Three women accuse Neil deGrasse Tyson of sexual misconduct

applecorped · 2nd December 2018, 07:39 AM

https://www-m.cnn.com/2018/12/02/us/...os-allegations

(CNN) — Astrophysicist and author Neil deGrasse Tyson has denied allegations of sexual misconduct made against him by three women.
Last month, three women told Patheos, a religion and spirituality website, that Tyson harassed them and made inappropriate sexual advances as early as 1984 and in recent years.
"Accusations can damage a reputation and a marriage. Sometimes irreversibly. I see myself as loving husband and as a public servant -- a scientist and educator who serves at the will of the public. I am grateful for the support I've received from those who continue to respect and value me and my work," he wrote in a lengthy Facebook post titled "On Being Accused."

Thermal · 2nd December 2018, 07:48 AM

...1984...

How old was NDT then?

Story not opening on my browser, but the Pluto tattoo seems pretty innocent considering his position on the TNO/dwarf.

angrysoba · 2nd December 2018, 08:47 AM

Originally Posted by Thermal

...1984...

How old was NDT then?

Story not opening on my browser, but the Pluto tattoo seems pretty innocent considering his position on the TNO/dwarf.

I bet he regrets downgrading Pluto now!

ETA: then again searching for Haumea, Maki Maki and others could have got him into even more trouble.

dann · 2nd December 2018, 09:08 AM

Originally Posted by Thermal

...1984...

How old was NDT then?

25-26.

The latest allegations have been discussed in the thread Sexual misconduct allegations against Radford, Shermer, et al. Part 2 since Friday, Nov. 30, 2018).
Also the thread Neil DeGrasse Tyson accused of rape from last year.

Bob001 · 2nd December 2018, 09:45 AM

A longer account:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/scien...?noredirect=on

And Tyson's detailed response:
https://www.facebook.com/notes/neil-...6870826326613/

Thermal · 2nd December 2018, 10:02 AM

Originally Posted by dann

25-26.

The latest allegations have been discussed in the thread Sexual misconduct allegations against Radford, Shermer, et al. Part 2 since Friday, Nov. 30, 2018).
Also the thread Neil DeGrasse Tyson accused of rape from last year.

Over thirty years ago..

I hope this doesn't come off as rape apologetics, but I was thinking about how much I can remember clearly from 1984-ish. The answer is not a damn thing. I mean, that's why we have statutes of limitations, right? A guy in their twenties is also doing a lot more than a more mature gentleman who may in fact recall distant events more accurately.

Should people making extremely distant claims be subjected to some sort of externally verifiable memory tests? Fumbling a little here

baron · 2nd December 2018, 10:09 AM

"I'm covered in tattoos, look at me!"

"How dare you look at me! Rape!"

Brainster · 2nd December 2018, 11:50 AM

Originally Posted by Thermal

Over thirty years ago..

I hope this doesn't come off as rape apologetics, but I was thinking about how much I can remember clearly from 1984-ish. The answer is not a damn thing. I mean, that's why we have statutes of limitations, right? A guy in their twenties is also doing a lot more than a more mature gentleman who may in fact recall distant events more accurately.

Should people making extremely distant claims be subjected to some sort of externally verifiable memory tests? Fumbling a little here

The statute of limitations for sexual assault and rape varies by state.

Quote:

Thirty-four states impose limits on when a rape case can be brought forward, ranging from 3 to 30 years after the assault. These statutes of limitations were created to ensure that evidence presented in trial has not deteriorated over time. But some crimes — like murder or sexual abuse of a child — have been deemed too heinous to warrant any limitation. Several states have now extended that same protection to rape and sexual assault, as well.

Doing a little quick work with my fingers reveals that at least 16 states have no statute of limitations on bringing these cases (and the trend is towards removing the statute of limitations).

baron · 2nd December 2018, 03:09 PM

Originally Posted by Brainster

Doing a little quick work with my fingers...

That's what got old Tyson into trouble. Allegedly.

