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Old 3rd April 2017, 03:38 PM   #321
JesseCuster
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The list of things that TOBS can supposedly cure is an odd mish-mash of symptoms and diseases.

Things like "shortness of breath" or "difficulty swallowing" can be caused by many different things, including some of the things on the list, whereas other things like "cancer" (not a single disease in itself, but a family of diseases) have a bewildering array of symptoms.

Billy, how did you come up with this list of things that TOBS can cure? Can you give some examples of diseases or symptoms that TOBS can't treat, and your reasons for thinking so?
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Old 3rd April 2017, 03:58 PM   #322
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Originally Posted by JesseCuster View Post
...
Billy, how did you come up with this list of things that TOBS can cure? Can you give some examples of diseases or symptoms that TOBS can't treat, and your reasons for thinking so?
I'm sure he'll oblige.

Originally Posted by JesseCuster View Post
...
It's almost like you're making this stuff up as you go along.
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Old 3rd April 2017, 05:09 PM   #323
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Originally Posted by Billy Baxter View Post
I most certainly am not blaming cancer victims for their own suffering. I shouldn't have included cancer or AIDS on my list.

bb

ETA: there is TOBS pain and there is non-TOBS pain. There's a big difference.
My Dear Mr. Baxter:

I thought you were "leaving" us? Hmmm...

If this is true, then your original title is cynically inadequate...

I remain, observantly yours &ct.
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Old 3rd April 2017, 05:10 PM   #324
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Originally Posted by Hokulele View Post
How can you tell which one is which?
Well, clearly, pain that is alleviated by TOBS is "TOBS pain"; pain that is not alleviated by TOBS is "non-TOBS pain", innit?
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Old 3rd April 2017, 05:45 PM   #325
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Originally Posted by Slowvehicle View Post
Well, clearly, pain that is alleviated by TOBS is "TOBS pain"; pain that is not alleviated by TOBS is "non-TOBS pain", innit?
[Forehead slap]Well dicks my potatos!

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Old 3rd April 2017, 06:53 PM   #326
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Originally Posted by Billy Baxter View Post
I most certainly am not blaming cancer victims for their own suffering. I shouldn't have included cancer or AIDS on my list.

bb

ETA: there is TOBS pain and there is non-TOBS pain. There's a big difference.
When you came here, how did this play out in your mind? Are you satisfied with the responses? Did you assume that people here would take your assertions as fact? Are you disappointed at your reception? If so, why?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BbgyppGqBgg
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Old 3rd April 2017, 08:20 PM   #327
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Originally Posted by Hokulele View Post
How can you tell which one is which?
God will tell you. "Ask and ye shall receive; knock and it shall be opened unto you." How do you think I learned what the signals mean?

bb
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Old 3rd April 2017, 08:23 PM   #328
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Originally Posted by Billy Baxter View Post
God will tell you. "Ask and ye shall receive; knock and it shall be opened unto you." How do you think I learned what the signals mean?

bb
My Dear Mr. Baxter:

Still with the unsupported assertions?

I remain, gennu gevengly yours &ct.
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Old 3rd April 2017, 08:25 PM   #329
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Originally Posted by JesseCuster View Post
Why did you include them on your list in the first place?

Either you have sound reasons to think that people with AIDS or cancer can get relief or cure from their suffering using TOBS, in which case Hokulele's comment shouldn't make any difference, or you included them on your list without having a good reason to think that TOBS will work for them.

It's almost like you're making this stuff up as you go along.
i got a little carried away. i've suffered from, and learned how to alleviate, all of the BS pains except for cancer and AIDS.

bb
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Old 3rd April 2017, 08:32 PM   #330
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Originally Posted by Billy Baxter View Post
God will tell you. "Ask and ye shall receive; knock and it shall be opened unto you." How do you think I learned what the signals mean?

bb
Everyone (without imaginary friends) knows the "ask/receive" thing does NOT work.
************************


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Old 3rd April 2017, 08:34 PM   #331
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Originally Posted by JesseCuster View Post
Billy, how did you come up with this list of things that TOBS can cure? Can you give some examples of diseases or symptoms that TOBS can't treat, and your reasons for thinking so?
God saw fit to teach me what they mean. I don't know what TOBS can't cure, as I haven't encountered anything so far like that with the possible exceptions of those classic diseases children catch like chicken pox, the mumps, the flu, pneumonia, etc.

bb
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Old 3rd April 2017, 08:56 PM   #332
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Originally Posted by JesseCuster View Post
Why did you include them on your list in the first place?

