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Tags !MOD BOX WARNING! , donald trump , Trump administration , Trump controversies

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Old 12th June 2018, 05:15 PM   #1801
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
I just finished binge watching the John Adams miniseries having read David McCullough's biography years ago and now in the middle of The Federalist Papers, which I last looked at in College.. When you read the words of Adams, Jefferson, Madison and Hamilton you stand in awe of these great and imperfect men. When I read anything Trump has written or said, I weep at what is to become of this great union.
Oh, hell, I miss the erudition of George W. Bush these days.
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Old 12th June 2018, 05:29 PM   #1802
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Originally Posted by phiwum View Post
Oh, hell, I miss the erudition of George W. Bush these days.
Hey, I miss the wisdom of Ronald Reagan.
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Old 12th June 2018, 05:32 PM   #1803
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Originally Posted by phiwum View Post
Oh, hell, I miss the erudition of George W. Bush these days.
I bet you never thought that would happen.
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Old 12th June 2018, 05:52 PM   #1804
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Originally Posted by phiwum View Post
I'm pretty sure that's not how propaganda works, but good luck with that.
I have very little hope of it happening. The opposition to Trump still labors under the illusion that the moral high ground has value.
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Old 12th June 2018, 06:09 PM   #1805
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Originally Posted by LSSBB View Post
What purpose does a derogatory nickname serve?
I don't know ask the President of the United States.
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Old 12th June 2018, 06:10 PM   #1806
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Originally Posted by Craig4 View Post
If enough of the electorate sees Trump as less than human they won't vote for him. If he feels hated, mocked, humiliated he may even decide he no longer wants to be president. Either outcome is a positive for the country.
Ok it seems if you just add wishful thinking, there is a possibility that something good can come of it.
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Old 12th June 2018, 06:16 PM   #1807
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Originally Posted by phiwum View Post
Oh, hell, I miss the erudition of George W. Bush these days.

Me too ... (sigh) ... good ole' Chimpy McFlightsuit. *** looks at ground and kicks rock***. Those were the days, eh?
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Old 12th June 2018, 06:58 PM   #1808
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Originally Posted by Elagabalus View Post
Me too ... (sigh) ... good ole' Chimpy McFlightsuit. *** looks at ground and kicks rock***. Those were the days, eh?
At the time, we all thought that the US had gone as low as it could with its selection of Presidents

Now we know better...

(a truly horrifying thought, we are now thinking that trumpff is as low as the US could go- what will be in charge in 2033?????)
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Old 12th June 2018, 06:58 PM   #1809
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
In my entire life, I have NEVER referred to a President or even another human being as I have with Trump.

But that is because I have never encountered such a disrespectful, deceitful human being much less a President. From the first day of his campaign, he has carried himself as simply despicable. The idea that this man entirely devoid of integrity, honor or compassion could be the President of the United States is sickening.

My country and its laws while never perfect has been reasonably honorable, but with Trump it is sadly gone.
I agree with all of that and have no qualms with the way you just expressed it.

When you add names and insults, it detracts, rather than adds, to the very valid points you may be trying to make.

But That's Just Me!™
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Last edited by Fast Eddie B; 12th June 2018 at 07:01 PM.
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Old 12th June 2018, 07:35 PM   #1810
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Originally Posted by Fast Eddie B View Post
I agree with all of that and have no qualms with the way you just expressed it.

When you add names and insults, it detracts, rather than adds, to the very valid points you may be trying to make.

But That's Just Me!™
Believe me, I get it. I wish we could follow Roberts Rules of order and have respectful debates. And that was what other Germans thought when dealing with Adolf.

And yet his way is winning. I remember what George S Patton said about talking to his troops. 'He gave it to them loud and dirty so the point was made'.
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Old 12th June 2018, 07:38 PM   #1811
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
Believe me, I get it. I wish we could follow Roberts Rules of order and have respectful debates. And that was what other Germans thought when dealing with Adolf.

