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13th June 2019, 02:37 AM | #2681 |
Penultimate Amazing
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Telegraph journalist and Boris supporter complains to BBC about
Quote:
Goes onto say
Quote:
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13th June 2019, 02:44 AM | #2682 |
Loggerheaded, earth-vexing fustilarian
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13th June 2019, 02:48 AM | #2683 |
Orthogonal Vector
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Sufficiently advanced Woo is indistinguishable from Parody "There shall be no *poofing* in science" Paul C. Anagnostopoulos Force ***** on reasons back" Ben Franklin |
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13th June 2019, 03:00 AM | #2684 |
Illuminator
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13th June 2019, 03:06 AM | #2685 |
Illuminator
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I've been looking into Leadsom, as she's a candidate for PM. On her wiki pages it reads:
Quote:
Is there a report (or even evidence) for this. Do these Tories have evidence that support their claims about the EU, that we would be better leaving? |
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"To vowels. They stop consonants sticking together like boiled sweets in a paper bag." |
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13th June 2019, 03:21 AM | #2686 |
Orthogonal Vector
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Sufficiently advanced Woo is indistinguishable from Parody "There shall be no *poofing* in science" Paul C. Anagnostopoulos Force ***** on reasons back" Ben Franklin |
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13th June 2019, 03:33 AM | #2687 |
Penultimate Amazing
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It's called Stockholm complex, but there is a catch: Blitz was not voluntary, the alternative was to let Germany run wild in the continent and ruin the British Empire in the process. Blitz was bad yes, but everyone knew why they had to suffer through.
Brexit is an entirely needless self-inflicted British thing. Half the country is against it and most support comes from people who genuinely bought the lies of Brexit. I doubt it can be equalled to the Blitz. Sure, the British people will say they support the government in the polls due to harsh reality, but this is not about starting an armed uprising. It is voting again for the people who promised you a free unicorn and got you in a situation that is "not worse than WW2". Plus the Blitz wasn't that bad in comparison to what was going on elsewhere. Compared to what German towns and cities went through it was almost pleasant - and that was nothing compared to what happened in Russia or Japan. Brexit won't have that. McHrozni |
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13th June 2019, 02:50 PM | #2688 |
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who claims the soulless Who speaks for the forgotten dead ~ Danzig |
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13th June 2019, 06:15 PM | #2689 |
Director of Hatcheries and Conditioning
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Oh well. You used to laugh at Trump and feel humiliated by the Brexit shambes. Now you have the Brexit shambles and the equivalent of Trump. MBGA!
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We do these things not because they are easy, but because we thought they were going to be easy. Everything is possible, but not everything is probable. “Perception is real, but the truth is not.” - Imelda Marcos |
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13th June 2019, 08:32 PM | #2690 |
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It's going to be Boris, isn't it?
They'll go through the motions, but I think the writing is already on the wall. Boris Johnson tops first ballot in Tory leadership contest It wasn't even close. 114 to 43 for his closest rival. The only question is, will the "wider Conservative Party" prefer Johnson or whoever else remains on the final ballot? |
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13th June 2019, 08:36 PM | #2691 |
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Any chance of a vote of no confidence succeeding, to force new elections?
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13th June 2019, 10:58 PM | #2692 |
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With a minority government there's always a chance for everything. In theory just two resignations from either the conservative party or DUP to the independent group could be enough, if all the others hold ranks against Boris. Ten resignations seal his fate, a new election is inevitable.
Will it happen? We don't know. "They voted for Tony, and yet they now get Gordon, and a transition about as democratically proper as the transition from Claudius to Nero. It is a scandal. "Why are we all conniving in this stitch-up? This is nothing less than a palace coup, effected by the Brownites, and it is possible only because Tony had run out of road." -- Boris Johnson, 2007 McHrozni |
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13th June 2019, 11:36 PM | #2693 |
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If Labour cannot get the votes to try and prevent a no-deal Brexit, something that the majority of Conservative MPs are allegedly want to prevent as well (though I think recent events indicate the opposite), then I think their chances of getting a no-confidence motion through are very low indeed and IMO not even worth trying.