Either you have sound reasons to think that people with AIDS or cancer can get relief or cure from their suffering using TOBS, in which case Hokulele's comment shouldn't make any difference, or you included them on your list without having a good reason to think that TOBS will work for them.

It's almost like you're making this stuff up as you go along.
Hmm..... could it be that simple, I wonder?
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Old 3rd April 2017, 09:42 PM   #333
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TOBS LESSON #2: THE WAYS GOD JUDGES US

Here is a partial list of scriptural verses mentioning how God passes judgment on us:

https://www.openbible.info/topics/gods_judgement

The reason entire groups of people don't automatically get the same body signals at the same time is, of course, that everyone has a different judgment, and are each at different stages of their spiritual progress.

God rewards good for good and evil for evil. Also, God measures out on our heads the same measure that we mete on our fellow men. Thus one person can get a specific BS for a specific thought while another person gets none at all when she thinks the same thought. That is the problem with clinical testing of TOBS: how do you pinpoint why one person's body gives different BS's from another's due to a differing judgment from God.

bb

Last edited by Billy Baxter; 3rd April 2017 at 09:52 PM. Reason: clarification
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Old 3rd April 2017, 10:05 PM   #334
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Another link about God's judgment:

https://rsc.byu.edu/archived/byu-rel...nt-book-mormon

bb
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Old 3rd April 2017, 10:35 PM   #335
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Originally Posted by Billy Baxter View Post
.........The reason entire groups of people don't automatically get the same body signals at the same time is, of course, that everyone has a different judgment, and are each at different stages of their spiritual progress...........
No, it's because this is made up crap with no basis in reality. It is delusional. Most of the population of the planet aren't delusional.
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Old 3rd April 2017, 10:39 PM   #336
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Originally Posted by Billy Baxter View Post
.........you people don't deserve to know the truth. i leave you to your willful ignorance..........
Most people un-flounce after at least a day or two. What made you change your mind?
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Old 3rd April 2017, 10:44 PM   #337
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Originally Posted by Billy Baxter View Post
God saw fit to teach me what they mean. I don't know what TOBS can't cure, as I haven't encountered anything so far like that with the possible exceptions of those classic diseases children catch like chicken pox, the mumps, the flu, pneumonia, etc.

bb
my arthritic right wrist and my right knee.
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Old 3rd April 2017, 10:56 PM   #338
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Originally Posted by MikeG View Post
Most people un-flounce after at least a day or two. What made you change your mind?
someone accused me of an unconscionably evil belief;

and

i had a good night's sleep.

bb
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Old 3rd April 2017, 11:04 PM   #339
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Originally Posted by John Jones View Post
my arthritic right wrist and my right knee.
right wrist = you're going about doing good in the wrong way
right knee = good intentions

I suggest asking God to forgive you of your sins through the Atoning blood of Christ, and try scripture study and prayer on a daily basis. I try to read one chapter a day, and it's amazing to me what a difference it makes.

bb
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Old 3rd April 2017, 11:04 PM   #340
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Originally Posted by Billy Baxter View Post
God will tell you. "Ask and ye shall receive; knock and it shall be opened unto you." How do you think I learned what the signals mean?

And yet you put down cancer as one of the things you can cure. Did your god not give you that list to post? If not, why did you post it?
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Old 3rd April 2017, 11:14 PM   #341
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Originally Posted by Hokulele View Post
And yet you put down cancer as one of the things you can cure. Did your god not give you that list to post? If not, why did you post it?
As I said, I got carried away in hope. God didn't tell me to post cancer on my list. I'm a sinner like anyone else. I don't always do God's will.

bb

ETA: Also, God doesn't command in all things. We are to be anxiously engaged in good works and do many good things in and of our own free will.

