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Old 10th December 2019, 04:42 PM   #1
deadrose
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Genealogy site bought by forensic DNA company

GEDmatch, the site that let you upload your DNA profile to find relatives, and which was used to solve the Golden Gate killer case, is now owned by Verogen, a forensic DNA company that works closely with police.

As a bonus, it looks as if GEDmatch was already not doing well at user privacy, with police being allowed access to the full database, including users who had specifically opted out of sharing data with police.

Yep, nothing wrong here at all. Why wouldn't you trust them with your DNA profile? I mean it's not as if they're checking people for having Jewish ancestors or anything. Yet.

https://www.wired.com/story/a-dna-fi...enealogy-site/
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Old 10th December 2019, 05:19 PM   #2
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Personally pushing it to garner any sympathy privacy wise tbf

If you are have killed, raped people, maybe you should have tried harder not to leave DNA, and maybe think about killing any relatives you think may submit to the site.
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Old 10th December 2019, 05:43 PM   #3
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I have no plans to commit crimes, and I hope my relatives don't either. I do have a problem with throwing my genome out there to companies that don't control access to that information. I also have serious issues with the misinterpretation of forensic data to get convictions. These are big problems here in the US.
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Old 10th December 2019, 05:51 PM   #4
William Parcher
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Originally Posted by deadrose View Post
I mean it's not as if they're checking people for having Jewish ancestors or anything. Yet.
Are you thinking that the next Holocaust will happen with this thing being the tool used to find Jews?
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Old 10th December 2019, 06:09 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by William Parcher View Post
Are you thinking that the next Holocaust will happen with this thing being the tool used to find Jews?
Jews, gypsies, Ukrainians, or what if the next victims du jure are white folks? Or those with those gay gene combinations?

But perhaps the buying company, which has experience dealing in genetics, had decided to morph into a similar field? I mean come on, how many crime scenes with DNA can there be, compared to MILLIONS of people looking for relatives?

Both Promethease and Gedmatch have been bought up by corporations with the cash to improve them immensely. Like AI computers? Or not quite AI, but what was the news about a chip with a trillion transistors? 10,000 mostly multigenic diseases, 60,000,000 gene SNPs. Tens of thousands of environmental factors. I run out of fingers to count on. Big computers would help. $$$$.
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Old 10th December 2019, 06:18 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by casebro View Post
Or not quite AI, but what was the news about a chip with a trillion transistors? 10,000 mostly multigenic diseases, 60,000,000 gene SNPs. Tens of thousands of environmental factors. I run out of fingers to count on. Big computers would help. $$$$.
This is like word salad with some periods thrown in as croutons.
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Old 10th December 2019, 07:25 PM   #7
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Looking to make a hire for an important new position at your company? Pay MonkeyTech DNAta Warehouse a fee and we'll let you know which of your candidates for hire are also candidates for expensive illnesses that would distract them from the work! Don't hire a cancer-prone dud, call MonkeyTech today!
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Old 10th December 2019, 07:30 PM   #8
William Parcher
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Originally Posted by TragicMonkey View Post
illnesses that would distract them from the work!
Annoying vaginal itch.
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Old 10th December 2019, 07:53 PM   #9
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Actually, for some serious illnesses a company may want to hire a person who's likely to get it: the worker will be too terrified to risk losing their health insurance by changing jobs so they'll put up with enormous abuse.

Only works in the US, of course. Yay, America!
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Old 10th December 2019, 08:09 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
Personally pushing it to garner any sympathy privacy wise tbf

If you are have killed, raped people, maybe you should have tried harder not to leave DNA, and maybe think about killing any relatives you think may submit to the site.
I don't subscribe to the "if you have done nothing wrong you have nothing to fear" theory. It is already possible to fake DNA, so I would not want to have my DNA in a database where anyone can get it.
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Old 10th December 2019, 08:16 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
It is already possible to fake DNA
Wait until the Bigfooters hear about that.
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Old 10th December 2019, 08:31 PM   #12
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Lets see who is stll free and easy with DNA privacy when health insurance corps start to mine the data.
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Old 10th December 2019, 08:57 PM   #13
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Plus if the government can arrest you for terrorism on the grounds of 3-5 matching points in an automated fingerprint database, who's to say they're not likely to do the same on the grounds of a few alleles in common?
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Old 10th December 2019, 09:46 PM   #14
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I believe that there are limits to what the police should be allowed to do even if these limits might make solving crimes more difficult and this is part of what it takes to live in a free society. This is already recognized. For example police are not generally allowed to break into a house and search it without a warrant - this limits solving certain crimes but is key to our privacy. One’s DNA should also be protected.

