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Tags Australia elections , Australia politics , Julie Bishop , Malcolm Turnbull , Tony Abbott

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Old 22nd September 2015, 09:12 AM   #81
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Originally Posted by lionking View Post
I was talking about independents. I've previously posted about stupid politicians of other parties.
The stupid politicians of the major parties are of little account if they are back benchers. They merely count as votes during a parliamentary division.

The stupid independent politicians can be more harmful when (as now) they hold the balance of power. Even so, it's still better than giving the Libs carte blanche to implement their agenda.
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Old 22nd September 2015, 07:47 PM   #82
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Originally Posted by psionl0 View Post
The stupid politicians of the major parties are of little account if they are back benchers. They merely count as votes during a parliamentary division.

The stupid independent politicians can be more harmful when (as now) they hold the balance of power. Even so, it's still better than giving the Libs carte blanche to implement their agenda.
This I agree with. That doesn't mean that it should be made harder for minor parties outside the big 4 to get in though. Far better it would be to have a more educated electorate who put some thought into who they were voting for and why.
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Old 23rd September 2015, 12:01 AM   #83
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Originally Posted by Damien Evans View Post
This I agree with. That doesn't mean that it should be made harder for minor parties outside the big 4 to get in though.
AFAIK there is no proposal to require candidates to pass a minimum threshold of primary votes to get elected.

The idea is that voters should set their own preferences either above or below the line rather than leave it to the parties to allocate preferences on the voters' behalf.
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Old 23rd September 2015, 06:21 AM   #84
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I think the only way is optional preferential voting, like they have in NSW. This means you only vote for who you want in the reps and a minimum number in the senate. You have of course got to educate the masses to not vote above the line. Better still ban voting above the line. Think that will happen
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Old 23rd September 2015, 06:28 AM   #85
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Originally Posted by wombatwal View Post
I think the only way is optional preferential voting, like they have in NSW. This means you only vote for who you want in the reps and a minimum number in the senate. You have of course got to educate the masses to not vote above the line. Better still ban voting above the line. Think that will happen
I'd be in favour of it.

I'll number all 120 or however many boxes there are at the next election below the line, just like I've always done, because I don't trust any of the parties to give their preferences in the way I want them to.
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Old 23rd September 2015, 09:15 AM   #86
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Originally Posted by wombatwal View Post
I think the only way is optional preferential voting, like they have in NSW. This means you only vote for who you want in the reps and a minimum number in the senate.
That is part of the plan.

Originally Posted by wombatwal View Post
You have of course got to educate the masses to not vote above the line. Better still ban voting above the line. Think that will happen
That is the other part of the plan. You would still be able to vote above the line but you would have to (optionally) number your preferences above the line as well. The idea is that if a candidate is going to get in with preferences then these preferences would have to come from the voters and not the political parties.
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Old 23rd September 2015, 09:17 AM   #87
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Originally Posted by lionking View Post
Not sure at all. Turnbull has a double dissolution trigger already. He'll pull it when most expedient.
I doubt he has such a trigger. Assuming the GG does their job properly, they would probably tell Turnbull that he has to actually attempt to govern first.

Originally Posted by lionking View Post
And Labor should. Having the likes of Leyonhjlem, Lambie, the Brick with Eyes, Wang and the other Independent idiots makes the Upper House a laughing stock.
Good thing Xenophon isn't in that list. He won his seat fair and square.

Originally Posted by wombatwal View Post
I think the only way is optional preferential voting, like they have in NSW. This means you only vote for who you want in the reps and a minimum number in the senate. You have of course got to educate the masses to not vote above the line. Better still ban voting above the line. Think that will happen
I don't know if they'll change above the line voting, the system works perfectly fine for the major parties since it's the easiest option to vote. Optional preferential voting, especially above the line, seems like a great change to the way things are done but I don't think that will pass. Or if it does, since it seems to be preferred by the Greens and Xenophon, who in the last election didn't get a second senate seat because of the preference deals, it might be on the table. I think however that any Senate "reform" will probably pass with a minimum primary vote amount, making the system rather meaningless.
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Old 24th September 2015, 12:19 AM   #88
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Originally Posted by Wildy View Post
I think however that any Senate "reform" will probably pass with a minimum primary vote amount, making the system rather meaningless.
Have you got any evidence for this? I don't see any proposals for a minimum primary vote being discussed ATM.