Bob001 · 2nd December 2018, 03:12 PM

Originally Posted by Thermal

....
Should people making extremely distant claims be subjected to some sort of externally verifiable memory tests? Fumbling a little here

I think we can agree that most people would have a strong memory of a traumatic event, and what is traumatic for the victim might not even be significant to the party who caused it, whether it's a violent attack or a traffic accident or getting fired by a callous boss. For example, I believe Dr. Ford is telling the truth about her assault, and I also believe Judge Kavanaugh honestly doesn't remember any of it.

In the particular case of Tyson, he says he was involved in a brief consensual relationship with his accuser.

Quote:

For me, what was most significant, was that in this new life, long after dropping out of astrophysics graduate school, she was posting videos of colored tuning forks endowed with vibrational therapeutic energy that she channels from the orbiting planets. As a scientist, I found this odd. Meanwhile, according to her blog posts, the drug and rape allegation comes from an assumption of what happened to her during a night that she cannot remember. It is as though a false memory had been implanted, which, because it never actually happened, had to be remembered as an evening she doesn’t remember. Nor does she remember waking up the next morning and going to the office.

https://www.facebook.com/notes/neil-...6870826326613/

I suspect that if this is anywhere close to true, the chances of successful prosecution would be zero.

Klimax · 3rd December 2018, 12:39 AM

Originally Posted by Bob001

I think we can agree that most people would have a strong memory of a traumatic event, and what is traumatic for the victim might not even be significant to the party who caused it, whether it's a violent attack or a traffic accident or getting fired by a callous boss. For example, I believe Dr. Ford is telling the truth about her assault, and I also believe Judge Kavanaugh honestly doesn't remember any of it.

In the particular case of Tyson, he says he was involved in a brief consensual relationship with his accuser.

https://www.facebook.com/notes/neil-...6870826326613/

I suspect that if this is anywhere close to true, the chances of successful prosecution would be zero.

And just because one has strong memory of something, doesn't mean it is correct memory. (Corruption of information is too easy)

Shadowdweller · 3rd December 2018, 01:17 AM

I seem to recall a study on memory-inhibiting drugs concluding that memories are re-encoded (and potentially altered) every time we recollect them. Hrm...need to look that one up.

Thermal · 3rd December 2018, 05:57 AM

Originally Posted by Bob001

I think we can agree that most people would have a strong memory of a traumatic event, and what is traumatic for the victim might not even be significant to the party who caused it, whether it's a violent attack or a traffic accident or getting fired by a callous boss. For example, I believe Dr. Ford is telling the truth about her assault, and I also believe Judge Kavanaugh honestly doesn't remember any of it.

In the particular case of Tyson, he says he was involved in a brief consensual relationship with his accuser.

https://www.facebook.com/notes/neil-...6870826326613/

I suspect that if this is anywhere close to true, the chances of successful prosecution would be zero.

Yes it is well established that you retain a strong memory of a traumatic event, but is it an accurate one? People react to trauma in different ways, sometimes even suppressing the memory. And as you mentioned with Justice Kavanagh, the accused may not be able to provide a defense or alibi for a time he does not even recall. Other phenomena, such as implanted, mistaken, or false memory, could show a jury a convincing victim who, after all, believes their own story.

casebro · 3rd December 2018, 06:26 AM

Originally Posted by Brainster

The statute of limitations for sexual assault and rape varies by state.

Doing a little quick work with my fingers reveals that at least 16 states have no statute of limitations on bringing these cases (and the trend is towards removing the statute of limitations).

But was was it at that place and time? Changes would be ex-post-facto. eh?

casebro · 3rd December 2018, 06:29 AM

Quote:

For me, what was most significant, was that in this new life, long after dropping out of astrophysics graduate school, she was posting videos of colored tuning forks endowed with vibrational therapeutic energy that she channels from the orbiting planets.....

Never **** crazy.

plague311 · 3rd December 2018, 12:10 PM

We need to stay consistent in the way we treat the accused and the accuser. This woman, or women, have every right to be heard as every other accuser. If there is evidence then it should be acknowledged and studied.

As weird as it sounds, I don't "believe" anyone. I will remark that NDT isn't screaming loudly in the mic and blaming conspiracy theories. He's taking the accusations as they come and addressing them.

