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Tags police issues , police misconduct charges

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Old 4th October 2019, 11:48 AM   #1281
chrispy
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Originally Posted by erlando View Post
Police in Glendale AZ are a bit triggerhappy when it comes to tasers..

Bike thief with hands up tased 5 seconds after police arrival:
https://www.abc15.com/news/local-new...force-incident

Man tased 11 times and kicked in the testicles while prone on the ground:
https://www.kshb.com/news/national/a...ers-in-arizona

Also this (fair warning; graphic video is NFSW):
YouTube Video This video is not hosted by the ISF. The ISF can not be held responsible for the suitability or legality of this material. By clicking the link below you agree to view content from an external website.
I AGREE


Police officer while tasing continuously: "GET OUT OF THE CAR"...



ETA: The officer in the video resigned: https://eu.azcentral.com/story/news/...ll/2216855001/
That story out of Arizona is DISTURBING. I urge all of you to read the article, as they discuss the actions of the police officers with former law enforcement brass. Be warned, please, that the details are rather brutal. Yikes, that officer need to be fired and become a convicted felon. No excuses for that behavior.
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Old 4th October 2019, 01:09 PM   #1282
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Originally Posted by Cainkane1 View Post
The behavior of the overwhelming majority of the police in the US is exemplary. Many officers go their entire careers not having to use their service weapon. They help people in many ways above and beyond their assigned duties.

There are bad police officers but most of them are great people.

Do you think that the number of policemen reporting fellow officers for felonies matches the numbers of policemen videoed and otherwise verified as having broken the law?

If not, why not?
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Old 4th October 2019, 01:29 PM   #1283
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Originally Posted by 3point14 View Post
Do you think that the number of policemen reporting fellow officers for felonies matches the numbers of policemen videoed and otherwise verified as having broken the law?

If not, why not?
Probably not but isn't this true of other professions? My father was a police officer on the Alameda PD and he and his fellow policemen did a very good job of protecting the public.
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Old 4th October 2019, 01:43 PM   #1284
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Originally Posted by Cainkane1 View Post
The behavior of the overwhelming majority of the police in the US is exemplary. Many officers go their entire careers not having to use their service weapon. They help people in many ways above and beyond their assigned duties.

There are bad police officers but most of them are great people.
This is (mostly) true. However, in many if not most of the videos we see (and I think all of the ones erlando just posted) there are other officers present. The fact that these other officers did not turn in their coworkers is a serious argument against the idea that most officers are "exemplary." I think it would be more accurate to say that the majority of officers are not themselves abusive, but that they are reluctant to report or intervene when they witness abusive behavior by their fellow officers.

To a certain degree I understand. No one wants to have a reputation as a snitch. It breeds distrust where officers may need to rely on each other. But you would think they would at a minimum step in and take over to stop things from going further when their partner loses their cool. It's like the police are afraid of each other.
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Old 4th October 2019, 02:42 PM   #1285
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Originally Posted by TomB View Post
This is (mostly) true. However, in many if not most of the videos we see (and I think all of the ones erlando just posted) there are other officers present. The fact that these other officers did not turn in their coworkers is a serious argument against the idea that most officers are "exemplary." I think it would be more accurate to say that the majority of officers are not themselves abusive, but that they are reluctant to report or intervene when they witness abusive behavior by their fellow officers.

To a certain degree I understand. No one wants to have a reputation as a snitch. It breeds distrust where officers may need to rely on each other. But you would think they would at a minimum step in and take over to stop things from going further when their partner loses their cool. It's like the police are afraid of each other.
People always say, "It is a few bad apples", but they forget that the saying is, "a bad apple spoils the whole bunch". Words to remember.
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Old 4th October 2019, 02:47 PM   #1286
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Originally Posted by TomB View Post
This is (mostly) true. However, in many if not most of the videos we see (and I think all of the ones erlando just posted) there are other officers present. The fact that these other officers did not turn in their coworkers is a serious argument against the idea that most officers are "exemplary." I think it would be more accurate to say that the majority of officers are not themselves abusive, but that they are reluctant to report or intervene when they witness abusive behavior by their fellow officers.