It wouldn't be necessary anyway. If the micro-parties can't simply swap preferences and have to rely on voters following a how to vote card then it will be harder for them to get a seat. If I vote for the Marijuana party, under optional preferential voting, I don't have to place a preference somewhere for the Sex Prohibition party (which is currently the case) or some even worse party (like the Liberals).
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Old 24th September 2015, 08:18 AM   #89
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And, just in case you had thought that our Government were any less committed to making fools of themselves at every opportunity under Turnbull, along comes the "Preventing Violent Extremism and Radicalisation in Australa" booklet from the AG's department with it's timely warning on the sinister consequences of becoming involved with 'the alternative music scene' and environmental activism.

http://www.livingsafetogether.gov.au...-australia.pdf
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Old 24th September 2015, 04:56 PM   #90
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It's all frighteningly McCarthyish.
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Old 24th September 2015, 05:25 PM   #91
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Morrison off to a bad start. He is channeling Abbott and Hockey already.

http://www.theguardian.com/australia...evenue-problem

Quote:

The new treasurer, Scott Morrison, has opened the batting in his new portfolio by declaring Australia does not have a revenue problem – it has a spending problem.

Morrison conceded national economic policy needed “a direction” and the government needed to build a sense of confidence to help boost economic growth – but he also signalled the government’s renewed efforts on budget repair would be focused on getting expenditure under control.

Team Turnbull must reverse Abbott's economic damage or face same fate
Stephen Koukoulas
Stephen Koukoulas Read more
“There’s plenty of people out there who want to raise taxes and have a new idea for a tax every single day of the week,” the treasurer told reporters during a joint press conference with the finance minister, Mathias Cormann.

“I’m interested in talking to people who have ideas how we can get spending under control. We have a spending problem, not a revenue problem.”
This is despite the fact that tax incomes have been falling for the Government and Hockey had finally started to do something about that by attempting to tax the avoiders like Apple and Google.
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Old 24th September 2015, 05:37 PM   #92
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If I hadn't already lost my job in the aid sector, I would probably be about to.

Julie Bishop to oversee largest ever cuts in Australian aid: report

Quote:
Foreign Minister Julie Bishop is set to preside over by far the largest overseas aid cuts as a proportion of the nation's income of any foreign minister in Australian history, a new report has found.

The report by the left-leaning think tank The Australia Institute has charted the rise and fall in Australia's foreign aid program since it was introduced by the Whitlam government in 1974.

If the aid cuts projected in the most recent federal budget go ahead, Ms Bishop will oversee a massive 33 per cent drop in spending, which is nearly double that of the next most parsimonious minister Bill Hayden, who in the 1980s managed a drop of 17 per cent under the Labor Hawke government.
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Old 24th September 2015, 06:14 PM   #93
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Originally Posted by Robin View Post
And, just in case you had thought that our Government were any less committed to making fools of themselves at every opportunity under Turnbull, along comes the "Preventing Violent Extremism and Radicalisation in Australa" booklet from the AG's department with it's timely warning on the sinister consequences of becoming involved with 'the alternative music scene' and environmental activism.

http://www.livingsafetogether.gov.au...-australia.pdf
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Old 24th September 2015, 06:50 PM   #94
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Originally Posted by Damien Evans View Post
case study from the booklet..

Karen grew up in a loving family who never
participated in activism of any sort. When she moved
out of home to attend university Karen became
involved in the alternative music scene, student
politics and left-wing activism. In hindsight she thinks
this was just “typical teenage rebellion” that went
further than most. One afternoon Karen attended an
environmental protest with some of her friends. It
was exhilarating, fun and she felt like she was doing
the ‘right thing’ for society. She enjoyed spending
time with this crowd. Over the next six months
Karen progressively dropped out of university in
order to live full-time in a forest camp, where she
remained for a year. Her family were confused and
disappointed and stopped supporting her financially.


How can I take advantage of this young girls confused and vulnerable state if they don't include a phone number?
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Old 24th September 2015, 09:30 PM   #95
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Originally Posted by The Fool View Post
case study from the booklet..

