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Old 2nd February 2018, 05:41 PM   #161
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The other big elephant in the room that everybody is just pretending to not notice is that random and arbitrary standards of which and isn't part of a "culture."

What exactly can I, a white person, not do because another "culture" does it? Can I not do anything that is generally associated with other cultures? Or just things they claim is "cultural?"
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Old 2nd February 2018, 11:30 PM   #162
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Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
The other big elephant in the room that everybody is just pretending to not notice is that random and arbitrary standards of which and isn't part of a "culture."

What exactly can I, a white person, not do because another "culture" does it? Can I not do anything that is generally associated with other cultures? Or just things they claim is "cultural?"
General rule of thumb seems to be if someone complains you have to stop or face social consequences.

My problem is how does this work for other countries? Anyone want to try and convince me japanese "jet" culture hurts me?

Seems to me anyone supporting this **** never seems to think it through.
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Old 2nd February 2018, 11:33 PM   #163
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Originally Posted by BobTheCoward View Post
I assure you, I go out of my way to not have opinions on things. I literally do not have the knowledge of cultural appropriation to make a judgement on it.

I'm not being obtuse. You are implying I'm hiding some feeling I possess. I'm disobliging. I am purposely refusing to form an opinion on the subject.

I like how claiming a degree in a social science is trying to hide something, as if it wasn't the lowest position you could be in.
Water is pretty cheap, if someone offered me a bottle for $100 right now I'd laugh. If I was in the middle of the desert my mind would change.

Your claim would be worth while in this situation, as you well know.

This is that whole being obtuse thing I was talking about.
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Old 3rd February 2018, 01:34 AM   #164
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If Kim Kardashian were claiming these braids were her own invention, then I might see the problem. But I don't understand why her simply wearing her hair like that is seen as a problem.

It's her hair, she can do what she likes with it. No one has rights over her body but her.
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Old 3rd February 2018, 05:33 AM   #165
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Originally Posted by sadhatter View Post
Water is pretty cheap, if someone offered me a bottle for $100 right now I'd laugh. If I was in the middle of the desert my mind would change.

Your claim would be worth while in this situation, as you well know.

This is that whole being obtuse thing I was talking about.
I do not understand the comparison.
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Old 3rd February 2018, 07:13 AM   #166
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Originally Posted by ThatGuy11200 View Post
If Kim Kardashian were claiming these braids were her own invention, then I might see the problem. But I don't understand why her simply wearing her hair like that is seen as a problem.

It's her hair, she can do what she likes with it. No one has rights over her body but her.
Welcome to the forums ThatGuy.

I believe the issue among the black women I've seen complaining is that she credits it as her Bo Derek look and she was criticized for it back a few years ago - the exact same statement.

A whole lot of black women have it in for the Kardashians, as I said, only half in jest, because they've appropriated some fine brothers.
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Old 3rd February 2018, 02:12 PM   #167
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I've never yet heard a satisfactory answer as to why "cultural appropriation" is in any way a bad thing.

So I "steal" your hairstyle. What is that bad? You're no worse off for it. It's not like hairstyles are copyrighted or something.

Cultures should cross-pollinate, IMO. Share clothing styles and music and cuisine and art and language and anything else they can share. Otherwise we live in a world where only Italians can eat Pizza, and what good is that?

Hmmmm. Pizza. Now I have to eat a pizza. Bye...
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Old 3rd February 2018, 02:54 PM   #168
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Originally Posted by Seismosaurus View Post
I've never yet heard a satisfactory answer as to why "cultural appropriation" is in any way a bad thing.
Why? Hell I've never even got a satisfactory answer as to what it is that isn't functionally reducible to "White people are doing stuff."

Quote:
Cultures should cross-pollinate, IMO. Share clothing styles and music and cuisine and art and language and anything else they can share. Otherwise we live in a world where only Italians can eat Pizza, and what good is that?
That was I was talking about earlier when I said that... I could of swore that not that long ago this was the goal. For us to all learn from other cultures and stuff like that.