That was then, this is now. In much the same way that Mitch McConnell used to think that appointing someone to SCOTUS in the final year of a presidency was undemocratic when a Democrat was in the White House but is perfectly fine with the idea if it were to fall to President Trump. That said, I don't think Labour stand much chance of forming the next government in any case. A Conservative Party under Boris would just have received several months non-stop coverage of the leadership election. Given that a fair chunk of the electorate seem to vote for the party they have heard most of, most recently, regardless of policies I think Boris would be well advised to call a snap election if and when he becomes leader. If he promises a hard Brexit, the Brexit Party supporters will return to the Conservative fold, he'll get a bunch of support for the Tories from people who recognise him from the telly and Labour will leak support to LibDems because of their pro-Brexit stance, enough to stop Labour getting elected, but not enough to get too many more LibDem MPs. |
14th June 2019, 02:09 AM | #2694 |
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The point of equilibrium has passed; satire and current events are now indistinguishable. |
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14th June 2019, 02:55 AM | #2695 |
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14th June 2019, 03:02 AM | #2696 |
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We must deliver Brexit
We must deliver Brexit Suicide is painless. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4gO7uemm6Yo |
14th June 2019, 03:18 AM | #2697 |
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Wrong. To get into the last two stage, when the party members get the final say, any candidate needs a third of the MP votes plus one. Boris has already surpassed that number and only has to avoid losing votes in the remaining MP ballots. He's much more likely to increase his vote, unless he says something really stupid (always a possibility with Boris).
All the opinion polls say that the party members will choose Boris over any other candidate, so again, it seems that the only person who could stop Boris becoming PM is Boris himself. |
14th June 2019, 03:23 AM | #2698 |
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True. Both should be talked about incessantly, I think.
Quote:
Quote:
It would still be a smelly, squishy turd, just like it was before. But it would have a strand of silver lining, so that's a plus. McHrozni |
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لا إله إلا رجل والعلوم والتكنولوجيا وأنبيائه |
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14th June 2019, 03:26 AM | #2699 |
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I agree with everything but the last adjective. He has to say something really vote repulsing, but "stupid" isn't the right adjective, he's been saying stupid things for three years straight.
Something that needs another qualifier, besides stupid.
Quote:
It really puts democratic deficit in perspective, doesn't it? McHrozni |
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14th June 2019, 04:59 AM | #2700 |
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Yes there is a risk, but Boris Johnson would have a number of things in his favour:
I'd call the election if I was in his shoes. I'd be confident of trouncing Jeremy Corbyn's Labour Party and the LibDems aren't likely to win enough seats. That's as long as it's clear that BoJo's pro no-deal stance has completely spiked the Brexit Party's guns. Fair enough but that means that we'd have at least 4 more years of Conservative government at a time when the effects of a no-deal Brexit are being felt - a very small silver lining indeed. |
14th June 2019, 07:54 AM | #2701 |
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As human right is always something given, it always in reality reduces to the right which men give, "concede," to each other. If the right to existence is conceded to new-born children, then they have the right; if it is not conceded to them, as was the case among the Spartans and ancient Romans, then they do not have it. For only society can give or concede it to them; they themselves cannot take it, or give it to themselves. |
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14th June 2019, 08:23 AM | #2702 |
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14th June 2019, 11:03 AM | #2703 |
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14th June 2019, 11:24 PM | #2704 |
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10 minute Youtube video with one man's view of the 8 Labour MPs who voted against the Labour Party motion a few days ago:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I3TOeCKrTIs |
15th June 2019, 09:44 PM | #2705 |
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Funny how old Marxists can morph into libertarians
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We do these things not because they are easy, but because we thought they were going to be easy. Everything is possible, but not everything is probable. “Perception is real, but the truth is not.” - Imelda Marcos |
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16th June 2019, 01:39 AM | #2706 |
Safely Ignored
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Yeah. It's ironic that the side which are in no doubt that they are the patriots, waving their metaphorical union jacks and humming the Dam Busters theme, are the ones happy to destroy the union to get their blue passports. They're almost eager to throw Northern Ireland under the bus, don't care that Scotland will split from the UK and have this movie-simple view that the EU is Germany and Germany are the baddies. They want to re-fight WW2 not to win it, but to live perpetually in a moment where Britain stood alone.
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16th June 2019, 03:50 AM | #2707 |
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All our politicians seems hopelessly transfixed by the Brexit Party, willing to sacrifice anything if they think it will save their seat.
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16th June 2019, 07:21 AM | #2708 |
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I agree. Johnson, twice elected as London mayor and successful brexit referendum campaigner, has electoral success behind him. I think he can galvanise the Tories who fear oblivion/Corbyn.
