maalox, Ex-Lax, Benadryl, Sudafed, albuterol, Preparation H, MMR vaccine, Claritin, Zoloft, Prilosec OTC, and azithromycin."
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Old 25th September 2021, 02:57 PM   #304
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Originally Posted by bruto View Post
Not sure which vaccine thread to post this in, but HERE is a smart hospital's response to employees claiming a religious exemption.

"The list includes Tylenol, Pepto Bismol, aspirin, Tums, Lipitor, Senokot, Motrin, ibuprofen, Maalox, Ex-Lax, Benadryl, Sudafed, albuterol, Preparation H, MMR vaccine, Claritin, Zoloft, Prilosec OTC, and azithromycin."

Gotta treat children like children.
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Old 25th September 2021, 03:04 PM   #305
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Old 26th September 2021, 03:37 PM   #306
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Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
Are British people getting crisps in their vaccines?
That would be nice, but since Brexit, Britain has been returning to a pre-industrial feudal society without the means of producing crisps or anything else. And if asked, the answer is yes, that's exactly the Brexit they voted for!
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Old 28th September 2021, 06:13 AM   #307
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Time to watch the so-called vaccine refusers chicken out when their bluff is called:

Quote:
Despite claims by the Massachusetts State Police union that “dozens of troopers” have submitted their resignation papers due to a COVID-19 vaccine requirement, a State Police spokesman said late Monday that only one trooper has definitively said he will retire because of the mandate.

“The Department has been notified by our HR office of one Trooper who has definitively stated he will retire because of the vaccine mandate,” spokesman David Procopio said in an e-mail. “It is our understanding that other Troopers have indicated they may possibly resign or retire for that reason, but as of [Monday evening] we are aware of only the one.”

The State Police Association of Massachusetts said Friday that among the troopers who plan to resign, some may return to “other departments offering reasonable alternatives such as mask wearing and regular testing.” The union had issued its Friday statement following a judge’s ruling that blocked its bid to extend Governor Charlie Baker’s Oct. 17 deadline to be vaccinated.
https://www.bostonglobe.com/2021/09/...initively-has/

Even if you believe the claim of the union, "dozens" of state troopers is insignificant compared to the roughly 2,000 trooper force.

If you can call the bluff of a bunch of thumb-headed cops used to getting exemptions to practically every rule, you can call the bluff of anybody. Seems like a good time to call the question and see how many of these vaccine refusers actually have the courage of their convictions.
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Old 28th September 2021, 09:35 AM   #308
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Another example:

Quote:
More than 175 employees of North Carolina-based Novant Health have been terminated after not complying with the company’s mandatory COVID-19 vaccination program.

Novant officials said last week that around 375 workers were suspended for defying the new policy. On Monday, Spokesperson Megan Rivers said in an email said nearly 200 additional workers came into compliance and confirmed that the others who failed to do so were fired, but did not give exact numbers.

...

Over 99% out of nearly 35,000 Novant Health employees are in compliance with the health company’s policy, Rivers tweeted Monday.
175 out of 35,000 stuck to their guns. A totally acceptable loss towards the goal of getting holdouts vaccinated.

Notable that some 200 changed their mind when they got suspended and realized that the hospital was not kidding, got their shots, and are back on the job.

https://www.wane.com/community/healt...covid-vaccine/

These morons are all talk, no guts.
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Old 28th September 2021, 10:48 AM   #309
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Originally Posted by SuburbanTurkey View Post
Another example:



175 out of 35,000 stuck to their guns. A totally acceptable loss towards the goal of getting holdouts vaccinated.

Notable that some 200 changed their mind when they got suspended and realized that the hospital was not kidding, got their shots, and are back on the job.

https://www.wane.com/community/healt...covid-vaccine/

These morons are all talk, no guts.
I guess they think they will get their job back once the 34,825 die of the vaccine nanovirus.
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Old 28th September 2021, 12:45 PM   #310
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It's like I said earlier: when it comes down to actually choosing between "but mah freedoms!" and a paycheck, most people will choose their paycheck.
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Old 1st October 2021, 11:52 AM   #311
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I just saw a NYC school teacher interviewed who has decided not to get the vaccine by the 5 PM deadline. She says her objection is religiously based but repeatedly failed to state exactly what the "religiously based" objection is. She was asked what in Judaism was the basis for her objection. She danced all around it with "I have a strong faith" blah blah blah but never provided any kind of teaching or prohibition for vaccinations from Judaism. She was then asked exactly what about the vaccine scared her. Again, she fell back on "I have a very strong faith" never actually answering the question. Very weird. I can't help but suspect her faith isn't what is driving her refusal to get vaccinated but she is using it in order to get an exemption.
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Old 1st October 2021, 12:46 PM   #312
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
I just saw a NYC school teacher interviewed who has decided not to get the vaccine by the 5 PM deadline. She says her objection is religiously based but repeatedly failed to state exactly what the "religiously based" objection is. She was asked what in Judaism was the basis for her objection. She danced all around it with "I have a strong faith" blah blah blah but never provided any kind of teaching or prohibition for vaccinations from Judaism. She was then asked exactly what about the vaccine scared her. Again, she fell back on "I have a very strong faith" never actually answering the question. Very weird. I can't help but suspect her faith isn't what is driving her refusal to get vaccinated but she is using it in order to get an exemption.
From what I understand, all but the Christian Scientists are doing that.
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Old 1st October 2021, 01:12 PM   #313
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
I just saw a NYC school teacher interviewed who has decided not to get the vaccine by the 5 PM deadline. She says her objection is religiously based but repeatedly failed to state exactly what the "religiously based" objection is. She was asked what in Judaism was the basis for her objection. She danced all around it with "I have a strong faith" blah blah blah but never provided any kind of teaching or prohibition for vaccinations from Judaism. She was then asked exactly what about the vaccine scared her. Again, she fell back on "I have a very strong faith" never actually answering the question. Very weird. I can't help but suspect her faith isn't what is driving her refusal to get vaccinated but she is using it in order to get an exemption.
There's a Ranger in the National Park Service that's apparently been using his agency email to spam much of the agency's staff with the same sort of message. Looks like he might be getting about half the agency staff with the emails.