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Old 3rd February 2018, 03:29 PM   #169
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Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
Why? Hell I've never even got a satisfactory answer as to what it is that isn't functionally reducible to "White people are doing stuff."
Well, and this not very white performance at the Grammys back in 2004...
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I AGREE


A lot of people were very displeased by this - only difference was that the term "cultural appropriation" was fairly unknown at the time.

And even I can remember when some white folks on Twitter were outraged when Bomani Jones wore a "Caucasians" shirt on an ESPN show...
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Old 3rd February 2018, 04:42 PM   #170
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Originally Posted by Mumbles View Post
Well, and this not very white performance at the Grammys back in 2004...
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I AGREE


A lot of people were very displeased by this - only difference was that the term "cultural appropriation" was fairly unknown at the time.

And even I can remember when some white folks on Twitter were outraged when Bomani Jones wore a "Caucasians" shirt on an ESPN show...
The guy brings up a good point and the people offended were twats. I fail to see how this isn't a point showing how silly cultural appropriation is as a concept.
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Old 4th February 2018, 01:04 PM   #171
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Originally Posted by sadhatter View Post
The guy brings up a good point and the people offended were twats. I fail to see how this isn't a point showing how silly cultural appropriation is as a concept.
the claim being rebutted was:

Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
Why? Hell I've never even got a satisfactory answer as to what it is that isn't functionally reducible to "White people are doing stuff."
I responded with two (of many) examples that didn't fit the criteria. There have also been pangs of outrage over black people cosplaying as non-black characters (although the insults tend to veer well beyond "appropriation" and into outright racial slurs), Asian rappers, and so forth. But the two I mentioned came to mind instantly.
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Old 4th February 2018, 02:59 PM   #172
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Cultural appropriation is what America is all about!!!

My "German" friend just sold his Italian restaurant to a Chinese guy.

We have Mexi-melts and Taco Bell, Hamburgers, Hot pocket pizza, Ragu sauce, we stole the name Futbol/Football. Panda Express - nice slap in the face to the Chinese!

We're gonna wear your braids and screw that up too, and you're just gonna have to like it. We never cared what you think and we're not gonna start now. I can pretend to care if that makes you feel better but I really probably don't, just like you don't care about us.
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Old 4th February 2018, 03:10 PM   #173
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Originally Posted by mgidm86 View Post
Cultural appropriation is what America is all about!!!

My "German" friend just sold his Italian restaurant to a Chinese guy.

We have Mexi-melts and Taco Bell, Hamburgers, Hot pocket pizza, Ragu sauce, we stole the name Futbol/Football. Panda Express - nice slap in the face to the Chinese!

We're gonna wear your braids and screw that up too, and you're just gonna have to like it. We never cared what you think and we're not gonna start now. I can pretend to care if that makes you feel better but I really probably don't, just like you don't care about us.
That was weirdly hateful.

Mind you, I'm not terribly keen on charges of appropriation either. But I am not as willing to say that I don't care about offense taken. Similarly, I don't assume that minorities don't give a damn about the majority (us).
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Old 4th February 2018, 09:01 PM   #174
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Originally Posted by mgidm86 View Post
Cultural appropriation is what America is all about!!!.
I can only wonder why you feel the need to yell!!!
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Old 5th February 2018, 12:28 AM   #175
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Originally Posted by mgidm86 View Post
Cultural appropriation is what America is all about!!!

My "German" friend just sold his Italian restaurant to a Chinese guy.

We have Mexi-melts and Taco Bell, Hamburgers, Hot pocket pizza, Ragu sauce, we stole the name Futbol/Football. Panda Express - nice slap in the face to the Chinese!

We're gonna wear your braids and screw that up too, and you're just gonna have to like it. We never cared what you think and we're not gonna start now. I can pretend to care if that makes you feel better but I really probably don't, just like you don't care about us.
'Cultural appropriation' is what the whole world is about. If humans didn't 'appropriate' other cultures, most of us would still be using stone knives a bear skins.
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Old 5th February 2018, 03:49 AM   #176
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Originally Posted by mgidm86 View Post
Cultural appropriation is what America is all about!!!

My "German" friend just sold his Italian restaurant to a Chinese guy.