Either way, NDT shouldn't get off any lighter than anyone else. Just like with Wohl, if this story is ********, they'll figure it out and bring it to light.

dann · 3rd December 2018, 12:53 PM

Originally Posted by Thermal

Over thirty years ago..

I hope this doesn't come off as rape apologetics, but I was thinking about how much I can remember clearly from 1984-ish. The answer is not a damn thing. I mean, that's why we have statutes of limitations, right? A guy in their twenties is also doing a lot more than a more mature gentleman who may in fact recall distant events more accurately.

Should people making extremely distant claims be subjected to some sort of externally verifiable memory tests? Fumbling a little here

It's not so much a question of faulty memory, I think, and being a woo obviously makes her unreliable if we are talking about cosmology, but we're not. When she ”accused him of telling students they could pass Astronomy 101 if they gave him a blow job,” you would expect others to come forward to back up her claim. Nobody has, apparently.
My guess, based on her own account, is that she made it all up – but not necessarily with ill intent. When I was in college, a student had a mental breakdown and accused a teaching assistant of having impregnated her. This may be a similar story.

mgidm86 · 5th December 2018, 03:47 PM

Originally Posted by Thermal

Over thirty years ago..

I hope this doesn't come off as rape apologetics, but I was thinking about how much I can remember clearly from 1984-ish. The answer is not a damn thing. I mean, that's why we have statutes of limitations, right? A guy in their twenties is also doing a lot more than a more mature gentleman who may in fact recall distant events more accurately.

Should people making extremely distant claims be subjected to some sort of externally verifiable memory tests? Fumbling a little here

I don't know how other people should perceive them but I assume it's bullcrap until evidence is presented. I have been falsely accused of harassment before (and proved it was false), and I'm not even a rich and famous celebrity. It can happen to anyone and it may happen to someone else in this forum one day. I do not wish it on anyone.

In these days of "victimhood", fingerpointing and overly sensitive people in general, I am far from taking anyone at their word on this.

"#Metoo! I'm a victim too, I must be!" is about where I'm at with all this. Show evidence or shut the f up.

The medias reporting of anyone with a claim is, I think, detrimental to the overall #metoo thing and is where a lot of my attitude comes from, not my own personal experience. Troubling times.

kedo1981 · 5th December 2018, 04:46 PM

"Never **** crazy"
But they are always the best ****.

theprestige · 5th December 2018, 08:36 PM

Originally Posted by kedo1981

"Never **** crazy"
But they are always the best ****.

Not actually true. I've had more crazy partners than not, and they were all inferior to the love of a sane partner.

Actually, I take that back. I've had exactly two of each. But the sane ones win the bedroom bingo sweepstakes hands down.

Brainster · 6th December 2018, 12:16 AM

Make it four women:

Quote:

Now a fourth woman has told BuzzFeed News her experience of sexual harassment from Tyson. In January 2010, she recalled, she joined her then-boyfriend at a holiday party for employees of the American Museum of Natural History. Tyson, its most famous employee, drunkenly approached her, she said, making sexual jokes and propositioning her to join him alone in his office. In a 2014 email shared with BuzzFeed News, she described the incident to her own employer in order to shoot down a proposed collaboration with Tyson.

baron · 6th December 2018, 03:22 AM

Jesus wept, if I detailed every incidence in which a woman had made lewd suggestions to me it would take me until 2050 (and I'm uglier than a hog). It's called life, you idiot woman, so suck on that.

applecorped · 6th December 2018, 04:27 AM

Originally Posted by baron

..you idiot woman, so suck on that.

Stellar defense of Tyson there

casebro · 6th December 2018, 10:20 AM

Originally Posted by baron

Jesus wept, if I detailed every incidence in which a woman had made lewd suggestions to me it would take me until 2050 (and I'm uglier than a hog). It's called life, you idiot woman, so suck on that.

Yeah dat. Propositioned at a party? It's called "freedom of expression".

I guess some people think it is only reasonable to meet potential mates in Sunday school.

theprestige · 6th December 2018, 10:25 AM

Originally Posted by Brainster

Make it four women:

That seems like a solid reason to decline working with Tyson, but doesn't rise to the level of sexual misconduct, in my opinion.

