ISF Logo   IS Forum
Forum Index Register Members List Events Mark Forums Read Help

Go Back   International Skeptics Forum » General Topics » Social Issues & Current Events
 


Welcome to the International Skeptics Forum, where we discuss skepticism, critical thinking, the paranormal and science in a friendly but lively way. You are currently viewing the forum as a guest, which means you are missing out on discussing matters that are of interest to you. Please consider registering so you can gain full use of the forum features and interact with other Members. Registration is simple, fast and free! Click here to register today.
Tags Minneapolis incidents , police incidents , police misconduct charges

Reply
Old 9th June 2020, 06:05 PM   #361
Skeptic Ginger
Nasty Woman
 
Skeptic Ginger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 81,631
Originally Posted by pgwenthold View Post
There is something I realized that I haven't heard addressed: the guy knelt on his neck for 8 minutes. What was he waiting for? What was the end point?

If he was waiting for Floyd to stop resisting, we know he wasn't breathing for like 3 minutes. How long does he have to be not resisting to be considered not resisting?

There were 3 other cops watching, so it's not like he was waiting for help.

So what was he waiting for, other for Floyd to stop breathing?
He was waiting for Floyd to say something like, "I'm sorry, Massa."

But I do hope we get to hear him answer that question in court.
__________________
Privatize the profits and socialize the losses. It's the American way. That's how Mnuchin got rich. Worse, he did it on the backs of elderly people who had been conned into reverse mortgages. Mnuchin paid zero, took on the debt then taxpayers bailed him out.

Space Force.
Because feeding poor people is socialism.
Skeptic Ginger is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 9th June 2020, 06:15 PM   #362
Skeptic Ginger
Nasty Woman
 
Skeptic Ginger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 81,631
Originally Posted by CaptainHowdy View Post
We're about the same age and have had a similar experiences with the police while driving. I've been pulled over four or five times for speeding or blowing through a stop sign but I've never gotten a warning. If the cops pull me over, I got the ticket. I never had a seat belt violation. I was pulled over once for drunk driving because I was drunk and I was driving. I've been stopped twice because "I fit the profile" of somebody they were after. I got pulled over once for not having the new registration tags on the car and for a faulty brake light.

How many times was the officer not very friendly to you or accused you of doing something you didn't do? How many times did you get confrontational with the cop or refuse to cooperate? How many times were you beaten up? For me, the answer is every single time, never, and never.
Here are my questions:
How often have you been pulled over for something bogus like failure to dim your brights? (Javier Ambler)
Failure to signal a lane change on a small street with no traffic? (Sandra Bland)

How far expired were your tabs?
Did you get cited for the brake light?
Get told to get out and put your hands on the car?
Handcuffed?
__________________
Privatize the profits and socialize the losses. It's the American way. That's how Mnuchin got rich. Worse, he did it on the backs of elderly people who had been conned into reverse mortgages. Mnuchin paid zero, took on the debt then taxpayers bailed him out.

Space Force.
Because feeding poor people is socialism.
Skeptic Ginger is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 9th June 2020, 06:20 PM   #363
Distracted1
Illuminator
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Philadelphia
Posts: 4,230
Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
My friend is a doctor who drives an expensive SUV. He's black. He gets pulled over frequently compared to how often I get pulled over in my unwashed 2003 wagon.
A longtime friend of mine gets pulled over at least two or three times as often as me.

He is a bad driver.
__________________
The man with one watch knows what time it is, the man with two watches is never sure.
Distracted1 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 9th June 2020, 06:23 PM   #364
Skeptic Ginger
Nasty Woman
 
Skeptic Ginger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 81,631
Originally Posted by Distracted1 View Post
A longtime friend of mine gets pulled over at least two or three times as often as me.

He is a bad driver.
My friend is not a bad driver. Your apology for police racism is duly noted.
__________________
Privatize the profits and socialize the losses. It's the American way. That's how Mnuchin got rich. Worse, he did it on the backs of elderly people who had been conned into reverse mortgages. Mnuchin paid zero, took on the debt then taxpayers bailed him out.