To a certain degree I understand. No one wants to have a reputation as a snitch. It breeds distrust where officers may need to rely on each other. But you would think they would at a minimum step in and take over to stop things from going further when their partner loses their cool. It's like the police are afraid of each other.
Originally Posted by chrispy View Post
People always say, "It is a few bad apples", but they forget that the saying is, "a bad apple spoils the whole bunch". Words to remember.
Yes

It is a toxic attitude - and in all too many US police forces, especially the small ones, it could be an entire department that's compromised. If it's only ten people, with no other oversight, that's not too difficult.
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Old 4th October 2019, 02:48 PM   #1287
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Originally Posted by erlando View Post
Police in Glendale AZ are a bit triggerhappy when it comes to tasers..

Bike thief with hands up tased 5 seconds after police arrival:
https://www.abc15.com/news/local-new...force-incident

Man tased 11 times and kicked in the testicles while prone on the ground:
https://www.kshb.com/news/national/a...ers-in-arizona

Also this (fair warning; graphic video is NFSW):
YouTube Video This video is not hosted by the ISF. The ISF can not be held responsible for the suitability or legality of this material. By clicking the link below you agree to view content from an external website.
I AGREE


Police officer while tasing continuously: "GET OUT OF THE CAR"...



ETA: The officer in the video resigned: https://eu.azcentral.com/story/news/...ll/2216855001/
I'm damn glad that last maniac isn't a cop any more, but he needs to be in prison or maybe a mental institution. I had to stop watching that video about halfway through.

ETA: He had the whole, "I was scared and I thought he was going for a gun" routine down, too.

Last edited by CORed; 4th October 2019 at 02:56 PM.
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Old 4th October 2019, 02:54 PM   #1288
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Originally Posted by erlando View Post
Police in Glendale AZ are a bit triggerhappy when it comes to tasers..

Bike thief with hands up tased 5 seconds after police arrival:
https://www.abc15.com/news/local-new...force-incident

Man tased 11 times and kicked in the testicles while prone on the ground:
https://www.kshb.com/news/national/a...ers-in-arizona

Also this (fair warning; graphic video is NFSW):
YouTube Video This video is not hosted by the ISF. The ISF can not be held responsible for the suitability or legality of this material. By clicking the link below you agree to view content from an external website.
I AGREE


Police officer while tasing continuously: "GET OUT OF THE CAR"...



ETA: The officer in the video resigned: https://eu.azcentral.com/story/news/...ll/2216855001/
The one with the bike thief, though there was no reason to taze the guy, I've got to give the cops credit for being efficient. One shot with the tazer, get the cuffs on quickly and get him in the car. OTOH, they probably could have done it just as efficiently without the tazer. The bike thief looked like he had no intention of giving them any trouble at all.

Last edited by CORed; 4th October 2019 at 02:57 PM.
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Old 4th October 2019, 06:03 PM   #1289
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Originally Posted by Cainkane1 View Post
Probably not but isn't this true of other professions?
So? They aren't policemen.
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Old 4th October 2019, 06:13 PM   #1290
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Originally Posted by chrispy View Post
People always say, "It is a few bad apples", but they forget that the saying is, "a bad apple spoils the whole bunch". Words to remember.
Yep.

When it comes to police, it's always, "A few bad apples is no big deal" instead
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Old 4th October 2019, 06:16 PM   #1291
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Originally Posted by 3point14 View Post
So? They aren't policemen.
But it's not even true. In my profession, I am really happy to get rid of the "bad apples." We work very hard to identify the bad apples and get rid of them.

Now, I can't promise that all of my co-workers feel the same way, but in that case, we call that out, too. And I am happy to say, "Stop enabling the bad actors"

If we have co-workers who are harming the citizenry, you darn right we stand up against it.
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Old 4th October 2019, 06:35 PM   #1292
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Originally Posted by chrispy View Post
People always say, "It is a few bad apples", but they forget that the saying is, "a bad apple spoils the whole bunch". Words to remember.
Of course, the actual problem is that the basket they're putting the apples in is rotten and moldy.
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Old 4th October 2019, 07:14 PM   #1293
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Originally Posted by chrispy View Post
People always say, "It is a few bad apples", but they forget that the saying is, "a bad apple spoils the whole bunch". Words to remember.
Actually, a single bad apple spoils the barrel.