Karen grew up in a loving family who never
participated in activism of any sort. When she moved
out of home to attend university Karen became
involved in the alternative music scene, student
politics and left-wing activism. In hindsight she thinks
this was just “typical teenage rebellion” that went
further than most. One afternoon Karen attended an
environmental protest with some of her friends. It
was exhilarating, fun and she felt like she was doing
the ‘right thing’ for society. She enjoyed spending
time with this crowd. Over the next six months
Karen progressively dropped out of university in
order to live full-time in a forest camp, where she
remained for a year. Her family were confused and
disappointed and stopped supporting her financially.


How can I take advantage of this young girls confused and vulnerable state if they don't include a phone number?
You're a bad man.
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i loves the little birdies they goes tweet tweet tweet hee hee i loves them they sings to each other tweet twet tweet hee hee i loves them they is so cute i love yje little birdies little birdies in the room when birfies sings ther is no gloom i lobes the little birdies they goess tweet tweet tweet hee hee hee i loves them they sings me to sleep sing me to slrrp now little birdies - The wisdom of Shemp.
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Old 24th September 2015, 09:38 PM   #96
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Originally Posted by Robin View Post
And, just in case you had thought that our Government were any less committed to making fools of themselves at every opportunity under Turnbull, along comes the "Preventing Violent Extremism and Radicalisation in Australa" booklet from the AG's department with it's timely warning on the sinister consequences of becoming involved with 'the alternative music scene' and environmental activism.

http://www.livingsafetogether.gov.au...-australia.pdf
Just read that link. For example the quote below. I cannot relate this to what happens in Australia. There may be some vandalism related to environmental or religious issues, but I think extreme physical violence is rare to nonexistent.


Quote:
There are many different types of violent extremism and examples can be found across many cultures, societies and religions. The motivations of those involved in violent extremism vary — people are motivated by particular ideologies (for example, interpretations of political movements or religious beliefs), issues such as environmental or economic concerns, or ethnic or separatist causes. People can also be motivated by more than one issue. What is common across all types of violent extremism is intolerance and hatred for other points of view.

Last edited by rjh01; 24th September 2015 at 10:18 PM.
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Old 25th September 2015, 05:50 AM   #97
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Originally Posted by psionl0 View Post
Have you got any evidence for this? I don't see any proposals for a minimum primary vote being discussed ATM.
I think I might have taken things from opinion pieces I read a while back have somehow turned into "facts".

Quote:
It wouldn't be necessary anyway. If the micro-parties can't simply swap preferences and have to rely on voters following a how to vote card then it will be harder for them to get a seat. If I vote for the Marijuana party, under optional preferential voting, I don't have to place a preference somewhere for the Sex Prohibition party (which is currently the case) or some even worse party (like the Liberals).
Which I think is great and if that's the plan then I'm all for it. I also hope that Turnbull and Brough actually go through with it and don't quietly kill it in order to avoid annoying the crossbench.
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Old 26th September 2015, 02:34 AM   #98
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Originally Posted by The Fool View Post
case study from the booklet..

Karen grew up in a loving family who never
participated in activism of any sort. When she moved
out of home to attend university Karen became
involved in the alternative music scene, student
politics and left-wing activism. In hindsight she thinks
this was just “typical teenage rebellion” that went
further than most. One afternoon Karen attended an
environmental protest with some of her friends. It
was exhilarating, fun and she felt like she was doing
the ‘right thing’ for society. She enjoyed spending
time with this crowd. Over the next six months
Karen progressively dropped out of university in
order to live full-time in a forest camp, where she
remained for a year. Her family were confused and
disappointed and stopped supporting her financially.


How can I take advantage of this young girls confused and vulnerable state if they don't include a phone number?
Apparently Karen is a real person.
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Old 26th September 2015, 03:41 AM   #99
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Originally Posted by a_unique_person View Post
Apparently Karen is a real person.
I'd believe it. This is straight out of the evangelical Christian's proselytisation handbook. The next step is where she finds Jesus and turns her life around.
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Old 26th September 2015, 04:36 AM   #100
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Originally Posted by arthwollipot View Post
I'd believe it. This is straight out of the evangelical Christian's proselytisation handbook. The next step is where she finds Jesus and turns her life around.
No. She's really ***** off.
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Old 28th September 2015, 06:05 AM   #101
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The Poll Bludger has updated the bludgertrack. As expected there has been a large swing to the coalition, which is not surprising since people actually like Turnbull.