Space Force.
Because feeding poor people is socialism.
Skeptic Ginger is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 9th June 2020, 06:26 PM   #365
I Am The Scum
Illuminator
 
I Am The Scum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 4,429
Originally Posted by Belz... View Post
Another vacuous answer that just shows that your only mode of thinking is tit-for-tat. You can't imagine that the actual complaint could be that the police simply acted wrongly. If Democrats (the noun) are complaining about this incident, then naturally you have to take the opposite position.
He's physically incapable of engaging in a thoroughly rational thought process. To most of the right, there aren't really any facts or deeply-held values. It's all just a big word game.
I Am The Scum is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 9th June 2020, 06:30 PM   #366
pgwenthold
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 19,107
Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
Here are my questions:
How often have you been pulled over for something bogus like failure to dim your brights? (Javier Ambler)
Failure to signal a lane change on a small street with no traffic? (Sandra Bland)

How far expired were your tabs?
Did you get cited for the brake light?
Get told to get out and put your hands on the car?
Handcuffed?
I once got pulled over for going 85 in a 55. At least, that is what the cop claimed. I wasn't going 85, though, I was only going 63 (had the cruise set). What he likely was catching was a train that was running parallel to the road.

It was about 9 pm at night in the winter, and so dark on a rural highway.

He told me he had at 85 mph. I told him it was nonsense, there was no way I was going that fast and that I had my cruise set at 63 ever since we got off the highway (where the speed limit was 65).

He let me go, without a warning.

That, my friends, is what is called "privilege."

And that's what you get when you are a middle aged white guy with his wife and two young kids in the minivan.

I was polite, yes, but I was firm in my denial. He was wrong and I was right, but I was able to get away with saying that. Oh by the way, did you notice that I actually admitted that I was speeding? Still, no warning, no nothingl.
__________________
"As your friend, I have to be honest with you: I don't care about you or your problems" - Chloe, Secret Life of Pets

Last edited by pgwenthold; 9th June 2020 at 06:31 PM.
pgwenthold is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 9th June 2020, 06:31 PM   #367
trustbutverify
Philosopher
 
trustbutverify's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 8,078
Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
I'm talking about "defund the police". It's awful messaging.
OK, but I assume you realize the Minneapolis city council, led by Lisa Bender, have declared their intent to dismantle and, eventually, abolish the Police Dept as an institution entirely. They've described it as a disbanding many times. After a rough CNN interview, they've been walking it back to varying degrees, but there have been serious plans in that direction since at least 2017. So there are indeed organizations talking about abolition.

The successful Camden reorganization was self-described as a disbanding followed by a reconstruction.
__________________
"The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated." -- Mahatma Gandhi

Wollen owns the stage

Last edited by trustbutverify; 9th June 2020 at 06:36 PM.
trustbutverify is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 9th June 2020, 06:34 PM   #368
Distracted1
Illuminator
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Philadelphia
Posts: 4,230
Originally Posted by trustbutverify View Post
OK, but I assume you realize the Minneapolis city council, led by Lisa Bender, have declared their intent to dismantle and, eventually, abolish the Police Dept as an institution entirely. After a rough CNN interview, they've been walking it back to varying degrees, but there have been serious plans in that direction since at least 2017. So there are indeed organizations talking about abolition.

The successful Camden reorganization was self-described as a disbanding followed by a reconstruction.
Which ultimately resulted in more LEO's on the streets of Camden - oddly crime went down too.
__________________
The man with one watch knows what time it is, the man with two watches is never sure.
Distracted1 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 9th June 2020, 06:38 PM   #369
trustbutverify
Philosopher
 
trustbutverify's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 8,078
Originally Posted by Distracted1 View Post
Which ultimately resulted in more LEO's on the streets of Camden - oddly crime went down too.
I've noted that earlier. They slashed pay and benefits to afford the additional officers.
__________________
"The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated." -- Mahatma Gandhi

Wollen owns the stage
trustbutverify is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 9th June 2020, 07:31 PM   #370
Bogative
Graduate Poster
 
Bogative's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 1,375
Originally Posted by Belz... View Post
Another vacuous answer that just shows that your only mode of thinking is tit-for-tat. You can't imagine that the actual complaint could be that the police simply acted wrongly. If Democrats (the noun) are complaining about this incident, then naturally you have to take the opposite position.
I agree with most Democrats that Floyd was murdered. I disagree that he was murdered because he was black and I will change my opinion if I ever see any proof otherwise. Did you have any?
Bogative is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 9th June 2020, 07:45 PM   #371
Checkmite
Skepticifimisticalationist
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Gulf Coast
Posts: 25,512
Per Variety, Paramount has cancelled "COPS"

Quote:
Definitive news that the series won’t return comes only four days after Variety exclusively reported that it had been pulled from the schedule.