A moldy apple will leave spores in the barrel, so every apple stored in it will eventually become infected with the mold. An overripe apple emits ethylene gas, causing every apple -and even other fruit- in the vicinity to become overripe faster.

One cop takes a bribe or plants drugs or lies about events, and all the other cops just ignore it, allowing the problem to contaminate the whole force.

It's an apt description for any situation where one person does something wrong, but everyone else turns a blind eye.
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Old 4th October 2019, 07:39 PM   #1294
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Originally Posted by chrispy View Post
That story out of Arizona is DISTURBING. I urge all of you to read the article, as they discuss the actions of the police officers with former law enforcement brass. Be warned, please, that the details are rather brutal. Yikes, that officer need to be fired and become a convicted felon. No excuses for that behavior.
Why didn't he put his hands behind his back? What was he stopped for? Being drunk?
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Old 5th October 2019, 01:30 AM   #1295
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It's hard to voluntarily do much when a more or less continuously-activated stun gun is driven into one's back and held there. Electric shock causes muscles to contract. Which, tragically, officers almost universally perceive as "resistance" that justifies continued activation of the taser.

The man was not stopped for anything; he was parked. The police were notified because a passerby noticed him sitting in the car and reported that he looked as if he might have been "in distress". That officer was essentially called to check on his welfare. The officer is a psychotic freak who should not have been allowed the dignity of a consequences-free resignation.
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Old 5th October 2019, 01:35 AM   #1296
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Originally Posted by Cainkane1 View Post
Why didn't he put his hands behind his back? What was he stopped for? Being drunk?
Why don't you watch the video then read the linked report, take in the full story, then get back to us about how the guy experienced "exemplary" policing.
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Old 5th October 2019, 06:46 AM   #1297
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Originally Posted by Checkmite View Post
The man was not stopped for anything; he was parked. The police were notified because a passerby noticed him sitting in the car and reported that he looked as if he might have been "in distress". That officer was essentially called to check on his welfare. The officer is a psychotic freak who should not have been allowed the dignity of a consequences-free resignation.
Again.

If you see someone who may be in mental distress in the US, or if you have a friend or relative who you know to be in mental distress, do *not* call the police. Instead, call the local fire department or hospital directly - not through any emergency line. Fully half of people known to have been killed by police had a mental illness, making this far more predictive than any racial category.

Last edited by Mumbles; 5th October 2019 at 06:47 AM.
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Old 5th October 2019, 07:21 AM   #1298
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Originally Posted by Cainkane1 View Post
Why didn't he put his hands behind his back? What was he stopped for? Being drunk?
If you'd watch the video, you would know that the guy kept saying he couldn't put his hands behind his back. The officer dismissed this claim and did not ask for an explanation, so we don't know why he couldn't, just that he informed the cop that he couldn't. My suspicion is that it's because his shoulder was shoved under the side of the car to the point where he couldn't move, but that's speculation. That whole issue is on the cop for not listening. Something that seems to be common in these videos is police not listening to the people they are interacting with.

Look, I understand you are defensive of police officers because of your father. My father was a teacher and I tend to be the same way about teachers. Partly, I like to think, it's because I understand their perspective. But there's a large part of it that's because my father was a teacher and criticizing teachers feels like attacking my father.

The officer in question is not your father. Admitting that he was acting as a criminal does not reflect on your father.

Even if the guy (who was clearly mentally impaired for an unknown reason) wasn't cooperating there was no justification for beating him, cussing at him, etc. Losing your temper on the job is just as unprofessional for police officers as it is for teachers, secretaries or waitresses. Verbal assault should be met with discipline up to termination (like anyone else) and physical assault should result in immediate arrest by by-standing officers (just like anyone else). If the police union has a problem with it, they can go to hell.

