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Old 15th January 2020, 04:32 PM   #1
crescent
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Virginia State of Emergency/Gun Lobby Day January 20 2020

I've been following this for a bit.

1: Virginia elected a bunch of Democrats, many of whom promised to enact gun control legislation if elected.

2: The Dems followed through, passing some gun control laws. Background checks, limits on per-month purchases, red flag laws, a few others. They considered bans on assault rifles but that died in committee.

3: "Lobby Day" is apparently an annual thing. Gun rights and guns control advocates both people hold events that day.

4: Lobby day is on Martin Luther King Jr. Day.

5: As a result, there will be a big pro-gun rally/protest at the Virginia State Capitol on MLK day.

That is, a big pro-gun rally at the (former) capitol of the (defunct) Confederate States of America, on a holiday named after Martin Luther King Jr.

Did I mention that the usual militia and white supremacist groups will be there? Alex Jones and his friends?

So now the governor has declared a state of emergency.

Virginia governor declares state of emergency following militia threats over gun reforms

Quote:
Virginia Gov. Ralph Northam issued a state of emergency on Wednesday that bars any weapons from the Richmond’s Capitol Square from Friday to Tuesday, after he received credible intelligence that hate groups and armed militias are planning violence at next Monday’s Lobby Day against gun control legislation.

....The announced weapons ban will include sticks, bats, chains, projectiles, and firearms, similar to the prohibitions issued on airlines and in courthouses,


Charlottesville Banned These Far-Right Activists, but They’re Bringing Their Guns to Richmond
Quote:
Shoaff, a Tennessee resident, has gone further than most other right-wing personalities in his calls for violence in Richmond. In a December broadcast, he advocated for the hanging of Rep. Donald McEachin, an African-American congressman, after McEachin suggested Northam could use the National Guard to enforce new gun laws.

“I hope to see you personally on Lobby Day, because I would love nothing more than to tell you to your face that you’re a coward, you’re a tyrant, committing treason,” Shoaff said in a December livestream. “And as a good friend of mine said just a few minutes ago, treason is punishable by death. I’m not telling you that I’m going to kill you, I’m telling you that your acts constitute treason, and the punishment for treason is hanging in the middle of the street.”

As Virginia gun rally approaches, Alex Jones and his Infowars outlet hype prospect of violence
Quote:
Jones and his associates are also preemptively claiming that any violence that does occur at the rally, planned for January 20 outside the Virginia Capitol, will be a “false flag,” a similar claim to what he’s said about violence that occurred at the deadly “Unite the Right” rally in Charlottesville, Virginia, in 2017.

Jones said that he and “dozens of our people” will be at the January 20 rally, and he has invited white nationalist Richard Spencer to join him.
From what I understand, the State of Emergency is limited to the capitol grounds. Lots and lots and lots of Conspiracy Theories flying around about using the National Guard to seize guns, bringing in the United Nations, all the usual nonsense.

As I said, I have been following this for a bit, wondering how big of a thing it will be. Gun advocacy people on social media are claiming that 100,000 to 150,000 pro-gun people will be there, many from out of state (dozens of busloads from Texas, according to some). The organizer has asked people to not bring long guns and to not wear camouflage or other military-looking gear. Then again, if it snowballs enough his requests may just be ignored.

Hopefully this just fizzles out, as these things often do.
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Old 15th January 2020, 04:44 PM   #2
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Big threats, tiny balls.
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Old 15th January 2020, 04:50 PM   #3
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That is some pretty special libtard snowflake stuff, especially from the folks who are okay with Ralph "Blackface" Northam.
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Old 15th January 2020, 06:21 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
That is some pretty special libtard snowflake stuff, especially from the folks who are okay with Ralph "Blackface" Northam.
Really? I'm surprised you're calling the conservative racist snowflakes 'libtards'.
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Old 15th January 2020, 07:26 PM   #5
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The only reason this isn't bigger news is the militias aren't black or Muslim.
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Old 15th January 2020, 07:54 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by Venom View Post
The only reason this isn't bigger news is the militias aren't black or Muslim.
And it's all the 'libtards' fault.
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Old 15th January 2020, 08:02 PM   #7
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I'd love to organize a big prank with a bunch of black men dressed in classic Black Panthers uniforms, maybe wearing masks and have them force their way into a city council building to see the reaction from Fox News and the right wing.