“‘Cops’ is not on the Paramount Network and we don’t have any current or future plans for it to return,” a Paramount Network spokesperson said in a statement.

The original decision to hold “Cops” was spurred by nationwide protests against police brutality following the killing of George Floyd by Minnesota police officers.

“Cops” originally launched on Fox in 1989 and has come under fire in recent years for its depicts law enforcement and questionable behind the scenes practices.

The series was the subject of a recent podcast hosted by Dan Taberski, “Running from Cops,” which chronicled hundreds of episodes of the show. Taberski and his team detailed instances where people were coerced into signing waivers and how production allows police to edit and remove anything that might paint them in a negative light.
__________________
"¿WHAT KIND OF BIRD?
¿A PARANORMAL BIRD?"
--- Carlos S., 2002
Checkmite is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 9th June 2020, 08:35 PM   #372
Bob001
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: US of A
Posts: 10,839
Co-worker says Chauvin and Floyd knew each other from the club where they worked.
Quote:
According to a former coworker, not only did they know each other, but they had a history of friction.

Floyd and Chauvin both worked security at a nightclub at the same time. Coworker David Pinney said the two men had a history.

"They bumped heads," Pinney said.

"How?" CBS News asked.

"It has a lot to do with Derek being extremely aggressive within the club with some of the patrons, which was an issue," Pinney explained.
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/george-...rmer-coworker/
Bob001 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 9th June 2020, 09:27 PM   #373
Skeptic Ginger
Nasty Woman
 
Skeptic Ginger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 81,631
Originally Posted by trustbutverify View Post
OK, but I assume you realize the Minneapolis city council, led by Lisa Bender, have declared their intent to dismantle and, eventually, abolish the Police Dept as an institution entirely. They've described it as a disbanding many times. After a rough CNN interview, they've been walking it back to varying degrees, but there have been serious plans in that direction since at least 2017. So there are indeed organizations talking about abolition.

The successful Camden reorganization was self-described as a disbanding followed by a reconstruction.
I understand all that.

Once you have to explain your message, the message is a fail.

MAGA is bull ****. But no one has to explain it.
__________________
Privatize the profits and socialize the losses. It's the American way. That's how Mnuchin got rich. Worse, he did it on the backs of elderly people who had been conned into reverse mortgages. Mnuchin paid zero, took on the debt then taxpayers bailed him out.

Space Force.
Because feeding poor people is socialism.
Skeptic Ginger is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 9th June 2020, 10:02 PM   #374
Darat
Lackey
Administrator
 
Darat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: South East, UK
Posts: 92,296
Originally Posted by pgwenthold View Post
There is something I realized that I haven't heard addressed: the guy knelt on his neck for 8 minutes. What was he waiting for? What was the end point?

If he was waiting for Floyd to stop resisting, we know he wasn't breathing for like 3 minutes. How long does he have to be not resisting to be considered not resisting?

There were 3 other cops watching, so it's not like he was waiting for help.

So what was he waiting for, other for Floyd to stop breathing?

For the paramedics to turn up....

I can’t bring myself to watch the video, at what point were the paramedics called?
__________________
I wish I knew how to quit you
Darat is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 9th June 2020, 10:04 PM   #375
Darat
Lackey
Administrator
 
Darat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: South East, UK
Posts: 92,296
Originally Posted by Bogative View Post
I agree with most Democrats that Floyd was murdered. I disagree that he was murdered because he was black and I will change my opinion if I ever see any proof otherwise. Did you have any?

What is your obsession with the political party you think people have in regards to this tragedy?
__________________
I wish I knew how to quit you
Darat is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 9th June 2020, 10:12 PM   #376
trustbutverify
Philosopher
 
trustbutverify's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 8,078
Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
I understand all that.

Once you have to explain your message, the message is a fail.

MAGA is bull ****. But no one has to explain it.
The MAGA version would be something like Replace the Police. It sounds good, but could mean almost anything... so it really means nothing.
__________________
"The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated." -- Mahatma Gandhi

Wollen owns the stage
trustbutverify is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 9th June 2020, 10:15 PM   #377
arthwollipot
Observer of Phenomena
Pronouns: he/him
 
arthwollipot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Location, Location
Posts: 67,359
Originally Posted by trustbutverify View Post
The MAGA version would be something like Replace the Police. It sounds good, but could mean almost anything... so it really means nothing.
No, it really means "We're really frustrated with the police right now and we don't know what to do except that we know that something needs to be done!"
__________________
Self-described nerd.