And yet his way is winning. I remember what George S Patton said about talking to his troops. 'He gave it to them loud and dirty so the point was made'.
But Trump and his supporters are so polite and willing to listen to reason.......
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Old 12th June 2018, 07:40 PM   #1812
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
I bet you never thought that would happen.
No kidding.

When H.W. was in office, I didn't think I'd miss his erudition. Then came his son. And now this.

To be fair, I have some respect for H.W. and even for W, at least in the immediate aftermath of 9/11, if not for the Iraq thing (or Katrina). But neither of them were eloquent. W was justifiably mocked by Doonesbury for his inability to string together a sentence.

But, boy howdy, he was friggin' Byron compared to our current articulator in chief. W knew what a sentence was -- he'd seen them before -- but it's a mystery to this putz.
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Old 12th June 2018, 07:41 PM   #1813
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Originally Posted by Craig4 View Post
I have very little hope of it happening. The opposition to Trump still labors under the illusion that the moral high ground has value.
You're damned right that the moral high ground matters.

Sorry to hear that you're willing to forego principles for winning.
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Old 12th June 2018, 07:47 PM   #1814
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Checks in to the thread... it has gone full Godwin.... chuckles.... keeps on moving
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Old 12th June 2018, 09:01 PM   #1815
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Originally Posted by phiwum View Post
Oh, hell, I miss the erudition of George W. Bush these days.
I don't.

I mean, he's preferable to the open white supremacism and overt hostility to our allies that Toupee Fiasco does, but I can very easily think of a president who was far superior than either one. In fact, he was in office for the 8 years between the two...
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Old 13th June 2018, 12:51 AM   #1816
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Originally Posted by phiwum View Post
You're damned right that the moral high ground matters.
Sorry to hear that you're willing to forego principles for winning.
One of the first things I said about Trump in these threads was that one of the biggest dangers he poses was having his example of civility becoming more pervasive in society in much the same way as his bigotry has emboldened bigots.

You don't need to take the moral highground as a means of beating Trump, you have to take it to avoid him beating you.
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Old 13th June 2018, 01:55 AM   #1817
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
Checks in to the thread... it has gone full Godwin.... chuckles.... keeps on moving
Because they now compare Donny to Bush father and son? Interesting perspective.
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Old 13th June 2018, 02:45 AM   #1818
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Originally Posted by phiwum View Post
Oh, hell, I miss the erudition of George W. Bush these days.
The rage against GWB was one of the most misguided in history and, in no small part, paved the way for Trump.

A rather substantial criticism against GWB was made up you see. Unilateralism? No, even in Iraq he had the majority of G7 and the majority of NATO behind him. Perpetual war? No, he stopped after one, two if you count Afghanistan. Dodging draft for Vietnam? No, he served in a minor role, after the war already ended. Saying stupid things? Most were lifted from Walter Mondale, not something said by GWB. This is not to say there weren't ample and justified criticisms of GWB in those fields, on the contrary, but most were considerably exaggarated.

Now apply these to Trump, who just ditched the G7 allies for North Korea of all places, got out of serving in Vietnam due to a life-threatning bone growth in one or both of his feet (he can't remember) and whose idea of great wisdom looks like this:

Robert De Niro, a very Low IQ individual, has received too many shots to the head by real boxers in movies. I watched him last night and truly believe he may be “punch-drunk.” I guess he doesn’t realize the economy is the best it’s ever been with employment being at an all time high, and many companies pouring back into our country. Wake up Punchy!

Posted on his twitter account about five minutes before this post. I didn't even have to dig up anything old.

Having spent those lines of attack against GWB, what are you left with?

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Old 13th June 2018, 03:15 AM   #1819
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Originally Posted by Fast Eddie B View Post
Speaking of hypocrisy, some who criticize Trump for calling gang members animals, then go on to include diatribes like the above when referring to him.
It is almost as if referring to a race of people with an insult vs an individual makes a difference. Shocking!!
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Old 13th June 2018, 03:16 AM   #1820
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Originally Posted by phiwum View Post
You're damned right that the moral high ground matters.