Ziggurat · 6th December 2018, 11:51 AM

Originally Posted by baron

It's called life, you idiot woman, so suck on that.

Telling her to suck on it is what got Tyson in trouble.

casebro · 6th December 2018, 12:02 PM

Originally Posted by Ziggurat

Telling her to suck on it is what got Tyson in trouble.

And other women like the taste. How is a guy supposed to know unless he asks?

dann · 6th December 2018, 01:09 PM

Originally Posted by Brainster

Make it four women:

Now a fourth woman has told BuzzFeed News her experience of sexual harassment from Tyson. In January 2010, she recalled, she joined her then-boyfriend at a holiday party for employees of the American Museum of Natural History. Tyson, its most famous employee, drunkenly approached her, she said, making sexual jokes and propositioning her to join him alone in his office. In a 2014 email shared with BuzzFeed News, she described the incident to her own employer in order to shoot down a proposed collaboration with Tyson.

To be absolutely sure I understood it correctly, I looked up proposition, but I still don't see any real problem ... unless his jokes were really bad. He propositioned, she declined.

baron · 6th December 2018, 01:09 PM

Originally Posted by Ziggurat

Telling her to suck on it is what got Tyson in trouble.

I think he merely suggested it.

dann · 6th December 2018, 01:17 PM

It just occurred to me that we have this move in salsa rueda Cubana:

Quote:

Festival el principe bueno y malo:
“On the 4th count, perform an Enchufala Y Dame, and slap the follower you are with gently on their buttocks while moving to the next follower. Followers can try avoid being “tagged.””
El principe bueno + el principe malo triple: http://www.salsalust.com/move.php?id=11

Principe Malo (Ruedawiki)

YouTube Video This video is not hosted by the ISF. The ISF can not be held responsible for the suitability or legality of this material. By clicking the link below you agree to view content from an external website.

I AGREE

I've never heard any complaints about this, and I haven't been able to find any on the internet.

Brainster · 6th December 2018, 09:07 PM

Originally Posted by theprestige

That seems like a solid reason to decline working with Tyson, but doesn't rise to the level of sexual misconduct, in my opinion.

Well, these days the standard seems to be that any unwanted sexual attention is verboten, and if you ask "How am I to know it's unwanted until I try a few lines?" you're part of the problem.

2nd December 2018, 07:39 AM	#1
applecorped Rotten to the Core Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 18,533	Three women accuse Neil deGrasse Tyson of sexual misconduct https://www-m.cnn.com/2018/12/02/us/...os-allegations (CNN) — Astrophysicist and author Neil deGrasse Tyson has denied allegations of sexual misconduct made against him by three women. Last month, three women told Patheos, a religion and spirituality website, that Tyson harassed them and made inappropriate sexual advances as early as 1984 and in recent years. "Accusations can damage a reputation and a marriage. Sometimes irreversibly. I see myself as loving husband and as a public servant -- a scientist and educator who serves at the will of the public. I am grateful for the support I've received from those who continue to respect and value me and my work," he wrote in a lengthy Facebook post titled "On Being Accused."
	__________________ All You Need Is Love.

2nd December 2018, 07:48 AM	#2
Thermal Philosopher Join Date: Aug 2016 Location: NJ USA. We Don't Like You Either Posts: 5,606	...1984... How old was NDT then? Story not opening on my browser, but the Pluto tattoo seems pretty innocent considering his position on the TNO/dwarf.
	__________________ "Half of what he said meant something else, and the other half didn't mean anything at all" -Rozencrantz Last edited by Thermal; 2nd December 2018 at 07:53 AM.

2nd December 2018, 08:47 AM	#3
angrysoba Philosophile Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Osaka, Japan Posts: 24,013	Originally Posted by Thermal ...1984... How old was NDT then? Story not opening on my browser, but the Pluto tattoo seems pretty innocent considering his position on the TNO/dwarf. I bet he regrets downgrading Pluto now! ETA: then again searching for Haumea, Maki Maki and others could have got him into even more trouble.
	__________________ "The thief and the murderer follow nature just as much as the philanthropist. Cosmic evolution may teach us how the good and the evil tendencies of man may have come about; but, in itself, it is incompetent to furnish any better reason why what we call good is preferable to what we call evil than we had before." "Evolution and Ethics" T.H. Huxley (1893) Last edited by angrysoba; 2nd December 2018 at 08:50 AM.