Famous Ben Franklin quote: “Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety”
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Old 10th December 2019, 11:02 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by Giordano View Post
I believe that there are limits to what the police should be allowed to do even if these limits might make solving crimes more difficult and this is part of what it takes to live in a free society. This is already recognized. For example police are not generally allowed to break into a house and search it without a warrant - this limits solving certain crimes but is key to our privacy. One’s DNA should also be protected.

Famous Ben Franklin quote: “Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety”
Don't quite get the hype to be honest

The people willingly giving dna to the site aren't the bad guys.

As long as they do it with a disclaimer saying something like "Your dna sample might be used to work out one of you cousins is actually a mass killer from dna found at a crime scene" then what is the problem?

The actual killy person isn't even involved until they match their dna to the crime scene after arresting them

And even then they have to prove the person actually did it.

I do get the insurance/employment thing though.

We just don't have an issue with this here, so find the concept a weird one.
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Old 11th December 2019, 12:28 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by deadrose View Post
GEDmatch, the site that let you upload your DNA profile to find relatives, and which was used to solve the Golden Gate killer case, is now owned by Verogen, a forensic DNA company that works closely with police.

As a bonus, it looks as if GEDmatch was already not doing well at user privacy, with police being allowed access to the full database, including users who had specifically opted out of sharing data with police.

Yep, nothing wrong here at all. Why wouldn't you trust them with your DNA profile? I mean it's not as if they're checking people for having Jewish ancestors or anything. Yet.

https://www.wired.com/story/a-dna-fi...enealogy-site/
I downloaded GED to get a full health report. This looks at your mutations and can predict to some degree your likelihood of experiencing various genetically linked illnesses.

It is a concern that a private company with a different motive and mission statement has now got hold of all this.

In the UK the police database webpage was asking for volunteers from various different ethnic groups to supply DNA so that it could pinpoint ethnicity of perps' DNA found at crime scenes.

Permission from the individual should rightly be sought first.
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Old 11th December 2019, 07:16 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by William Parcher View Post
Annoying vaginal itch.
I could handle that for her.
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Old 11th December 2019, 09:00 AM   #18
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Originally Posted by TragicMonkey View Post
Looking to make a hire for an important new position at your company? Pay MonkeyTech DNAta Warehouse a fee and we'll let you know which of your candidates for hire are also candidates for expensive illnesses that would distract them from the work! Don't hire a cancer-prone dud, call MonkeyTech today!
Better yet, if your company uses this service to weed out potential employees with certain genetic markers, they will save big bucks on the crappy health insurance they provide.
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Old 11th December 2019, 02:53 PM   #19
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My Dad has been upset with me for two years for not sending in a genealogy DNA test kit he bought me. He says he wasted $60. Too bad.

And no, it isn't about crime with me, it's about other people having access to this extremely personal information without my knowledge. Insurance companies for one, and yes law enforcement too.

People will give away anything these days. Being a private investigator must be such an easy job compared to 40 years ago. Actually I know it is as I've seen lectures about it. Finding a simple photograph of a person in question used to be very difficult. Not anymore.

I can see the SPAM now...

"Hey Mgidm86, looks like you may be a genetic risk for cancer, try our new pills!"
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Old 11th December 2019, 04:34 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by TragicMonkey View Post
Actually, for some serious illnesses a company may want to hire a person who's likely to get it: the worker will be too terrified to risk losing their health insurance by changing jobs so they'll put up with enormous abuse.

Only works in the US, of course. Yay, America!
Too much hassle, employ people who are likely to die suddenly and young then take out 'Dead Peasant' life insurance policies on them. It doesn't even matter if they can do their jobs since their worth more dead than alive.
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Last edited by P.J. Denyer; 11th December 2019 at 04:36 PM.
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Old 12th December 2019, 04:00 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by mgidm86 View Post
"Hey Mgidm86, looks like you may be a genetic risk for cancer, try our new pills!"
Or even worse

"Hey Mgidm86 this is your friendly Health Insurance Provider here. Looks like you may be a genetic risk for cancer. We have decided to increase your premiums by 150% in order to offset the risk to our company"
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Old 12th December 2019, 04:08 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by mgidm86 View Post
My Dad has been upset with me for two years for not sending in a genealogy DNA test kit he bought me. He says he wasted $60. Too bad.