unarmed of course, to play it safe.
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Old 16th January 2020, 02:40 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by Venom View Post
I'd love to organize a big prank with a bunch of black men dressed in classic Black Panthers uniforms, maybe wearing masks and have them force their way into a city council building to see the reaction from Fox News and the right wing.

unarmed of course, to play it safe.
Would still be potentially deadly for the black men involved.
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Old 16th January 2020, 03:45 AM   #9
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Originally Posted by crescent View Post
I've been following this for a bit.



1: Virginia elected a bunch of Democrats, many of whom promised to enact gun control legislation if elected.



2: The Dems followed through, passing some gun control laws. Background checks, limits on per-month purchases, red flag laws, a few others. They considered bans on assault rifles but that died in committee.



3: "Lobby Day" is apparently an annual thing. Gun rights and guns control advocates both people hold events that day.



4: Lobby day is on Martin Luther King Jr. Day.



5: As a result, there will be a big pro-gun rally/protest at the Virginia State Capitol on MLK day.



That is, a big pro-gun rally at the (former) capitol of the (defunct) Confederate States of America, on a holiday named after Martin Luther King Jr.



Did I mention that the usual militia and white supremacist groups will be there? Alex Jones and his friends?



So now the governor has declared a state of emergency.



Virginia governor declares state of emergency following militia threats over gun reforms











Charlottesville Banned These Far-Right Activists, but They’re Bringing Their Guns to Richmond







As Virginia gun rally approaches, Alex Jones and his Infowars outlet hype prospect of violence





From what I understand, the State of Emergency is limited to the capitol grounds. Lots and lots and lots of Conspiracy Theories flying around about using the National Guard to seize guns, bringing in the United Nations, all the usual nonsense.



As I said, I have been following this for a bit, wondering how big of a thing it will be. Gun advocacy people on social media are claiming that 100,000 to 150,000 pro-gun people will be there, many from out of state (dozens of busloads from Texas, according to some). The organizer has asked people to not bring long guns and to not wear camouflage or other military-looking gear. Then again, if it snowballs enough his requests may just be ignored.



Hopefully this just fizzles out, as these things often do.
Any chance of summarizing this to thick kiwis like me to understand.

Ie like just a paragraph
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Old 16th January 2020, 06:19 AM   #10
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How dreadful that they'd defile Lee-Jackson-King Day in this fashion!
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Old 16th January 2020, 06:31 AM   #11
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The self-sabotage of overheated rhetoric and the conspiratorial mindset.

Pro-gun people have a legitimate grievance here. Militia nuts talking about executing duly elected politicians and establishing martial law don't really help their situation.

They don't want another Charlottesville, where the police took a "hands off" approach and let the violence unfold unhindered. Can't really blame them for that.
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Old 16th January 2020, 07:07 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by SuburbanTurkey View Post
The self-sabotage of overheated rhetoric and the conspiratorial mindset.

Pro-gun people have a legitimate grievance here. Militia nuts talking about executing duly elected politicians and establishing martial law don't really help their situation.

They don't want another Charlottesville, where the police took a "hands off" approach and let the violence unfold unhindered. Can't really blame them for that.
Not sure I'd describe their grievance as legitimate. Pro-gun groups and militias have linked arms before. I'd wager the Venn-diagram for membership and/or support is fairly round.
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Old 16th January 2020, 07:51 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
Not sure I'd describe their grievance as legitimate. Pro-gun groups and militias have linked arms before. I'd wager the Venn-diagram for membership and/or support is fairly round.
It's legitimate in that people do oppose these gun control measures that are about to be made law. This isn't some made up conspiracy theory, people do oppose AWB laws and the others being considered.

Pro-2A culture is heavily infiltrated with these anti-government militia kooks and it makes it unappealing to non-extremists who might otherwise agree.
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Old 16th January 2020, 07:56 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by SuburbanTurkey View Post
It's legitimate in that people do oppose these gun control measures that are about to be made law. This isn't some made up conspiracy theory, people do oppose AWB laws and the others being considered.