2nd December 2018, 09:08 AM	#4
dann Philosopher Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 6,188	Originally Posted by Thermal ...1984... How old was NDT then? 25-26. The latest allegations have been discussed in the thread Sexual misconduct allegations against Radford, Shermer, et al. Part 2 since Friday, Nov. 30, 2018). Also the thread Neil DeGrasse Tyson accused of rape from last year.
dann Philosopher Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 6,188	__________________ /dann "Stupidity renders itself invisible by assuming very large proportions. Completely unreasonable claims are irrefutable. Ni-en-leh pointed out that a philosopher might get into trouble by claiming that two times two makes five, but he does not risk much by claiming that two times two makes shoe polish." B. Brecht "The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx Last edited by dann; 2nd December 2018 at 09:15 AM.

2nd December 2018, 09:45 AM	#5
Bob001 Philosopher Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 8,086	A longer account: https://www.washingtonpost.com/scien...?noredirect=on And Tyson's detailed response: https://www.facebook.com/notes/neil-...6870826326613/
Bob001 Philosopher Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 8,086

2nd December 2018, 10:02 AM	#6
Thermal Philosopher Join Date: Aug 2016 Location: NJ USA. We Don't Like You Either Posts: 5,606	Originally Posted by dann 25-26. The latest allegations have been discussed in the thread Sexual misconduct allegations against Radford, Shermer, et al. Part 2 since Friday, Nov. 30, 2018). Also the thread Neil DeGrasse Tyson accused of rape from last year. Over thirty years ago.. I hope this doesn't come off as rape apologetics, but I was thinking about how much I can remember clearly from 1984-ish. The answer is not a damn thing. I mean, that's why we have statutes of limitations, right? A guy in their twenties is also doing a lot more than a more mature gentleman who may in fact recall distant events more accurately. Should people making extremely distant claims be subjected to some sort of externally verifiable memory tests? Fumbling a little here
	__________________ "Half of what he said meant something else, and the other half didn't mean anything at all" -Rozencrantz

2nd December 2018, 10:09 AM	#7
baron Philosopher Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 7,203	"I'm covered in tattoos, look at me!" "How dare you look at me! Rape!"
baron Philosopher Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 7,203	__________________ "I am a liar as well as a dwarf!"

2nd December 2018, 11:50 AM	#8
Brainster Penultimate Amazing Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 15,911	Originally Posted by Thermal Over thirty years ago.. I hope this doesn't come off as rape apologetics, but I was thinking about how much I can remember clearly from 1984-ish. The answer is not a damn thing. I mean, that's why we have statutes of limitations, right? A guy in their twenties is also doing a lot more than a more mature gentleman who may in fact recall distant events more accurately. Should people making extremely distant claims be subjected to some sort of externally verifiable memory tests? Fumbling a little here The statute of limitations for sexual assault and rape varies by state. Quote: Thirty-four states impose limits on when a rape case can be brought forward, ranging from 3 to 30 years after the assault. These statutes of limitations were created to ensure that evidence presented in trial has not deteriorated over time. But some crimes — like murder or sexual abuse of a child — have been deemed too heinous to warrant any limitation. Several states have now extended that same protection to rape and sexual assault, as well. Doing a little quick work with my fingers reveals that at least 16 states have no statute of limitations on bringing these cases (and the trend is towards removing the statute of limitations).
	__________________ My new blog: Recent Reads. 1960s Comic Book Nostalgia Visit the Screw Loose Change blog.

2nd December 2018, 03:09 PM	#9
baron Philosopher Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 7,203	Originally Posted by Brainster Doing a little quick work with my fingers... That's what got old Tyson into trouble. Allegedly.
baron Philosopher Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 7,203	__________________ "I am a liar as well as a dwarf!"