Last edited by Billy Baxter; 3rd April 2017 at 11:21 PM. Reason: clarification
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Old 3rd April 2017, 11:18 PM   #342
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Originally Posted by Billy Baxter View Post
God will tell you. "Ask and ye shall receive; knock and it shall be opened unto you." How do you think I learned what the signals mean?

bb
You didn't learn what the signals mean, your unconscious mind generated signals and you gradually trained it to do so in a pattern.

Until and unless you produce some objective evidence to the contrary, that is by far the most likely explanation of your experiences.
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Old 3rd April 2017, 11:19 PM   #343
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Originally Posted by Billy Baxter View Post
.......I suggest asking God to forgive you of your sins through the Atoning blood of Christ, and try scripture study and prayer on a daily basis. I try to read one chapter a day, and it's amazing to me what a difference it makes. ...........
And yet you are wracked with constant pain, twitches cramps and itches. I am not, despite a life-long acceptance that the babble is irrelevant bollocks. How do you explain that?
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Old 3rd April 2017, 11:26 PM   #344
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Originally Posted by Pixel42 View Post
You didn't learn what the signals mean, your unconscious mind generated signals and you gradually trained it to do so in a pattern.

Until and unless you produce some objective evidence to the contrary, that is by far the most likely explanation of your experiences.
objective evidence is your god

bb
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Old 3rd April 2017, 11:33 PM   #345
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Originally Posted by MikeG View Post
And yet you are wracked with constant pain, twitches cramps and itches. I am not, despite a life-long acceptance that the babble is irrelevant bollocks. How do you explain that?
I'm not in pain right now, and I've learned how to stop the BS's through obedience to Christ's gospel, which sets us free from the consequences of our sins.

Regardless of whether you believe in TOBS, you must repent of your sins lest they destroy you.

bb
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Old 3rd April 2017, 11:39 PM   #346
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Originally Posted by Billy Baxter View Post
objective evidence is your god

bb
Objective evidence is how we avoid inadvertantly fooling ourselves. There's nothing magical, let alone god like, about it. Only when we learned how to obtain it did true progress in understanding the world we live in begin. You enjoy the results of that progress whilst continuing to wallow in the ignorance and superstition that plagued humanity before it.
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Old 3rd April 2017, 11:39 PM   #347
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Originally Posted by Billy Baxter View Post
I'm not in pain right now, and I've learned how to stop the BS's through obedience to Christ's gospel, which sets us free from the consequences of our sins.

Regardless of whether you believe in TOBS, you must repent of your sins lest they destroy you.

bb
Why, secular laws from a liberal (note small "l") democracy are far superior to the rules set out in either the BoM or the various bibles out there.
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Old 3rd April 2017, 11:49 PM   #348
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Originally Posted by Pixel42 View Post
Objective evidence is how we avoid inadvertantly fooling ourselves. There's nothing magical, let alone god like, about it. Only when we learned how to obtain it did true progress in understanding the world we live in begin. You enjoy the results of that progress whilst continuing to wallow in the ignorance and superstition that plagued humanity before it.
I'm not totally dissing OE, I'm just saying it has its limits. You seem to think personal experience is completely unreliable as evidence, while God wants us to exercise faith in him without perfect knowledge.

bb
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Old 3rd April 2017, 11:52 PM   #349
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Originally Posted by Billy Baxter View Post
......you must repent of your sins lest they destroy you........
I don't have any. I've not much to repent of, although I wished I hadn't bought that expensive brass mortise gauge 3 or 4 weeks ago. I'll repent of that every time I get the old wooden one out.
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Last edited by MikeG; 3rd April 2017 at 11:56 PM.
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Old 3rd April 2017, 11:55 PM   #350
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Originally Posted by Billy Baxter View Post
.......You seem to think personal experience is completely unreliable as evidence
It is. Utterly unreliable. Which is why we developed rigorous methods of avoiding the inherent problems of personal experience. It's called the scientific method.


Quote:
while God wants us to exercise faith in him without perfect knowledge........
Set aside the question of the existence of god/s for a second. You have no way of knowing what god wants.
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Old 3rd April 2017, 11:56 PM   #351
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Originally Posted by Billy Baxter View Post
I'm not totally dissing OE, I'm just saying it has its limits. You seem to think personal experience is completely unreliable as evidence, while God wants us to exercise faith in him without perfect knowledge.

bb
Personal experience is unreliable, yes. That is something humanity learned the hard way.