I do hope the Tories are the next government, so they can take the hit, especially with a no deal, as reality comes crashing down. |
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Audiophile/biker/sceptic |
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16th June 2019, 08:22 AM | #2709 |
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16th June 2019, 08:26 AM | #2710 |
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The problem is that reality will never come crashing down. No matter how bad it gets, the majority of English people will convince themselves that either it's the fault of horrible foreigners and/or it would have been even worse had we been in the EU.
The NHS effectively disappearing - inevitable market forces A long and deep recession - the EU's fault, and worth the cost Farmers going out of business due to zero tariff imports - good news for consumers Businesses leaving the UK - traitors the lot of them IMO there is literally no combination of outcomes, no matter how dire, that would lead them to think that they made a bad choice and that it was their fault. |
16th June 2019, 08:50 AM | #2711 |
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16th June 2019, 09:18 AM | #2712 |
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Hilarious TV announcement of the C4 debate in The Grauniad. Seems the writer expected it to be rejected (was he/she drunk? ) but they printed it anyway:
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16th June 2019, 12:58 PM | #2713 |
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So I've started a blog about my writing. Check it out at: http://fourth-planet-problem.blogspot.com/ And my first book is on Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B077W322FX |
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16th June 2019, 01:15 PM | #2714 |
Uncritical "thinker"
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Well the author seems to be standing by it:
https://twitter.com/AliCatterall/sta...15921526620160 He seems to have been asked to take his original tweet down, from the comments to that. FB_IMG_1560675272472.jpg |
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OECD healthcare spending Public/Compulsory Expenditure on healthcare https://data.oecd.org/chart/60Tt Every year since 1990 the US Public healthcare spending has been greater than the UK as a proportion of GDP. More US Tax goes to healthcare than the UK |
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16th June 2019, 10:14 PM | #2715 |
Penultimate Amazing
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Sounds a lot of what went through the mind (or equivalent) of Theresa May in 2017. But yeah, it could work all right this time, if Remain vote is split between Labour and LibDem and Brexit vote is united behind BJ.
Quote:
McHrozni |
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16th June 2019, 10:40 PM | #2716 |
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I'm sure there is a sizable minority of Englishmen who really do have those opinions. It is somewhere in the 20-40% of the electorate, but not more. They were deluded by the promises of the Brexit campaign and have since identified themselves with Brexit - if there is something wrong with Brexit, there is something wrong with them, so of course they will support Brexit, come what may, and claim any and all faults of Brexit are faults of other actors.
It's an emotional argument and reasoning won't work against them. On the upside, I think the people who genuinely can't be convinced of the flaws of their ways are on the low end of the spectrum, perhaps just 15-20% of the electorate. The others can be drawn away at any point with a steady diet of reality. This is based on my personal observations of such issues for the lower boundry of support for emotional arguments of this nature. The same goes for any such argument - Brexit, Trump, vaccines, 9/11 twoofers, Moon hoax, Flat Eartherism ... all these and other stuff we love to hate in these parts of the internet have a maximum reach of some 15-20% of the public, those who can't be rescued from their dellusions no matter what you do. This point is reached by few, but Brexit and Trump were prolific enough to get there and beyond. Getting below the 15-20% treshold is nigh-on impossible, but reaching it is achievable. Painful perhaps, but achievable. McHrozni |
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17th June 2019, 05:22 AM | #2717 |
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Just had a four-page A4 leaflet from the EFDD (the grouping the Brexit Party belongs to) shoved through the door.
It strawmanned a series of Remain arguments and reassured us that a no-deal Brexit would be just fine - without giving any specifics as to why. If only I had a parrot cage I'd have found a use for it. |
17th June 2019, 05:58 AM | #2718 |
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17th June 2019, 08:12 AM | #2719 |
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Why? It's an accurate summary of the debate.
Live: Britain’s Next PM – The Channel 4 Debate 6.30pm, Channel 4 That the UK is bound for hell in a hand-assisted vehicle, there is little doubt. All that remains is to discover which of these escapees from Pandora’s box will taxi us there; a more wretched collection of dissemblers, idiots, narcissists and people who have mistakenly taken drugs is difficult to imagine under one studio roof, but here we are. An asbestos-clad Krishnan Guru-Murthy meets the contenders before an audience drawn from across this broken isle. God actually help us. Ali Catterall |
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As human right is always something given, it always in reality reduces to the right which men give, "concede," to each other. If the right to existence is conceded to new-born children, then they have the right; if it is not conceded to them, as was the case among the Spartans and ancient Romans, then they do not have it. For only society can give or concede it to them; they themselves cannot take it, or give it to themselves. |
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17th June 2019, 08:16 AM | #2720 |
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