Now, I'm actually pretty pro-police. My Boy Scout troop leader was a police officer. I always thought highly of him. But I'm not sure if he was a good cop. He had a reputation for being a hard ass. Everyone in town knew him because he sat in his car smoking his cigar. The word was you didn't want to be pulled over by him. But he was a good scoutmaster. His son also became a cop. Grew up to be one of several officers caught urinating on the lawn of a challenger in the sheriff's race the night of the election. Cops do stupid crap just like everyone else and should face the consequences. They aren't special and they need to understand that.
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Old 5th October 2019, 07:35 AM   #1299
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Originally Posted by Cainkane1 View Post
Why didn't he put his hands behind his back? What was he stopped for? Being drunk?
Would being drunk justify an officer pistol whipping a suspect multiple times to the point of bleeding? Would it justify continously tasing a person while screaming "GET OUT OF THE CAR" when it's next to impossible to move while being tased?

If not, why are you even asking the question?
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Old 5th October 2019, 07:38 AM   #1300
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Also, asking a person to "Stop resisting" while simultaneously tasing them is either being ******* stupid or being ******* malicious.
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Old 5th October 2019, 09:46 AM   #1301
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Originally Posted by Cainkane1 View Post
Why didn't he put his hands behind his back? What was he stopped for? Being drunk?
Are we talking about this guy?

Quote:
He'd already been tased 10 times, with one officer kneeling on his back as another, Officer Matt Schneider, kicked him in the groin and pulled down his athletic shorts to tase him a final time in his testicles, according to a federal lawsuit and body camera footage obtained by Scripps sister station KNXV-TV.
If the above is true, what difference does it make what he was stopped for?

Dave
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Old 7th October 2019, 05:21 AM   #1302
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Originally Posted by Cainkane1 View Post
Probably not but isn't this true of other professions? My father was a police officer on the Alameda PD and he and his fellow policemen did a very good job of protecting the public.
Maybe but of course they also might well have gotten their jollies putting the boot in now and then. How would you know?

The cops simply accept this violent behavior, as is shown by how it is always the video coming out that causes an issue and they keep their jobs not all the other officers on these scenes caring what happened.
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Old 7th October 2019, 05:22 AM   #1303
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Originally Posted by CORed View Post
I'm damn glad that last maniac isn't a cop any more, but he needs to be in prison or maybe a mental institution. I had to stop watching that video about halfway through.

ETA: He had the whole, "I was scared and I thought he was going for a gun" routine down, too.
Don't worry he will get his job back. They always do. Police unions are not going to let a bit of violence get between these officers and a paycheck.
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Old 12th October 2019, 05:52 PM   #1304
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A Fort Worth Police Officer shot and killed a woman called Atatiana Jefferson in her own home yesterday. The police were called on a non-emergency number because a neighbour saw an open door at a property, police arrived, saw someone through a window and shot her dead immediately.

The police video of the shooting is here:

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Just a few days after Amber Guyger's conviction - I wonder if this cop will also be charged with murder?
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Old 12th October 2019, 06:56 PM   #1305
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Originally Posted by Matthew Best View Post
A Fort Worth Police Officer shot and killed a woman called Atatiana Jefferson in her own home yesterday. The police were called on a non-emergency number because a neighbour saw an open door at a property, police arrived, saw someone through a window and shot her dead immediately.

The police video of the shooting is here:

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Just a few days after Amber Guyger's conviction - I wonder if this cop will also be charged with murder?


The distortion of the facts starts quickly.

I read a number of different media accounts of the events. At least two of them including this one described the events as follows;

Quote:
At the 1:34 mark in the video, the officer in the yard spins toward one of the home’s windows and yells, “Put your hands up! Show me your hands!” before shooting into the window, all in less than 3 seconds.
The highlighted is the problem. It suggests there was some sort of announcement.

There wasn't. The audio is clear. The shot was fired roughly the same time that the word "Show" was uttered.

'Put your hands upBang!'

There was no other warning. No announcement that they were police. No nothin'.

Basically they just drove up, walked around the house, and shot her through the upstairs window.