Sorry to hear that you're willing to forego principles for winning.
I'm willing to forego principals for the good of my country.
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Old 13th June 2018, 03:17 AM   #1821
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Originally Posted by eerok View Post
Hey, I miss the wisdom of Ronald Reagan.
I miss the integrity of Nixon.
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Old 13th June 2018, 04:54 AM   #1822
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Originally Posted by McHrozni View Post
Perpetual war? No, he stopped after one, two if you count Afghanistan.
Seriously? One war all by itself can be perpetual--As indeed the war in Afghanistan has been, to this point.


Quote:
Saying stupid things? Most were lifted from Walter Mondale, not something said by GWB.
Seriously? Is there a joke I'm missing here? Mondale being responsible for the stupid things GWB said does seem laughably ignorant to me.


Quote:
Having spent those lines of attack against GWB, what are you left with?
Seriously? Is there some rule that once person A receives criticism X, criticism X can no longer be applied to any one other than person A.

Do you think we should reserve criticism for only the most superlative offenders of this or that ethic?

Like, hey, let's not criticize Hitler for killing six million Jews, otherwise, you run the risk that when some worse tyrant comes along and kills seven million Jews you're just gonna have to grin and bear it because you've used up all your criticisms, sorry!
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Old 13th June 2018, 05:07 AM   #1823
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Originally Posted by Cabbage View Post
Seriously? One war all by itself can be perpetual--As indeed the war in Afghanistan has been, to this point.
We are still rather active in Iraq too. But it is mostly bombing so I guess that doesn't count.
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Old 13th June 2018, 05:15 AM   #1824
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Originally Posted by Craig4 View Post
I'm willing to forego principals for the good of my country.
Giving up one's principles in order to defeat Trump isn't good for the country. One of the reasons that Trump represents a threat to the nation is that he is a man of no principles. It does no good to give up your principles in order to oust him.
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Old 13th June 2018, 06:10 AM   #1825
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Originally Posted by phiwum View Post
Giving up one's principles in order to defeat Trump isn't good for the country. One of the reasons that Trump represents a threat to the nation is that he is a man of no principles. It does no good to give up your principles in order to oust him.
If it helps oust him you can always pick up your principles afterwards. Trump will never have principles, and he will cheat to remain in power.

Nice guys finish last.
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Old 13th June 2018, 06:18 AM   #1826
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Originally Posted by ponderingturtle View Post
It is almost as if referring to a race of people with an insult vs an individual makes a difference. Shocking!!
Is the difference not primarily one of scale?
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Old 13th June 2018, 06:20 AM   #1827
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Originally Posted by Fast Eddie B View Post
Is the difference not primarily one of scale?
The difference between racism and a personal insult is one of scale?
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Old 13th June 2018, 06:28 AM   #1828
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Originally Posted by phiwum View Post
Oh, hell, I miss the erudition of George W. Bush these days.
Ive posted this before, but Bushs speaking ability definitely declined over the years...

https://youtu.be/GpKCoPx9108

Not agreeing with the Lyme Disease diagnosis, but something seemed to be going on.

Also, he was checked out in jets by our military. You dont need superior mental skills to fly a jet, but a truly stupid person would have quickly washed out.
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Old 13th June 2018, 06:35 AM   #1829
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Originally Posted by phiwum View Post
No kidding.

When H.W. was in office, I didn't think I'd miss his erudition. Then came his son. And now this.

To be fair, I have some respect for H.W. and even for W, at least in the immediate aftermath of 9/11, if not for the Iraq thing (or Katrina). But neither of them were eloquent. W was justifiably mocked by Doonesbury for his inability to string together a sentence.

But, boy howdy, he was friggin' Byron compared to our current articulator in chief. W knew what a sentence was -- he'd seen them before -- but it's a mystery to this putz.
HW was fairly good President. Not perfect, but certainly above average in the last 50 years. W wasnt the smartest but was always a good person trying to do good things. His issue was that he believed too much of the propaganda even though the Republican Party was already starting to contradict itself.