It's also the first time in a long while that the Liberals have actually outpolled Labor, which was last like this for a short time after the election.

Labor will probably have to dump Shorten now, since "not being Tony Abbott" isn't a selling point any more.
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Old 28th September 2015, 04:28 PM   #102
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Bill Who?
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Old 28th September 2015, 11:04 PM   #103
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The Labor party can just wait for awhile until Turnbull puts his foot in it. Remember after the election Abbott was still popular. It takes sometime before people realise how bad a PM is.
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Old 28th September 2015, 11:27 PM   #104
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As much as Id like to, I wouldnt count out Shorten just yet.

History seems to be scattered with the corpses of people who underestimated him.
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Old 28th September 2015, 11:29 PM   #105
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http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/o...-1227546307247

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Old 28th September 2015, 11:44 PM   #106
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Originally Posted by devnull View Post
As much as Id like to, I wouldnt count out Shorten just yet.

History seems to be scattered with the corpses of people who underestimated him.
Well, yes. As a Hitman. But as already said, the "I am not Abbott" will simply not work now. Labor needs things called, now what is that word... oh yes, Policies if they want to compete.

Abbott had none, but it did not matter because Rudd/Gillard smelt so bad that a dead Guppy could have won the last election. Labor in opposition have essentially played the same game. It is time to change, come out, and actually say what they intend to do if they move to the Government benches.

I will not hold my breath.

Norm
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Old 29th September 2015, 12:19 AM   #107
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Originally Posted by devnull View Post
Sorry that is behind a pay wall.
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Old 29th September 2015, 01:21 AM   #108
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Originally Posted by devnull View Post
Andrew Bolt is a moron.
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Old 29th September 2015, 02:03 AM   #109
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Originally Posted by rjh01 View Post
Remember after the election Abbott was still popular.
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Old 29th September 2015, 03:16 AM   #110
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Originally Posted by Wildy View Post
Andrew Bolt is a moron.
The Blot got thoroughly lambasted nationwide for his "gushy love letter" to his dear friend Abbott. And deservedly so - it was suspiciously close to being beyond just a bromance. And with the Hadley interview this morning being equally icky, it does show everyone just who his friends were and what an awesomely inappropriate moron Abbott was to be our PM.
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Old 29th September 2015, 03:20 AM   #111
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Originally Posted by Wildy View Post
Andrew Bolt is a moron.
I came to post same. Could not believe the bloke had a job writing the **** he does when I first read an article a year ago. Then I started meeting his readership.
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Old 29th September 2015, 08:31 PM   #112
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Originally Posted by rjh01 View Post
Sorry that is behind a pay wall.
Sorry.

Summary: Andrew Bolt loves Tony Abbott and wants to have his children, as we're all idiots because we don't feel the same way.
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Old 30th September 2015, 09:49 AM   #113
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I think Media Watch may have said it best, when they said that it seems that people like Bolt and Jones (who has also been having hissy fits) are starting to learn that even most conservatives don't think the way they do.
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Old 30th September 2015, 07:55 PM   #114
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Time to bring out the laughing dog.

Quote:
Mr Abbott also hit out at his allies in the conservative media, accusing them of not doing enough to back his "brave reforming" budget of 2014, which included a series of broken promises that were a catalyst for poor poll results.

Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/federal-pol...#ixzz3nHTyA12H
Follow us: @theage on Twitter | theageAustralia on Facebook


What the hell, why not make it two laughing dogs.

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Old 4th October 2015, 12:46 AM   #115
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It may no longer be Tony Abbott but it is still a Liberal government.

Their latest act of corporate obeisance is to make laws that shield large corporations from tax transparency.
Quote:
Dick Smith says Prime Minister Malcolm Turnbull will be "ratting on typical Australians who pay their tax" if the Coalition goes through with plans to shield large private companies from having to disclose how much tax they pay.

The entrepreneur is incensed that the government has caved in to lobbying by wealthy business owners who argue that disclosing their tax affairs would place them at risk of kidnapping and ransom attempts.