My mom told me she tries never to make fun of people for not knowing something.
- Randall Munroe
arthwollipot is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 9th June 2020, 10:26 PM   #378
trustbutverify
Philosopher
 
trustbutverify's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 8,078
Originally Posted by arthwollipot View Post
No, it really means "We're really frustrated with the police right now and we don't know what to do except that we know that something needs to be done!"
Ok. And MAGA could mean "we're really frustrated with the elites right now and we don't know what to do except that we know something needs to be done!" Obviously, I'm not equating the legitimacy of the two.










'
__________________
"The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated." -- Mahatma Gandhi

Wollen owns the stage
trustbutverify is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 9th June 2020, 10:43 PM   #379
arthwollipot
Observer of Phenomena
Pronouns: he/him
 
arthwollipot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Location, Location
Posts: 67,359
Originally Posted by trustbutverify View Post
Ok. And MAGA could mean "we're really frustrated with the elites right now and we don't know what to do except that we know something needs to be done!" Obviously, I'm not equating the legitimacy of the two.
No, MAGA really meant "I support Donald Trump" except when Trump used it where it means "The people who know what they're talking about have told me that if I use this slogan all you sheeple will repeat it and that'll help me become the most powerful man in the world, which I totally deserve because I'm the best at everything, ask anyone."
__________________
Self-described nerd.

My mom told me she tries never to make fun of people for not knowing something.
- Randall Munroe
arthwollipot is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 9th June 2020, 10:54 PM   #380
trustbutverify
Philosopher
 
trustbutverify's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 8,078
Originally Posted by arthwollipot View Post
No, MAGA really meant "I support Donald Trump" except when Trump used it where it means "The people who know what they're talking about have told me that if I use this slogan all you sheeple will repeat it and that'll help me become the most powerful man in the world, which I totally deserve because I'm the best at everything, ask anyone."
Well, since the force keeping America from being great is supposedly deep state neoliberal elitism, and Trump is supposedly the populist hero who was somehow going to defeat it, I'd say what I quoted is probably what Dump and the dumpettes had in mind.
__________________
"The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated." -- Mahatma Gandhi

Wollen owns the stage
trustbutverify is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 9th June 2020, 10:56 PM   #381
arthwollipot
Observer of Phenomena
Pronouns: he/him
 
arthwollipot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Location, Location
Posts: 67,359
Originally Posted by trustbutverify View Post
Well, since the force keeping America from being great is supposedly deep state neoliberal elitism, and Trump is supposedly the populist hero who was somehow going to defeat it, I'd say what I quoted is probably what Dump and the dumpettes had in mind.
You assume that their minds are capable of having something in them.
__________________
Self-described nerd.

My mom told me she tries never to make fun of people for not knowing something.
- Randall Munroe
arthwollipot is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 9th June 2020, 11:40 PM   #382
erlando
Graduate Poster
 
erlando's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 1,758
Originally Posted by Meadmaker View Post
To follow up on this, I just read a friend's Facebook page yesterday. He went public with something that happened to him a year ago.

He was driving on I-80 in Indiana, when a cop pulled him over. The cop told him to get out of the car. My friend was ex-military and a martial arts practitioner. He was impeccably polite at all times. I have never known him to be otherwise. The cop asked if he had drugs in the car. He responded that he did not. The cop informed him that he would have to search the car. And, since the cop had no partner, and my friend was much bigger than the cop, my friend would have to be handcuffed while the cop searched the car. He proceeded to search the car, let my friend out of the cuffs, and very politely, wished my friend a nice rest of the day.
So it's ok to violate civil rights if you're polite about it?
__________________
"If it can grow, it can evolve" - Eugenie Scott, Ph.D Creationism disproved?
Evolution IS a blind watchmaker
erlando is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 9th June 2020, 11:52 PM   #383
Skeptic Ginger
Nasty Woman
 
Skeptic Ginger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 81,631
Originally Posted by trustbutverify View Post
The MAGA version would be something like Replace the Police. It sounds good, but could mean almost anything... so it really means nothing.
I'm still bouncing ideas around in my head:

MCOPA

Make the cops our partners again.
__________________
Privatize the profits and socialize the losses. It's the American way. That's how Mnuchin got rich. Worse, he did it on the backs of elderly people who had been conned into reverse mortgages. Mnuchin paid zero, took on the debt then taxpayers bailed him out.