We have Mexi-melts and Taco Bell, Hamburgers, Hot pocket pizza, Ragu sauce, we stole the name Futbol/Football. Panda Express - nice slap in the face to the Chinese!

We're gonna wear your braids and screw that up too, and you're just gonna have to like it. We never cared what you think and we're not gonna start now. I can pretend to care if that makes you feel better but I really probably don't, just like you don't care about us.
Jesus man, stop yelling.

I nearly choked on my Hawaii Pizza
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Old 5th February 2018, 06:34 AM   #177
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Originally Posted by Seismosaurus View Post
I've never yet heard a satisfactory answer as to why "cultural appropriation" is in any way a bad thing.

So I "steal" your hairstyle. What is that bad? You're no worse off for it. It's not like hairstyles are copyrighted or something.

Cultures should cross-pollinate, IMO. Share clothing styles and music and cuisine and art and language and anything else they can share. Otherwise we live in a world where only Italians can eat Pizza, and what good is that?

Hmmmm. Pizza. Now I have to eat a pizza. Bye...
How hard have you tried to get a good answer?
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Old 5th February 2018, 12:15 PM   #178
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Originally Posted by Eddie Dane View Post

I nearly choked on my Hawaii Pizza
Which was, of course, invented in Canada.
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Old 5th February 2018, 01:50 PM   #179
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Originally Posted by deadrose View Post
Which was, of course, invented in Canada.


Blame Canada


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Old 5th February 2018, 02:07 PM   #180
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Originally Posted by Eddie Dane View Post
Blame Canada


Might as well.

At least they'll apologize.
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Old 27th June 2020, 11:08 AM   #181
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Resurrected, mutha-fuckas!

Rising starlet Florence Pugh is in the news, and not because she's banging some 40+ year-old dude. https://www.instagram.com/p/CB6FNMcl...ource=ig_embed

She's been enlightened by recent events, and reflects back on how cornrows are a nasty form of cultural appropriation. A top comment reads, "Most of the people enraged by this post are white men. Does it ever get boring being so predictable[?]"

If we're thinking in gendered terms, I wonder if this is a chick thing. Up-thread someone pointed out that you can have your own hairstyle, it does not affect others who have the same style. Except it does. Because no one wants to be a "basic bitch." (Or apparently a white guy who is so predictable.)

I remember in high school, a friend's girlfriend made a catty snide remark because someone "copied" her style. The classic example involves two women who attend a function in the same dress. Meanwhile, men don't give a **** if someone else wears an identical suit. All of the suits look the same to us anyway. The only guy who stands out is the one who is flamboyantly gay.
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Old 27th June 2020, 12:10 PM   #182
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Not if another flamboyantly gay guy attends a function in the same dress.
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Old 27th June 2020, 12:39 PM   #183
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Originally Posted by dann View Post
Not if another flamboyantly gay guy attends a function in the same dress.
If we are going to do gender stereotyping (heaven forfend), how about they both get a huge laugh out of it?
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Old 27th June 2020, 02:24 PM   #184
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Originally Posted by Mumbles View Post
I can actually see it as a mistake - the first time in the family. Hair is one of those obnoxious issues among black women, for some obvious reasons - and when you combine it with social media, *and* praise for Bo Derek's hair style in "10" which was supposed to be gorgeous (I personally don't think it worked for her, but whatever), you're going to get a hostile reaction, whether deserved or not.
Honestly I don't think corn rows suit anyone white, but that's personal taste, dreadlocks I can see being contentious, as a white man I've had problems at times because I've always worn my hair long, but my opinion is that unless there is a good reason (such as machinery safety or infection control) then any clean and reasonably neat style should suffice. The situation with Rhonda Lee is absolutely indefensible, I hope she sues their asses for a fortune.

ETA: Thinking about it, tied back dreads might actually be better in a situation where infection control is a factor than most other hairstyles since it's less likely to shed individual hairs.
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Old 27th June 2020, 03:37 PM   #185
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I always really wanted cornrows but turned out my hair looks like just utter garbage in cornrows. I don’t think it would have helped much to add extensions. But anyways.