(The NPS has a sort of loosey-goosey email system that allows just about anyone in the agency to spam the whole agency. That plus some overly intuitive names for group names makes spamming easy. A year or two ago they had some sort of agency-wide "reply all" fiasco that had like a hundred responses over a couple of days. Being the NPS it was about the Junior Ranger Badge for Historic Trains [as in, something fun and not controversial] but I was surprised to see that the agency still allows "reply-all" to mass mailings. Most large IT departments have safeguards and authorization levels to mostly stop that)

So this guy is apparently encouraging anyone to just claim religious exemption. He claims the agency can do nothing at all to challenge or verify that. He's pretty well admitting that it does not need to be a sincere religious belief or be consistent with any specific religious group or belief system.
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Old 1st October 2021, 03:10 PM   #314
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Things are moving along....

Biden Administration Outlines Process for Disciplining, Removing Unvaccinated Feds

Beginning November 8, 2021:

Quote:
Federal workers who fail to get vaccinated or provide proof of vaccination by Nov. 8 will be deemed to be in “violation of a lawful order,” at which point agencies should begin the “enforcement process.” That process begins with a five-day counseling period, in which agencies should provide the noncompliant employee with information on the benefits of vaccination and how to get the vaccine.

If an employee continues to refuse to get vaccinated after that five-day period, managers should issue a short suspension of 14 days or fewer, the task force said.
“Continued noncompliance during the suspension can be followed by proposing removal,”
Quote:
....agencies should not move forward to enforce the vaccine mandate on anyone who has been granted a religious or medical exception or on anyone who has requested an exception that is still under review. OPM also stressed that agencies should abide by employees’ procedural rights, as well as any union contract provisions governing disciplinary procedures, as they move to enforce the vaccine mandate.
Quote:
f an employee receives the first dose of the Pfizer or Moderna vaccine after an agency has begun the disciplinary process, the agency should put the process on hold to give that employee the opportunity to prove he or she has received a second shot, OPM wrote. If that occurs during a suspension, the remainder of the suspension should also be put on hold until the employee provides documentation of a second shot, at which point the suspension should be ended.
Quote:
In cases where an employee is denied a medical or religious exemption, the employee will have two weeks to get the first dose of a vaccine before they are deemed to be noncompliant with the mandate, and six weeks after that to get the second shot of a two-dose vaccine.
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Old 1st October 2021, 04:25 PM   #315
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Vaccines are mandated for the job I do (heaps of public contact). Two of my colleagues are adamant they won’t get vaccinated. They think the company will offer them office jobs. That would be fine by me if their pay was cut and the company cars taken off them. Let’s see what happens.
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Old 1st October 2021, 04:39 PM   #316
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My brother's state has refused to issue mask or vaccine mandates. Despite being vaccinated, he's got it. Fortunately, because of being vaccinated, he's got qot a mild case. Unlike thousands of his fellow Idaho residents who are being shipped out of state because their hospitals are overwhelmed.
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Old 1st October 2021, 05:06 PM   #317
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I find it interesting to see how the number of people protesting the vaccine mandates in Castle Rock and Kelso freeway overpasses has dwindled. There were about 30 people a month ago in Castle Rock. It looked like maybe 5 this week.

They have been protesting mask and vaccine mandates on Fridays at both places for the last month. They do get people honking their horns because they wave a lot of American flags. They also have signs protesting the mandates but you can't read them going by on the Freeway. So from a perspective of getting out their message, this is pathetic.
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Old 2nd October 2021, 01:01 AM   #318
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https://www.cnn.com/videos/health/20...ted-nr-vpx.cnn

A New York teacher is leaving her job instead of getting vaccinated. The real question here is how did someone this stupid ever end up teaching children? She's an idiot. She's not good enough to teach children. I'm glad she's leaving and hopefully the New York City School District will find someone who isn't a complete moron to replace her.
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Old 2nd October 2021, 01:05 AM   #319
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This guy, retiring two years short of his pension (18 years enlisted) in protest:

https://www.businessinsider.com/army...vaccine-2021-9

I get standing up for your ideals...but this is pure stupidity.
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Old 2nd October 2021, 01:18 AM   #320
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Originally Posted by Craig4 View Post
https://www.cnn.com/videos/health/20...ted-nr-vpx.cnn

A New York teacher is leaving her job instead of getting vaccinated. The real question here is how did someone this stupid ever end up teaching children? She's an idiot. She's not good enough to teach children. I'm glad she's leaving and hopefully the New York City School District will find someone who isn't a complete moron to replace her.
I talked about her yesterday in this thread.
http://www.internationalskeptics.com...4#post13616634

I think she's using her faith just trying to get an exemption. There's nothing in Judaism to prevent her getting vaccinated.
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