Trump is probably smarter than W, but his narcissism leads him to worse decisions, and hes a terrible person as well.
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Old 13th June 2018, 06:36 AM   #1830
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Originally Posted by McHrozni View Post
Having spent those lines of attack against GWB, what are you left with?
Gutting civil rights enforcement at the DoJ (including elevating many of today's leaders in voter suppression efforts).

Poor Supreme Court picks.

The War in Iraq wasn't simply "unilateral", it was also aggressive and would prove to be a distraction to efforts in Afghanistan.

Katrina response at the federal level.

The Lehman Bros. Collapse which led to the great recession.

And those are some of the major ones. Were some people eager to push minor to nonexistent problems? Sure. That doesn't mean he was good, however.
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Old 13th June 2018, 06:43 AM   #1831
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Originally Posted by lomiller View Post

Trump is probably smarter than W...
I doubt that, but I doubt well ever know for sure.
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Old 13th June 2018, 07:44 AM   #1832
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Trump administration looking to build "tent cities" to house up to 5,000 immigrant children separated from their parents
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Old 13th June 2018, 08:39 AM   #1833
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Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim View Post


Its what Jesus would have done.
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Old 13th June 2018, 08:56 AM   #1834
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Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim View Post
Now we know why Joe Arpaio was pardoned. This is right up his alley.
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Old 13th June 2018, 09:17 AM   #1835
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Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim View Post
Well, yes, that would be the expected middle point of the KKKeebler Elf's violent white supremacism...
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Old 13th June 2018, 09:19 AM   #1836
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Originally Posted by lomiller View Post
Trump is probably smarter than W, but his narcissism leads him to worse decisions, and hes a terrible person as well.
What makes you think Trump is smarter than Bush?

Trump: Bachelors degree from Wharton
Bush: Bachelors & MBA (Harvard and Yale)
Ok, Bush may not have been at the top of his class, but I suspect it takes a bit more intelligence to get an MBA from an ivy league school than a Bachelors from Wharton

Trump: Never served in any sort of military capacity
Bush: Never went to Vietnam, but did serve in the air national guard. And lets face it... it does take at least some intelligence to fly an airplane

Trump: Multiple bankruptcies (including a casino, which rather boggles the mind)
Bush: While he may not have been a great businessman, didn't have the failures that Trump had
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Old 13th June 2018, 11:40 AM   #1837
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Originally Posted by McHrozni View Post
The rage against GWB was one of the most misguided in history and, in no small part, paved the way for Trump.

A rather substantial criticism against GWB was made up you see. Unilateralism? No, even in Iraq he had the majority of G7 and the majority of NATO behind him. Perpetual war? No, he stopped after one, two if you count Afghanistan.
Haven't you noticed, the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan are still ongoing.
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Old 13th June 2018, 11:44 AM   #1838
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Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
Bush: Never went to Vietnam, but did serve in the air national guard. And lets face it... it does take at least some intelligence to fly an airplane
Can you imagine Trump flying a fast jet?
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Old 13th June 2018, 11:45 AM   #1839
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Trump tweets

"Oil prices are too high, OPEC is at it again. Not good!"
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Old 13th June 2018, 11:53 AM   #1840
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Originally Posted by Captain_Swoop View Post
Trump Tweets.

" The Philadelphia Eagles Football Team was invited to the White House. Unfortunately, only a small number of players decided to come, and we canceled the event. Staying in the Locker Room for the playing of our National Anthem is as disrespectful to our country as kneeling. Sorry"

As far as I am aware none of the Eagles stayed in the dressing room or kneeled at the Superbowl.

Lies again from Trump.
Will NBA champions Golden State be invited and if so will they go? What about the NHL champions the Washington Capitals?

As a hockey fan Im happy to see Capitals Captain Alexander Ovechkin, arguably the best goal scorer in NHL history, finally win the Cup, but politically hes a very vocal Vladimir Putin supporter. Do this make it look bad if the Capitals receive an invitation to the Whitehouse after the Eagles and possibly Golden State Warriors are snubbed?
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