Space Force.
Because feeding poor people is socialism.
Skeptic Ginger is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 9th June 2020, 11:57 PM   #384
erlando
Graduate Poster
 
erlando's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 1,758
Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
I'm still bouncing ideas around in my head:

MCOPA

Make the cops our partners again.
Seen from the perspective of minorities they never really were.
__________________
"If it can grow, it can evolve" - Eugenie Scott, Ph.D Creationism disproved?
Evolution IS a blind watchmaker
erlando is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 10th June 2020, 12:19 AM   #385
The Don
Penultimate Amazing
 
The Don's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Sir Fynwy
Posts: 28,961
Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
My friend is a doctor who drives an expensive SUV. He's black. He gets pulled over frequently compared to how often I get pulled over in my unwashed 2003 wagon.
Well if he wasn't so uppity in owning such a nice vehicle he wouldn't be stopped nearly as much. It's almost as if he's inviting confrontation.....

If these ******* stopped antagonising the police by failing to follow instructions (or by following instructions depending on situation), being out of their houses (or inside their houses depending on situation) and having an excess of melanin then their lives would be so much easier.
The Don is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 10th June 2020, 12:24 AM   #386
The Great Zaganza
Maledictorian
 
The Great Zaganza's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 12,062
Originally Posted by Bogative View Post
I agree with most Democrats that Floyd was murdered. I disagree that he was murdered because he was black and I will change my opinion if I ever see any proof otherwise. Did you have any?
what kind of evidence would satisfy you?
__________________
ETTD
Everything Trump Touches Dies
The Great Zaganza is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 10th June 2020, 12:34 AM   #387
Blue Mountain
Resident Skeptical Hobbit
 
Blue Mountain's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Waging war on woo-woo in Winnipeg
Posts: 6,138
Originally Posted by thaiboxerken View Post
That's what I'm wondering. What is the problem with people linking in ways that one poster doesn't like?
Which of the following provides up-front information about what's at the target of the link?
The campaign for good linking is an educational effot to get forum members to format links so readers don't have to actually click on them in order to know what the person who used it is wanting to communicate. It's partly a time saver for the reader, partly a bandwidth saver for people with limited data plans, and partly simply being being a courteous poster.
__________________
The social illusion reigns to-day upon all the heaped-up ruins of the past, and to it belongs the future. The masses have never thirsted after truth. They turn aside from evidence that is not to their taste, preferring to deify error, if error seduce them. Gustav Le Bon, The Crowd, 1895 (from the French)
Canadian or living in Canada? PM me if you want an entry on the list of Canadians on the forum.
Blue Mountain is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 10th June 2020, 12:42 AM   #388
Skeptic Tank
Trigger Warning
 
Skeptic Tank's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 2,844
I've heard some people speculate (again, speculation - not claiming this is true) that the high levels of meth and fentanyl in Floyd's system at the time of his death may indicate that he had a stash on him intended for sale, and when he knew police were there and coming up to the car to interact with him, he swallowed it so they couldn't find it - and that this caused his death.

An interesting theory and it makes sense to me. I am no expert on what a typical amount of those drugs to find in an addict's toxicology would be, but I'm hearing people say that his levels were quite high.

I think there's at least a possibility here that Chauvin's technique was pretty standard, and didn't contribute to the guy dying all that much. Floyd may have been a dead man walking from a decision made as they first approached his truck.

ETA: That could also explain why he stumbled to the ground on the newer video that has come out, as they were trying to put him in the police vehicle. Nothing rough at all had been done to him at that point, and yet he went to the ground for seemingly no reason. I had felt this was likely a deliberate stalling / resisting tactic on his part, but it may have been the drug overdose hitting him.

Last edited by Skeptic Tank; 10th June 2020 at 12:45 AM.
Skeptic Tank is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 10th June 2020, 12:48 AM   #389
RedStapler
Critical Thinker
 
Join Date: Mar 2020
Posts: 373
Originally Posted by Skeptic Tank View Post
I've heard some people speculate (again, speculation - not claiming this is true) that the high levels of meth and fentanyl in Floyd's system at the time of his death may indicate that he had a stash on him intended for sale, and when he knew police were there and coming up to the car to interact with him, he swallowed it so they couldn't find it - and that this caused his death.