2nd December 2018, 03:12 PM	#10
Bob001 Philosopher Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 8,086	Originally Posted by Thermal .... Should people making extremely distant claims be subjected to some sort of externally verifiable memory tests? Fumbling a little here I think we can agree that most people would have a strong memory of a traumatic event, and what is traumatic for the victim might not even be significant to the party who caused it, whether it's a violent attack or a traffic accident or getting fired by a callous boss. For example, I believe Dr. Ford is telling the truth about her assault, and I also believe Judge Kavanaugh honestly doesn't remember any of it. In the particular case of Tyson, he says he was involved in a brief consensual relationship with his accuser. Quote: For me, what was most significant, was that in this new life, long after dropping out of astrophysics graduate school, she was posting videos of colored tuning forks endowed with vibrational therapeutic energy that she channels from the orbiting planets. As a scientist, I found this odd. Meanwhile, according to her blog posts, the drug and rape allegation comes from an assumption of what happened to her during a night that she cannot remember. It is as though a false memory had been implanted, which, because it never actually happened, had to be remembered as an evening she doesn’t remember. Nor does she remember waking up the next morning and going to the office. https://www.facebook.com/notes/neil-...6870826326613/ I suspect that if this is anywhere close to true, the chances of successful prosecution would be zero.
Bob001 Philosopher Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 8,086

3rd December 2018, 12:39 AM	#11
Klimax NWO Cyborg 5960x (subversion VPUNPCKHQDQ) Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Starship Wanderer - DS9 Posts: 12,560	Originally Posted by Bob001 I think we can agree that most people would have a strong memory of a traumatic event, and what is traumatic for the victim might not even be significant to the party who caused it, whether it's a violent attack or a traffic accident or getting fired by a callous boss. For example, I believe Dr. Ford is telling the truth about her assault, and I also believe Judge Kavanaugh honestly doesn't remember any of it. In the particular case of Tyson, he says he was involved in a brief consensual relationship with his accuser. https://www.facebook.com/notes/neil-...6870826326613/ I suspect that if this is anywhere close to true, the chances of successful prosecution would be zero. And just because one has strong memory of something, doesn't mean it is correct memory. (Corruption of information is too easy)
	__________________ ModBorg Engine: Ibalgin 400

3rd December 2018, 01:17 AM	#12
Shadowdweller Muse Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 696	I seem to recall a study on memory-inhibiting drugs concluding that memories are re-encoded (and potentially altered) every time we recollect them. Hrm...need to look that one up.
Shadowdweller Muse Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 696

3rd December 2018, 05:57 AM	#13
Thermal Philosopher Join Date: Aug 2016 Location: NJ USA. We Don't Like You Either Posts: 5,606	Originally Posted by Bob001 I think we can agree that most people would have a strong memory of a traumatic event, and what is traumatic for the victim might not even be significant to the party who caused it, whether it's a violent attack or a traffic accident or getting fired by a callous boss. For example, I believe Dr. Ford is telling the truth about her assault, and I also believe Judge Kavanaugh honestly doesn't remember any of it. In the particular case of Tyson, he says he was involved in a brief consensual relationship with his accuser. https://www.facebook.com/notes/neil-...6870826326613/ I suspect that if this is anywhere close to true, the chances of successful prosecution would be zero. Yes it is well established that you retain a strong memory of a traumatic event, but is it an accurate one? People react to trauma in different ways, sometimes even suppressing the memory. And as you mentioned with Justice Kavanagh, the accused may not be able to provide a defense or alibi for a time he does not even recall. Other phenomena, such as implanted, mistaken, or false memory, could show a jury a convincing victim who, after all, believes their own story.
	__________________ "Half of what he said meant something else, and the other half didn't mean anything at all" -Rozencrantz

3rd December 2018, 06:26 AM	#14
casebro Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 15,992	Originally Posted by Brainster The statute of limitations for sexual assault and rape varies by state. Doing a little quick work with my fingers reveals that at least 16 states have no statute of limitations on bringing these cases (and the trend is towards removing the statute of limitations). But was was it at that place and time? Changes would be ex-post-facto. eh?
	__________________ Great minds discuss ideas. Medium minds discuss events. Small minds spend all their time on U-Tube and Facebook.