Your assertions as to what God does and does not want are unsupported and arrogant.
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Old 4th April 2017, 12:33 AM   #352
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Originally Posted by Pixel42 View Post
Personal experience is unreliable, yes. That is something humanity learned the hard way.
Yet all objective evidence is viewed subjectively with human eyes and interpreted with fallible, biased human minds.

Quote:
Your assertions as to what God does and does not want are unsupported and arrogant.
I do apologize if I come off as arrogant; it's a character flaw. Bear with me.

bb
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Old 4th April 2017, 12:55 AM   #353
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Originally Posted by Billy Baxter View Post
Yet all objective evidence is viewed subjectively with human eyes and interpreted with fallible, biased human minds.
The scientific method is specifically designed to allow for, and eliminate the effect of, our fallible perceptions and cognitive biases. That is precisely what makes the evidence it produces objective, not subjective.
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Old 4th April 2017, 01:11 AM   #354
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Originally Posted by Pixel42 View Post
The scientific method is specifically designed to allow for, and eliminate the effect of, our fallible perceptions and cognitive biases. That is precisely what makes the evidence it produces objective, not subjective.
how do you know that we aren't just imaginary beings in the dreams of the IPU? can you prove you even exist to me?

tongue-in-cheek

bb
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Old 4th April 2017, 01:26 AM   #355
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Originally Posted by Billy Baxter View Post
how do you know that we aren't just imaginary beings in the dreams of the IPU? can you prove you even exist to me?

tongue-in-cheek

bb
Perhaps you should take your tongue out of your cheek and do a little studying and thinking about subjects other than the superstitions of the LDS church, most of which were made up by a fantasist.
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Old 4th April 2017, 02:03 AM   #356
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Originally Posted by Pixel42 View Post
Perhaps you should take your tongue out of your cheek and do a little studying and thinking about subjects other than the superstitions of the LDS church, most of which were made up by a fantasist.
nice dodge

prove you exist or i shall taunt you a second time.

bb
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Old 4th April 2017, 04:05 AM   #357
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Originally Posted by Billy Baxter View Post
nice dodge

prove you exist or i shall taunt you a second time.

bb
Who will you be taunting should she not exist?
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Old 4th April 2017, 05:01 AM   #358
JesseCuster
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Join Date: May 2016
Posts: 643
Originally Posted by Billy Baxter View Post
Here is a list of maladies I believe TOBS can cure or bring relief from:

Acne
Joint pain (hips, knees, elbows, wrists, fingers, etc.)
Arthritis
The common cold (coughing, throat clearing, runny nose, sneezing, etc.)
Sinus pain
Headache, fever
Burning sensation when urinating
Shortness of breath
Trouble swallowing
Chest pain/heart problems
Body moles
Mouth canker sores
Phantom limb pain
Stitches in sides of ribs
Fibromyalgia
Cramps/charly-horses
Excessive vomiting
Indigestion/diarrhea/constipation
Irritable bowel syndrome
Restless leg syndrome
Body itches/exzema
Insect/spider bites
Excessive body odor even right after a thorough soapy shower
Genital itch/excessive gas pains/farting/hemorrhoids
Irritable eyes
Excessive earwax/ringing and rushing in ears/tinnitis
Pain in back of neck
You have suffered from, and successfully treated with TOBS, every single malady and symptom on this list?

Last edited by JesseCuster; 4th April 2017 at 05:04 AM.
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Old 4th April 2017, 05:10 AM   #359
Billy Baxter
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Originally Posted by JesseCuster View Post
You have suffered from, and successfully treated with TOBS, every single malady and symptom on this list?
Obviously excluding phantom limb pain; also, not arthritis and only limited sinus pain.

bb
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Old 4th April 2017, 05:18 AM   #360
JesseCuster
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Join Date: May 2016
Posts: 643
So along with all the maladies and symptoms you have treated suffered from personally and treated with TOBS, why did you add phantom limb pain to the list? Why that particular affliction and not others?
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