I'll be real interested to hear how this one gets cop'splained.
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Old 12th October 2019, 07:03 PM   #1306
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Originally Posted by quadraginta View Post
I'll be real interested to hear how this one gets cop'splained.
I'm sure in some alternate universe the woman did something that made the cop fear for his life.
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Old 12th October 2019, 07:11 PM   #1307
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Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
I'm sure in some alternate universe the woman did something that made the cop fear for his life.

The problem with the USA is it is awash with guns. Cops get killed for issuing a traffic ticket. The situation is inherently unstable and these killings will keep occuring and cops will keep getting shot for trivial reasons.
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Old 12th October 2019, 07:21 PM   #1308
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Originally Posted by a_unique_person View Post
The problem with the USA is it is awash with guns. Cops get killed for issuing a traffic ticket. The situation is inherently unstable and these killings will keep occuring and cops will keep getting shot for trivial reasons.

Yeah ... no.

The problem is letting people become cops who are so in fear for their own safety that they feel that shooting an unarmed woman through her own window in her own house without any provocation whatsoever is a reasonable action.

Those people need to find another line of work.

Preferably before they kill innocents because they "feared for their lives".
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Old 12th October 2019, 07:23 PM   #1309
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Originally Posted by a_unique_person View Post
The problem with the USA is it is awash with guns. Cops get killed for issuing a traffic ticket. The situation is inherently unstable and these killings will keep occuring and cops will keep getting shot for trivial reasons.
Hogwash. Afghanistan and Iraq were awash with guns. Soldiers there were still expected to follow basic deescalation and spectrum of force rules and are punished when they don't.

I've said this a hundred times. If you can take a 18 year old GED graduate from Dishrag, WV, send him to bootcamp for 8 weeks, SRF-A/B for 6 weeks, and in the end have a person that is capable of being dropped into open conflict; not patrol of a civilian populace you are ostensibly supposed to be protected but open conflict with a declared enemy and still get basic "Okay I shoot when this happens, not when this happens, when this happens in this circumstance, but not when it happens in this circumstance, and never only when I feel like it" thought processes out them, it's not too high of a standard to put on the police.
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Old 12th October 2019, 07:32 PM   #1310
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Again, we know the actual solutions to this - punishment for guys like this who just shoot immediately or otherwise become violent at the drop of a hat, don't send them in with military equipment, keep track of complaints so we can tell which cops are clean, and which ones rack up one misuse of force complaint after the next, use other means to "check up on" the elderly, people with mental health issues, increase federal oversight (this requires getting Dolt 45, and similar overt white supremacists, out of office. Do it, and get your family to as well. This means you, white readers - you can get killed or beaten by these goons, too.)

In the meantime, I really don't know what to say except "don't call police unless it's truly a violent situation."
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Old 12th October 2019, 08:04 PM   #1311
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Originally Posted by Mumbles View Post
In the meantime, I really don't know what to say except "don't call police unless it's truly a violent situation."

'kin A! Please do not ever call the cops for a welfare check on me.
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Old 12th October 2019, 09:55 PM   #1312
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Quote:
"Firearms-related fatalities were the leading cause of officer deaths, with 52 officers shot and killed in 2018," the NLEOMF says. That's a rise from 2017, when guns were involved in 46 officer deaths.
https://www.npr.org/2018/12/27/68041...018-report-say


I'm not defending this shooting, just saying that the number of guns and shootings in the USA is just going to produce events like this.
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Old 12th October 2019, 11:55 PM   #1313
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Originally Posted by a_unique_person View Post
https://www.npr.org/2018/12/27/68041...018-report-say


I'm not defending this shooting, just saying that the number of guns and shootings in the USA is just going to produce events like this.
You’re not wrong, but there does seem to be small imbalance.
52 police shot and 992 shot by police in 2018.
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Old 13th October 2019, 03:30 AM   #1314
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Originally Posted by a_unique_person View Post
https://www.npr.org/2018/12/27/68041...018-report-say