3rd December 2018, 06:29 AM	#15
casebro Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 15,992	Quote: For me, what was most significant, was that in this new life, long after dropping out of astrophysics graduate school, she was posting videos of colored tuning forks endowed with vibrational therapeutic energy that she channels from the orbiting planets..... Never **** crazy.
	__________________ Great minds discuss ideas. Medium minds discuss events. Small minds spend all their time on U-Tube and Facebook.

3rd December 2018, 12:10 PM	#16
plague311 Great minds think... Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: North Dakota Posts: 4,663	We need to stay consistent in the way we treat the accused and the accuser. This woman, or women, have every right to be heard as every other accuser. If there is evidence then it should be acknowledged and studied. As weird as it sounds, I don't "believe" anyone. I will remark that NDT isn't screaming loudly in the mic and blaming conspiracy theories. He's taking the accusations as they come and addressing them. Either way, NDT shouldn't get off any lighter than anyone else. Just like with Wohl, if this story is ********, they'll figure it out and bring it to light.
	__________________ "All acts performed in the world begin in the imagination."--Barbara Grizzuti Harrison “There are times when the mind is dealt such a blow it hides itself in insanity. While this may not seem beneficial, it is. There are times when reality is nothing but pain, and to escape that pain the mind must leave reality behind.” - Patrick Rothfuss

3rd December 2018, 12:53 PM	#17
dann Philosopher Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 6,188	Originally Posted by Thermal Over thirty years ago.. I hope this doesn't come off as rape apologetics, but I was thinking about how much I can remember clearly from 1984-ish. The answer is not a damn thing. I mean, that's why we have statutes of limitations, right? A guy in their twenties is also doing a lot more than a more mature gentleman who may in fact recall distant events more accurately. Should people making extremely distant claims be subjected to some sort of externally verifiable memory tests? Fumbling a little here It's not so much a question of faulty memory, I think, and being a woo obviously makes her unreliable if we are talking about cosmology, but we're not. When she ”accused him of telling students they could pass Astronomy 101 if they gave him a blow job,” you would expect others to come forward to back up her claim. Nobody has, apparently. My guess, based on her own account, is that she made it all up – but not necessarily with ill intent. When I was in college, a student had a mental breakdown and accused a teaching assistant of having impregnated her. This may be a similar story.
dann Philosopher Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 6,188	__________________ /dann "Stupidity renders itself invisible by assuming very large proportions. Completely unreasonable claims are irrefutable. Ni-en-leh pointed out that a philosopher might get into trouble by claiming that two times two makes five, but he does not risk much by claiming that two times two makes shoe polish." B. Brecht "The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx

5th December 2018, 03:47 PM	#18
mgidm86 Illuminator Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 4,861	Originally Posted by Thermal Over thirty years ago.. I hope this doesn't come off as rape apologetics, but I was thinking about how much I can remember clearly from 1984-ish. The answer is not a damn thing. I mean, that's why we have statutes of limitations, right? A guy in their twenties is also doing a lot more than a more mature gentleman who may in fact recall distant events more accurately. Should people making extremely distant claims be subjected to some sort of externally verifiable memory tests? Fumbling a little here I don't know how other people should perceive them but I assume it's bullcrap until evidence is presented. I have been falsely accused of harassment before (and proved it was false), and I'm not even a rich and famous celebrity. It can happen to anyone and it may happen to someone else in this forum one day. I do not wish it on anyone. In these days of "victimhood", fingerpointing and overly sensitive people in general, I am far from taking anyone at their word on this. "#Metoo! I'm a victim too, I must be!" is about where I'm at with all this. Show evidence or shut the f up. The medias reporting of anyone with a claim is, I think, detrimental to the overall #metoo thing and is where a lot of my attitude comes from, not my own personal experience. Troubling times.
mgidm86 Illuminator Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 4,861	__________________ Franklin understands certain kickbacks you obtain unfairly are legal liabilities; however, a risky deed's almost never detrimental despite extra external pressures.