Pro-2A culture is heavily infiltrated with these anti-government militia kooks and it makes it unappealing to non-extremists who might otherwise agree.
My pet theory as for why "Pro-2A culture" is so heavy with anti-government freaks is that the reason for being in the "Pro-2A culture" isn't a love for guns, but a hatred for other people and a deep rooted wish to be able to shoot those people.
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Old 16th January 2020, 08:00 AM   #15
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
My pet theory as for why "Pro-2A culture" is so heavy with anti-government freaks is that the reason for being in the "Pro-2A culture" isn't a love for guns, but a hatred for other people and a deep rooted wish to be able to shoot those people.
The reactionary right is really into guns for many of the reasons you state.

Leftists like myself also like guns, but for different reasons. Organizations exist to advocate for instructing people in the use of firearms without all the right wing propaganda. The Socialist Rifle Association is one such group, in which I am a member. There's probably a chapter near you, if you live in the US.
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Old 16th January 2020, 12:10 PM   #16
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Update:

Three members of the Neo-Nazi group "The Base" were arrested by the feds in advance of their plans to travel to the armed VA rally.

One of the arrested was a Canadian ex-soldier who was kicked out of the Army after being discovered as a white supremacist. He has experience with explosives as a combat engineer. He illegally entered the country and was picked up and armed by his two comrades.

They were arrested in possession with a rifle that was suspected as being converted to automatic fire.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/01/16/u...gun-rally.html

Seems that the Governor had good reason to call a state of emergency and disarm protesters.
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Old 16th January 2020, 03:26 PM   #17
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Salon has an article:

State of emergency: High tension in Virginia as right-wing gun fanatics descend on Richmond

Quote:
Thousands of pro-gun fanatics are expected to descend on the Virginia state capital on Martin Luther King Day, and, until Northam's declaration of a state of emergency, clearly had expected to brandish weapons and look as menacing as possible to lawmakers who want to reform the state's gun laws. Many have taken to social media, saying they are showing up armed anyway and promising a "boogaloo," which is far-right code for an armed insurrection against the government.
(This paragraph is worth reading in the original article because it contains a whole bunch of links to the posts where people are making these claims. Disturbing stuff).

Quote:
"Far-right internet personality Joshua Shoaff, who has more than 540,000 Facebook fans," argued on a livestream last week that Northam should be "walked up to the steps of a swinging rope that's placed around your neck, because you, sir, are a tyrant and you're committing treason."

Shoaff has already been banned from carrying firearms in the city of Charlottesville for the role he played in the riots there, but when contacted by Sommer, he stood by his claim that legislators who support gun control should be murdered.
There are an absure number of links embedded in the article. People are very, very amped up about this.

I hope this just fizzles out into a big nothingburger, I think there is a good chance this turns out to be just handful of crazy people yelling things.

But the gun nut right wing social media is going crazy right now. Not in a good way.
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Old 16th January 2020, 05:12 PM   #18
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Jesus!
Who, incidentally, pretty much all of these idiots will claim to worship; despite being against pretty much everything he'd have stood for, if he existed, which he probably didn't.
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Old 16th January 2020, 05:31 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by Trebuchet View Post
Jesus!
Who, incidentally, pretty much all of these idiots will claim to worship; despite being against pretty much everything he'd have stood for, if he existed, which he probably didn't.
These guys remind me of those violent murderous dickheads who worship Allah.
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Old 16th January 2020, 07:06 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by William Parcher View Post
These guys remind me of those violent murderous dickheads who worship Allah.
"The Base" is literally the English translation of Al Qaeda. These people aren't your average dog whistling right wingers, they are open neo-nazis.
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Old 17th January 2020, 04:00 PM   #21
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I hate when this **** happens here!
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Old 17th January 2020, 07:35 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
My pet theory as for why "Pro-2A culture" is so heavy with anti-government freaks is that the reason for being in the "Pro-2A culture" isn't a love for guns, but a hatred for other people and a deep rooted wish to be able to shoot those people.
There is a group that does the lion's share of shooting people. I surmise you don't like that group very much. (hint: it's not "Pro-2A culture")