Cultural Appropriation is one of those terms people use on a sliding scale. So there’s what I think it’s supposed to mean, which is of course sensible and understandable, and there’s what mad internet youngsters think it’s supposed to mean, which is a little more extreme, and then there’s what right wing trolls think it’s supposed to mean, which is that somebody thinks pizza and tex-mex should be illegal.

The textbook version is taking another culture’s important symbols and using them as accessories; copies of the Native American war bonnet for example. Now if you would say ‘fine, you can wear fake copies of the Purple Heart and the Vietnam vet colors too, see if I care’ then sure, the whole argument is not for you in the first place.

A less painful but more ubiquitous version is dream catchers. They originated with the Ojibway but at this point they’ve osmosed through most of North America. Commission one from a Native American craft artist and you’re golden. Buy them as a pair of earrings in a gas station, out of a box from a sweatshop somewhere, and it’s just crap. Dream catchers aren’t full on sacred or anything, so seeing them made and sold without any of the original ceremony, heart or meaning is only... obnoxious; sad. But that heartlessness is the part that’s appropriative; if someone learns the traditional way and meaning and makes their own, nobody will get up their ass about it.

If anyone’s seen the movie “the Nightmare Before Christmas” I think it’s a perfect illustration of what moderates see as cultural appropriation. The protagonists take all the trappings of another group’s culture, out of pure joy and appreciation no less, but (and this is critical) without any attempt at actual cooperation. Just grabby hands.

What it isn’t: making cross cultural friends and mutually sharing and asking someone to teach you about arts and picking up good food and cute looks and all that stuff and taking the time to understand the CONTEXT, because you care a little bit about the people who were doing the thing that caught your eye.

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Old 27th June 2020, 10:17 PM   #186
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I dunno if this still belongs in thread, but I read the other day that realtors in Houston will say "primary" instead of "master." Master has long annoyed me as a matter of aesthetics (especially when one my father's tenants called me "master [first name]"; it's also annoying that owners are called "landlords"; hell, even "owner" is annoying). Still, I'll fight to use the word retard.
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Old 27th June 2020, 10:29 PM   #187
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Originally Posted by crescent View Post
I think white people with dreadlocks are fine as well.
I don't, but not because of cultural appropriation, but because they're always dirty smelly hippies.
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Old 28th June 2020, 12:15 AM   #188
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I can understand being annoyed if someone took an aspect of someone else's culture and claimed it was part of their own and originated with them. But just using it? Nah.
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Old 28th June 2020, 08:25 AM   #189
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Oh haha, I forgot about this thread!

Personally, I did stop braiding my hair (if I'm leaving the house) for the time being. I think that someday a lot of this business about what constitutes "appropriation" will be settled, but in the meantime, I don't want to risk offending anyone over something so silly. Tiny, tight braids can cause hair breakage, anyway. Besides, it's not like I get to go many places these days.
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Old 28th June 2020, 08:27 AM   #190
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
I don't, but not because of cultural appropriation, but because they're always dirty smelly hippies.
That specific olfactory blend of patchouli, BO, musty clothes, and schwag weed.

shudder


EDIT: #NotAllDreadyKids
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Old 28th June 2020, 09:30 AM   #191
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Just as a by the way, a few weeks ago I saw a tall older black guy with the most amazing long big beautiful natural-looking dreds and I keep wishing I had not looked like warmed up cheese that day so I could have had enough confidence to compliment him on his look.

My favorite part about days when I look really cute is that I can start complimenting people who are ROCKIN A LOOK. Especially older ladies who have just, got, a thing! Layers and boots! Young pretty couples! Guys in new shoes! That dude who had Bill the Cat painted on his van! Gosh, I love people.
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Old 28th June 2020, 02:33 PM   #192
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Old 28th June 2020, 03:41 PM   #193
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Originally Posted by deadrose View Post
Apparently back hair correlates with a particular Neanderthal gene. My ex-husband looked like a blond fur seal from the neck down by his 20s.
Iíve never heard them called that before.
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"It's all god's handiwork, there's little quality control applied", Fox26 reporter on Texas granite
You can't make up anything anymore. The world itself is a satire. All you're doing is recording it. Art Buchwald
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