I'm not defending this shooting, just saying that the number of guns and shootings in the USA is just going to produce events like this.
Sorry but no. This is another in long line of events discussed in this thread where police officers failed to even try to assess the situation and wildly overreacted. There was zero threat to the officers and they didn't even allow the woman time to respond to their challenge before shooting. Time and again police officers who are either on the brink of panic or pumped up on Adrenaline go for their guns in circumstances where there is no reason to do so.
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Old 13th October 2019, 05:20 AM   #1315
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Originally Posted by Garrison View Post
Sorry but no. This is another in long line of events discussed in this thread where police officers failed to even try to assess the situation and wildly overreacted. There was zero threat to the officers and they didn't even allow the woman time to respond to their challenge before shooting. Time and again police officers who are either on the brink of panic or pumped up on Adrenaline go for their guns in circumstances where there is no reason to do so.
In this particular case, I'm going to guess that the car that is very clearly seen on the body cam (dunno if it's shown in any video on the linked article, I saw this story earlier in the day on "black Twitter") is registered to someone who lives at that address, so it'd take a minute tops to confirm that there's a good chance that at least one resident was at home.

I like how they're showing grainy still shots of a gun. Um, I've seen videos of white dudes with, like 4-5 guns on them in public, goofballs walking around in groups all with assault rifles, at the local Wal-Mart like it's nothing. Even if it's an illegal gun and she pointed it at the window, the cop are still the one who shouted "Show me your hands!" and fired *before he could say that twice*. Just like many of these situations (Tamir Rice, John Craw...you know what? I've done this list enough times.), the cop created the dangerous situation that he then used to justify killing someone.
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Old 13th October 2019, 05:45 AM   #1316
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Originally Posted by quadraginta View Post
The distortion of the facts starts quickly.


The highlighted is the problem. It suggests there was some sort of announcement.

There wasn't. The audio is clear. The shot was fired roughly the same time that the word "Show" was uttered.

'Put your hands upBang!'
He actually says "Put your hands up! Show me your hands! [BANG] Show me your hands!" The shot is fired at the same time of the second "Show".

Other than that you are right. They did not announce that they were police. They shot her inside 3 seconds of discovering her in the window.

It seems that the video tries to make the usual "Cop was in fear of life" argument by showing something that is supposed to look like a gun. This will at most be a slap on the wrist of the murderer brave officer.
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Old 13th October 2019, 08:37 AM   #1317
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I work in a convenience store. I have faced all the people the police do, and I have shot exactly zero of them.

And my job is more dangerous than being a police officer.

And I never swore to “protect and serve” any of these idiots.
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Old 13th October 2019, 08:42 AM   #1318
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BBC report on the shooting

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-50032290
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Old 13th October 2019, 09:40 AM   #1319
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Originally Posted by Mumbles View Post
In this particular case, I'm going to guess that the car that is very clearly seen on the body cam (dunno if it's shown in any video on the linked article, I saw this story earlier in the day on "black Twitter") is registered to someone who lives at that address, so it'd take a minute tops to confirm that there's a good chance that at least one resident was at home.

I like how they're showing grainy still shots of a gun. Um, I've seen videos of white dudes with, like 4-5 guns on them in public, goofballs walking around in groups all with assault rifles, at the local Wal-Mart like it's nothing. Even if it's an illegal gun and she pointed it at the window, the cop are still the one who shouted "Show me your hands!" and fired *before he could say that twice*. Just like many of these situations (Tamir Rice, John Craw...you know what? I've done this list enough times.), the cop created the dangerous situation that he then used to justify killing someone.
He was also outside the ******* house. He had every opportunity to back off (into cover if he felt that necessary) and take time to evaluate the situation.

Let's call these murderers what they are: Cowards. The slightest inkling that they might be in danger at some point in the near future is enough to make them take another's life.
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Old 13th October 2019, 11:38 AM   #1320
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I was going to say that police in the U.S. are trained like they're going to war, but that's not true. U.S. soldiers are not trained to act like this. If this had been a soldier outside her home, she would be alive right now. A soldier would have evaluated the situation correctly and, at worst, she would have been taken into custody without gunfire and then soon released.

Many U.S. police departments hire gun-happy yahoos, and they train them to be even more gun-happy. I'm absolutely certain this wasn't true when I was young. I never felt any fear when I saw police then. I do now. I'm not always sure they're not the enemy.
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