Last edited by Baylor; 17th January 2020 at 07:37 PM.
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Old 17th January 2020, 08:47 PM   #23
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And then there's this:

Quote:
Pro-gun activists threaten to kill state lawmaker over bill they misunderstood

Virginia legislator Lee Carter wrote a bill to allow teachers to strike. Pro-gun activists wrongly concluded it threatens their rights

The legislation introduced by Lee Carter, a 32-year-old Bernie Sanders-endorsed socialist, would allow public school teachers to strike without being fired, and has in fact nothing to do with guns. But some gun rights activists wrongly interpreted it as an attempt to fire law enforcement officials who might refuse to comply with gun control laws introduced by Virginia’s new Democratic legislative majority.

The result, Carter said, has been a torrent of threats and abuse on social media, from promises to vote him out of office, to claims that “this is tyranny and you know what we do to tyrants,” to explicit threats of murder, like, “I’m going to make sure you don’t live through this legislative session” or “I’m going to kill this guy, y’all make sure you don’t forget my name.”
Virginia Democrats won an election. Gun owners are talking civil war
Read more

Carter, says he has been so concerned about the death threats that he has started openly carrying a handgun to protect himself.
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...rike-bill-guns

And I see Trump's twitter feed has weighed in on this...without any fact-checking, of course.
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Last edited by Norman Alexander; 17th January 2020 at 08:49 PM.
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Old 17th January 2020, 09:42 PM   #24
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And who are these "pro-gun activists?" A couple of unverified twitter accounts.
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Old 18th January 2020, 03:08 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by Baylor View Post
And who are these "pro-gun activists?" A couple of unverified twitter accounts.
It doesn't take much googling to find a multitude of rabbit holes containing of 2nd amendment crazies. And who knows, maybe some of those rabbit holes are dug by Russian trolls.
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Old 18th January 2020, 03:43 PM   #26
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ok
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Old 19th January 2020, 07:05 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by Baylor View Post
And who are these "pro-gun activists?" A couple of unverified twitter accounts.
And FBI informants working to stir up ****.
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Old 19th January 2020, 07:50 PM   #28
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Who cares? There will be no Americans at this rally. Does anyone think that the products of incest and failed genetic experiments coming to this rally aren't a bunch of filthy Trumptrash? No American's rights will be violated. Just look at these scum; you could barely argue that any human rights will be violated if the pissy little bitches can't have theirguns security blankets.
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Old 19th January 2020, 10:58 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by a_unique_person View Post
It doesn't take much googling to find a multitude of rabbit holes containing of 2nd amendment crazies.
DEEP STATE (((GLOBALISTS))) COINTELPRO FALSE FLAG

Or something like that.
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Old 20th January 2020, 05:13 AM   #30
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Originally Posted by Craig4 View Post
Who cares? There will be no Americans at this rally. Does anyone think that the products of incest and failed genetic experiments coming to this rally aren't a bunch of filthy Trumptrash? No American's rights will be violated. Just look at these scum; you could barely argue that any human rights will be violated if the pissy little bitches can't have theirguns security blankets.
These right-wingers who are desperate for any thin pretext to engage in political violence certainly poison the well, but that doesn't mean there isn't any reasoned opposition to these bills.

You can practically guarantee that law criminalizing firearms will be selectively enforced disproportionally on disadvantaged communities. Leftists are opposed to these measures as they will likely criminalize community defense forces.
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Old 20th January 2020, 06:20 AM   #31
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I read that the local Antifa-chapter are going to the protest, and not for counter-protesting. Their reasons are pretty much what SuburbanTurkey states above.

That said, I think gun control measures are long overdue, and if the problem is uneven enforcement, then the problem isn't with the legislation.
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Old 20th January 2020, 07:25 AM   #32
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"Community defense forces?" Who or what are those?

I might add a **** to that question, as in, What the **** are you talking about?
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Old 20th January 2020, 08:35 AM   #33
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
I read that the local Antifa-chapter are going to the protest, and not for counter-protesting. Their reasons are pretty much what SuburbanTurkey states above.