5th December 2018, 04:46 PM	#19
kedo1981 Master Poster Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 2,565	"Never ** crazy" But they are always the best **.
kedo1981 Master Poster Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 2,565

5th December 2018, 08:36 PM	#20
theprestige Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 30,460	Originally Posted by kedo1981 "Never ** crazy" But they are always the best **. Not actually true. I've had more crazy partners than not, and they were all inferior to the love of a sane partner. Actually, I take that back. I've had exactly two of each. But the sane ones win the bedroom bingo sweepstakes hands down.

6th December 2018, 12:16 AM	#21
Brainster Penultimate Amazing Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 15,911	Make it four women: Quote: Now a fourth woman has told BuzzFeed News her experience of sexual harassment from Tyson. In January 2010, she recalled, she joined her then-boyfriend at a holiday party for employees of the American Museum of Natural History. Tyson, its most famous employee, drunkenly approached her, she said, making sexual jokes and propositioning her to join him alone in his office. In a 2014 email shared with BuzzFeed News, she described the incident to her own employer in order to shoot down a proposed collaboration with Tyson.
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6th December 2018, 03:22 AM	#22
baron Philosopher Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 7,203	Jesus wept, if I detailed every incidence in which a woman had made lewd suggestions to me it would take me until 2050 (and I'm uglier than a hog). It's called life, you idiot woman, so suck on that.
baron Philosopher Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 7,203	__________________ "I am a liar as well as a dwarf!"

6th December 2018, 04:27 AM	#23
applecorped Rotten to the Core Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 18,533	Originally Posted by baron ..you idiot woman, so suck on that. Stellar defense of Tyson there
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6th December 2018, 10:20 AM	#24
casebro Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 15,992	Originally Posted by baron Jesus wept, if I detailed every incidence in which a woman had made lewd suggestions to me it would take me until 2050 (and I'm uglier than a hog). It's called life, you idiot woman, so suck on that. Yeah dat. Propositioned at a party? It's called "freedom of expression". I guess some people think it is only reasonable to meet potential mates in Sunday school.
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6th December 2018, 10:25 AM	#25
theprestige Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 30,460	Originally Posted by Brainster Make it four women: That seems like a solid reason to decline working with Tyson, but doesn't rise to the level of sexual misconduct, in my opinion.

6th December 2018, 11:51 AM	#26
Ziggurat Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 41,381	Originally Posted by baron It's called life, you idiot woman, so suck on that. Telling her to suck on it is what got Tyson in trouble.
	__________________ "As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law

6th December 2018, 12:02 PM	#27
casebro Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 15,992	Originally Posted by Ziggurat Telling her to suck on it is what got Tyson in trouble. And other women like the taste. How is a guy supposed to know unless he asks?
	__________________ Great minds discuss ideas. Medium minds discuss events. Small minds spend all their time on U-Tube and Facebook.

6th December 2018, 01:09 PM	#28
dann Philosopher Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 6,188	Originally Posted by Brainster Make it four women: Now a fourth woman has told BuzzFeed News her experience of sexual harassment from Tyson. In January 2010, she recalled, she joined her then-boyfriend at a holiday party for employees of the American Museum of Natural History. Tyson, its most famous employee, drunkenly approached her, she said, making sexual jokes and propositioning her to join him alone in his office. In a 2014 email shared with BuzzFeed News, she described the incident to her own employer in order to shoot down a proposed collaboration with Tyson. To be absolutely sure I understood it correctly, I looked up proposition, but I still don't see any real problem ... unless his jokes were really bad. He propositioned, she declined.
dann Philosopher Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 6,188	__________________ /dann "Stupidity renders itself invisible by assuming very large proportions. Completely unreasonable claims are irrefutable. Ni-en-leh pointed out that a philosopher might get into trouble by claiming that two times two makes five, but he does not risk much by claiming that two times two makes shoe polish." B. Brecht "The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx

6th December 2018, 09:07 PM	#31
Brainster Penultimate Amazing Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 15,911	Originally Posted by theprestige That seems like a solid reason to decline working with Tyson, but doesn't rise to the level of sexual misconduct, in my opinion. Well, these days the standard seems to be that any unwanted sexual attention is verboten, and if you ask "How am I to know it's unwanted until I try a few lines?" you're part of the problem.
	__________________ My new blog: Recent Reads. 1960s Comic Book Nostalgia Visit the Screw Loose Change blog.