And no, it isn't about crime with me, it's about other people having access to this extremely personal information without my knowledge. Insurance companies for one, and yes law enforcement too.

People will give away anything these days. Being a private investigator must be such an easy job compared to 40 years ago. Actually I know it is as I've seen lectures about it. Finding a simple photograph of a person in question used to be very difficult. Not anymore.

I can see the SPAM now...

"Hey Mgidm86, looks like you may be a genetic risk for cancer, try our new pills!"
Just use a false name.
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Old 12th December 2019, 01:04 PM   #23
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And then there are things like this, which would be a weird way to get linked to a crime.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/12/07/u...crime-lab.html

Basically, people who've had successful bone marrow transplants become chimeras, with their DNA and the donor's DNA coming up on tests, depending on where the DNA was gathered from the body.
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Old 23rd December 2019, 02:14 PM   #24
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Slightly off-topic, but never realised the woman who worked out the Golden State killer was a kiwi, with the geneology sites is a kiwi.

Sounds like a cool chick



https://www.nytimes.com/2018/08/29/s...login=facebook
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Old 23rd December 2019, 10:44 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
Don't quite get the hype to be honest

The people willingly giving dna to the site aren't the bad guys.

As long as they do it with a disclaimer saying something like "Your dna sample might be used to work out one of you cousins is actually a mass killer from dna found at a crime scene" then what is the problem?

The actual killy person isn't even involved until they match their dna to the crime scene after arresting them

And even then they have to prove the person actually did it.

I do get the insurance/employment thing though.

We just don't have an issue with this here, so find the concept a weird one.
One: DNA doesn’t identify the “killy person” it only identifies (pretty often) where a person has been. And who said police will apply it exclusively to murders. Use it to identify rapists? Hard to argue against. But what about felony embezzlements? Hit and runs? In fact the information will go into giant data bases and be available for whatever query might interest the police and courts at any time.

And of course it works in reverse. Your cousin, perhaps one you don’t even know, has given permission to the police to potentially determine where you’ve been for what ever reason they wish. Who you’ve spent time with. Who you are related to, and how. Does that feel right just because you are not a murderer? Would you be comfortable if you were required by law to provide a list of where you’ve been each day before you go to sleep which can be queried by the police if they have some suspicion about you? DNA data bases are fairly close to that.

How comfortable are we with this, in essence one of the ultimate totalitarian wet dreams ever? And are you certain our governments will always be relatively benevolent? The DNA data bases will be there even if our leaders become extraordinarily sinister. And already are in use by existing sinister governments.

Although the issues are more intense given the circumstances you might find interesting the deep concerns the military have with this issue and their recommendations for their personnel to avoid DNA data bases:
https://www.yahoo.com/news/pentagon-...173304318.html
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Old 23rd December 2019, 10:48 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by Giordano View Post
One: DNA doesn’t identify the “killy person” it only identifies (pretty often) where a person has been. And who said police will apply it exclusively to murders. Use it to identify rapists? Hard to argue against. But what about felony embezzlements? Hit and runs? In fact the information will go into giant data bases and be available for whatever query might interest the police and courts at any time.

And of course it works in reverse. Your cousin, perhaps one you don’t even know, has given permission to the police to potentially determine where you’ve been for what ever reason they wish. Who you’ve spent time with. Who you are related to, and how. Does that feel right just because you are not a murderer? Would you be comfortable if you were required by law to provide a list of where you’ve been each day before you go to sleep which can be queried by the police if they have some suspicion about you? DNA data bases are fairly close to that.

How comfortable are we with this, in essence one of the ultimate totalitarian wet dreams ever? And are you certain our governments will always be relatively benevolent? The DNA data bases will be there even if our leaders become extraordinarily sinister. And already are in use by existing sinister governments.

Although the issues are more intense given the circumstances you might find interesting the deep concerns the military have with this issue and their recommendations for their personnel to avoid DNA data bases:
https://www.yahoo.com/news/pentagon-...173304318.html
I would never send off my DNA to a test willingly and don't know any of the family I have who would so don't really care tbf
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