That said, I think gun control measures are long overdue, and if the problem is uneven enforcement, then the problem isn't with the legislation.
Every measure is an infringement.
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Old 20th January 2020, 08:59 AM   #34
SuburbanTurkey
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Some known extremist groups are present today, like Proud Boys, League of the South, open neo-nazi Jovi Val, and Joey Gibson of Patriot Prayer These groups make up a small minority

So far, however, the protest has largely a circus atmosphere and is fairly orderly. Large groups of armed folks outside the gun-free zone, and plenty of unarmed folks going up to the capitol building.

Good coverage of the events in real time from Molly Conger on Twitter:

https://twitter.com/socialistdogmom?lang=en
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Old 20th January 2020, 09:06 AM   #35
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I have a live feed on and I'm seeing a lot of people. This is probably one of the better turnouts for one of these than I've seen previously. Lots with guns, and stickers that say "Guns save lives".

One guy had a sign that said something about Russia and Ukrain (sp) are investigating democrats to see if they still support the constitution.
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Old 20th January 2020, 09:47 AM   #36
carlitos
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Originally Posted by Craig4 View Post
Who cares? There will be no Americans at this rally.
Originally Posted by SuburbanTurkey View Post
Some known extremist groups are present today, like Proud Boys, League of the South, open neo-nazi Jovi Val, and Joey Gibson of Patriot Prayer These groups make up a small minority
One thing that those groups have in common is that they are all Americans.

A key instigator in this rally is Philip Van Cleave, a pro-gun nut from Virginia that was pranked by Sascha Baron Cohen into endorsing the idea of arming schoolchildren - Kinderguardians.

Van Cleave is an awful human being.
Quote:
In the aftermath of the 2012 Sandy Hook Elementary School shooting that left 28 dead, including 20 children between the ages of 6 and 7 years old, he was asked by The Washington Post to explain the allure of guns like the military-style .223-caliber Bushmaster semiautomatic rifle used in the shooting. Van Cleave answered that they were “fun.”

“I could ask you why should anyone want a Ferrari?” he told the newspaper. “[Bushmasters] are absolutely a blast to shoot with. They’re fast. They’re accurate.”
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Old 20th January 2020, 09:58 AM   #37
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Pix are going around of fools dolled up in cammie gear, knee guards, helmets, and, apparently, body armor, along with their guns. Loaded guns? Can't tell, but a mag in the well suggest live ammo. In a confrontation, a prudent policeman would give them just one try to disarm.

What in hell does all that ugly fetishism have to do with gun rights?
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Old 20th January 2020, 01:50 PM   #38
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Originally Posted by Venom View Post
I'd love to organize a big prank with a bunch of black men dressed in classic Black Panthers uniforms, maybe wearing masks and have them force their way into a city council building to see the reaction from Fox News and the right wing.

unarmed of course, to play it safe.
We've done that, several times, and the answer in many cases is "cops in military surplus blasting black people with tear gas and rubber bullets, much to the delight of many of the people attending this supposedly small-government rally." A good portion, though certainly not all, of these gun nuts are terrified of black people marching peacefully.
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Old 20th January 2020, 02:06 PM   #39
Armitage72
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Originally Posted by Mumbles View Post
We've done that, several times, and the answer in many cases is "cops in military surplus blasting black people with tear gas and rubber bullets, much to the delight of many of the people attending this supposedly small-government rally." A good portion, though certainly not all, of these gun nuts are terrified of black people marching peacefully.

Don't forget that the NRA supported an open-carry ban (Horrors!!) in California in 1967 because the Black Panthers were exercising their rights to carry firearms.
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Old 20th January 2020, 02:17 PM   #40
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Originally Posted by TragicMonkey View Post
How dreadful that they'd defile Lee-Jackson-King Day in this fashion!
So did Trump, it's his inauguration day anniversary.

It's funny listening to some of these idiots spout off how they are going to start shooting if we take their gun rights away. Yeah, a few hundred nut-jobs are going to carry out a revolution.

Both McVeigh and Manson believed they could ignite a revolution.

Of course those people making threats to society are the ones that sell news.
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