An interesting theory and it makes sense to me. I am no expert on what a typical amount of those drugs to find in an addict's toxicology would be, but I'm hearing people say that his levels were quite high.

I think there's at least a possibility here that Chauvin's technique was pretty standard, and didn't contribute to the guy dying all that much. Floyd may have been a dead man walking from a decision made as they first approached his truck.

ETA: That could also explain why he stumbled to the ground on the newer video that has come out, as they were trying to put him in the police vehicle. Nothing rough at all had been done to him at that point, and yet he went to the ground for seemingly no reason. I had felt this was likely a deliberate stalling / resisting tactic on his part, but it may have been the drug overdose hitting him.
I've heard some people speculate (again, speculation - not claiming this is true) that you beat your wife on a daily basis and that she will press charges (which means you are probably going to jail for a few years)
RedStapler is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 10th June 2020, 01:07 AM   #390
Dave Rogers
Bandaged ice that stampedes inexpensively through a scribbled morning waving necessary ankles
 
Dave Rogers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Cair Paravel, according to XKCD
Posts: 30,932
Originally Posted by Darat View Post
How do you know the looters and vandals are democrats?
The same way he knew back at post #4 that George Floyd's killing was obviously nothing to do with police brutality against black people.

Dave
__________________
Inspiring discussion of Sharknado is not a good sign for the audience expectations of your new high-concept SF movie sequel.

- Myriad
Dave Rogers is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 10th June 2020, 02:14 AM   #391
Belz...
Fiend God
 
Belz...'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: In the details
Posts: 89,766
Originally Posted by CaptainHowdy View Post
During the armed robbery for which he was convicted he threatened a pregnant woman by pointing his pistol at her baby bump. This is the kind of guy who is a hero to some people.
Very few people.

Most consider him a victim.
__________________
Master of the Shining Darkness

"My views are nonsense. So what?" - BobTheCoward


Belz... is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 10th June 2020, 02:16 AM   #392
Belz...
Fiend God
 
Belz...'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: In the details
Posts: 89,766
Originally Posted by Meadmaker View Post
To follow up on this, I just read a friend's Facebook page yesterday. He went public with something that happened to him a year ago.

He was driving on I-80 in Indiana, when a cop pulled him over. The cop told him to get out of the car. My friend was ex-military and a martial arts practitioner. He was impeccably polite at all times. I have never known him to be otherwise. The cop asked if he had drugs in the car. He responded that he did not. The cop informed him that he would have to search the car. And, since the cop had no partner, and my friend was much bigger than the cop, my friend would have to be handcuffed while the cop searched the car. He proceeded to search the car, let my friend out of the cuffs, and very politely, wished my friend a nice rest of the day.
Without the ridiculous "war" on drugs, this sort of thing just wouldn't happen.
__________________
Master of the Shining Darkness

"My views are nonsense. So what?" - BobTheCoward


Belz... is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 10th June 2020, 02:17 AM   #393
Belz...
Fiend God
 
Belz...'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: In the details
Posts: 89,766
Originally Posted by Bogative View Post
Statistically, Chicago is a majority Democrat city
Democratic, remember?

Quote:
therefore it's Democrats who are burning and looting the city. (I learned on this forum that I don't need direct evidence to a claim if I have statistics e.g., Floyd was murdered because he was black)
So your solution to seeing other people use bad logic is to use bad logic yourself? Where did you learn that you have to be the lowest common denominator?
__________________
Master of the Shining Darkness

"My views are nonsense. So what?" - BobTheCoward


Belz... is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 10th June 2020, 02:20 AM   #394
Belz...
Fiend God
 
Belz...'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: In the details
Posts: 89,766
Originally Posted by Bogative View Post
I agree with most Democrats that Floyd was murdered. I disagree that he was murdered because he was black and I will change my opinion if I ever see any proof otherwise. Did you have any?
Why are you asking me? I never made that claim.

On the other handa LOT of discussion has been had on this issue and it should not come as a surprise to you that black people report very different experiences with the police than white people, depending on the location.
__________________
Master of the Shining Darkness

"My views are nonsense. So what?" - BobTheCoward


Belz... is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 10th June 2020, 02:22 AM   #395
Belz...
Fiend God
 
Belz...'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: In the details
Posts: 89,766
Originally Posted by Skeptic Tank View Post
I've heard some people speculate (again, speculation - not claiming this is true) that the high levels of meth and fentanyl in Floyd's system at the time of his death may indicate that he had a stash on him intended for sale, and when he knew police were there and coming up to the car to interact with him, he swallowed it so they couldn't find it - and that this caused his death.