.......................

Liberal Senator David Bushby has claimed there was a danger that companies could be "shamed into paying more tax than they are legally obliged to" if the tax transparency laws are not rescinded.
http://www.theage.com.au/federal-pol...03-gk0j90.html
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Old 4th October 2015, 01:01 AM   #116
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Originally Posted by psionl0 View Post
It may no longer be Tony Abbott but it is still a Liberal government.

Their latest act of corporate obeisance is to make laws that shield large corporations from tax transparency.

http://www.theage.com.au/federal-pol...03-gk0j90.html
Well there's a grand tradition of high tax paying (er, avoiding) Australians having their children kidnapped so that their declared tax (avoidance) status will mean they will pay a ransom. Mexico has nothing on Australia......

Or something.
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Old 9th October 2015, 03:38 AM   #117
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Unhappy

Who else feels that the statements by the Director of the Parramatta Mosque, Malcolm Turnbull and Bill Shorten was stupid and not thought through. That statement was along the lines of "If you don't like Australia's laws and way of life you can leave".
If I was a young radicalised Muslim not liking Australia where would I most likely go to?
To ISIS of course. And do you think that the Australian Government would allow that. I would have thought that those 3 would have had their brains in gear before their mouths.
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Old 9th October 2015, 06:27 AM   #118
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Originally Posted by wombatwal View Post
Who else feels that the statements by the Director of the Parramatta Mosque, Malcolm Turnbull and Bill Shorten was stupid and not thought through. That statement was along the lines of "If you don't like Australia's laws and way of life you can leave".

If I was a young radicalised Muslim not liking Australia where would I most likely go to?
To ISIS of course. And do you think that the Australian Government would allow that. I would have thought that those 3 would have had their brains in gear before their mouths.
Reminds me of the Russell Brand clip:

Remember always, the (Daily) Mail (saying) "Get out of our country, clear off, clear off".

"Alright, we're off - to go to Iraq"

"Get back here!!"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=la2oGCbrKEg
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Old 9th October 2015, 11:47 PM   #119
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I read with amusement today that Turnbull was laughed at when he said at a Liberal Party conference that the Party wasn't run by factions. Those people who were laughing at him? They were the factions.
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Old 13th October 2015, 05:41 AM   #120
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Metadata laws go into effect.

Australia's metadata laws went into effect today. The Abbott government bill received bipartisan support back in March when, with the support of the ALP, the bill passed the Senate by 43 votes to 16. (http://www.bbc.com/news/world-australia-32061421).

However, it is being reported that many telecommunications companies are not ready for the task.
Quote:
The Government is giving these companies $131 million in taxpayer cash to establish the scheme but Communications Alliance chief John Stanton has told Fairfax Media many providers are still waiting to hear from the government about whether their implementation plans have been approved and when these subsidies will be distributed.

And there are a host of new apps designed to help you circumvent the laws.

Jon Lawrence, executive officer from Electronic Frontiers Australia, told the Adelaide Advertiser said the implementation, which will take another 18 months, had been a “complete shambles”.
http://www.news.com.au/technology/on...-1227566871231

Interestingly, the law has come into effect during Malcolm Turnbull's watch but he was an outspoken critic of the laws when they were proposed by the Gillard government.
Quote:
Then opposition spokesman for communications, Turnbull warned he had "very grave misgivings" about the Gillard government proposal, which "seems to be heading in precisely the wrong direction".
Advertisement

"Surely as we reflect on the consequences of the digital shift from a default of forgetting to one of perpetual memory we should be seeking to restore as far as possible the individual's right not simply to their privacy but to having the right to delete that which they have created in the same way as can be done in the analogue world," he said in his Deakin Lecture.

Ironically, he was charged with implementation of the bill by his former master Tony Abbott although he managed to make the bill a little less broad.
Quote:
While wary of the costs and hassle involved, the telecommunications sector praised Turnbull's role. Without his involvement, many said, the scheme would have been far broader and with fewer safeguards.

"He started to drive some sanity into the model, thank goodness," a senior telecommunications source said last year. "He has a good knowledge of the industry and isn't captured by the agencies."
http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politi...12-gk702z.html
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