An interesting theory and it makes sense to me.
Oh, it makes sense to you? Gee, I wonder why.

Why do you always jump right into the arms of any theory that agrees with you? Haven't you ever heard of doubting those MORE?
__________________
Master of the Shining Darkness

"My views are nonsense. So what?" - BobTheCoward


Belz... is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 10th June 2020, 02:35 AM   #396
Dave Rogers
Bandaged ice that stampedes inexpensively through a scribbled morning waving necessary ankles
 
Dave Rogers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Cair Paravel, according to XKCD
Posts: 30,932
Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
what kind of evidence would satisfy you?
An entry in Chauvin's diary saying "I hath resolv'd this fine Morn to go out upon the street and kill me a Negro, for only thus may the ultimate Superiority of the White Race be conclusively Prov'n to all," together with the testimony of at least three doctors that he was of sound mind when he wrote it. Anything less isn't proper racism.

Dave
__________________
Inspiring discussion of Sharknado is not a good sign for the audience expectations of your new high-concept SF movie sequel.

- Myriad
Dave Rogers is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 10th June 2020, 02:54 AM   #397
Arcade22
Philosopher
 
Arcade22's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Sweden
Posts: 6,560
Originally Posted by erlando View Post
Seen from the perspective of minorities they never really were.
Pretty sure law enforcement can be, and often is, just as abusive towards minorities as they are towards people of lower social status in general. That is not to say that Black or Latino people aren't generally treated worse than poor non-Hispanic white people in the US, but just being white is no guarantee that you won't experience abuse, misconduct or otherwise unprofessional behavior at the hands of law enforcement.

Which is why white people should take police abuse against black people or other minorities seriously.
__________________
We would be a lot safer if the Government would take its money out of science and put it into astrology and the reading of palms. Only in superstition is there hope. - Kurt Vonnegut Jr

And no, Cuba is not a brutal and corrupt dictatorship, and it's definitely less so than Sweden. - dann
Arcade22 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 10th June 2020, 03:58 AM   #398
erlando
Graduate Poster
 
erlando's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 1,758
Originally Posted by Arcade22 View Post
Pretty sure law enforcement can be, and often is, just as abusive towards minorities as they are towards people of lower social status in general. That is not to say that Black or Latino people aren't generally treated worse than poor non-Hispanic white people in the US, but just being white is no guarantee that you won't experience abuse, misconduct or otherwise unprofessional behavior at the hands of law enforcement.

Which is why white people should take police abuse against black people or other minorities seriously.
I can't figure out if you're agreeing with me or trying to argue a point.
__________________
"If it can grow, it can evolve" - Eugenie Scott, Ph.D Creationism disproved?
Evolution IS a blind watchmaker
erlando is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 10th June 2020, 04:16 AM   #399
bonzombiekitty
Graduate Poster
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 1,539
Originally Posted by Dave Rogers View Post
An entry in Chauvin's diary saying "I hath resolv'd this fine Morn to go out upon the street and kill me a Negro, for only thus may the ultimate Superiority of the White Race be conclusively Prov'n to all," together with the testimony of at least three doctors that he was of sound mind when he wrote it. Anything less isn't proper racism.

Dave
However, Dr Yossarian says being racist indicates you are not of sound mind.
bonzombiekitty is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 10th June 2020, 04:24 AM   #400
Distracted1
Illuminator
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Philadelphia
Posts: 4,230
Originally Posted by Darat View Post
For the paramedics to turn up....

I can’t bring myself to watch the video, at what point were the paramedics called?
According to reports read in some media outlets. Medical help was called for within the first minute of Floyd laying down.
__________________
The man with one watch knows what time it is, the man with two watches is never sure.
Distracted1 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Reply

International Skeptics Forum » General Topics » Social Issues & Current Events

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 04:56 AM.
Powered by vBulletin. Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

This forum began as part of the James Randi Education Foundation (JREF). However, the forum now exists as
an independent entity with no affiliation with or endorsement by the JREF, including the section in reference to "JREF" topics.

Disclaimer: Messages posted in the Forum are solely the opinion of their authors.